An Incident with Lessons for All of Us
10-19-2010 | 07:13 PM
#76
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From: Rockford,
MI
RE: An Incident with Lessons for All of Us
Our club used to share a field with full scale aircraft. Common sense should tell you, or hopefully a spotter with any brains, to get your model grounded immediately when full scale aircraft are present. And as for the $5k that was lost, oh well, lucky he didn't kill anyone showing off. Guess common sense isn't all that common.
10-19-2010 | 07:20 PM
#77
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RE: An Incident with Lessons for All of Us
ORIGINAL: wahoo
I'm not here to bash anyone or try to persuade anyone one on their choices in this hobby but I will say that some of the posts in this thread are ridiculous. <div>
</div><div>I won't name any names but ''the way were brought up'' as in flying level ''circuits'' around the ''pattern''. Golly gee that sounds like loads of fun !!! And GOD FORBID they had better be all left hand circuits too !!!! Why not just stay home on Sunday and watch nascar ?</div><div>
</div><div>As far as 3D being dangerous... I call BS. Personally I feel much safer flying or even <span style=''font-family: arial, sans-serif; line-height: 19px; ''><em size=''2'' style=''font-style: normal; ''>spectating[/i]</span> at a 3D event then to be in the air or even anywhere near some of the FOG circle jerks that so highly despise other forms of this hobby which we all love AND should be able to enjoy. </div><div>
</div><div>I truly enjoyed one persons thought that 3D flying is basically a mishap waiting to happen and always on the verge of a crash. Again I'll call BS. Some (NOT ALL) 3D pilots have skills far outweighing those of the casual sunday circle fliers.</div><div>
</div><div>Lastly I'd love to be at some of the fields these ''armchair aviators'' fly at and see just how many would ''ditch'' their trainer or 40 size warslug when I yelled there was a FS approaching. What makes me laugh is how many times I've personally had to duck and run from an out of control plane where the pilot was trying to save it at all costs. And these are the same self righteous ones that are telling someone THAT WAS ASKED TO PERFORM FOR THIS EVENT to ditch his 42% model. </div><div>
</div><div>Mistakes were made and lives were in the balance but some of those in this forum are way out of line. I'm just glad no one was injured or killed.</div><div>
</div><div>My ¢.02</div><div>wahoo</div><div>
</div><div>
</div>
I'm not here to bash anyone or try to persuade anyone one on their choices in this hobby but I will say that some of the posts in this thread are ridiculous. <div>
</div><div>I won't name any names but ''the way were brought up'' as in flying level ''circuits'' around the ''pattern''. Golly gee that sounds like loads of fun !!! And GOD FORBID they had better be all left hand circuits too !!!! Why not just stay home on Sunday and watch nascar ?</div><div>
</div><div>As far as 3D being dangerous... I call BS. Personally I feel much safer flying or even <span style=''font-family: arial, sans-serif; line-height: 19px; ''><em size=''2'' style=''font-style: normal; ''>spectating[/i]</span> at a 3D event then to be in the air or even anywhere near some of the FOG circle jerks that so highly despise other forms of this hobby which we all love AND should be able to enjoy. </div><div>
</div><div>I truly enjoyed one persons thought that 3D flying is basically a mishap waiting to happen and always on the verge of a crash. Again I'll call BS. Some (NOT ALL) 3D pilots have skills far outweighing those of the casual sunday circle fliers.</div><div>
</div><div>Lastly I'd love to be at some of the fields these ''armchair aviators'' fly at and see just how many would ''ditch'' their trainer or 40 size warslug when I yelled there was a FS approaching. What makes me laugh is how many times I've personally had to duck and run from an out of control plane where the pilot was trying to save it at all costs. And these are the same self righteous ones that are telling someone THAT WAS ASKED TO PERFORM FOR THIS EVENT to ditch his 42% model. </div><div>
</div><div>Mistakes were made and lives were in the balance but some of those in this forum are way out of line. I'm just glad no one was injured or killed.</div><div>
</div><div>My ¢.02</div><div>wahoo</div><div>
</div><div>
</div>
But you saod one thing that's a real idea. 3D SHOULD be flown at their own fields and in their own events so they do not threaten the fields and the hobby for responsible standard-RC individuals.
