butlern

My Feedback: (15)

After the gear rails were glued in place, the W-3's were dropped in. Those will likely require some adjusting to get up to and near the gear rails, as well as relieved to accommodate the swing arm on the landing gear. After that, I checked to be sure that my wing tube receivers were going to fit. Some adjustment was necessary there, too. Once the wing tubes checkout (be sure they are square over the plan and both left and right are the same dimension above the building board) I removed them and then started the shear webbing. Everything is 1/8 light-ply, with the exception of the webbing between W-2 and W-3. Because of the maple rail back there, I cut a piece of 1/8 AC plywood and tucked it in between the ribs and the spars (like an I-beam), rather that gluing it to the front of the spars as indicated on the plan. I should have noted above that the Sierra gear have (apparently) changed a bit since Charlie drew the plans in 2004, so the gear dimensions do not exactly match the plans, particularly with regard to the rear support/swing arm. But it's close, so no worries. I only mention this because you'll likely never get the maple rail supporting the swing arm to align over the plans. Due to it's "new" location, I could not put shear webbing on the front of the spars in that location. Rear shear webbing was added, too. Used 1/8 balsa back there. Attached pictures should help to clarify.

butlern

My Feedback: (15)

Now it's time for W-6... Not sure how to best proceed here. Here is where I left off this afternoon. I'll go back and try to finish it tonight, but I needed a break from "adjusting" wing ribs. Anyway, it seems like in order to get W-6 appropriately placed over the plan and using the 62 degree alignment template, the rib notchs (in the rear) are going to have to be re-cut. Cut more deeply into the rib. I just can't seem to keep W-6 flat (using some aluminum angle bar clamped to the part) and get it to rotate into position. It binds at the rear spars. I'll have to look at it again.

I'll have another go after dinner tonight. Hopefully, by the end of the day, I can get the sub-leading edge on, servo rails epoxied in place and the top of the wing sheeted. We shall see.

I'll post more as I make more progress. If the pictures (or descriptions) are not clear, Chic, let me know and I'll post more detailed info and higher-resolution pictures.

Regards,

Noah

butlern

My Feedback: (15)

So my latest interpretation is that the W-6 rib is drawn and cut oversized, such that when it's rotated into position, the top (and maybe some of the bottom) of the rib will fall outside the profile of the center section. If true, then it will be relatively straightforward to sand W-6 it to match the contour (profile) of the existing center section. It should be reasy to handle from here. I'll just get it into place, relieving the spar notches as required, making sure that the inner flap area fits, and then lock it in place. Then I'll sand it to match.

That's my plan at least (for now).

If someone (Charlie?) has an alternative approach, please let me know!

Regards,

Noah

redtail

My Feedback: (15)

Noah, I can only say beautiful work. Your working slowly through the construction which are not only securing a solid, straight build but your taking this rookie to school. I really appreciate your adding clarity to my upcoming build of the wing. Glad you are a part of this build. Where did you get your wing tubes, are you using carbon or alum? I'll certainly be in touch with you as I build on my Tarpon Mk. III. [8D] Speaking of that, have you considered a color scheme for your Avenger yet? Have you thought about what you will cover the control surfaces with yet? Are you going to use a single elevator control horn or as per Charlies' plans? Well, I'm going back to study your text and pictures. Thanks. Chic

redtail

My Feedback: (15)

Noah, one question out of many for now, is there not a template to adjust W-6 when positioning it? If so, once positioned, I could see where you could then trim it to fit the profile. Chic

butlern

My Feedback: (15)

Hi, Chic.

Yeah, working slowly and trying to work carefully... but I wish I had more time to spend on the project. I only get a few hours each week to chip away at it.

I got my wing tubes from TNT. They're aluminum. They should be fine. Not too concerned about saving weight! This behemoth should handle it just fine, and the aluminum should also be plenty strong.

Regarding the control surfaces, I plan to cover them in fabric. I used Solartex on my Meister 109 and my little shyshark Avenger control surfaces, and I liked it alot. Very easy to work with, stays put and takes paint very well. I have been getting it from Balsa USA.

I have not yet decided on a scheme! I'm not a real scale modeler, Chic! I don't start with a subject and then build... I start building and then pick the scheme when the details are going on and the plane is almost ready for paint.

So, I never got back to the plane this afternoon/evening... I'll have another look tomorrow. There is a template to position W-6, but the spar notches in the rib do not allow the part to rotate to the appropriate angle. That second photo in post 127 was my attempt to demonstrate how much farther I have to rotate the part (the template is shown next to the rib). Anyway, I think it'll work out just fine if I massage the notches until the rib gets to 62 degrees, so long as I maintain register at the inner flap area and maintain the maximal width of the center section (which I think is about 29 3/4 inches).

