Go Back  RCU Forums > RC Helicopters > Electric RC Helis > T-Rex heli
Reload this Page >

Is it just me or .... Align frame hex screws

Notices
T-Rex heli For all you T-Rex lovers out there, this where you can post!

Is it just me or .... Align frame hex screws

Old 11-17-2010, 06:32 PM
  #1  
joe_crash
Member
Thread Starter
My Feedback: (3)
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Derwood, MD
Posts: 45
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Default Is it just me or .... Align frame hex screws

Is it just me or has anyone else had problems with the Align Trex 450 frame hex screws stripping?I am rebuilding a 450 Pro, and have to take the frame apart to get the servos in, and almost all of mine are stripped. Isuspect it may have to do with the EXI 1.5mm hex driver not being of the best quality tool steel, but they do seem very soft.
Anybody have a better idea to getting stripped screws out other than drilling them out? I was going to try taping the CF frame everywhere but the screw caps, and filing them off, lifting the frame off and then turning them out with plyers, but think that just drilling them out may be a better idea.

I ordered a replacement frame from HeliProz, just in case I had to cut it off, but misunderstood their catalog description of that part "Trex 450 Frame" as being two sides - a complete frame. Low and behold, it's just one. I wanted to avoid drilling if at all possible on the screws that turn into the metal frame where the 2 cyclic servos are and the main shaft, as I suspect I'd have to then tap and cut new threads.

Anyone have a better idea or a good (read easy and fast!) way to do this???

Thanks all,

(Oh, Ijust looked at the HobbyKing website and see I could have gotten the entire assembly for $30 )
Old 11-17-2010, 08:45 PM
  #2  
gi1mo2
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Gatineau, QC, CANADA
Posts: 608
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Default RE: Is it just me or .... Align frame hex screws

I thought the Align screws were a bit better than the HK models (I have both). The HK kits hex screws are known to be soft and the head to strip easily. I normally put my hex driver at an angle to get a better grip on the head to prevent stripping. A little bit of heat with a soldering iron on the screw head might be enough to loosen them.
Old 11-17-2010, 08:45 PM
  #3  
nothinbetr2do
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: elkton, MD
Posts: 3,657
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Default RE: Is it just me or .... Align frame hex screws

no, it's not just you. i just had a not so pretty landing and stripped my tail gears, i stripped a frame screw trying to replace a front gear. i ended up using my dremel and cutting a slot in the head and using a straight screwdriver to get the screw out. and as already said, use a soldering iron to heat the screw up, to help get it out. i need to find a better screw set for my pro
Old 11-17-2010, 08:46 PM
  #4  
Rob2160
Senior Member
 
Rob2160's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Sydney, AUSTRALIA
Posts: 4,786
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Default RE: Is it just me or .... Align frame hex screws


ORIGINAL: joe_crash

Is it just me or has anyone else had problems with the Align Trex 450 frame hex screws stripping?I am rebuilding a 450 Pro, and have to take the frame apart to get the servos in, and almost all of mine are stripped. Isuspect it may have to do with the EXI 1.5mm hex driver not being of the best quality tool steel, but they do seem very soft.
Anybody have a better idea to getting stripped screws out other than drilling them out? I was going to try taping the CF frame everywhere but the screw caps, and filing them off, lifting the frame off and then turning them out with plyers, but think that just drilling them out may be a better idea.

I ordered a replacement frame from HeliProz, just in case I had to cut it off, but misunderstood their catalog description of that part "Trex 450 Frame" as being two sides - a complete frame. Low and behold, it's just one. I wanted to avoid drilling if at all possible on the screws that turn into the metal frame where the 2 cyclic servos are and the main shaft, as I suspect I'd have to then tap and cut new threads.

Anyone have a better idea or a good (read easy and fast!) way to do this???

Thanks all,

(Oh, Ijust looked at the HobbyKing website and see I could have gotten the entire assembly for $30 )
Hi,

No, it is not just you..

I had exactly the same problem with the hex nuts on a Pro and a GT..

It is ENTIRELYthe fault of your tools.

I got so frustrated with it happening to me I went and bought the BEST Hex drivers I could find.