That's why it's not the older, tamer, more boring folks who have higher insurance rates. What, you THINK we like flying in a pattern? We find ways to work other stuff into the pattern. We don't just go straight up through it and make everybody scatter. I know that's YOUR idea of fun, but I'm going to go way out on a limb here and say that I don't think that most of the rest of us regular flyers enjoy that too much. When clubs don't DO SOMETHING about guys who like that stuff, we find new clubs.
But I'm probably going a little hard on you, because you said that the Air boss should have made him land and you said that it should have been on the ground. Right on both counts and darn it all, it shows that at least ONE of you dang 3Ders have a responsible bone in your body. Maybe.
~ Jim ~
10-19-2010 | 07:20 PM
#78
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From: Napoleon, OH
RE: An Incident with Lessons for All of Us
This is so simple I can't understand the debate. The so called "Air Boss" totally lost control of the event, resulting in the near loss of 2 lives. Then the RC pilot whines and moans about losing his $8000 airplane. Are you kidding me???? These folks should be thanking God people didn't die, instead of placing blame when they were completely at fault. No doubt this will have a very negative impact on model aviation.
How this situation ever arose is beyond the realm of responsible thinking.
How this situation ever arose is beyond the realm of responsible thinking.
10-19-2010 | 08:24 PM
#79
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RE: An Incident with Lessons for All of Us
ORIGINAL: TexasSkyPilot
Yeah, working within the rules we've all done well by WOULD irritate you, no doubt about that. As far as being a spectator and feeling safe, I'll bet you would have loved the 3D event we're talking about here. I know the guy in the Bipe felt quite safe.
But you saod one thing that's a real idea. 3D SHOULD be flown at their own fields and in their own events so they do not threaten the fields and the hobby for responsible standard-RC individuals.
That's why it's not the older, tamer, more boring folks who have higher insurance rates. What, you THINK we like flying in a pattern? We find ways to work other stuff into the pattern. We don't just go straight up through it and make everybody scatter. I know that's YOUR idea of fun, but I'm going to go way out on a limb here and say that I don't think that most of the rest of us regular flyers enjoy that too much. When clubs don't DO SOMETHING about guys who like that stuff, we find new clubs.
But I'm probably going a little hard on you, because you said that the Air boss should have made him land and you said that it should have been on the ground. Right on both counts and darn it all, it shows that at least ONE of you dang 3Ders have a responsible bone in your body. Maybe.
~ Jim ~
Yeah, working within the rules we've all done well by WOULD irritate you, no doubt about that. As far as being a spectator and feeling safe, I'll bet you would have loved the 3D event we're talking about here. I know the guy in the Bipe felt quite safe.
But you saod one thing that's a real idea. 3D SHOULD be flown at their own fields and in their own events so they do not threaten the fields and the hobby for responsible standard-RC individuals.
That's why it's not the older, tamer, more boring folks who have higher insurance rates. What, you THINK we like flying in a pattern? We find ways to work other stuff into the pattern. We don't just go straight up through it and make everybody scatter. I know that's YOUR idea of fun, but I'm going to go way out on a limb here and say that I don't think that most of the rest of us regular flyers enjoy that too much. When clubs don't DO SOMETHING about guys who like that stuff, we find new clubs.
But I'm probably going a little hard on you, because you said that the Air boss should have made him land and you said that it should have been on the ground. Right on both counts and darn it all, it shows that at least ONE of you dang 3Ders have a responsible bone in your body. Maybe.
~ Jim ~
<span style="font-family: 'Comic Sans MS'; ">Where did I say that 3D should be flown at their own field and in their own events ?
What does insurance premiums have to do with the price of tea in China ?
Why is it you feel that you were hard on me ?
What makes you think all I do is fly 3d ? Do you know me ?
Wow is all I can say<br type="_moz" /></span><br type="_moz" />
10-19-2010 | 08:28 PM
#80
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RE: An Incident with Lessons for All of Us
Ok guys, time to step in here. I'm not pointing any fingers at anybody, but the direction this thread is taking is one that we don't need here. We're not going to get into a fight over the virtues of any type of flying over any other. Also, we're not going let this thread digress into the "who done wrong" in the original incident. There are several threads on RCU that have already discussed the incident to death.
