Aw Heck-----I am beginning to feel a little insecure bout my balancer

Nice John. And your shop is so clean.

Kurt

OK. I thought the High Point was just a trade name of Robart's. My main point is that it's balancer that uses gear leverage which has more drag than magnetic suspension. The only reason I used the word "rip off" was to indicate that I understand the principle behind the balancer.

I haven't said and should have that there very well may be a problem with the Top Flite balancer. I'm not claiming there isn't. But it could be people are getting worked up over the fact that a magnetic balancer will reveal an even smaller out-of-balance condition than a Dubro balancer will. If that's what's going on it's a good thing, not a bad thing.

John - I know you know this, but newer folks might not - that type balancer WAS state of the art before the High Point. I had a couple of those and they were and still are more than adequate.

Okay so to take this all in if it moves vert slow that's good enough.

That's my attitude. If you notice any symptoms in your plane that can be cause by vibration then revisit prop balance. If the glow plug is blurry that's a good indicator. Usually the engine runs rougher at lower throttle settings and that has a lot more to do with the engine than the propeller. An easy way to tell is just run a spinner with no prop at idle. Won't hurt the engine as long as you don't throttle up. I used to polish aluminum spinners that way.

Me Too, I do not normally balance propellors on the majority of my aircraft unless it is called for by excessive vibration. I do however for some of my higher performance or competition airplanes and a few of the bigger ones.

My first post was somewhat 'tougue in cheek' but I Have somehow hung on to the little razor blade in a balsa block balance widget well a long time.

I do have others including the magnetic, The Sig CG, prop balance kit was interesting that I put together when I was recuperating from some medical problems and it was a pleasant diversion that I could do in bed and a building board. it does use the wheel type and works well but with some difficulty due to the clutter of the airplane balance device portion.

In the Picture second from the left is a wheel type that I have no clue as to its origin since it came with a 'buy out' and the one that I use the most when I choose to balance a prop since its quick and easy on a shelf. Anyone know what it is?



John

John
Your balancer in question is the same one I have. Mine is 20 years old, I thought it was the original Top Flight balancer but I could be wrong. I use mine on every propellor I buy. You can turn the legs over on one side to make a tall and short side and hang large props off the end. The spindle goes through the hole and rides on the bottom of the wheels on the tall side.

That second from the left is the Robart. You're talking about the gold anodized one, right? It should say Robart on the base but looks like it's been sanded off. The wheels are on I think 1/32" wire axles.

CafeenMan has it exactly right! I had forgotten about that balancer...

Hmm went out and double checked Yes it is exactly like the picture AMA, There was a sticker on the top of the base but gone long ago, but there is tiny embossed lettering I can see in your picture that says " High Poinrt Products" second line "Multi use balancer"..

Thanks AMA amd Cafeen, Hey Pylon never thought about using on a slant now ain.t that interesting.

Now that Mystery of the Day is done what's next?

John

John,
I never thought of it either. The instructions that came with mine showed how to do it. If you look at your photo they are both tall, and the photo AMA posted they are both short. If you go 1 of each, the top wheels line up with the bottom of the other wheels. Then you hang large props over the edge of your bench. Works great.

srthstrying please don,t do that at least give it to someone who will utilize it. While not my favorite as I have noted they can be very functional indeed.

In my opinion the major difference between the conventional types and the magnetic is simply the magnetic is so much more friction free. This tends to show up side to side imbalances far more than the conventional types as opposed to the tip to tip imbalances. Since sanding and removing material from a hub side is really a no/no there is not much we can do for side to side problems. This means that a decision to quite a little earlier in tip to tip adjustment needs to be made.

Try just checking the balance with the prop vertical sometimes and this side to side becomes more apparent with the wheel types 'in my opinion' this is not as apparent.

It could be argued that the magnetic type is superior to the wheel types but I wont

The bottom line is the magnetic is more tedious to use simply because it requires more time as the it requires that the prop needs to come to a complete stop each check and recheck and it requires some decision as to what is actually occurring is the imbalance side to side, tip to tip or even more common a combination of the two.

John

that was a Robot account making a spam posting, John.

