HI everyone. Flew a littel bit when I was a kid but now I'm an old 36 year old man that bought a new toy. I love to fly and when I saw the Hanger 9 P-51 trainer at the hobby store in November, I had to buy it! Thank God it snowed here in Minnesota right after I bought it so I didn't attempt to fly the friendly skies on day one. The store manager did tell me, though the P-51 says "trainer" on the package it is by no means a real starter/training aircraft. I have a hundred acre field that I plan on turning into a nice little air field this spring. I actualy got the plane assembled, balanced and adjusted all the servos. I also got her running and made some taxi runs on the future air field before the snow came and I can't wait to fly this thing.......but I'm going to. It really looked like it wanted to get off the ground but I resisted the VERY STRONG URGE to take flight. After some thought I'm going to mothball the 51 for a bit and get another more beginner friendly trainer to get my wings back. I have an electric 51 that I really don't care if I crash and burn and I'm sure I probably will do just that to it. Gas planes are in my future not the electrics. I understand flight and I am not new to planes just rc planes. One thing you have to understand is there are not many instructor options around northern Minnesota so I could be on my own here. It would be nice to have an instructor plugged into my radio for the first 100 flights with the Hanger9 but I might be taking baby steps with lesser craft on my own to get there. I know this isn't going to go over well with you guys and I'm not liking the idea of solo rc flight right of the bat either but lets say you didn't have any other option.

Question: What would be a good trainer both gas and electric? I'm sure there will be many answers.

Suggestions: If I am on my own?????

Even replys from Isis, who looks like he got a good chewing out are welcomed

I would recommend you got to the Hanger9 threads and read about trainers and the PTS and also ask your local LHS about a first trainer, otherwise you're going to get many different opinions on what to get. you can go back from the beginning of this thread and to up to date. link below.
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/fb.asp?m=3717342

roltech

I should of given you the start of the thread link, hear it is.

http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/m_31..._1/key_/tm.htm

roltech

Thanks roltech.

Your welcome and also welcome to RC.

roltech

Mothballing the P-51 trainer for now is an excellent idea.

What very few people seem to realize is that your typical 40 size high wing trainer has a wing loading of mid to high teens. This P-51 trainer has a wing loading of about 26 - 27 oz per sq foot.

What this means in the real world is that the P-51 is going to have to fly faster to stay in the air and is going to have to land faster also to keep from stalling.

While you are learning, slower is better.

Obviously the best approach is to work with an instructor day 1, but you certainly have the right idea with the electric.
I bought a 4 channel (3D capable) foam electric to start with & went out to the field to start with & lets just say I kept Parkzone in business for a few months with all my parts orders to repair crash damage. Fortunately though my total bill for all repairs probably didn't exceed 100 bucks before I got to the point that I didn't crash anymore.
When I bought my first glow trainer & joined a local club the solo process with the instructor was more of a formality because I already had 70+ flights under my belt. (plus some simulator time)
I'm certainly not encouraging anyone to do what I did but if you don't live near an airfield start out with cheap (somewhat safer) planes & work your way up.

May I recommend you check the club locator at the AMA website. There might be a club located nearby that would be willing to help you develop a nice flying site on that 100 acre site. I know my club would die for such an opportunity. Half the fun of RC is the social aspect of watching others fly, seeing new planes at the field, and helping one another with problems.

Brad

I have to agree with that, I started with a high wing, but if the P 51 advertised as a trainer, It might of been my first plane, not saying It would still be in one piece.

roltech

I totally get that you know an instructor to be the best way, but your question is for a good trainer to go at it alone on if you can't find an instructor in your remote area, correct? Assuming I have that right, I would suggest the NexStar. As allready stated there are many fine trainers available & everyone has their favorite(usually the one that actually got them soloed) & I am no different. I have 2 different high-wing trainers but I found the NexStar far easier to fly, for me that is. It also comes with a sim of that model plane, which I found to be very helpful in my case as opposed to just a generic trainer on the sim that isn't really modelled after any one particular aircraft, just all trainers in general. Alot of instructors have mixed feelings about using the sims before we get to them as it can lead to them having to unteach us bad habits that we picked up practicing with the sim, others say go home & practice on the sim. But that is eventually what got me in the air & back safely on my own. Practice on the sim, then flying the NexStar. Hopefully you will be able to locate a club somewhere up there & do it the right way with an instructor. Good luck in your search, I hope you find someone, but don't get discouraged if ya don't. It can still be done alone, it's just alot harder & can cost you alot more aircraft in some cases. Keep us posted. Welcome to RCU