Ken
Ken
10-19-2010 | 09:16 PM
#82
RE: An Incident with Lessons for All of Us
ORIGINAL: Silent-AV8R
Just trying to be clear that the accomplishment was Mr. Hill's. He was the one who set the plane to do what it did. Dave Brown was an observer. It beats me what your point is about him ''saving everybody'' is.
Just trying to be clear that the accomplishment was Mr. Hill's. He was the one who set the plane to do what it did. Dave Brown was an observer. It beats me what your point is about him ''saving everybody'' is.
IIRC Dave Brown actually participated in the event/accomplishment...I think he was the one to regain radio control of the model after a visual was made and actually effected the landing in Ireland to complete the flight.
Is that not right?
10-19-2010 | 11:29 PM
#84
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From: Athabasca,
AB, CANADA
RE: An Incident with Lessons for All of Us
I feel the RC pilot and "Air boss" is to blame.
FS pilots have the right of way "period" at any air field or private airport, end of story. FAA will rule this.
The reason why is what if the pilot had radio issues, mechanical issues, etc he must land. In this case the pilot stated his intentions by flying over the air field that he needed to land, the first pass was ignored by the air boss and RC pilot whom should have landed not knowing why that plane flew over. FS has right of way.
Here is an example of plain stupidity in my own back yard regarding water bombers and leasure crafts on lakes. There was a forrest fire on crown land. This lake is populated, and in plain sight on the horrizon was smoke. The news did say firebans were in place and all.
The water bomber was cabable of scooping from the lake, but the boaters stopped dead in the water to admire the site, and also just kept skit skatting across the lake where the bomber wanted to go. So the bomber called off the run due to stupidity and had to make the 1 hr trip back to base to reload.
very sad, 2 examples of classic stupidity on part of the human race, always what if's and why me, why not do that wa wa wa crap.
vent done. I hope the RC pilot and air boss are both sued in this case.
BTW, it would have cost the FS pilot a load of dough to land else where... bet alot of you don't know that. It is called a landing fee...
FS pilots have the right of way "period" at any air field or private airport, end of story. FAA will rule this.
The reason why is what if the pilot had radio issues, mechanical issues, etc he must land. In this case the pilot stated his intentions by flying over the air field that he needed to land, the first pass was ignored by the air boss and RC pilot whom should have landed not knowing why that plane flew over. FS has right of way.
Here is an example of plain stupidity in my own back yard regarding water bombers and leasure crafts on lakes. There was a forrest fire on crown land. This lake is populated, and in plain sight on the horrizon was smoke. The news did say firebans were in place and all.
The water bomber was cabable of scooping from the lake, but the boaters stopped dead in the water to admire the site, and also just kept skit skatting across the lake where the bomber wanted to go. So the bomber called off the run due to stupidity and had to make the 1 hr trip back to base to reload.
very sad, 2 examples of classic stupidity on part of the human race, always what if's and why me, why not do that wa wa wa crap.
vent done. I hope the RC pilot and air boss are both sued in this case.
BTW, it would have cost the FS pilot a load of dough to land else where... bet alot of you don't know that. It is called a landing fee...
10-20-2010 | 12:44 AM
#85
RE: An Incident with Lessons for All of Us
I fly at a FS airport adjacent to an active runway and we fly over it with our runway right next to that active runway. The airport "REQUIRES" us to land if a full scale is in the area. We are REQUIRED to have a dedicated spotter. We have an excellent relationship with the airport by following them two requirements.
You know what. We have never had as much as close call. If a FS plane is spotted whoever sees it first yells "FULL SCALE" and the direction. The FS can be heard long before it is a "CRITICAL PROBLEM". Doesn't matter if there is 3d going on or not. You have to have "locational awareness". R/C Planes then land we have safely landed as many as seven airplanes before the full scale got to the runway. I have sat on our runway with engine idling waiting for the full scale to land. After it lands or flies by and clears the area I can then go back up. Many of the local full scale pilota will wave at us as they go by. Our planes are on the ground. And we watch them land and laugh when they bounce.
