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WACO YMF

Old 11-12-2012, 09:08 AM
  #15601
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Default RE: WACO YMF

Bill - I remember reading an article about using epoxy to join aluminum, and it's not the type of epoxy but the surface preparation that matters most. I'll see if I can find it and pass the info along
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Old 11-12-2012, 10:11 AM
  #15602
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I'd appreciate that. I have to fasten a couple of wing joiners (1/8 X 3/4) that are about 22 inches long into the front spar area and the rear spar area of the wings for the Ryan. I doubt if they would ever pull out, but I wanna be dang sure that they don't. These plug into the fuse and the aluminum C channel attachment and are bolted down when the plane is assembled for flight. I used bolts and Hysol on the fiberglass fuse and wing/gear former. I don't think that this is ever going to fail.

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Old 11-12-2012, 10:34 AM
  #15603
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Couldn't get a clean scan, so i just copied the info. It's an old article, probably about late 80's, but it does mention Devcon, so it can't be that ancient . The article deals with aluminum to aluminum, so aluminum to wood might be easier.

“Many modelers have tried to epoxy aluminum with little or no success. The big secret in getting a good glue joint lies in the proper preparation of the surfaces. The following procedure will prepare the joint area for good adhesion. Wash the joint area in solvent or thinner and air dry. Do not allow anything to touch the areas to be joined (especially fingers!). Now immerse the areas to be joined for 10 minutes in a solution containing 10 parts by weight of sulfuric acid, 1 part sodium dichromate and 30 parts distilled water, at 125 to 155 degrees Fahrenheit. Wash the solution off with distilled water and air dry. Your favorite epoxy can now be used to glue the joints”
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Old 11-12-2012, 10:54 AM
  #15604
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Default RE: WACO YMF

Bill, Jerry Nelson had some epoxy for alum. I don't know if the people that bought his buiness still sells it.. You might try them
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Old 11-12-2012, 11:09 AM
  #15605
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Quote:
ORIGINAL: amscat

Bill - I remember reading an article about using epoxy to join aluminum, and it's not the type of epoxy but the surface preparation that matters most. I'll see if I can find it and pass the info along

Prep is important I found that drilling several holes along the edge and tapering them on both sides allows the epoxy to form a plastic rivit and a sronger bond. just a thought maybe it would help!!
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Old 11-12-2012, 11:21 AM
  #15606
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Default RE: WACO YMF

Thanks to all. By the way, I've been using Devcon since the early 60's.

Bill, Waco Brother #1
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Old 11-12-2012, 05:11 PM
  #15607
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Default RE: WACO YMF

Bill,
I used 15 minute epoxy to bond the wood fairings to my 1/3 Waco gear. I scuffed up the aluminum with 150 paper and cleaned with alcohol. The bond was good and it is one of the few items up front on my Waco that didn't suffer any damage. All the wood to aluminum joints held well.
Later!!
Anthony
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Old 11-13-2012, 03:01 AM
  #15608
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I sanded mine, and used 1 hour epoxy. There is no stress on the fittings other than the shear load of the wings, and this is mitigated by the flying wires, and on landing, the landing wires. There are 2 of the bars on each wing and they measure 1/8" X 3/4" and they are over 20" long and extend all the way to the 6th rib. That means the wing is fully supported out through the 5th bay. Should be plenty strong.

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Old 11-13-2012, 05:43 AM
  #15609
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Bill, i have been using this stuff called MetlWeld, its thick and it stinks but it sure is strong www.systemthree.com i believe is their web site. Its kind of like the stuff the snips in the navy used to repair cracks I think the called that stuff Belzonea it becomes like the surface and it does bond to wood well, also grindable and sandable.

regards
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Old 11-13-2012, 05:52 AM
  #15610
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Nine o Nine, Mitch, I just wanted to take a moment to hope you and yours were not to severely upset by "Sandy" I know parts of R.I. were badly hit wasn't sure exactly where you were in relation to the coast. Hope all is well, take care and hope to see you at Top Gun next year.

regards ,

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Old 11-13-2012, 09:19 AM
  #15611
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Thanks for the thoughts CJ. We were fortunate to have only a couple of days with no power. My 2 stepkids family's, one Long Island and one In Westchester County NY lost power for more than a week. An in law family still has no power and a beachfront apartment building in which they own a condo has no power and my have to come down due to the damage up to the third floor. Our family suffered no real tragedies as have others though.
Again, thanks for asking. Mitch
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Old 11-13-2012, 09:52 AM
  #15612
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Hello,
The project I have started this month. I plan to make my Waco entirely from composite materials. I'm doing a model which later I'll get the negative forms ... The model has a scale of 1:3.
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Old 11-14-2012, 04:00 AM
  #15613
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Default RE: WACO YMF

VOX, nice work a few questions if i may. is she a kit or from plans, you say composit what type of materials. it looks like everything is interlocking, how much time is invested so far. thanks,[8D]

regards,
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Old 11-14-2012, 07:57 AM
  #15614
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Default RE: WACO YMF

Got to meet Jaybird this morning. He is down visiting some friends who live close by me. We got to spend a few minutes chatting. Nice to be able to put a face with a name.

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Old 11-14-2012, 03:17 PM
  #15615
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I don't know if anyone is aware that there is a WACO YMF-5 sim for MS FSX (Microsoft Flight Simulator X) It can be found on flightsim.com. It costs $20 to download. I haven't downloaded it yet but I did view the review. It looks very scale detailed. So if anyone has MS FSX try it.

