redtail

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Good morning guys, critical question. If you look at my #2221 posting above, you will see that I actually created new formers in the bottom wing saddle/bomb bay area. I cut out all the notches that was in the original formers. Now I am questioning where to place the 1/4x1/4 spruce strips used to screw the fiberglass halves to the area. Since I have the top of the former squared off with F-21 that locks the wing in - do I place the spruce strip on top of the former, or is a notch cut into those formers to run the top of the spruce strip level with the former or is the spruce strip installed in a notch on those formers at an angle? I have a couple of the original formers where I see notches for stringers to form the basis of the bay area shape at the bottom as well as along the curve of the bay area former. While I wait for the stringers to arrive, I'll wait to hear from all of you.

Peter, I thank you for joining Noah, Larry, and Boyd in helping me to bring this build to a conclusion. When I first felt a bit of a burn out with this build, I too indulged into the jet community (Post #2001). It is fun and helped bring back the inspiration to get back to this build, then I pulled the dumb s#@$ and hacked up my right hand. I did not realize how intrigue and detailed scale modeling can be and how "LARGE" this puppy is. However, I'm back, and Peter, you will fly that Avenger this late spring, early summer. I'm doing everything I can to make it to the Nats in June. I need you guys. Chic

butlern

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Chic,

I installed the supplied F5B, F6B, FB7, and F8B formers. These formers both dictate/encompass the lower radius of the bombay/lower fuselage and provide notches to locate the spruce stringers (hinge points for bay doors). I used straight edge to carefully verify alignment before gluing into these into place. I also added the formers both left and right. They should meet in at the centerline/bottom of the fuse radius, further helping with alignment.

After I mounted these formers, and added the spruce stringers in the pre-cut notches. After those were set, the formers were cut flush with the bottom of F21 (the ply that locks the wing).

Details can be found here: #277

Not sure of the best way for you to proceed, given your custom modifications and deviations from the plans, but I personally believe it will be critical to notch the stringers into these formers (whether you stick with your custom pieces, or not), as well as run the stringers all the way up and through the formers that delineate the bay (fore and aft).

redtail

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Thanks Noah, will notch the formers using the curved basis and angle of the notch of the couple of original formers I still have. That should give a foundation. The notch I cut will be angled and level with the top of F-21. Hope the overall alignment remains. I understand I will be running the stringers the length of the bay. Thanks Noah. Chic

redtail

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Noah, just slipped the fiberglass bay shell on the airframe. Trimming is needed but the fit seems to be very good. The formers follow the natural curvature of the bay area. However, I am having a tough time finding the 0.060 brass sheet to make the arms from; I have access to a 0.064 brass sheet. By the way, how did you cut the 0.064 brass sheet? Thanks. Chic

lkahn4

Chic,
Did you buy the shell from Charlie or did you make it?

redtail

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​Hey Larry, I purchased it from Charlie. For those who used the torque tubes and brass levers method, what material did you make the levers out of????? Chic

butlern

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Hi Chic,

Cut-off wheel and dremel. Used a metal file to smooth edges and round the curves of the torsion arms.

Pain.

redtail

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Noah, are you saying you made the levers and the plates holding the torque tubes from the same 0.064 material, if so that solves a great problem? Chic

butlern

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In my post (#290) I claimed to have used 0.064 brass sheet for all of it, arms and plates, along with brass tubing. I think I got it at my local hobby shop or craft store. Could have been 0.060, though.

I considered using epoxy plate material (G10) and carbon rods for the torque tubes, but I went with Charlie's design/plans. Works great!

redtail

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Smile - I will never assume what a PhD asserts. That solves a great problem for me, heading to the hardware store now to get the 0.064 pieces I was viewing this morning. Thanks for you very fast responses. You are the man - my brother. Chic

lkahn4

And that's why we made ours too short, we laid up ours and cut the it too short....

lkahn4

Chic,
I think we made the arms from 1/8" brass and JB weld to join them

redtail

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Noah and Larry - I had no idea how hard making these torque arms would be. Noah, you gave me notice when you wrote "Pain". Should of taken your hint. Boy are you right. I have been working most of the day just to cut them out of the 0.064 brass material. I went through two cutting discs and a hacksaw blade to cut through the material. Now that I have them cut out, rather raggedly I must say, I put them in my hand to move from the vise over to the workbench and felt their weight. I then decided to lighten them up a bit. One of the arms is finished.