Had them two requirements been followed. This incident would have never happened. There is plenty of blame to go around for this incident. Unfornuately the R/C pilot will probably bear the brunt of it.
Safety and common sense work hand in hand. Unfornuately that day little of either was used. The only good thing no injuries.
You know what. We have never had as much as close call. If a FS plane is spotted whoever sees it first yells "FULL SCALE" and the direction. The FS can be heard long before it is a "CRITICAL PROBLEM". Doesn't matter if there is 3d going on or not. You have to have "locational awareness". R/C Planes then land we have safely landed as many as seven airplanes before the full scale got to the runway. I have sat on our runway with engine idling waiting for the full scale to land. After it lands or flies by and clears the area I can then go back up. Many of the local full scale pilota will wave at us as they go by. Our planes are on the ground. And we watch them land and laugh when they bounce.
Had them two requirements been followed. This incident would have never happened. There is plenty of blame to go around for this incident. Unfornuately the R/C pilot will probably bear the brunt of it.
Safety and common sense work hand in hand. Unfornuately that day little of either was used. The only good thing no injuries.
10-20-2010 | 06:20 AM
#86
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From: No City,
RE: An Incident with Lessons for All of Us
I learned to fly RC at a full scale airport. In spite of flying RC for many years at an active full scale runway, I never witnessed or heard of any event where an RC model was even remotely near a full scale airplane. The model aircraft operation was safe because the RC pilots (nearly all I flew with were also full scale pilots) were responsible people. If full scale entered the pattern, or even if an airplane happened to be flying by at altitude, the model aircraft land immediately. It really can't be any safer or easier when responsible people are involved. Unfortunately, the recent incident in Colorado proves our sport/hobby does not always involve people capable of normal levels of responsibility.
Actually, incidents such as the Colorado event are what brings us ever closer to regulation and licensing. And why wouldn't it? Here are three people, FS pilot, air boss and RC pilot all participating and responsible for the potential loss of life and property in an operation that should be properly regulated and licensed. What I'm saying is simple - if full scale and model aircraft share airspace the model aircraft pilot should be licensed. I'm the last person on earth that thinks we need more government regulation, but this incident sadly shows how foolishly irresponsible people can be.
And the popular question, who's most to blame? Follow the bouncing ball of potential law suits. Which of the three individuals has the least leverage, the least number of people to sue? Obviously the air boss is odd man out.
Actually, incidents such as the Colorado event are what brings us ever closer to regulation and licensing. And why wouldn't it? Here are three people, FS pilot, air boss and RC pilot all participating and responsible for the potential loss of life and property in an operation that should be properly regulated and licensed. What I'm saying is simple - if full scale and model aircraft share airspace the model aircraft pilot should be licensed. I'm the last person on earth that thinks we need more government regulation, but this incident sadly shows how foolishly irresponsible people can be.
And the popular question, who's most to blame? Follow the bouncing ball of potential law suits. Which of the three individuals has the least leverage, the least number of people to sue? Obviously the air boss is odd man out.
10-20-2010 | 07:33 AM
#87
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From: newbury,
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RE: An Incident with Lessons for All of Us
Dragging Dave Brown and Maynard Hill into THIS thread is really out of line, PERIOD, and here's why. The "implication" is that the record attempts Hill and Brown accomplished, whether for the trans oceanic flight, record altitude etc, were done in a "reckless" manner with no reguard to the publics safety. Comparing their accomplishments to "showboating" at a fly in at over active FS runway is a perfect example of "apples to oranges". I read the original account of the ocean crossing record attempt, and there was a lot of planning and assurances that the attempt would in fact be safe.
In 1963 when Hill set an altitude record of 13,328 feet, he had the help AND PLANNING of many learned individuals AND organizations. It was the US Navy that provided the anti-aircraft gun fitted with high power binoculars for Maynard to track his plane during the altitude record setting flight, and I think it was Pro Line who highly modified the transmitter to extend its range. And it was flown at a Naval base if my memory serves me correctly. You don't get that kind of help doing something to "showboat" your talents. The "mods" to the TX alone violated the FCC rules about power output but the FCC gave a waiver for the attempt.
