I finally got to Maiden my Extra 330L and it was great with the C of G at 80mm it was spot on!!! But i had a crash as i lost power from the engine!!! It was a 34 Deg (C) day and the motor cooked I made a mod to get more air into the cowl by cutting out the bottom..
I also added guides for the elevator rod as i was shown how the elevator can act as alirons at high speed..
PEZ

Hi Guys,

I got this plane as a gift... last Christmas. Finally like many of you I got around to building it. First off I didn't like the way the white canopy trim set with me. It is just wrong in that it makes the canopy buldgy and fat looking. So I scraped it all off and AH.... much BEEEEEETTER. Oh enough with the nit-pikin....

Power for me is an OS 70 surpass II. I have one on my YAK 54 (version 1) and it does the job WELL. Prop I have on the YAK is a 14x4W, but this Extra being heavier and wanting to be flown on the wing, I am going to attempt the 14x6 prop. Also I got rid of the stock wheels, and slapped on some 3inchers... I think, but they are huge as I fly off of grass... I hate the way they look at the moment, but I was convinced by some others that this was the way to go.... also got a sullivan tail-wheel on.

Anywho, I am going to take a look at the CG tomorrow and also reinforcing the root as I don't want my wing to snap off during flight. Thinking that the maiden will be this Sunday 1/11/09 we will try to take pictures... maybe a movie, but at least I full flight report thereafter!

Since there is a TOTAL LACK OF PICTURES of this plane on the web... or ones not working at the moment, I thought I would contribute some shots I took :P

Don't you agree that the canopy looks better this way?

Oh yeah I made a false twin-engine doubling as a baffle to direct air thru the engine. Hehehe. I got tricky with my camera, and paint skillllllz... oh yeah! :P









I am proud of my cowl cut-out here, looks like a manta-mouth or something...


That is about it for now. I am hoping that I can handle this plane. 'Had my hands on some pretty FATTY/HEAVY planes in the past that tip stall like a mo-fo.... should be fun!!!

Your plane looks really good. I like how you scraped the white trim off of the canopy. It makes it look much slicker. I am very interested in what you have your CG set at. I am sitting right at 96mm or 3.75 inches, but I have read that people have had luck with the CG as low as 80mm and as high as 110mm. I am running an OS .61fx with a pitts muffler, and my total weight is 6.4 pounds dry. I was hoping to maiden this weekend, but the wind has been over 20mph. I thought that the main wings felt a little flimsy at the root, so I put some single sided foam tape between the fuse and the wing (I have to be able to remove the wings for transport). This made a HUGE improvement in how they seat on the fuse. I also added some 3/4" washers in place of the 4mm washers to bolt the wings down on the inside to give a little more surface area to hold on to. It now feels as sturdy as if they were glued in place. Here are a couple pictures of my plane, finally done !!!!

This is a picture of the foam tape on the wing, and the washers:





Here is the engine, minus the muffler.



And a couple pictures of the plane itself all put together.

Sweet pictures!!! I like the red color scheme! First one I have seen that's for sure As for the CG, I at 95mm dry just at the manual says, I am glad that you said you are right at 96mm! With a full tank we should both be ~90mm. I have not weighed mine yet, I don't have a scale right now. I just tried to start mine up this morning, but I think my glow starter needs a good charge, didn't get a single "pop" out of my engine. Hmmmmm.

Good luck on flying this weekend! Hope that you get to go out there. Weather for me looks pretty bad, and COOOOOOLD. We'll see.

BTW nice pitt muffler, that is too cool and I am sure it is going to sound fantastic, too!

I actually broke the engine in with the Pitts muffler on, and it does sound AWESOME!!

I had the choice between the blue extra and the red one, and decided to go with the red because I thought I may lose the blue one in the sky. What's funny is that every plane I have owned (this is my fourth) has been red and white, so this one fit right in.

I hope that the glow starter is all that is wrong with your plane. I had a blast taxiing up and down my street while I broke my engine in. This plane has great lines, and a great eye catching color scheme, and looks great moving.

I feel that our CG is correct. I hope so anyways, as I have read that the CG will make this a great plane if it's right, and a huge dud if it's not.

Please keep me/us posted on the maiden, and I will do the same. I sure was happy to see this post resurrected.