Mark

P.S. Even if you can't locate a club and instructor, you can still join the AMA & have coverage as long as you follow AMA safety guidelines at the little airfield you build. Maybe you will find flyers in your area & start a club at your own field! That would be cool.

The Nexstar was my first trainer! I have 3 other high wing trainer, but I can say the Nexstar also got me my wings. it's a large plane wingspan is 68"something, can be seen from a distance as compared with others.[8D]

roltech

Thanks for the responses guys. I'm on page 18 of the thread roltech got me started on. Seems to be some useful information regarding the 51 pts. I checked out the servo's on my plane, having read something about them breaking off from perhaps some inadiquate CA attachment. The servos on my plane are screwed on. Looks like some guys are modifying this thing right out of the box to be something it was never designed to be and having motor issues among other things. Why not just go purchase a plane designed for more hard core flying instead of all the mods. I know how it can be with modding things. I take brand spanking new $8,000 snowmobiles and have a pile of parts taken off them, on the shop floor, swapping with hp parts. I aslo just dropped $2,000 rebuilding the relatively low mile motor, connecting rod sticking through the block. hmmmmmmmmmmmm............. It seems power mods in all sports lead to engine trouble.

Ahhh I see it's the wing servos that are having issues. I'll have to beef them up I guess.

Hey, it's really good advice to try and find a club/instructor within say a couple hours drive.

Here is the club listing page from the AMA website. http://www.modelaircraft.org/clubsearch.aspx Put in your zip code or just the state and you got a list in a heartbeat. "Give 'em a call." Most of them will be happy to setup a meeting with an instructor. Having someone look over your plane and radio and doing a couple of buddybox flights would be more than worth whatever it takes in time and gas for you.

BTW, where did you buy the P.51 trainer? They ought to have a line on someone who'd be glad to help.

BTW, two days ago, one of our better flyers had a buddy from work out to our field as a guest. The buddy had bought that P51 trainer and the experienced flyer hadn't seen it. He was less than enthusiastic about it, figuring it was just a gimmick. So he didn't hook up the buddybox for the first flight. He just did a trim flight. And was he amazed. The sucker is slow enough with all the trick training add-ons and flies like a trainer ought to. His 2nd or 3rd pass while learning how it handled on approach was scary slow.... and rock stable. The buddy flew a bunch of his 2nd and 3rd flights. The buddy seemed to have the touch and I'd have guessed would have solo'd that day except the engine mount loosened up (not unusual for ANY new model). And the loosened engine mount was something the buddy didn't have a clue to look for. He also really didn't know how to set the engine in spite of knowing the words from the instruction book by heart. Going at it by yourself can work out for the good, but probably won't.

(The servos on my plane are screwed on.) )

By the way I think there all screwed on but I also think the part that comes apart is the servo screw frame from the wing.

roltech

The problem is also with someone new at this hobby and this trainer, he may crash it thinking he did something wrong and it could be something like loose motor mounts screws or other discrepancies detrimental to keep this plane flying. A newbee won't know this and once crashed won't know what happened. Not fare.[]

roltech

This kind of digs up the old argument about ARF's in the this hobby. I know there are going to be viewpoints from all sides on this, but this is something to think about. When a new person in this hobby gets a RTF plane they just don't have any knowledge of what to look for. In the days when they built their plane they would at least have to put everything on, yes it's true that a lot did it incorrectly, but they learned by doing it incorrectly and fixing it when pointed out by an instructor. Even with an ARF they still have to put together the major assemblies of the plane. But in an RTF they just pull it out of the box, charge it, fuel it, and fly it. They don't know what to look for, and if an instructor misses it or doesn't show them then they have no clue what's going on. Unfortunately I don't see this changing anytime soon in the hobby.