These and other statements on these threads are what make them "useless" if "facts" aren't presented. These are the "things" people that have been in the hobby for a long time know about having lived through them. "Things" that some are using to support their views on a current problem, that in reality have NOTHING in common.
In 1963 when Hill set an altitude record of 13,328 feet, he had the help AND PLANNING of many learned individuals AND organizations. It was the US Navy that provided the anti-aircraft gun fitted with high power binoculars for Maynard to track his plane during the altitude record setting flight, and I think it was Pro Line who highly modified the transmitter to extend its range. And it was flown at a Naval base if my memory serves me correctly. You don't get that kind of help doing something to "showboat" your talents. The "mods" to the TX alone violated the FCC rules about power output but the FCC gave a waiver for the attempt.
These and other statements on these threads are what make them "useless" if "facts" aren't presented. These are the "things" people that have been in the hobby for a long time know about having lived through them. "Things" that some are using to support their views on a current problem, that in reality have NOTHING in common.
10-20-2010 | 07:35 AM
#88
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RE: An Incident with Lessons for All of Us
I'm glad it was a 3d plane that got hit. The alternatives are much worse, say a giant scale warbird or jet flying full throttle directly into the FS which could have easily been the case at an event such as this one!!! We were all LUCKY that it was a lightly built, hovering slowly RC plane!!
Think what would have happened if it was a 50% Hempel cub or a COMPOSITE, comp arf Corsair!!!!
ALL PARTIES were at fault but the main responsible party was the airboss. He was totally out of control. Just to see how badly, watch the video to the end and you'll see people going across the runway picking up the pieces IN FRONT OF A TAXYING FULL SCALE T6!!!!
Think what would have happened if it was a 50% Hempel cub or a COMPOSITE, comp arf Corsair!!!!
ALL PARTIES were at fault but the main responsible party was the airboss. He was totally out of control. Just to see how badly, watch the video to the end and you'll see people going across the runway picking up the pieces IN FRONT OF A TAXYING FULL SCALE T6!!!!
10-20-2010 | 08:18 AM
#89
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RE: An Incident with Lessons for All of Us
ORIGINAL: Gooseman240
I feel the RC pilot and ''Air boss'' is to blame.
FS pilots have the right of way ''period'' at any air field or private airport, end of story. FAA will rule this.
The reason why is what if the pilot had radio issues, mechanical issues, etc he must land. In this case the pilot stated his intentions by flying over the air field that he needed to land, the first pass was ignored by the air boss and RC pilot whom should have landed not knowing why that plane flew over. FS has right of way.
Here is an example of plain stupidity in my own back yard regarding water bombers and leasure crafts on lakes. There was a forrest fire on crown land. This lake is populated, and in plain sight on the horrizon was smoke. The news did say firebans were in place and all.
The water bomber was cabable of scooping from the lake, but the boaters stopped dead in the water to admire the site, and also just kept skit skatting across the lake where the bomber wanted to go. So the bomber called off the run due to stupidity and had to make the 1 hr trip back to base to reload.
very sad, 2 examples of classic stupidity on part of the human race, always what if's and why me, why not do that wa wa wa crap.
vent done. I hope the RC pilot and air boss are both sued in this case.
BTW, it would have cost the FS pilot a load of dough to land else where... bet alot of you don't know that. It is called a landing fee...
I feel the RC pilot and ''Air boss'' is to blame.
FS pilots have the right of way ''period'' at any air field or private airport, end of story. FAA will rule this.
The reason why is what if the pilot had radio issues, mechanical issues, etc he must land. In this case the pilot stated his intentions by flying over the air field that he needed to land, the first pass was ignored by the air boss and RC pilot whom should have landed not knowing why that plane flew over. FS has right of way.
Here is an example of plain stupidity in my own back yard regarding water bombers and leasure crafts on lakes. There was a forrest fire on crown land. This lake is populated, and in plain sight on the horrizon was smoke. The news did say firebans were in place and all.
