Well If any of you have seen my other threads I have been researching for a bit on both the 4 * and the Venture. I had previously decided on the Venture but changed my mind at the last minute. I have the 4 * kit on my table right now.

I have read over the instructions several times and Im just now looking over the parts as I take them out of the box.

I seem to have run into a problem before I have even started.

On page 8, Step 1 it talks about 6 1/4" x 1/2" x 36' balsa sticks.
I found all 6 of these however 2 of them seemed to be very, very flexible compare to the others. So much so that one broke into 2 pieces as I flexed it slightly. I could not believe it broke with so little pressure.
The other 4 sticks seem to be quite stiff and seem to be in good quality.
I am intending to contact SIG customer service to ask for replacement pieces.

I also found a Balsa trailing edge sheet that was torn down the center.
Guess Im about to find out about SIG customer service. Worst case is that I just run down to the Hobby shop and grab some replacements for a couple of bucks.

I will be posting on my progress as I build. Already looks like its gonna be a while.

Dbow

Here is the box

Don't worry too much about varying differences in wood quality (at this level anyway), just use the lighter one on areas of less stress, if these pieces are used in the wing (spars), use the stiffer ones starting from the center of the wing, lighter ones goes towards the tip (less stress), the piece that broke, don't loose any sleep over that either, you can just use some glue to weld the joint, use some pins to hold the parts while it dries, or just use cyano, after the part is glued where it is supposed to go, you can just reinforce the joint with some scrap sheeting material (3/32 is fine) on two opposing sides, that should be plenty.
When building wings, just be careful to try and even out the quality of the wood used on each wing, this is to avoid having one wing heavier than the other, which in turn can change how your airplane will behave in flight

Walter,

Thanks for the advice, I just finished glueing the stick back together. Seems to be stronger than before actually. I will go ahead and use them then for the spar Doublers. If I cut the 4 parts out of the 2 softest pieces then It sounds like things will be o.k.
Cant build it tonight though as my counter top turned out to be bowed slightly. Im going to look at the solid core doors later this week at home depot.

For those considering buying a kit, this is what it looks like just out of the box.

thats not a 4* thats a stack of firewood

Im getting ready to build a 4*40 after im done with my wifes trainer. It looks fairly easy and somewhat a fast build, but it is a 40. Keep us posted on the progress.

A Few things worth mentioning...

First: See those plastic bags with the hardware in them? It's amazing how quickly that stuff can get lost once the bag is open. Do yourself a favor and get one of those zip-lock bags to put all of those parts in!

Next: Keep all the wood in the box! What i do is to lay the two box halves side by side. Then any time you need to sort through the pieces to find something, you take the pieces out of one box, and put it in the other. That way you always know where all of the wood is (Comes in handy if your shop gets as messy as mine!). Also if any of the small die-cut parts come out of their frames before you're ready for them, keep them in a separate zip-lock bag.

And finally, a word to those of you who have never built a kit, but want to try it some day...

Don't be overwhelmed by the picture that dbow posted showing all of the wood. It does look like a lot. But really, kit building is a simple step-by-step process and a lot of the wood you see there is stuff like wing sheeting, fuselage sides etc. It's really not very hard to do.

A Few things worth mentioning...

First: See those plastic bags with the hardware in them? It's amazing how quickly that stuff can get lost once the bag is open. Do yourself a favor and get one of those zip-lock bags to put all of those parts in!

Next: Keep all the wood in the box! What i do is to lay the two box halves side by side. Then any time you need to sort through the pieces to find something, you take the pieces out of one box, and put it in the other. That way you always know where all of the wood is (Comes in handy if your shop geta as messy as mine!). Also if any of the small die-cut parts come out of their frames before you're ready for them, keep them in a seperate zip-lock bag.

And finally, a word to those of you who have never built a kit, but want to try it some day...

