PropsnWings

My Feedback: (9)

I forgot to add my other question,  

iflywhenican

My Feedback: (1)

P&W...You can usually get the carbon fiber strips at your local hobby store. The answer to your second question, IMO would be a 50cc and no less. You could probably hover with a smaller engine, but your pullout would not be there.
Cut a new wing joiner out of either hardwood or pine and you would not need the carbon fiber. I used the suppplied joiner with Gorilla Glue and have not had any problems and I have been flying it since the beginning of this thread.

PropsnWings

My Feedback: (9)

Thanks! I sure appreciate the info. I may have a DA50 for it. (working a deal for seller to send to DA for inspection before I buy) I think that would be a nice combo.

a1pcfixer

My Feedback: (7)

I got my CF strips from a LHS, but they can be found online in various hobby shops. The mfg of mine is Midwest Products Co., Inc....a few miles away from me actually. Part #5744 - .092 x .220 x 24" $5.59

I cut (2) 6" strips, used my Dremel and a carbide router bit to create the 'trench', then used J-B Weld, and layed the strips into place. Afterwards, each sits maybe 1/16" below surface level. That's important (at least to me), so that when I epoxy the joiners into the wings, then some epoxy wil bond into the groove as well.

I'd considered a tube style piece of CF, but don't have a drill long enough. Ya'd think that after 30 years of being a machinist, I'd have every size, length, and size concievable.

As for why I did this; considering I'll have round abouts 2 grand wrapped up in it, such a simple mod seems so appropriate.
But, for every thing we strengthen, something else may then fail.

As to whether or not it's needed, Bob put it very well....
"Whether or not "needed", it is apparent that this is an area of improvement that could be made, with little hassle, little weight gain, possible significant strengthening of a very stressed joint. "

Btw, there's been only a few reports (in this thread) of wing failure, which might -or- might not be an issue to the majority of us. My take on it is why take the risk, when a simple fix is so easy.

As to hovering & eng choice, I'm running a DA-50r with smoke and two tanks and AUW of 16.5 lbs, and I can easily hover at around abouts 60% throttle. Pull-outs are easy!

a1pcfixer

My Feedback: (7)

Here's another 'mod' which hasn't (yet) been added to the list.

It's something that's NOT needed, but sure does make assembling at the flying field soooo much easier & quicker.....
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/fb.asp?m=10734614

Might want to drill out the two holes in the "aluminum wing rib" before assembling the top wing & epoxying.
Kinda hard to drill after assembly.

Got the idea after watching my friend assembling his at the field and his fumbling with wrenches and cussing the whole time.

bubbagates

My Feedback: (32)

I'd agree with everyone else so far. A decent 50cc and you'll have a mini-missile on your hands, start out with a 22x8 to get a decent pull and then move to a 22x10 or a 23x8, you want to keep the pitch down since any biplane is a draggy plane and needs pull to help it, not speed (higher pitch number = more speed). You definitely do not want to fly this plane fast, those are huge elevators and flutter is a very real possibility but it's slow speed abilities will astonish you. Be mindful of your throws as well, especially on the ailerons. The book throws are OK but on low rates it will still roll amazingly fast so be ready for it. You have 4 of those bad boys and they are powerful, though just a tad bit on the weak side in a hover. I've added some right thrust to mine to help with tracking and it seemed to help with torque rolling in a hover as well but then I fly IMAC and I am used to doing the trimming on all my planes and that means going way beyond the trim tabs on the TX.

I'd also do the wing joiners as well. CF works just fine but to me a better replacement is different wood. If you do use CF, then yes, epoxy is the way to go. I'd use at least 30 minute to give it time to soak into the wood as well. There will be more strength than shorter time epoxies and no difference in weight.