I bought this one..

http://www.orcarc.com/en/products_3.asp?id=153

I have not had a single screw strip since using this tool.. I have even deliberately tried to strip a screw by overtightening it.. it did not strip.. the screw just snapped...

The tool cost more than a Hobbyking helicopter Kit but has paid for itself many times over by saving my sanity on subsequent heli builds..

I now have two of these tools and 2 are perfect for tightening the feathering shaft screws on the head...

Hope that helps...
Old 11-17-2010, 10:35 PM
  #5  
joe_crash
Member
Thread Starter
My Feedback: (3)
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Derwood, MD
Posts: 45
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Default RE: Is it just me or .... Align frame hex screws

Thanks to all who replied. I did try the heating trick - thanks for reminding me - that has worked in the past on other stubborn screws. Unfortunately not tonight though! So, since I did have one frame side thanks to HeliProz (and I may be being unfair - but to me, it implied the entire frame), I got out the Dremel and a cutting wheel and cut 1 side off and when all of that side of the frame came off there was just enough to grip the head with a pair of pliers and got those screws out.
When I put it back together (after I stop writing) I am going to reset them with a hex elbow key (I don't know if that is the correct terminology but Ithink you guys will get the gist.) and the next thing I order will be a set of quality hex pro grade drivers - Thanks for the link too!

This is a nice heli - but again, HK sells an EXACT copy (thank god the patent lawyers reach doesn't extend to China!) for a fraction of what Ipaid for it, and I believe Iposted the link ot another site that has a 600 machine that is again an EXACT copy of the Trex 600 w/ torque tube for $200, Ibelieve. It is seriously nice looking - but if Imove to a 600 Ihave to buy expensive blades, a new set of batteries, etc, so I am going to stick to the 450's and 500 size birds for now.

One interesting thing - Ibought on the heli listings here a Align 450 XL - I got a super price on it, and really wanted to try it because of the push/pull controls. I think that is going to be my "beater bird" until my skills imporove.

I am running Windows 7 Home Premium, and Ido not know if anyone else had this problem, but I couldn't get it to install for the life of me. Itried a LOT of solutions given to me on the Win7 support forums, but it turned out to be a mystery for them also. So Idid the thingI should have done in the first place - contact RealFlight support and they got back to me in 2 days with a super easy fix. Go to Control Panel>System>advanced settings and change the DEP setting to "Only for essential Windows services only", and the install worked like a charm. One reboot and changed DEP back (As soon as Ihad changed it to the less restrictive setting a trojan immeadiately tried to install but got stopped in it's tracks by Malwarebytes. I highly recommend this program - Norton didn't pick up on the trojan, and MB has saved me a lot of times. No Norton when my subscription runs out.

Thanks Again!
Joe
Old 11-18-2010, 08:06 PM
  #6  
Rob2160
Senior Member
 
Rob2160's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Sydney, AUSTRALIA
Posts: 4,786
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Default RE: Is it just me or .... Align frame hex screws


ORIGINAL: joe_crash

I am going to reset them with a hex elbow key (I don't know if that is the correct terminology but Ithink you guys will get the gist
We call them Allen Keys here in Aus. Trojan brand are the best I have used...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hex_key

Old 11-18-2010, 08:57 PM
  #7  
joe_crash
Member
Thread Starter
My Feedback: (3)
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Derwood, MD
Posts: 45
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Default RE: Is it just me or .... Align frame hex screws

Hey, thank you - I actually call the ones pictured allen keys also. "Hex Driver" - I don't know if Imade that up or how it was described in the EXI description of them. But, the EXI brand is pretty cheap - not inexpensive, though it is also that, but cheap. Any regular usage seems to round the heads. I did try it with a 1.5mm hex key, no luck.
I ended up cutting it off with a cut off wheel on my Dremel tool. I was very carefull and didn't hit any of the cast or forged solid metal pieces like the main rotor block. Maybe I was too hasty in saying Heliproz should have desribed it as "half of a frame", because that's all I need not that the one side is off - I can put the servos in very easily, and it is one heck of a lot easier to do than when both sides are attached.
I started this afternoon on the project, but quickly hit a snag - the 6 hex cap head screws are 2x6mm, not 2x3mm as are the frame, bottom plate, and most (if not all the other parts) - Ihad to go out and buy some - they should include those in the motor mount, I mean, what, they probably cost pennies on the scale Align buys them for.
In the not too distant future (my next heli project) I am going to buy one of those 1000 piece sets from ... I believe it's RLC?They advertise here on rcuniverse.