You are right Noah, that flat file came in handy. Now to move on to the other three arms. Will begin the construction of the torque arms/tubes tomorrow - especially due to a snow/icy road mix expected Saturday. Let me tell you guys cutting those arms out was HARD. Ha, Ha, Chic

redtail

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Still more work to do - Hard

butlern

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Yes, pain. But nearly there!

Looking good.

peter w h

Hope these help.

I may have made them out of something heavier .090" holds better while you soft solder them onto the shafts.

redtail

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Peter thanks for the pics. Gives me a good look at the wood you used to screw the shell quarters too. Larger than the 1/4" suggested on the plans the I think. Got a bit sloppy on one of the arms, I guess you shouldn't sneeze while using a grinder. Smile. Will certainly re-do that piece. Will also finish the shorter pieces tomorrow and start soldering. Thanks Guys. Chic

lkahn4

Nice work Chic

redtail

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Hit a roadblock - "VERY" afraid to move on. I'm looking at the plans with regards to the positioning of the torque rods and the pads that the larger bushings are soldered too and mounted onto F-1 and F-9. I know the critical point is the drill holes in the torque arms. I have that. But where to mount the pads that hold the larger bushing that the rods slip into at both ends is freaking me out. If the rods are placed wrong, the circular path the torque arms take will not allow the shells to fold or lay right on the fuse. How did you guys figure out the placement of the pads that support the torque rods. I am not making a move until I hear from all of you. Chic



HELP

lkahn4

Chic,
Just went through the thread and Noahs post about the doors starts at Post #305. Hope this helps

Working on the hinges for the Trojan gear doors, hopefully will post pix this afternoon

Stay well my friend
Larry

butlern

My Feedback: (15)

No Panicking!

You will be fine.

I used the F-21 wing lock parts as a guide. If those were installed straight and true, then just mount your torque tubes in reference to those.

For example, starting on one side or the other, just make sure that either the inner (or outer) edge of the tube aligns with the vertical surface of F21 (both sides). Next, make sure that both ends of the tube are elevated above F21 an equivalent distance. Important: simply "tack" the mounts/stops/bushings in place using only 2 screws, and then repeat for the other tube using the first tube as a reference.

How close the arms come to the bottom radius of the fuse (ultimately inner surface of the bay door fiberglass layup) is irrelevant at this point. Those gaps/span will be filled by a 90 degree hinge mounting point when you connect the arms to the glass bay doors (when you get to that point).

This should get you through the day. If it doesn't, and this turns into a disaster... I don't want to hear about it!

Hahahaha.... I'm trying to extract memories of my build from 2009!

All kidding aside... just "tack" the torque tube mounts/plates into place with only 2 screws/side. After the bay doors have been cut and fit and mounted, you can make final adjustments as you test the operation of the doors. Once confirmed, finalize the installation with the remaining screws.

butlern

My Feedback: (15)

Yes, thanks, Larry.

When it comes to ripping the glass bay doors and hinging them, that info is found starting here:

#305

Noah

Kinner

I'm getting inspired again which is becoming more difficult in my senior years. Having reintroduced myself to this thread on the late CKellogg designed TBF, my creative juice is thawing.

Of late, I've taken a back door to building and flying for almost a year. My last club was many miles away and fraught with internal personality conflicts so I left them this year.

That written, my 1/3 scale Fleet is complete and looking for a buyer as it is just toooooo big. I'm reading all the good stuff here again with all the familiar names and will attempt to clean off the building board and FINALLY start the TBF build.

Other inspirations is a availability of full size WWII carrier borne aircraft working the volunteer staff at the USS Yorktown (CV10) here in the Cities harbor.

Now, to dust off all those niceties of gear, wood, cowls, etc. and fire up the heater in the garage.

Thanks for keeping it all alive.

Cheers

Ray W

redtail

My Feedback: (15)

Luv ya my brothers - will keep you both updated as I work my way, carefully, through this obstacle. Cutting the pads now, then figuring out the angle for the bushings soldered to the pads mounted on F-9. Holler at you both later this day. THANKS ​Chic

redtail

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Welcome Ray, there is a lot to learn from the Avenger fans: Noah, Larry, Peter, Boyd, etc. As you can see, I continue to learn from these guys and others. Chic