Very Interesting, I myself believe there are no less builders than before, more if anything because there are more fliers thanks to arfs.
It's kinda of a rigged poll you see.

My first plane was a soarstar electric, it got me up and flying (Still have it). My first kit (Balscraft Spitfire) is still unfinished after four years. Yet in this time I have assembled and built at least 20 arfs and 6 kits. Almost all my arfs have received the arf-bash treatment. I too don't like showing up at the field with a looky-likey. But I don't look down on those who do.

I've had old timers tell me they would not be caught dead at the field with an arf. But then I've had old timers totally confused if my Tiger Moth was a scratch build or a kit.....................it's an arf.........oh really ?

I have built arfs, kits, plans built/kit (Ziroli) and scratch built UAV's for the Department of Defense. I enjoy iy all. But the real love is that of flight. There is magic in seeing my Tiger fly or how my giant P-40 handles like a real one.

Here's a few of my planes........

My latest work is refurbishing my Vailly P-47 adding 3D panel lines, rivets, access hatches and new paint.

Oh yeah, this was one of those kits that became an arf when I got it or whatever. The original owner/builder was killed in a motorbike accident. The plane was sold to a friend and then passed on to me. Originaly ' Big Stud ' she will now fly under the fictitious 362nd Fighter Group "Forever Young" being a tribute to my wife's Uncle who was KIA in March 45'.

In addition, I am converting the TF RTC P-51D to the B model (Yeah, I know the wing is different in scale) The wing and tail are all glassed. I have the B plans but need to blow it up for the formers unless there is someone out there that would make a set ?

My Yellow spit is also staring at me now, I can't wait to fondle her further this winter, hehehehehe.

Keep your passes low and your spirits high !

S1

some more of my squadron mates

........................ but I can't cover worth a dam,................................

I wasn't going to go that far to describe my covering abilities that way Crash, but that pretty well sums it up. The ugliest plane I have it probably the best flying and most forgiving, an old Telemaster .40. Since I moved to Ultracote, I do get along better with the covering, but I'm really liking the glass cloth, water based poly and paint method.
If we considering those who assemble ARF's as being in the "building" category too, then there certainly is the same amount or more of builders. I think there is a difference between building a kit and assembling an ARF.
Another thing I've noticed about those who start fresh in this hobby with ARF's. When the time comes that a wing gets dinged, or some minor damage occurs, most of them with no building experience have no clue where or how to begin to fix it.
But so what. I rarely hear of golfers who "built" their own set of golf clubs, or Bass fishermen who "built" their own Bass boat, but they still enjoy the sport.
Fact is, ARF's are here to stay, the number of kits as I see it is diminishing, and scratch building and building from plans will probably increase. Whatever happens, I plan to be here in the hobby.

Randy

You know, I just remembered something that makes me observe the following. There are a lot of comments about the poor quality of the first ARF's. In the time period ARFs started to appear, there were a lot of kits available that were pure crap. You hear them mentioned with reverent terms like "They were BUILDER'S kits." (Translation : You couldn't build them unless your skills exceeded those of the designer.) Those "kits", from many reports, were never built "Per Plans", but always "bashed" or built with "extra reinforcement" or extra features like added washout or increased wingspan.

Sort of like some current ARF's are reinforced or bashed.

Some day, I'm going back to Mar del Plata to see if that Pilot Zero kit is still gathering dust, bring it back and try to build it.

Or does no one else remember poorly designed or cut kits?

Best wishes,
Dave Olson

Yea Dave, I can recall several poor kits with the "die crunched" parts. And on the other hand, I remember buying an MRC "Trainer Hawk" back in probably the late 70's or early 80's . It was a .15 size ARF, all foam. Flew like a champ, and I even won a Limbo contest with it and beat out the best flier in the club who had always previously won the limbo. There were some decent ARF's back in the old days. I taught myself to fly on a Sears "Cessna Centurion 2 channel foamie. First couple flights weren't pretty, but it got the job done. I couldn't find anyone else to teach me at the time.
I take some of these comments with a grain of salt at times, like the thread on here that said basically that the Funtana .40 was garbage, didn't fly good, etc. I have one and there are at least 5 others in our club, and everyone loves them.
Installing bigger engines on an ARF than what the mfr. reccomends might also be some of the problem. I know one case where the firewall came right out of the airplane in flight. A prop out of balance can contribute to a failure, then "flutter" gets the blame, etc. Point is, there is a whole load of things that can contribute to an in flight failure that may never be realized. There's still some people that when asked if they "balance their props", give you the deer in the headlight look.
But then, this is just my opinion, and I could be wrong!!
Randy

As a builder flier, the problem I face is economics.
I can't build a plane, scratch or kit, for the price of the ARF.

Example: the Somthin' Extra, kit=$99, ARF=$200
By the time I get it finished to the same level as the ARF, it cost me just as much after you figure in covering, glue etc.
Plus the kit has slab surfaces while the ARF's are stick built, so unless I purchase more wood, I'm building a HEAVIER plane!

Personally, If its available as an ARF, I don't build it.
If its a kit, it had better be speacial.
If I scatch it, It damn shure is going to be unique!!!!

Some of us don’t have a choice of kit building vs. ARF.

Some have the building skills of a child and the mind of an adult. It is the worst of all possible worlds since we always understand when the repair/building has going wrong.

Have never finished a kit. An ARF takes 9 months while others finish in a week or less. It’s a mental thing. As the plane starts to become pretty the construction process starts to slow. Minor decisions, which are made in minutes by others sometimes, take days or weeks. A cowl once took two weeks to fit and was never satisfactory. Those who have musical or artistic or painting skills can never be expected to fully understand the difficulty for others. The same is true for building.

My preference is to buy finished airframes that are ready to be discarded. At Joe Niall this year several crashes were put into the trash that I would have been happy spending months patching. Crashes are delicate moments so I rarely ask about purchase. If you see me eying your latest mishap seize the opportunity. Knowing that the airplane is never going to be a beauty queen somehow helps with the repair/decision process.

Hi,

I also think that more people, due to the increased production of ARFs, come into (and then get right back out of) the hobby. When I first began working part-time at a hobby shop, there was a whole shelf stocked with kits. By the time I was running the place a couple years later, there were mostly ARFs as the kits would sit and sit. The down-side is that when a new guy has no 'blood, sweat and tears' invested in his airplane, he's more likely to give up on it after an initial failure than someone who has more than just some money in it.

Just my $.02