Back to the shootin' the breeze thing...

On Monday, I walked into my LHS, and asked about new engines (for a Savage). The guy behind the counter talked with me for a few hours giving me the ups and downs and ins and outs of all the engines that I asked about. There were two engines that I asked about that he personally never ran, so he honestly said that he could not give me a truthful answer. In the end, I ordered a new engine from him, and picked it up Wedesday. When I bought that engine, I didn't have two parts to install it, so I ordered them from him as well. It costs $10 in gas for one round trip, but when you think about that he sold the engine $20 below Horizon's price, and he can get the parts I need in two days for free instead of $20 for shipping, it seems worth it.

About that drinking the coffee topic...

I do not see how people can stand to drink coffee. BLEH [:'(]. It smells great, but the taste...pass me the water, please. [X(]

I don't see how people can shoot the breeze without a cup of coffee!!!!!

Ken

If I can't have my morning coffee I might as well not bother getting out of bed [8D]
I stopped by my LHS just a little while ago ( need some aileron extensions and a Y harness)
I pull up to the store and the first thing I notice is a sign saying "Closing Sale, 30% off"
I go inside and the place is almost empty (I was in there 2 weeks ago and everything was normal)
Out of all the LHSs I go to this one is closest to my home, has been the most helpful and will be sorely missed.
I know I did my part in trying to keep this shop going and have spent far more there than all other places combined.
Sadly I think lack of inventory and out of the way location combined to do this store in.

A little tail about the LHS ,been building balsa models for a while and flying control line .049 planes . at about 14 yrs old I wanted to try RC they looked too cool to pass up, went to the local guy a gruff guy part time store owner who tolerated me and my curious friends after delivering 10,000+ news papers I had enough cash for a 4ch radio , falcon 56 , and a engine K&B .35 after building the plane and setting the plane up that gruff old guy who was totally tolerant went over my plane trimmed it out and helped me learn to fly of course I had to track him down and help him clean his stuff up but he was teaching me and it was worth it, the memory is still with me . I think I was about 22 when I heard he had passed away and his shop was closed forever that is the legacy of a local shop for me his name was Karl and his shop was in Ventura,Ca . now I am back 43yrs old and shopping from tower Hobbies the deals are there and there is $ to be saved but there is no glass counter with radios and motors no shelves with boxes of kits to oggle so when I can I will go down to the local shop buy what I need and remember this is where it started . and if that pimply faced kid starts feeding you a line of bull let him know what the real deal is in a nice kind of way because when those stores are gone thats a end of a era . my kids get a real rev-up when I say lets go to the hobby shop that a computer screen could never do .

You said a mouthfull there BigTim!! I used to pedal my bicycle with a few friends clear across Sunnyvale & into Santa Clara, well over an hours ride just to go drool over all the cool stuff at a shop called "Hobbies Galore". Like your gruff friend the guy that ran this shop put up with us kids hanging around, rarely having the money to actually buy anything. We were there all most everyday though one summer when we were about 12 or 13 yrs old. He was raffling off a mini-bike & no purchase was required. So we would ride over there just about everyday for the 2 months leading up to the raffle, stuffing the ballot box with tickets with our names on it. We thought for sure that one of us had to win with all the tickets we had filled out. Of course none of us won that mini bike but it sure was exciting thinking we were going to & looking at all the control line airplanes that he had for sale. I eventually got my hands on enough money to buy a Cox PT19 Trainer in the control line version. RC wasn't really off & running much at that time. It was a very exciting day when we rode to the shop to buy the Cox plane. I had it crashed before the day was over but I did get some good fun out of it first.

As you said, looking at items on a computer screen will never be able to replace the excitement for a kid walking into a Hobby Shop full of cool stuff to dream about it & wish on for Christmas & Birthday presents. It will be a sad day for this hobby when that Era is gone forever. I know it will be for me.

I went out and bought my LT 40 from my LHS. It was used, hanging in the ceiling. The owner said " not to rush you, those sale signs come down today" I told him I would think about it. Well Well, A week later those signs were still there. I bought it at the sale price plus our club discount. I was pretty mad, BUT I did save a few bucks.

Now as a newbie, I should have asked one of our club instructors come down and help me look it over. It has been crashed (a trainer crashed, no ) Ok so it is a little out of plumb. It still flyes well. I will chock it up to a learing experiance. Newbie lesson #1.

I still go there and pick up a few things once and a while. I am just a little more carefull on what I buy.

I know both shops you refer to, and yes you are correct. The young fellow who runs the Central shop right there on 150 before you get to the heights seems like a fine fellow to do business with. I live about 35 miles from his shop, and will occasionally make the drive over just to see what new stuff he might have. Always seems glad to have your business. The other shop I believe you are referring to is across the bridge, and I have went in there a few times, and he gives you the eye like you are there to rob him or something. I won't even comment on HobbyTown since in my opinion they usually don't stock a single thing I ever need. So I don't bother to go there much anymore.

i like the LHS because i drive there, buy what i need and walk out with it. no waiting a week for it in the mail. its just me, im very impatient. the online price is somewhat cheaper because shipping isnt included yet. the LHS has to pay for the product to be shipped.