The water bomber was cabable of scooping from the lake, but the boaters stopped dead in the water to admire the site, and also just kept skit skatting across the lake where the bomber wanted to go. So the bomber called off the run due to stupidity and had to make the 1 hr trip back to base to reload.
very sad, 2 examples of classic stupidity on part of the human race, always what if's and why me, why not do that wa wa wa crap.
vent done. I hope the RC pilot and air boss are both sued in this case.
BTW, it would have cost the FS pilot a load of dough to land else where... bet alot of you don't know that. It is called a landing fee...
We as RCers simply do not have any rights to that air...we are at all times interlopers and there only by permission.... and when we sign up for our AMA number we clearly agree to that. And that is as it should be. Any aircraft with humans onboard ALWAYS and INSTANTLY takes preference. No amount of money spent on an RC plane changes that.
It would be crazy to say the RC pilot didn't do anything wrong staying in the air and trying to save his plane, yet a few here are saying exactly that.
And that makes my point exactly. That's human nature. We follow urges. Rules are in place to keep those very human human-nature urges in check, and keep people alive. That's why the airboss should be in trouble, he didn't do his job, and there was also a failing at the planning stages. The RC pilot should be in lots of trouble as well. He knew there was a plane in the area, and he knew he was still flying. He knew he was breaking rules. Doing so with the blessings of the Air Boss who is not doing his job is still no excuse. Though ultimately, I believe the Air Boss is where the buck will stop, due to his being in charge and making really bad choices right then.
Unfortunately, since it was not an AMA-sanctioned event, we won't have the benefit of AMA involvement, other than for AMA to make a very pointed statement that they were at no time involved in this unfortunate series of events that lead up to this collision. So our information is going to have to come to us through other sources.
I think we know enough to know that lots of things happened that should not have happened. And that most of them were done by RCers, unfortunately.
~ Jim ~ [
]
10-20-2010 | 08:39 AM
#90
RE: An Incident with Lessons for All of Us
ORIGINAL: tinner1
Dragging Dave Brown and Maynard Hill into THIS thread is really out of line, PERIOD, and here's why. The ''implication'' is that the record attempts Hill and Brown accomplished, whether for the trans oceanic flight, record altitude etc, were done in a ''reckless'' manner with no reguard to the publics safety.
Dragging Dave Brown and Maynard Hill into THIS thread is really out of line, PERIOD, and here's why. The ''implication'' is that the record attempts Hill and Brown accomplished, whether for the trans oceanic flight, record altitude etc, were done in a ''reckless'' manner with no reguard to the publics safety.
My intent was not to imply that any of the record breaking flights were reckless but if any of them had the unfortunate occasion to collide with a full scale aircraft or an automobile or even a guy on a horse things would have been looked at much differently but since nothing like that happened they are considered "cool" as the event that occurred recently would have if the biplane had successfully done a “fly by†with the smoke on over the hovering model.
My point...had the two aircraft not collided there would have been a cheering crowd and no discussion on the forums about how reckless “whoever†was...
For us to set here now and try to point fingers is a waste...in the end it will matter none what we think about who is at fault...now, maybe we should direct our attention to those things occurring right now that has the potential of a similar outcome or worse.
10-20-2010 | 09:16 AM
#91
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RE: An Incident with Lessons for All of Us
My point...had the two aircraft not collided there would have been a cheering crowd and no discussion on the forums about how reckless “whoever†was...
And its corresponding point-
Maynard-Dave took part in something that they would have been pike-foisted over had there been a collision,
but rather than looking at that and saying they should never do such a reckless thing,
they are a heros for attempting it
Had there been better coms in colorado,
the model would have finished getting off the runway & into the infield before the FS turned to final,
the FS could have landed (aka HotDog Smokey Hispeed 40' Crowdbuzz)
and everyone would blog about what a great show it was and we should do it again next year
10-20-2010 | 09:21 AM
#92
RE: An Incident with Lessons for All of Us
I have resisted my comments, so i will keep them positive, I hope!!
The full scale guy flew his damaged aircraft back to his home airport with known damage when he was right over an airport, Where he could have landed safely but with lots of imbarrasement I would think. NTSB involvement, probility not. FAA investagation will be small due to the $ value of the damage to the aircraft.