Don't be overwhelmed by the picture that dbow posted showing all of the wood. It does look like a lot. But really, kit building is a simple step-by-step process and a lot of the wood you see there is stuff like wing sheeting, fuselage sides etc. It's really not very hard to do.

Minn,

Thanks for the suggestions.

I dont think it looks like that much really, I have never seen a picture of a kit pulled out of the box on here though, so I thought I would post one.

When I first opened the instuctions I thought I was in trouble. After reading them over a few times and going back to the box to look at some of the parts, it got clearer and clearer each time.

Im still getting prepared to start building so nothing has been put together yet.

I also started another project on my trainer which is almost complete. Im installing a larger 16oz tank for longer flight times.
As soon as its complete I will get started on the 4 star.

Dbow

This is another GREAT idea regardless of how ever many kits you've built, but especially for a rookie.... READ THE BOOK!!!!

I don't mean read it as you go, I mean take it to bed with you, take it to the bathroom with you, sit in the living room with it and read it cover to cover, over and over. If theres something you don't understand, stop, go to the workshop, look at the plans or the parts and figure out what they mean. If you still can't figure it out, make a note right there in the book and see what happens when you get to that step. If it STILL doesn't make sense, call a buddy, or ask here on line. You may have to wait a day or so to get an answer, but it may save you from having to tear things apart. THAT sucks! (Don't ask me how I know!)

Hey dbow,

Glad to see you're getting started. My Venture just arrived but, I'm going to wait until mid-November to get started (Life serving as an inconvenience to my hobby!). I look forward to watching your build.

Good Luck,
JB

Rcfan,

I too decided on the Venture but at the last minute my finances became a problem. Comparing the 2 the Sig came out to be like $40 cheaper give or take a little.
Right now as it stands this kit wont fly until sometime next year, but hey I got something to do when it gets to cold outside to fly.

I think we excahnged messages on previous threads about what kit to get.
All the stuff about the pushrods on the 4 * is true, complete plastic rod junk. I will replace them with steel rod for sure.

As for the landing gear, the main gear looks fine actually looks heavy duty to me. I think as long as there are no major hard landings it should be fine. The tail gear looks a little on the weak side, I will probably replace it.

Everything else looks great, most of the laser cut parts appear to be precise and very high quality.
Other than the couple of problems mentioned in the first part of the thread, everything is great.
I will know more as I start building.

Dbow

I found me a building board earlier tonight after running around between home depot and Lowes.
I looked at the hollow core doors and they looked like they would warp very easily. They were cheap though at something like $20.

The helpful Home Depot person suggested I not get a hollow core door and go for a solid core door. I checked them out and gave the bottom of the door a little kick to feel the weight. As soon as my foot touched the door I knew I was not going to be lugging one of those doors into my apartment.

I ended up at lowes and found a nice laminated 24 x 48 board, I went and got a straight edge and tested it out. Both sides were nice and straight. I thought it to be a little expensive at $28 but I could not find anything else that did not have a bow in it of some sort. This board takes pins very well so I wont need to put cork or sheet rock or anything like that on it.


Well I glued the spar doublers tonight, I used 2 of the stronger sticks and put the lightest of the others doubled on to it. So basically the 2 main ones that start out the wing will the the strongest..one for each side. The flimsy ones I assume will go on top of the wing. After looking at the design I dont think it will be a big deal once wing is complete. Once everything is connected and glued it should be quite sturdy.

Dbow

Here is the board

I got a chance to start building tonight and thought I would spend a few minutes preparing and so forth. That was around 7:00pm or so. I turned around a few minutes later and it was 11:00pm. I could not believe that I had been building that long.

I had to tear myself away so I wont be fighting to keep my head up at work in the morning.

Well here is what I have so far.



Dbow

what direction is the grain on those shear webs going? something doesnt look right.

Just to clarify the grain of the shear webs should be vertical (perpendicular to the spar)

How come wood glue and not CA?

SIG kits like that come with pre-cut shear webs, so it's difficult to get them going the wrong way. How the heck could you tell from a picture like that, anyway? You gotta get closer to see the grain.