Well.... too windy today 10 mph... would be doable but not fun. I think tomorrow we'll have more sun and half the wind!

Did you fly yours today, bonebreak?

No, I didn't get to fly. I work Sun-Wed, so thursday will be the earliest I will be able to maiden. I agree with the 10mph wind. I hate having to make the minor adjustments for the wind, but I sure do like the extra lift I get on takeoff's and landings. With as fast as everyone says this thing lands, I may welcome the wind to help slow her down a little. I know I am super excited to get this thing in the air. Hopefully tomorrow will treat you right, and you can fly.

So the weather was... decent today. Cloudy and cold with only a 5 mph breeze, no gusting. But I got to maiden the Extra! I actually got to get three great flights in! I had an awesome time with the plane. Got the maiden flight all spliced together on video and put it on youtube already so go ahead and watch that please (link below). It is a very sharp plane out there in the air. Take offs are great, unreal with the OS 70 surpass II. LOTS of authority in every direction. ELEVATOR was slightly touchier than I am used to, due to shorter tail moment. Roll rate is lightning fast at full throttle and still amazing at 1/3-throttle. Slow flight was not THAAAAT slow, but controllable. The wings DO start getting tippy but never fully tip-stalled on me once. Landings are fast, I don't think it is possible to land this plane "3-point" style with the CG at 95mm. "Two-points" are the way to go for now. The CG at 95mm dry is a great start, might push it even farther back to maybe 105mm later on. OK OK OK, Enough jibber-jabber...

...Here is the video!
[link=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dcJA0PkxOXo]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dcJA0PkxOXo[/link]

Hope you enjoyed it! I did!!!

~Jeremy

WOW!!! Great flying!! I really liked the take-off, straight up, and with authority. I have a question. When do the wings get tip stally? On your final, or flying in general? I didn't see any tip-age in the video.

So, do you think I should pull my CG back closer to 100mm, or keep it at 96mm?

Thanks for posting the video, and for the flight report. It sure was nice to see it in action!! I am hoping to maiden this weekend. I hope the weather will hold out for me.

Thanks for the compliments !!! The wings will start to get tippy or see-saw back and forth once you cut the throttle to around 25%, and you try to maintain altitude (a nose high slow flight with the wings alternately going left and right every second or so is what it turns out to be). You will see, try it high and just be ready with getting out with throttle and a slight down-elevator if needed. This thing is on rails at any throttle above 25% [&:] The decent rate of this plane at idle is STEEP, keep that nose down and keep the speed at all costs, tippy wings down low and slow to the ground is bad. Hahahahaha.

As far as the CG I would say that you are best off at where you are 96mm for the first time out. If you running off of grass too, you just need to have a lot of up-elevator while taxiing, or you will nose in. This is mostly due to the high main-gear, but CG is part of it.

Oh yeah one last thing, if you are going with full throws on the elevator as the manual shows, be sure to have either your dual-rates set up with nice and low throws for low-rates, OR have a ridiculously high about of exponentials dialed in. I was at full throws or more on elevator, with 55% expo's this first flight, not bad, but I dialed it up to 70% for the second and third flights [X(]

Your welcome!

I actually have triple rates set up already, with expo dialed in on all three. I had read elsewhere that the elevator control was very sensitive, and adjusted the rates to avoid any unexpected snaps. I cant wait to get out there and fly her. She should be a rocket with my .61 in it!!

I also wanted to ask if you used the quick connectors included with the kit for the ailerons? I have them installed currently, and put some blue thread locker on them, and then a dot of super-glue on the tips for safe measures. I am still debating however on buying new rods, and using a Z bend instead.

Did you measure your CG right side up or upside down?

Great you got your rates all set... btw what are triple rates? Utilizes the three-way switch? Your 61fx is going to be a potent engine for this I think. Fast and great sounding.

I used these connectors on all surfaces, control-horn side:

And then I did use the quick connectors on almost all servo-arms.

I measured CG right side up.

Did you thicken up your wing-rod? I had to do this on a couple locations on each side of the rod. (I glued the wing rod into my fuselage). I used a couple inches of blue masking tape so that the wings go on the tube nice and snug with no play for wobbing. This is a very important step so that the wing bolts don't see anything but small axial loads, IMHO.

Got more videos coming, I am editing some more we took that maiden day!!!