I know this may sound a bit cold, but I've used this to my advantage. I don't know how many times I've seen a pilot crash an ARF/RTF, which is usually a minor crash, but because they don't know how to repair the plane they will just shove it into the trash can at the field. I will pull it out, take it home, and repair it. Now in my defense, after I repair it I will offer it back to the pilot who crashed it for a small fee for my time and materials in repairing it. If they don't want to buy it like that then I have a new plane. I've probably had 10 or 12 like that in the last few years.

I guess that's the cost of convenience for having an ARF/RTF. It's the cost of having an "instant" society.

That's my 2¢ worth

Ken

Ken That's right even building a kit there are some weak spots, places like this forum or getting info from club members is a major help and lessons the chance of crashes, even the plans could be wrong, this hobby you take nothing for granted it's up to all new and seasons members to check as much as possible every thing you can. I had a Nexstar that crashed when I first got into this hobby, and after checking the remains since I seem to of lost control of the elevators, we (some club members) found a broken clevis pin,
and down it went I could not do anything, but they replaced it with an ARF, and would you know it it had a defective clevis too, the clevis shaft was too short and would not claps to the joiner, but this time I checked every thing took nothing for granted.

roltech

Rcken, I agree with you on some of the issues regarding ARF/RTF kits, especially for newbies. I've seen some new looking stuff in the trash can at our flield.

When I began this hobby (July '05), I assembled 2 RTF kits (H9 Arrow &PTS) with no major problems, BUT!, I had more experienced fliers look everything over before flying them. I've learned a lot from club instructors and members. Having someone check the work of a new guy's work makes a lot of difference.

To be honest, I've been interested in R/C flight for over 30 years, but was not ready to jump in with a box of spars, formers, sheeting and stringers to build something that would hopefully fly. I was given a RTF trainer, put it together in an hour or so (following supplied directions), and went off to a club field that I quickly joined. I received a few pointers, had someone else maiden my first bird, and started training (soloed after 9-10 buddy box flights). A few weeks later, I crashed my first trainer into a tree, but that was pilot error due to my depth perception problem and the close proximity of trees at one end of the field. The plane was repaired and improved as a tail dragger-----by a friend that taught me loads during the repair!

Guys, get all the help you can. I believe all clubs will be there with help and encouragement for you.

This is all a learning process and great hobby that I would not have entered upon if it weren't for my first RTF. I'm working on ARF projects now uisng info from the club-----and from the forums!

mn5503, Once the weather breaks, I'd be happy to help you if you feel like taking a drive down to Willmar.

In the meantime, the best thing you can do is to get out the Simulator that came with the Mustang PTS and Practice, Practice, Practice!

balls to the wall ,easy on controls,mustangs fly like u meanit. goodluck.

Practice on your sim and then build your self this abuse resistant bugger cheap with stuff from Home Depot/Lowes. It won't hurt you if you smash it (it's gonna be hard to do that) compared to your mustang. Here is the link for the abuse resistant bugger:
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showt...&highlight=STC

Have fun

Thanks MinnFlyer but that's about 187 miles from Cloquet. I might take you up on the offer if I can't find someone around here to help the maiden flight. In the meantime I have a 3ch T-Hawk I'm going to practice with out on the frozen lake when the fishing is slow. I am new to the rc flying but not the plane construction. My dad was a pilot and I was helping him build these balsa models since I was a kid. Never flew one that didn't have the little string attached to control the elevator though. Not much skill required there! Long story short I ran out of time not intrest and I'm just getting back into it again. The p51 thread has given me a lot to look at with this plane and I will have gone over this thing a million times before I attempt to get her airborne. Engine mount, servo's etc... I have built planes from scratch just never flown 'em. The time has come. I'm not getting over confident but I think by this summer I will have the p51 solo. Going to take my time for sure and make sure I am ready. It's not like I'm crashing a real plane anyway. They make parts everyday!! Oh I forgot I have another 4ch p51 that can can be used first. Don't care if that thing crashes. I know I need to get used to the 4ch configuration before "Marie" goes up. Thanks for all the help guys, I appreciate it and keep it coming!

Flybug,

I just might try that!! Thanks for the info.