I used Gorilla Glue to join my wings, give the joiner area a nice mist of water, only a tiny bit, apply the glue, put everything together and tape the halves together tightly across the joint and not with the joint and babysit it for about 30 minutes or so as you will need to wipe away some of the foam every few minutes that you are going to get using rubbing alcohol. Once done, there is nothing that is going to separate the wings from each other. I did this with all of mine one but my first one was taken out in mid-air on approach and while totally destroyed, the wing joints did not separate one tiny bit, though everything around them was toast

PropsnWings

My Feedback: (9)

Well closed the deal on the DA-50-R .  Should see it in a week or so. Its being sent off to DA for a health check up before its final destination as my new power plant. 

a1pcfixer

My Feedback: (7)

I never (yet) used a TME, but have a Sullivan Skywriter on mine. If TME has worked well for you, stick with it.

If you have -or- want a smoke muffler, DA sells them pre-made, but I much prefer to simply drill & tap mine so I install the fitting in the hottest area of the muffler.

Here's some fittings;

http://www.troybuiltmodels.com/items...KEFITTING.html

http://shop.dubro.com/products/searc...x=0&submit.y=0

Now, as to where to locate your fitting. When the muffler is bolted on, the bolts pass through what's essentially two 'sleeves'.
I drill & tap mine so the fitting gets aimed at one of those bolt sleeves (above/below don't matter). You'll then have it located in THE hottest area of the muffler and aimed so the output gets sprayed.

Just be certain that it does NOT get any sort of direct aim to the exhaust port of you eng! That'll cause a engine flame out.

I've done mine as described above, and smoke output is AWESOME! I've had it where in a hover I couldn't see my bipe!

acerc

Just picked me up one of these ulti's. Read the thread and plan on a few of the mod's. Jim, I have gotten good advise from you on many other thread's so, what would you say would be an adequate cc without being overpowered. I don't fly hard/ extreme 3-D.

bubbagates

My Feedback: (32)

I don't know it the fuji 45cc is still around but that was the recommended engine and I had one and properly propped it dig well. It was heavier than a da50 and almost the same price. Stick around 40 to 45cc and if you stay reasonably light and you'll be fine

acerc

Just out of curiosity would a DLE 55 be to much or to heavy. I have one on the shelf.

huntndux

My Feedback: (11)

It will be a rocket. Thats a great engine for this plane

mstcitabria73

My Feedback: (1)

with the DLE55in the nose and3 servos in the tail my CG was dead on.........use it you will like it.

acerc

Ok, DLE 55 it is. Thank's gents.

PropsnWings

My Feedback: (9)

It so awesome to see interest in this bi plane still.  I have not started on mine yet, but have been reading this thread, and gathering all my components.  Power will be the DA50r  Using Power HD 9150's on Ail and Elev, with a Power HD 1218th on rudder.   Havent decided what to use for throttle yet.   Will be using my new JR 11X as guidance.

a1pcfixer

My Feedback: (7)

Yep, your DLE55 will be a great match!

Mine has a DA-50r, but if I were to do it again I'd use a DLE55....just to save some $$.
Both use the same bolt patterns for both the eng mounting & prop drilling.

On your DLE55 if you haven't yet dumped that crappy stock DLE/3 plug, do so and get a NGK/CM-6 spark plug.

Honda number is 98052-56471, it's an NGK CM-6 in a Honda box.
At the auto supply store it's (NGK/CM-6) listed as a Stock #5812

a1pcfixer

My Feedback: (7)

Bill,

Maybe you meant the Fuji 43?
Either way, Tower Hobbies no longer carries that brand nor will they service them.