Yes, I have my rates on a triple switch. I have always set it up like that so I can put them really low for maiden, and just flip the switch instead of landing, or dealing with high rates if it needs a bit more on the throws. I normally set the lows on 50% and the medium on 65%-70%.

I actually didn't thicken up the wing rod at all, as it fits pretty tight the whole way. Instead I used single sided foam tape and larger washers on the inside (i assume you are talking about the front wing). That is what the first couple of pictures in my first post are showing. I wasn't sure I explained it very well. I will surely look at the rod itself, and add tape as needed just to be sure. The foam tape and 3/4" washers make my wings feel like they are glued on. The foam allows for the wing to snug up from front to back, with absolutlely no gaps at all on the entire surface.

I also have the metal cleveses (sp?) on my control surfaces. There is just something I dont like about the quick connects on the ailerons screwing on instead of having a snap fitting or snap washer holding it on the servo arm itself. I think that putting super-glue and blue thread locker is overkill and will do just fine, so I will most likely leave it alone.

I am looking forward to the video's!! I have watched the other one quite a few times, and would love to see more.

Thanks again for helping answer all of my questions. You have helped alot, and made me a lot more confident in my build. As i'm sure you know, there isn't a whole lot of info on this plane on the web.

Kevin

Glad that I could be of some help to you and hopefully people that get this plane in the future. It is just what makes these websites so good and useful [sm=thumbup.gif]

So I spent a couple hours trying to get this nice movie and set up with music and everything and go and try to download it doesn't. So I just made some small clips just now, short and simple!

Taxi-ing around video:
[link=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k9FWwZOYdbc]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k9FWwZOYdbc[/link]

Landing video:
[link=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JM2SVuWVTGU]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JM2SVuWVTGU[/link]

Here's a pic of Racingnismo's plane just getting airborne on the 2nd or 3rd flight that maiden day. I was there, I am his dad! The plane flies great. I was concerned after reading so many posts about how bad the plane is, and we had never heard any glowing reports on it. Well, now you guys have a glowing report from my son! He thinks it weighs about 7 pounds, so it is heavier than his Nitro Yak 54 50size, and with less wing area. They have the same engine in them...the OS 70 Surpass II. It does indeed fly faster, but you can see from the vid of the maiden that it is very manageable. It has ample power, witness the vertical pull on takeoff. He balanced at the recommended CG with no weight needed anywhere. He can add a little lead in the tail when/if he wants to move the CG rearward. I was surprised to see the rolling circle on the maiden flight! Good looking bird in the air! Awesome day it was. Jon

Thanks for the picture. I too had read many posts on how bad the plane was, but I had to take this with a grain of salt. One guy said he had the CG set at 96mm back like the book said, but from the wing tip!! Holy cow! No wonder it flew so horribly!! This is well over 50% back!! I am no expert on CG, but have done enough research to know that 25-30% back is a good start. When I first recieved the kit (before I read anything on it) I thought it was put together very well. I was surprised to hear so much negativity.

I think it is great that you go flying with your son. I have extended the offer to my father, but he has declined so far. [] He did call the other day and ask me if they still make kits you build from scratch. I pointed him in the right direction, and hope that building may get him interested in the hobby (I hope he asks me what he should build, just in case he gives it to me!!).

Keep the video's and pictures coming. I enjoy seeing them. The weather down here is going to be to cold for me to fly down here for at least the next couple of days.

All I got to say is that this hobby is a great one, for life! Sharing it with family members is even better!

Here is another video I got going:
[link=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5HInRn0Ixu0]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5HInRn0Ixu0[/link]

Enjoy! These take a lot of time to do, I am running out of steam! Hahaha.

I know! I used to make skate video's of me and my friends, and they took F-O-R-E-V-E-R to edit! Having to watch hours of footage to get what you need is the worst. I sure appreciate you taking the time to do it!!!

SWEET!!!!!!!

Now i have a question for you both.. Are you setting the CofG with or without fuel?

I set the CofG at 96cm and its SO tail heavy with out fuel which make it hard to land for me!!!

Any ideas?

PEZ

Center of gravity is set while fuel tank if empty for me, and I am almost positive it is the same story with bonebreak.