Ya thanks Jim, I kinda noticed that right after posted that this AM seems like it spammed a bunch of threads. Oh well provided an opportunity stand up a little for the magnetic even if it takes a little more patience to be successful with. I was on the run to get on out to the field this morning so I could maiden my newest little ship, just a cheap ARF with .35AX's was successful and a kick with two flights:



John

gotta love an OV-10... even an ARF

nice, John I'll bet it was fun

I don't think taking material off the hub is a no no. I scrape off the flash as part of balancing as it's not really supposed to be there anyway and if it helps bring the prop into balance anyway then no harm.

As a more general philosophy, I think with all the info on the internet, a lot of people talk like they take things to way extremes as if they're working to tolerances to send a probe that is launched with the precision necessary to make it to the nearest star with no course corrections possible during the journey and have to arrive within a target of a square meter.

When I see people's piloting proficiency at the field, the talk on the internet isn't even close to being backed up.

Close enough with prop balance is close enough. If the plane isn't shaking apart and your servos aren't being destroyed then don't lose sleep over it.

And by the way, nobody here should be offended by my comment. It was a general observation and not directed at anyone in particular. I fit it just as well as anyone else.

Scraping off the flash is quite a different thing from removing enough material from the hub to fix an imbalance problem. I fix out of balance hubs with medium CA and kicker. I even went so far with a big 20 inch prop as to pound out a thin sheet of lead and glue pieces of it on to get the hub balanced right. The effort may not matter much in the grand scheme of things, but I'm able to get my props balanced near perfect, and it doesn't take long. There may be a benefit in the long term durability of my planes, so I do it.

I don't stop at the flash though. I take off material until the prop is balanced to my liking. I've never heard that you're not supposed to take material from the hub until this thread. If it's common knowledge then it never made its way to me. In fact, until recently, I've never heard of anyone adding weight to a prop to balance it except by adding clear coat. I don't know how I came across it but a couple weeks ago I saw a video on YouTube I believe where a guy was adding tape strips to a prop for an electric to balance. Seemed like a good idea for electric motors but wouldn't work for glow as the fuel would dissolve the tape glue pretty quickly.

actually tape does work reasonably well with non electrics... (I used it in the early 70's even) since the prop is ahead of any fuel (or fuel spray) the tape does actually stay on pretty well.
(although I'd go a tiny bit light on the tape and add a coat of dope to make it permanent.)
it's not a great idea to remove material, but (ONLY my opinion!) unless you're removing big hunks, it shouldn't be an issue.

Hmm never thought I would create such discord with a simple old school point of wisdom or be accused of trying to create a space probe, good grief.

Fact is there have been many episodes of propellers throwing blades in some venues and further that is why Landing Products created the D-1 series of props as opposed to the C-2 series and has much thicker hub to help with the much greater RPM, I also witnessed one prop blade failure at the hub this in a 428 event I was participating in at the basin the gentleman had to go to the hospital. It was an still common to carve and customise props for these types of events and caution about removing material from the sides of the hubs is most certainly common.

To anyone who carves, creates or otherwise modifies their props I say great I love doing it too, its just not a great idea to remove material from the side of the hub area.

I attended a nearby clubs swap meet event a week ago and picked up this little guy for a buck and one I have not seen before, makes a nice addition to my little museum



John

I have both the DB and GP prop balancers and find them both very good. The smaller props I balance on the GP aren't off at all when I tested them against the DB. I haven't a clue why others have a problem but I have had my GP for about 20 years so maybe there is a difference in the newer ones? Other then a bent shaft or loose fit into the prop what can go wrong?? My smaller props are all APC and the GP balancer can handle up to a 15 or 16 inch prop. I'm not a huge fan of Great Planes products but the balancer has worked out fine.

My magnetic balancer was driving me nuts until put index marks on the two cones at their lightest point(top) and now when I balance a prop if it always goes to the index marks when the prop is in different positions it is good to go.

Calvi

If your balancing shaft has a light side, it's defective. The whole point is to start out with a perfectly balanced shaft and then get a reading on your prop.

it is not the shaft that has a light side it is the cones.Calvi