The Fuji brand for us hobbyists is kaput! Parts will be hard to come by.
But it's claimed Fuji's commercial line will continue on.

bubbagates

My Feedback: (32)

Thanks for the correction Jim,

I never had much love for fuji but the 43 was a decent engine, at least the one I had I had it in the plane first then in the GP Cap232 but in the end the DA50 was the way to go. I also used a Brison 3.2 which basically was a 52 or 53cc (not really sure) which was a huge powerhouse on this plane as well but I do not think Brison is around anymore but then again, my knowledge with smaller gas engines and what is still around has twindled quite a bit since I'm pretty much a DA person any more using mainly 170cc and 200cc power plants

No doubt that any 50cc is the way to go on this plane, stuff one in the nose, use whatever spinner type you wish, personally I lite the CF Ultimate type of spinner the best but Aluminum works well (I did not use the included one at any time, seems a bit weak to me when tossing a good powerful gas engine in the plane), stuff the rudder servo in the tail, put everything else pretty much where the manual says and you'll be really close on balance with gobs over power. You can always throttle back to fly more scale like but there having the extra power is never a bad thing

a1pcfixer

My Feedback: (7)

Yeah it sure has a long standing history & GP STILL produces them!
Other bipes come & go.

First post here that started this msg thread was by drumbum on 8/8/2005, and here we are 6 & 1/2+ years later still going.
This GP Ultimate must be related to the Energizer Bunny!

acerc

Thank's Jim, PnW, and Bill. Meant to say reading thread. And after the past couple hours it seem's the 55 would be the best choice. As for the spark plug, been there done that. Buy cm6's at the local lawn shop for $4. Right now my only real concern is with servo torque. What is truly sufficient. And whether to stay with the stock pipe or get a pitt's wraparound.

a1pcfixer

My Feedback: (7)

Considering the large size of this plane's ail/elev surfaces I went with Hitch HS-5645MG's there, and for that barn door rudder it got a HS-5955TG (current #HS-7955TG). The manual has settings for Low & high rates for control throws, but for myself I set it up to have a low/mid/high(3D).
On 'mid' level flying at 1/3 throttle, barrel rolls look like a Waring blender on 'puree' setting......flat out awesome!.....and a bit scary, I love it!

As for the muffler; a couple years back my flying buddy & I went to the Toledo RC Show and he talked with the folks from DA at their booth, regarding getting more ooompf out of his DA-50 (his Yak weighs almost 19#! - my Ultimate w/smoke is about 16.5#). They told him their stock single pipe muffler netted almost 200 more rpm on that -vs- a pitts style wrap around. In actual real world you can't notice the difference, but it IS louder! Now you're using a DLE55, but the results might be similar I'd guess. However this bird looks best with a pitts. Food for thought.

When I put this Ultimate together TBM was carrying a pitts wrap around they called a "Silent Beauty" which was baffled (sort of). It's ever so slightly quieter than the std pitts on my DL50 in my SD/TOC-260 Extra. Not sure if anybody carries those now days. Stock pitts have the 2 stingers welded onto the expansion chamber. On that 'Silent Beauty' they go all the way inside that expansion chamber but have side holes drilled into each stinger.....hence my 'sort of baffled' statement.

PropsnWings

My Feedback: (9)

What you using for throttle servo?  I, in the past have used just some cheapy  plastic analog that was laying around, but I can see where I might want to use metal gear and speedy for 3Ding.

mstcitabria73

My Feedback: (1)

acerc,
I used the following Hitecservos;
Ailerons-5625 MG 1ea. (4)
Elevator-5985 MG 1ea. (2)
Rudder-7954 SH 1 ea.
Throttle-HS 635 1ea.

a1pcfixer

My Feedback: (7)

HS-65MG, touted as being somewhat shockproof.
Used by many 3D/profile fliers.

Cheaper, lesser servos can be used, but consider that after all is said & done
it IS controlling a rather important feature of your model....the throttle!

acerc

Thank's for the support guy's. But taking into consideration the mfg only call's for 50oz I'm going with Futaba 3010's. I have those on a 20cc profile and do very well with the size of control surface on it. If it don't go well with this ultimate I will let you all know and you all can say you told me so. I have a number of gas powered and never had a servo fail because of nylon gear's. We'll see with this one.
Again Thank's, Robert