R/C demos at a private airport, the AMA has no control over. I would think if you were flyin over the edge of the runway you would be over the airpark homes or over the crowd and parked airplanes. not a lot of room for error.
My comments made as a R/Cer AMA CD, Licensed Pilot, airpark home owner and FAA Designee
Now lets go flying and do it SAFELY.....
The full scale guy flew his damaged aircraft back to his home airport with known damage when he was right over an airport, Where he could have landed safely but with lots of imbarrasement I would think. NTSB involvement, probility not. FAA investagation will be small due to the $ value of the damage to the aircraft.
R/C demos at a private airport, the AMA has no control over. I would think if you were flyin over the edge of the runway you would be over the airpark homes or over the crowd and parked airplanes. not a lot of room for error.
My comments made as a R/Cer AMA CD, Licensed Pilot, airpark home owner and FAA Designee
Now lets go flying and do it SAFELY.....
10-20-2010 | 09:23 AM
#93
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RE: An Incident with Lessons for All of Us
The full scale guy flew his damaged aircraft back to his home airport with known damage when he was right over an airport,
10-20-2010 | 09:24 AM
#94
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RE: An Incident with Lessons for All of Us
My guess however, is that they did their attempt appropriately, with NOTAMs to pilots thru the FAA and other government entities, and stringent attention to details such as altitude enforcement. You are comparing apples to oranges here. you can bet if there had been an incident it would have been publicized, but at LEAST they probably were obeying all the rules and safety codes which are currently in place. That is the difference in these two events. there was no adherence to safety protocols, nor common sense, and it almost ended in a catastrophe.
10-20-2010 | 09:27 AM
#96
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RE: An Incident with Lessons for All of Us
Doc
I never saw anything credible that the RC pilot REFUSED to yeild,
but that he was caught unawares and didnt have enough time to complete his attempt to yield.
As such,
what does AC91-57 say about being within 3miles of an airport? ... and who was the radioguy-airboss?
That is the difference in these two events. there was no adherence to safety protocols, nor common sense,
but that he was caught unawares and didnt have enough time to complete his attempt to yield.
As such,
what does AC91-57 say about being within 3miles of an airport? ... and who was the radioguy-airboss?
10-20-2010 | 09:34 AM
#97
My Feedback: (102)
RE: An Incident with Lessons for All of Us
I believe in the "common sense" category, and with adherance to the AMA safety code, if and when a full scale airplane entered the pattern, or the immediate area, he should have landed. He should also have been utilizing a dedicated spotter, at least someone who was not also trying to communicate on a radio sevral yards away from modeler. Sometimes all it takes is a little common sense to keep yourself out of trouble and avoid an accident. There is plenty of blame to go around, but if you are flying at an event like this, refuse to fly your routine if there will be full size planes in the pattern or immediate area. I have been in a similar situation and learned my lesson.
10-20-2010 | 09:45 AM
#98
RE: An Incident with Lessons for All of Us
ORIGINAL: DocYates
you can bet if there had been an incident it would have been publicized, but at LEAST they probably were obeying all the rules and safety codes which are currently in place. That is the difference in these two events.
you can bet if there had been an incident it would have been publicized, but at LEAST they probably were obeying all the rules and safety codes which are currently in place. That is the difference in these two events.
10-20-2010 | 09:57 AM
#100
My Feedback: (102)
RE: An Incident with Lessons for All of Us
No you are trying to make an orange an apple. I said, they were obeying the rules. Call up and ask if they notified the FAA of their intentions. If they had the proper permits.
Do the same with the Colorado incident. See if a NOTAM was issued, and if all the pilots and participants were briefed on what to do and when to do it.
That is what seperates the apple from the orange.
You are trying to pull the AMA into the fray by saying they committed an act with lack of regard for safety, and believe you are mistaken.
Do the same with the Colorado incident. See if a NOTAM was issued, and if all the pilots and participants were briefed on what to do and when to do it.
That is what seperates the apple from the orange.
You are trying to pull the AMA into the fray by saying they committed an act with lack of regard for safety, and believe you are mistaken.