I'll post more later this week.

Best,

Noah

butlern

My Feedback: (15)

Chic,

Are you reinforcing the stab hinges with anything, or just using the drilled plywood parts? I was thinking about the G10 material, but if the ply works well enough, then I might as well use what I have on hand.

By the way, in answer to your earlier question, I have not yet thought about the linkages in the tail (or wing/flaps, for that matter). I'll sort it out when I get there, I suppose. Although I'm pretty much there for the inner flaps. I am installing the servo rails (for the inner flap and elevator) in the wing as per the plans. Whether I use them or re-position the elevator servo(s) elsewhere has yet to be determined.

Started on the fuse crutch yet??!? I'm looking forward to starting that assembly. I have a fair bit remaining on the wing (like about 90% of the wing yet to build), but framing the fuse is my favorite part, as it's then when you get a feel for the overall size of the plane.

regards,

Noah

redtail

My Feedback: (15)

Noah, Charlie recommended that I reinforce all the ply hinges with the G-10 material and I did. I too will try to internalize the inner flap and certainly the elevator/rudder control horns. With regards to the ailerons, I don't see a choice. Have not started on the fuse, the wing center section is next for me. Dennis has my L/gear but I'm sure I'll see them back before I get started on it since I understand the importance of having the L/gear handy during construction. Keep the tips and photos coming, I really appreciate it. Chic

butlern

My Feedback: (15)

Thanks, Chic... Can you give me the specifics? Where did you buy it, and what gauge? Comes in sheets, I presume?

tccjfk

My Feedback: (6)

Butlern
It took me a few ribs of W6 to get the center section right.I put a straight end across the top of the center section and mearured 29 3/4 to make the top of W6. for the bottom of W6 I used the angle guide he has to get the bottom of the rib on the right angle and yes the spar cut outs have to be cut deeper.I hope this make sense. After trying a few times I found that was the best way.I hope this helps
Frank

butlern

My Feedback: (15)

Thanks, Frank.

It's starting to make sense now. Should go together rather easily, now that I'm no longer worried about why W-6 was so ill-fitting.

Have you finished the center and are you now working on the outer panels? I saw eariler in this thread that you were cutting your own. Hope it's going well.

Post some pictures when you get a chance. Chic and I love to hear from others working on this kit.

Regards,

Noah

redtail

My Feedback: (15)

OK guys, I think for sure I'm going to follow Frank's suggestion and begin work on the center section so that I can stay close to where both Noah and Frank are in their build. This way, your suggestions and tips will be fresh and you'll be able to recall what I may need to know quickly. Noah, I got the G10 fiberglass directly from Frank Tiano on his website. Will give you the specifics this evening on the size of the G10 sheet, rushing out to work right now. Chic

tccjfk

My Feedback: (6)

Noah
Just figured it out how to send the pictures.
Well W6 might not be a problem now comes W7
Frank

redtail

My Feedback: (15)

Hey Frank, what kind of glue are you using? Chic

redtail

My Feedback: (15)

[:-] Hey Noah, I did some digging through my "Avenger E-Mails" and I found the specs on the G10 fiberglass sheet recommended by Charlie. It is a .030 x 12" x 24" sheet as sold by Frank Tiano directly from his website for $13.95. Which is www.franktiano.com at his scaleshop Got to go clean up the shop to begin the wing center section build. By the way Ken, it is in the low 30's here. No sanding or paint is flowing. [:-] Chic

butlern

My Feedback: (15)

Thanks for the G-10 specs, Chic.

Now go get that shop in order to you can hit the ground running on the wing! You're falling behind!

I now have W-6's in place and the inner flap recess done. Just now gluing the subleading edge on and the it's on to sheeting. I thought it would be easier to sheet the top first, but it's becoming clear why Charlie suggests sheeeting the bottom first (so you can more easily mate W-6 to W-7 when fitting the outer panels). Photos forthcoming.

Looking forward to staring the out panels in the next couple of days.


