SETTING UP Your New VPP
04-27-2005, 11:44 AM
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SETTING UP Your New VPP
Well Its a new world now and many of us "Airplane" pilots don't have the Radio Setup knowledge to make VPP easy. I'm hopin to pass on some useful information on how I built my own VPP setup, how I actuated it, and most importiantly, HOW IT OT SETUP to work in the radio!
On a Home brew VPP setup this is how I have the radio set.....
JR 8103 Radio
BMS 371 Pitch Servo
Hacker A20-20L Outrunner
Falcon Predator 1600 3s1p
T-Rex Tail Rotor Assembly
SS Hollow Shaft
Carbon Push/Pull Pitch Control
Ball Link Ends
Start with Heli Mode, not airplane Mode.
Plug ESC on Throttle Ch and the prop Pitch on the Collective Chanel. Program Flight mode 1 (your landing mode switch) to a flat pitch line. (other words, 5 points, all at the same %) you'll have to adjust the % to get normal flight (No Vpp, throttle only) pitch on the blades. I have 4.5 Deg set, but that'll vary with blades. The Throttle Curve is a straight, 0% to 100%
HIGHLY reccomend that you do flight tests in flight mode 1 before attempting any VPP tests. etting normal flight to work well is importiant, that way if you get mixed up, all you do is flip the switch.
On a Home brew VPP setup this is how I have the radio set.....
JR 8103 Radio
BMS 371 Pitch Servo
Hacker A20-20L Outrunner
Falcon Predator 1600 3s1p
T-Rex Tail Rotor Assembly
SS Hollow Shaft
Carbon Push/Pull Pitch Control
Ball Link Ends
Start with Heli Mode, not airplane Mode.
Plug ESC on Throttle Ch and the prop Pitch on the Collective Chanel. Program Flight mode 1 (your landing mode switch) to a flat pitch line. (other words, 5 points, all at the same %) you'll have to adjust the % to get normal flight (No Vpp, throttle only) pitch on the blades. I have 4.5 Deg set, but that'll vary with blades. The Throttle Curve is a straight, 0% to 100%
HIGHLY reccomend that you do flight tests in flight mode 1 before attempting any VPP tests. etting normal flight to work well is importiant, that way if you get mixed up, all you do is flip the switch.
04-27-2005, 11:58 AM
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RE: SETTING UP Your New VPP
The Next Part is settin up your mode 2 settings. This is a seperate task and menu from the mode one, and is accessed on most radios by flipping the landing switch to the middle position. This is how you'll activate your VPP mode and have access to Reverse thrust.
Set the Pitch curve on mode 2 on a 0% to 100% line. (Your radio may use a -100% to +100%) This will allow your throttle stick to control the pitch. Heres the tricky part to et used to.... Half throttle is ZERO pitch, LOW throttle is Full Reverse pitch, and FULL throttle is FORWARD pitch. It'll take some Getting used to...
The Throttle Curve is a V shaped curve on the mode 2 switch. Youll want Full power when at FULL neative, and FULL positive pitch settings. BUT you'll want less power at the zero pitch settin to keep the RPM down with no load on the prop. I use a 100/50/100 setting on the Throttle Curve to start with...You can fine tune these curves later to look like a U or a sharper V.... it all depends on your flyin style.
Set the Pitch curve on mode 2 on a 0% to 100% line. (Your radio may use a -100% to +100%) This will allow your throttle stick to control the pitch. Heres the tricky part to et used to.... Half throttle is ZERO pitch, LOW throttle is Full Reverse pitch, and FULL throttle is FORWARD pitch. It'll take some Getting used to...
The Throttle Curve is a V shaped curve on the mode 2 switch. Youll want Full power when at FULL neative, and FULL positive pitch settings. BUT you'll want less power at the zero pitch settin to keep the RPM down with no load on the prop. I use a 100/50/100 setting on the Throttle Curve to start with...You can fine tune these curves later to look like a U or a sharper V.... it all depends on your flyin style.
04-30-2005, 09:14 AM
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RE: SETTING UP Your New VPP
On the Futaba 9C, there is another option.
The 9C has slider switches on the left and right side of the box. On the left side (VRD-D switch) it is located so it can be controlled by the index finger without removing your thumb off the throttle stick.
In ACRO mode, I put the Chnl 6 VPP servo on the VRD-D slider switch. This way the throttle stick is unnafected, so you would not need to relearn it as in HELI mode. The VRD-D also gives full variable control over each throttle setting, i.e. it is not 'slaved' to the throttle.
Any opinions on how well it would work?
Wade
The 9C has slider switches on the left and right side of the box. On the left side (VRD-D switch) it is located so it can be controlled by the index finger without removing your thumb off the throttle stick.