Thank you all for your suggestions - I've used at least part of all of them.

One more though! I am intending on putting this into a scale body. I'd like it to be a Blackhawk Heli - do they sell kits to change the angle of the tail box? I watched the install video on Horizon on their Align 500D and it seems like it's pretty cheesy w/ that very obvious rc tail end hanging out.

Old 11-20-2010, 10:53 AM
  #8  
Cleared2Engage
Senior Member
 
Cleared2Engage's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Oxnard, CA
Posts: 602
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Default RE: Is it just me or .... Align frame hex screws

One trick I used before I upgraded my hex tools was to use the Dremel to cut a slot on the head of the screw. From there I just get a small flat headed screwdriver and unscrew it from the frame. Good to hear you were able to get it out.
Old 11-20-2010, 11:05 AM
  #9  
joe_crash
Member
Thread Starter
My Feedback: (3)
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Derwood, MD
Posts: 45
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Default RE: Is it just me or .... Align frame hex screws

That also sounds like a workable technique, but alas, my Dremel Cut off tool was too wide, or my hand too unsteady, to do that.

When I was at the hardware store I did notice a tool that is made for this exact reason - extracting stripped screws/nuts. Unfortunately, they did not have anthing that would have fit on a 1.5mm or 2x6mm cap head.

When I get a few pennies saved up, I am simply going to purchase the entire frame, landing skid blocks, motor mount and rotor block - that have it for the 450 PRO and it was $30.00. Far less that what I paid to HeliProz, and now that HK is in the US (you have to see what prodeucts they keep in stock though)

I hope everyone is well, it's such a beautifull day here in MD I am putting repairs on the back burner, and go Fly some (just some overing in my front yard.) and if I can get a ride, to the field later for my electrip planes.
Peace!
Old 11-20-2010, 12:30 PM
  #10  
joe_crash
Member
Thread Starter
My Feedback: (3)
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Derwood, MD
Posts: 45
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Default RE: Is it just me or .... Align frame hex screws

Wow - I just re-read my earlier post - Idefinately need to use spell check more often.

I went to the HK site, to look at the 450 Fuses, just to see what they have. After I get this 450P back together, I wanted to make a scale body, for kicks. Rather, put it in a scale body. My favorites are the EC135, BK117, the Air Crane - all of these use 4 blade heads except I believe the Air Crane uses a 5 blade.

I think some mod needs to be made to the angle of the tail rotor gearbox, to make it more scale looking. Is there anyone besides Vario or East Coast Helis (thier retail store here in the East) sell these or is it all mail order, which again, would be find.
I am worried about running a 4 to 5 blade head - wouldn't that increase the load incredably so,?Would Ihave to upgrade the motor and other electronics?And, the tough looking part - the angled tail rotor. I can cheat and make it "Scale at 40 feet if you squint", but would rather do it correctly.

Any tips, hints, and resources on this subject will be most welcome.

Joe
Old 11-27-2010, 02:09 AM
  #11  
noreboi
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Brea, CA
Posts: 16
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Default RE: Is it just me or .... Align frame hex screws

Yep, Align screws suck.

I have a Trex 500ESP and I stripped a couple of them when I was assembling my bird....
Old 11-27-2010, 02:38 PM
  #12  
joe_crash
Member
Thread Starter
My Feedback: (3)
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Derwood, MD
Posts: 45
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Default RE: Is it just me or .... Align frame hex screws

I actually had to cut one side of the frame off and replaced it with one from Heliproz, and new frame hex screws, only I don't know what I was thinking, because I ordered the screws again from Align!! Duh!!!
I think eventually I will buy that huge screw collection that is advertised here - what is it, Master Screws or something like that? I know everybody has seen their ad, I'll find the new one right after I send this.
Old 11-27-2010, 04:48 PM
  #13  
gi1mo2
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Gatineau, QC, CANADA
Posts: 608
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Default RE: Is it just me or .... Align frame hex screws

I have heard of the following before, but never used them myself... [link=http://rtlfasteners.com/RC/908.html]RTL Fastners[/link]
Old 11-28-2010, 04:18 AM
  #14  
Aframomum
My Feedback: (10)
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Orlando, FL
Posts: 1,519
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Default RE: Is it just me or .... Align frame hex screws

Unfortunately both Align and clone screws are made of very soft metal...there are many threads both here and on Helifreak of them stripping easily.