Are you having trouble landing due to the elevator being too sensitive maybe (so you can't flair easilly without worrying about the plane pitching-up, stalling out, and tumbling?)?

Or are you having trouble on approach at low speed? If you set up your CG at 80mm from LE and got used to it, and then moved the CG back to 96mm I can see that you MIGHT have a tendency of pulling too much up elevator to keep the nose up, therefore losing too much airspeed and stalling out prior to hitting the runway.

I noticed that with an aft CG I had to really be careful with how much elevator I need while doing any maneuver. Basically a lot LESS tail-surface control is needed when the CG moves farther and farther back. With my Yak I kept shifting the CG farther back every outting, and it took me a while to get used to the new feeling everytime. But is sure helps for any high-alpha maneuvers, spins, rolling harriers, etc. It makes slow-rolls a little harder, to me.... IMHO [&:]

I really hope that you mean 96mm not 96cm. This in itself would be a HUGE problem, but seems very unlikely as 96cm = about 37 inches. I have yet to fly mine due to the horrible weather, so I cant yet say. Racingnismo says he had his set at 95mm and it flew fine (and looks like it lands fine in the video's). I had read a post where a guy put his CG at 96mm back from the wing TIP. This is NOT right. You need to make sure that you are setting the CG next to the fuse. If you have done this and its still flying tail heavy, you may want to find a way to add a little more weight to the nose of your plane. I didn't realize that you had your CG set at 80mm at one point in time. This would make a HUGE difference on how the plane would handle then and now. It would make it much more snappy moving the CG from 80mm to 96mm and make it "seem" tail heavy. I hope this helps. I am sure Racingnismo will chime in soon to give his input. It will be more valuable due to him actually flying this bird.


EDIT: Told you Racingnismo would chime in, and he did it before I was done typing!!



Kevin

Sweet I will re-set the CofG for 95mm .

I just finished digging around removing broken wheel spats and fixing a hole or two after my last nose over when I landed last and I found the elevator rod had pulled it's self out of the plastic cap with the metal rod in it!!! 30min Epoxy and its all good.

I have to say this is a wonderful looking plane but the quality of the parts supplied is not up to scratch.. I really love this plane and it has so much potential. I can't wait to get it right and really enjoy flying it!!

PEZ

Edit: Actually thinking about the broken rod it may have caused the issue of feeling tail heavy with the elevator pushing down all the time?? and not returning to center.. or being able to nose down. I do remember having trubble when landing with trying to come down. I had 1/4 power and was moving at a good landing speed but the controls where strange, i would push down and it would take some time to respond.

PEZ

Pezzer, I think that I know what you are talking about. The elevator push and pull rod, right? So this rod should be light and rigid enough to get the elevator halves to center easilly. The weight of it, if it was really heavy, would cause the elevetor to go down I suppose (like you said). Maybe check to see if you are centering well by ensuring that the rods that go through the fuselage are not touching the fiberglass body at any time. Check for binding in your elevator hinges too... use LOW rates or a considerable amount of exponentials.

Had some energy tonight to set this video up, last one for a while LOL:
[link=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xgEzP1rpiTY]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xgEzP1rpiTY[/link]

Laters!

No i fixed that with tounge depressors, I was talking about the plastic tip that is glued on the end of the carbon fiber push rod had been pulled out!!!!

I have added a pic to show what i did.

PEZ

Hello Guys,

I'm very surprised about the issues that some of you are getting with this A/C.

I own an extra 330L "50" size and it flies pretty well with the following setup:
- Os 55 AX + Pitts slimline muffler
- 5 kg numerical servo on the rudder
- 5 kg servo on the elevator
- Std servo for the others axis.

I had headache to balance the A/C to get a CG point at 90mm of wing root's leading edge but I finally made it. I fixed about 300 grs of lead just behind engine cowl’s air intake (not on firewall).

With this setup the A/C is quite easy to fly, he is not overpowered but I can perform all the acrobatics except unlimited verticals. Landing is not too difficult if approach are stabilized with a very little throttle to avoid bumpy landings. Landing speed is higher than trainer landing speed but it’s still easy enough.

If I had to make it again, I would fit a bigger engine such as an OS 75 AX to get an A/C a bit more fun and to get more power instead of carrying useless weight. Nevertheless A/C quality and flying characteristics are good for a kit that price!

Cheers,

Marc