In ACRO mode, I put the Chnl 6 VPP servo on the VRD-D slider switch. This way the throttle stick is unnafected, so you would not need to relearn it as in HELI mode. The VRD-D also gives full variable control over each throttle setting, i.e. it is not 'slaved' to the throttle.
Any opinions on how well it would work?
Wade
05-02-2005, 09:20 PM
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RE: SETTING UP Your New VPP
I already got my VPP, just waiting for the hollow shaft axi to come in. Do you need a Heli esc, or can I use my normal airplane escs??? I'm going to be using my Futaba 9C radio and use the slider on the left of the radio to control the pitch. It should work good that way. I'll be trying it on an F3A shocky.
05-03-2005, 08:42 AM
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RE: SETTING UP Your New VPP
Scott Foster was interviewed in the latest 'Quiet Flyer'. He seem to have used a CC10 ESC in governor mode. Any brushless ESC would work for us.
Scott also recommends that we stock a lot of the pitch servo gears! True, I had 3 short flights and already changed the gears twice on the HS81 servo. Both times I thought that the landings were survivable, just that the plane tipped-off. You can't fly a 'Heli' paralled to the groung and not hit the head, which jams the servo gears.
The EVP blades pitch is very easily set with a 'Whatt Meter'. Just adjust the end-points of the servo to output 8 to 9 Amps in each direction for the AXI2208-34.
A more accurate method we are using works in the forward mode. Hang the model from a fish scale. Adjust the end-point to achieve max thrust. It should be close to 8 Amps.
Scott also recommends that we stock a lot of the pitch servo gears! True, I had 3 short flights and already changed the gears twice on the HS81 servo. Both times I thought that the landings were survivable, just that the plane tipped-off. You can't fly a 'Heli' paralled to the groung and not hit the head, which jams the servo gears.
The EVP blades pitch is very easily set with a 'Whatt Meter'. Just adjust the end-points of the servo to output 8 to 9 Amps in each direction for the AXI2208-34.
A more accurate method we are using works in the forward mode. Hang the model from a fish scale. Adjust the end-point to achieve max thrust. It should be close to 8 Amps.
05-04-2005, 12:14 AM
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RE: SETTING UP Your New VPP
Hey Wade, how much thrust are you getting at 8-9A on the EVP/2208/34 combo and approximately how much pitch are you using (either by pitch angle or distance from hub to slider)? Is that on a 3S or 2S pack? I'm pulling more current than that on a 3S pack for probably 11+oz of thrust or so...
Baron
Baron
05-04-2005, 08:36 AM
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RE: SETTING UP Your New VPP
I did not offer details as we are using the makeshift 1/8" rollpin on the AXI2208-34. Lots of vibration and losses.
Here it is for what its worth, which is very for this setup: all use a 3S GWS 1050 battery.
Original Setup: 9x6 Graupner, 8 A, 16 oz Thrust
Original Setup: Slo Flyer 9x4.7, 9 A, 13 oz Thrust
EVP Setup: 9A, 12 oz Thrust. At 11 A, the thrust is below 10 oz. Obviously not a well balanced system.
I am waiting for the SS shafts (see Levi's recommendations). I will publish data and pictures next week. I will also have data on the Raptor 30/Hacker combination (again, per Levi's recommendations)
Here it is for what its worth, which is very for this setup: all use a 3S GWS 1050 battery.
Original Setup: 9x6 Graupner, 8 A, 16 oz Thrust
Original Setup: Slo Flyer 9x4.7, 9 A, 13 oz Thrust
EVP Setup: 9A, 12 oz Thrust. At 11 A, the thrust is below 10 oz. Obviously not a well balanced system.
I am waiting for the SS shafts (see Levi's recommendations). I will publish data and pictures next week. I will also have data on the Raptor 30/Hacker combination (again, per Levi's recommendations)
11-10-2005, 10:33 AM
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RE: SETTING UP Your New VPP
Wakle-
If you set up the Futaba 9C as you stated (on the VRD-D switch) wouldn't this put your motor in jeopardy? At 0 pitch the motor is at very little or no load and may "over-rev". I think this is why govenor mode on the speed controller makes sense. In governor mode the speed controller will attempt to maintain the same RPMs regardless of the load imposed on the motor from the changing of pitch.
If you set up the Futaba 9C as you stated (on the VRD-D switch) wouldn't this put your motor in jeopardy? At 0 pitch the motor is at very little or no load and may "over-rev". I think this is why govenor mode on the speed controller makes sense. In governor mode the speed controller will attempt to maintain the same RPMs regardless of the load imposed on the motor from the changing of pitch.