I have used RTL Fasteners on both my Pro and 500 and they are very durable. The only issue with the RTL Fasteners screws is they come in two types: stainless steel and black steel. Sometimes not all the screws needed will be in one 'color', so you can have a mix of stainless steel and black steel depending on what screw is required. And they usually come in packs of 10 or 12 screws, so if you need only 4 of one kind you'll have extra's.

Another option is to get a screw kit from RCScrewz.com - they already have all the screws that will fit the particular heli in one package. I haven't used their kits but they do seem nice and organized and after adding the prices of all the individual screws for say, the 450 Pro heli, the RCScrewz option is a better deal. See [link=http://www.rcscrewz.com/product_info.php/stainless-screw-kits-heli/align-heli-screw-kits/p/alg008-align-trex-450-pro-stainless-steel-screw-kit/cPath/350_295/products_id/3457]Link[/link]

Mark
Old 12-04-2010, 09:40 AM
  #15  
Moontan13
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Aurora, CO
Posts: 437
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Default RE: Is it just me or .... Align frame hex screws


ORIGINAL: gi1mo2

I have heard of the following before, but never used them myself... [link=http://rtlfasteners.com/RC/908.html]RTL Fastners[/link]

I've used Smallparts.com for hardware. After I get by bird running I'll probably swap all screws for alloy steelor stainless. The yy have some low profile cap screws as well.

http://www.smallparts.com/?ie=UTF8&p..._rd_s=footer-1


How do you guys make small links?
Old 12-12-2010, 09:23 AM
  #16  
jauguston
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Bellingham, WA
Posts: 178
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Default RE: Is it just me or .... Align frame hex screws

The screws you use should be grade 12.9. That is the hardest grade. It doesn't matter where you buy them just ask the grade. Grade numbers are a industry standard. Also always use a straight shank hex wrench NOT a ball end driver.

Jim
Old 12-12-2010, 01:48 PM
  #17  
Moontan13
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Aurora, CO
Posts: 437
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Default RE: Is it just me or .... Align frame hex screws

The hardest screws are too brittle to use withouta precise torque limitingdriver,(IMO), and I wouldn't want to try and drill one out of an aluminum hole. My experience has been that the tiny screw heads strip because there's so little metal at the head, and because of a poor fitting tool. If the originals give me problems, I'll likely try stainless next.

FWIW, screws stretch as they tighten, and the hardest ones give little indication of tightness before they snap. This has beenmy experience in industrial applications.
Old 12-12-2010, 02:08 PM
  #18  
jauguston
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Bellingham, WA
Posts: 178
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Default RE: Is it just me or .... Align frame hex screws

13,

You will find that virtually all the small metric socket head boltsused in our helis are GR12.9 and that is the best grade available. Stainless is soft. Phillips and pan head screws can be anything. High quality (Say expensive) allen wrenches are your best chance to avoid stripping the heads.If you have cheap ones be sure and keep them sharp and square on the tip.With use the tip will wear down and fit loose. Grind a little bit off the tip when they get loose.

If you use a little bit of Blue Locktite when you assemble things the bolts don't have to be Gorilla tight.

Jim
Old 12-21-2010, 05:35 AM
  #19  
Rob2160
Senior Member
 
Rob2160's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Sydney, AUSTRALIA
Posts: 4,786
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Default RE: Is it just me or .... Align frame hex screws



I just found the BEST tool for working on helis..

http://www.hudy.net/xhudy/products/p...&kategoria=538

This driver is INCREDIBLE - I had a number of hex screws with heads that I thought were"Stripped" as none of my other hex drivers worked.. they just slipped..

This HUDY driver locked in tightly and I could tighten the hex screw as much as I wanted.. NO slippage at all..


Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off


Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service - Do Not Sell My Personal Information -

Copyright 2021 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.