Carl
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Old 11-14-2012, 11:43 PM
  #15616
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Quote:
ORIGINAL: ceije

VOX, nice work a few questions if i may. is she a kit or from plans, you say composit what type of materials. it looks like everything is interlocking, how much time is invested so far. thanks,[8D]

regards,
Chris Melhus, ceije 196
Hello Chris,
Work with the project lasts about a month. It is a fully independent work. At first I was planning to make a set of lightweight balsa and plywood. But then I decided to make a model of a fully composite. This will make them more technologically advanced production for me. I work with materials German company R & G. Model will be made ​​on a "sandwich" that ensures greater strength and light weight. As a filler, I will use the material Herex. Model weight is about 16 kg.

regards,
Albert
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Old 11-14-2012, 11:55 PM
  #15617
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Default RE: WACO YMF

Some forms of this project, I have done ...
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Old 11-15-2012, 03:50 AM
  #15618
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Default RE: WACO YMF


Quote:
ORIGINAL: VOX


Quote:
ORIGINAL: ceije

VOX, nice work a few questions if i may. is she a kit or from plans, you say composit what type of materials. it looks like everything is interlocking, how much time is invested so far. thanks,[8D]

regards,
Chris Melhus, ceije 196
Hello Chris,
Work with the project lasts about a month. It is a fully independent work. At first I was planning to make a set of lightweight balsa and plywood. But then I decided to make a model of a fully composite. This will make them more technologically advanced production for me. I work with materials German company R & G. Model will be made ​​on a ''sandwich'' that ensures greater strength and light weight. As a filler, I will use the material Herex. Model weight is about 16 kg.

regards,
Albert
Albert,

16kg for a third scale model? Wow! Please keep us posted as this build progresses. This opens up a new dimension in building (for me anyway). Congratulations on taking on this project. Wanna be a Brother?

Bill, Waco Brother #1
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Old 11-15-2012, 05:01 AM
  #15619
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Hello Bill,

Thank you for your interest in my work. This project - my dream! I love this plane. It will be my great honor to become a brother. I accept your offer.
Albert
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Old 11-15-2012, 05:24 AM
  #15620
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Default RE: WACO YMF

VOX,Your glass work is beautiful. But I have a question?  Of all of the WACO photos I have seen, I have not seen the large rivited enforcements on the cowl, other than the two smaller ones  on the parting seam.  Were these just on your subject plane? 

Joe
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Old 11-15-2012, 06:51 AM
  #15621
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Joe,

VOX has the Cowl correct for the modern Waco Classic Cowls. The Cowl on NC 14031, a 1934 Waco YMF/UMF (the subject of Paul Matts drawings and Pica's kit) does not have any reinfocing on the cowl, it is smooth.

P1 - Side view on NC 14081, a 1987 Waco Classics YMF serial number F5-009
P2 - 3/4 view on NC 14081
P3 - Close up of P2
P4 - Cowl on NC 14031
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Old 11-15-2012, 08:45 AM
  #15622
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John,

Isee what you are talking about on your photos, however, here are two WACOClassics that are smooth. The first one, N40116, is based in VABeach, and Ihave lots of photos of her. Other than the normal ones along the seperation seam, nothing. The second one with the polished blisters, is spanking new, made in 2011. That is N128L based in VA. Again, no re-enforcements.

So that is why I made my comments.

Joe
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Old 11-15-2012, 01:45 PM
  #15623
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Default RE: WACO YMF


Quote:
ORIGINAL: VOX


Quote:
ORIGINAL: ceije

VOX, nice work a few questions if i may. is she a kit or from plans, you say composit what type of materials. it looks like everything is interlocking, how much time is invested so far. thanks,[8D]

regards,
Chris Melhus, ceije 196
Hello Chris,
Work with the project lasts about a month. It is a fully independent work. At first I was planning to make a set of lightweight balsa and plywood. But then I decided to make a model of a fully composite. This will make them more technologically advanced production for me. I work with materials German company R & G. Model will be made ​​on a ''sandwich'' that ensures greater strength and light weight. As a filler, I will use the material Herex. Model weight is about 16 kg.

regards,
Albert
VOX, Albert, I do beleive your project just opened up PANDORA's BOX, congrats on becoming a brother and welcome to the brotherhood. I guess the next set of questions are, is this going to be a production item or strictly experimental, if production will it be cost effective and will kits be in the Barth and ARM price range. You've caught a lot of eyes and this is a high interest group. This is a great build to watch unfold, please keep it the photos and info. posted.

regards
V OX,
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Old 11-15-2012, 02:19 PM
  #15624
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Vox, Welcome aboard, beautiful work being done there, you truely are a craftsman. best wishes ,George
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Old 11-15-2012, 08:13 PM
  #15625
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[/quote]

Hello Chris,
Work with the project lasts about a month. It is a fully independent work. At first I was planning to make a set of lightweight balsa and plywood. But then I decided to make a model of a fully composite. This will make them more technologically advanced production for me. I work with materials German company R & G. Model will be made ​​on a ''sandwich'' that ensures greater strength and light weight. As a filler, I will use the material Herex. Model weight is about 16 kg.

regards,
Albert
[/quote]

Albert, how will you replicate the fabric areas with composite material? Not sure if I am understanding your project properly.

James.
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