Noah

redtail

My Feedback: (15)

OK fellows, we have had snow and 20 degree weather here so I petted the "DAWG" on the head and said, "Sit in the corner for now", I need to do some work on the Tarpon Mk. III. I'm not trying to catch up with you guys but I will start on the wing as all of you have suggested and therefore stay reasonably close to ya. I like going to school before I start something, that way, I have friends to ask questions of when I get in trouble. [] So, I cleaned up the shop, cleaned off the building table, cut up the plans, taped the plans to the top of my building table, and covered the plans with Saran Wrap. I do not have my landing gear back from Dennis so its "HIS" fault I haven't started yet the center section yet. That is my excuse and I'm sticking with it. Works for me. [>:]

Making me start on the wing caused me to search through piles of notes, build thread notes, and emails for advice, tips, and what to do right. Then I had to do something, so I followed Noah's lead. I sanded the center section ply ribs, got out my Hysol gun and glued the doublers to W-2 and W-4. Decided to follow the gentleman from the deeper south, who by the way has a beautiful Kellogg TBM Avenger completed, flight video here on RCU, who told me to make all the ribs that the wing tube runs thru ply and extend the tube one more rib. I just recently found the notes from him among all the stuff I have collected on the Avenger. W-1 thru W-8 are all ply, so I traced W-9 and W-10 on 1/8" ply and cut them out. I'll also make an end block for the wing tube as he suggested. I have to go to the local craft shop and try to get a 1/4 x 3 x (at least 36") to make the necessary 1/4 x 11/16 shim for the rear spar to sit onto. I do not have any in the shop. Hummmm. Great, it gives me an excuse to go out and get a "Five Guys" cheese & bacon double burger. Rec'd the carbon wing tube and sleeve from TNT. Robart air cylinders/tank and piano hinges for the bomb bay doors are all enroute. Bye for now. Chic

redtail

My Feedback: (15)

Ooooops, just got an email from Dennis who said my gear/brakes shipped Thursday. Looks like I'll be working on laying up and adjusting the center section by the weekend. Thanks Dennis, your certainly the professional. However, you have caused me a bit of a problem. I now do not have an excuse to use for not proceeding with the wing. Dog gone it. Chic

redtail

My Feedback: (15)

To all you special guys out there who are supporting this build: Ken, Charlie, Noah, Frank, Dennis, Wild Horse Hans, Mick, Jim, David, Mobyal, Dan, Sierra P, Rusty, Al, R8893, Chad, Tony, Craig, Peter Oz, and all the viewers of this build thread, may you and yours all be blessed and have a wonderful Thanksgiving. Chic

mobyal

Thanks, Chic.
The same to you and your family, and to all you others as well.
Al

butlern

My Feedback: (15)

OK, once again I failed to get much accomplished on the Avenger this week/weekend, but I will show you guys what I have so far:

Since I last posted, I was (with some email help from of a couple of master builders!) able to get the W-6's into place. I sanded the center section with a long flat bar in order to get the W-6's to match the contour. After that, I moved on to the inner flap section, which was very straightforward, although it took a little time to get the bottom of the W-6's to match W-5 through W-3 at the flap cut-out area. Once the flap areas were glued, I moved back to the wing tube receivers. The elongated hole in W-6 did not line up very well with the other holes in the ribs, so I partially filled the W-6 holes with ply, and slowly sanded out the opening until the receivers slid back into the position I established (in W-5 through W-3) prior to mounting the W-6's. Not too difficult, but again it took a bit of time to work carefully to get a good fit. Once the fit was correct, I glued the tubes in place with some methacrylate (hysol). Once dry, I trimmed the excess tubing with a razor saw and then sanded the surface of W-6 to get everything smooth and even. Very pleased with how it's coming out so far.

butlern

My Feedback: (15)

Here's a couple of more photos of my center section. I never seem to upload them in the correct order. Anyway, below you'll see the flap area detail, the servo rails that I glued in the center section, and the center section ready to recieve the upper wing sheeting. I have received some good advice from someone who knows (Mr. Kellogg, of course) that the best way to proceed is to sheet the top of the center section first... so, no argument from me!

I have not yet started the flaps themselves, but after I get the top sheeting on I'll start to work out those details. But honestly, I have neither the 5/32 wire on hand to make the actuating rod nor the suggested hinges for the flaps, so I'll probably work on the flaps at the end of this week when I get all the materials in place.

It's coming along and I'm excited to start the outer wing panels. Although, I anticipate that it will be slow-going trying to get the outer's to align with the center section and the wing tubes. But, now that I have a little more experience under my belt, I think that I can work though it OK.

Thanks again to all those who have helped me so far!

I'll post again at the end of next week. Hopefully I'll have at least one of the out panels framed by then. regards,

Noah

dhal22

it's nice to see the support Charles continues to give after the sale. other Kellog build threads haven't mentioned this.

Also, happy holidays to everyone here. who will be able to squeeze in some building while watching football on thurs?[sm=tongue_smile.gif]

david

redtail

My Feedback: (15)

Charlie, many thanks for the continued support to solve our collective problems. Chic

tccjfk

My Feedback: (6)

Charlie Kelloggs has other builds on the web?