Wood glue is fine, especially for a first kit. Lots of time to reposition, think, and double-check. Not only that, it sands easily, which can't be said for CA.

BTW, dbow, the wing is looking nice! :thumbup:

you can plainly see a dark streak along many of the webs which would indicate the grain direction.

Also clicking on the pictures makes them bigger if you did not know

I think the dark streak you're seeing is the joint between the web and the lower spar.

In any case, This is what cracks me up about non-builders. They seem to think that building is a chore. Sure it can get frustrating at times, but then, so can a lot of things (women come to mind LOL). Building, for the most part is relaxing, rewarding, and FUN!

Note: I am not refering to people who don't have time to build, or can't build for other reasons other than they are unwilling to try. So let's not turn this into an ARF vs Building debate. Thankyou.

I used Thin CA to glue all the joints, the trailing edge sheet and the leading edge are the only places that have wood glue as added strength so far. I had already put the CA back on the shelf when I took the picture, so thats whay you only see the wood glue on the table.

The instructions say to go back and re-glue all joints with CA or Medium CA before sheeting. It also states to not be stingy with the glue.
I was thinking about going back and using wood glue on all the joints.

Is this a bad idea?
Should I just stick with the CA?

As for the grain direction, To be honest I have no idea what you could be seeing that leads you to think something is wrong. I went back and double checked it and I cant see any other way of doing it other than the way it is.
It appears to match up perfectly with the directions and the pieces are already laser cut.
Now Im not saying that its not possible for me to screw it up...lol
But so far I think I have built it according to the directions.

I know one thing for sure, I intend to keep a kit of some form on my table from now on. I really enjoyed putting that wing together and Im stuck here in this cube salivating waiting to get home to build some more.



What about the Glue? Wood or CA to go back over the joints?



Thanks

Dbow

Dbow,

Keep it up, makes newbie builders like me happy to see works in progress, and your questions are some of the same as mine.


Mill the newb

Use wood glue or MEDIUM CA to go over the joints. Not THIN! Thin CA works on a capillary principle. That means it needs two (or more) pieces firmly pressed together that it can "wick" into. If the area is already glued, it is sealed off and the thin CA has nowhere to soak into.

dbow,

I've been hanging around the ARF discussion board and missed this post until now... but I'm REALLY GLAD that I found it, because I haven't heard much from you regarding your new plane and was wondering about it, had it arrived yet, and exactly what was a Four Star... now I know.

The work you've done so far looks GREAT! I can't even believe that you're suprised that time flys when you're working on these things, because I was up until 3:00 to 4:30 some nights because I couldn't stop. One night on the (final building night?) I didn't go to bed at all. Turns out - it wasn't the "final building night"... DaOh!

I'm not as anxious as you to start-in on a "kit" due to my lack of working space due to my "office" which houses my four Macintosh computers... so my building (for now) is done on the living-room floor and will consist of ARFs.

But I'm glad to hear that from now on, you'll always have some sort of project on the table.

(Hey... you just called as I'm writing this, so you know what I was going to write.)

So for now, I'll see you in the morning at GMA.

To Kallikrates,

The shear webs in the 4*60 and the LT-25 are in fact designed with the grain running spanwise. While it is true that most models have shear webs that have verticle grain, this is more for the builders convenience in slicing webs from the end of a long balsa plank.

The four star 60's wing is about as stiff as a 2X12 plank of the same length. Between the one peice shear webs and the geodetic cross-ribs, it is one solid wing.

Thanks for the clarity I may need glasses but I'm not blind,
but yes every plane I've ever seen and built mysel has had virtical webs.

But, I guess you never hear stories of sig four star wings blowing up in midair so I guess their enginering is sound, and the diagonal ribs most likely strengthen the wing quite a bit.
anyways

I just questioned it because it's an unfamiliar building method to someone who's put quite a few kits under his belt i have never built a fourstar and was just worried for dbow.