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A certain ARF I have my eye on. Tower price $209, LHS1 $239, LHS2 $275. I am willing to pay the price at LHS1 and would probably even be willing to dish out $250 for it but not the $275 LHS2 wants.
[/quote]

Sorry not to include your whole post but I am only speaking to this part.

For my own self I think a $30 markup on a $209 purchase is excessive and I would not pay it, 15% on a ten dollar item is one thing but on $200 that is significant. Tower also has $20 off $150 code right now that makes it a $50 delta.
Once you get to $100, sales tax here in Texas is more than shipping.
None of the hobby shops near me mark up the ARFs, they sell them for the mail order price plus sales tax.
If you are not a Tower Super Saver member check out Omni Models
Place an order of $150 or more by August 31, 2006 and we'll take $15.00 off the total. Add in the free shipping we offer every day of the year (for $100 minimum orders) and your total savings comes to $20.00. To save just use: Coupon Number: 33W28

Mail order it and feel good about the money you are saving, as you already know the price of the airframe is just the beginning, if you break up all of your orders to be $150 you can save $15 every time at Omni or $20 at Tower.

I'm one side of the coin and chashint is the other side. You have to know that the LHS buys from the same parent company as Tower. Service that is supplied free and the LHS is worth something. What's it's worth is up to you.
Dennis

Same parent company that Tower buys from ? Isn't Tower Hobbies the Parent company . Don't they import Futaba, OS Max, and don't they own Great planes and Hobbico ? They can transfer you to an expert technical support for any of those companies and they have Parts Express service.

There is simply no hobby shop in the world with the technical support and parts support for their products, combined with a liberal return and exchange policy that Tower Hobbies provides. They are the bench mark for excellence in this hobby for customer support, they are second to none. What is that worth ? Its Priceless. Its worth my business. Its worth my loyalty and its worth stepping in and defending them.

To pilotfight: Hobbico is the parent company. I don't care where to buy your stuff, and I'm not knocking Tower. If you like sitting at home and not having any interaction with other flyers thru the LHS thats OK by me. I stay open because I can give more then M/A. As far as tech goes, when you call you may or may not get someone thats knows anything. Most of the time all they do is type in your question and read back what the computer says. Me, I have private phones # and names to get answers.Dennis

Don't get me wrong, I am not down on the LHS in any way, if I left that impression it was not intentional. I regularly buy from the LHS.
I usually know what most things cost to mail order and I expect the local shops to be pretty close to those prices, if they are not then I don't normally use any of the LHS "services" in regards to that item. The shops in the Dallas metroplex price ARFs at the mail order price regardless of brand, other items are priced higher or lower than mail order prices.
Normally I do not need to handle an engine, an ARF, or a kit to know if I want to buy it so there is really not a service aspect the hobby shop can provide other than to offer that item at a competitive price. There are some items though that I do like to handle before purchase and this is where the LHS service comes into play, if I go and "try out" something to see how it feels in my hands, or turn it on and look at the menus, or if I simply ask to compare couple of competing brands to see which one I like the looks of best, then it is only fair to purchase that item from the hobby shop. In that instance if the price is $239 vs. $209 then I will pay the extra money because a service was provided that helped make or influence a purchase decision. If I know I want a particular ARF or kit and mail order is $209 I would not pay $239 to the LHS for that item.

And Tower can't compare to a well run hobby shop which has a knowledgable staff and understands customer service. The owner of one of the hobby shops I used to frequent taught me how to build, setup and race boats. The owner of another one taught me how to build, cover, and fly airplanes. You're not going to get that from Tower or any other online source. Don't get me wrong, I buy lots of stuff from Tower and other online sources, but it's important to remember that a good local hobby shop DESERVES people's support even if their prices are a bit higher.

I agree with you. I would support a Good hobby shop. I just don't see any near my home. I would hate for new people , newbies, in the hobby to think they need a good LHS to help them become established in this hobby. That simply is not true. I want everyone to know that they can enjoy this hobby regardless of their location and regardless if there is a good LHS nearby.

Assistance can be optained at the local flying site , from experienced pilots. Assistance can be obtained on line from experienced pilots, ( here on RCU).

If you have a good LHS, then by all means go there. I wish there was a good one near me.

There is one common thread with all the great hobby shops... The owners are involved with the hobby, because they love it not just in it for the money... God knows they arn't going to get rich from it. My local hobby shop owner over the years has become one of my best friends... His shop has become the Cheers of Hobby shops... All theguys who fly and run cars hang out there... He too has the sim that any one who walks through the door can use. He will help anyone even if they didn't buy it there... and charge nothing but the parts needed... He actually has a spot in the back room that 5 guys share and pay rent so they have a place to build. If one guy decides to not rent someone is always there to take over... Every Tuesday you will see a dozen guys at his shop. After the shop closes at 9:00 PM we all go next door to the bar for the Beer and wing specials... and talk planes...

Yes, I buy some things on line... I have only baught 3 planes from him... But I try to buy all my hardware from him... The larger I go in planes the tougher it gets to get the planes I want... Also the motors from him... He carries FUGI & Zenoah. I fly with Brison and others. He understands and I buy as much as I can and I refur anyone I can to his shop. The customer service and knowlege yu get from his shop is Priceless... I am very glad to have his shop so close and will do all I can to suport him...

The other side of the mirro is a shopabout 5 miles further away... They have cameras mounted through the store... Charge by the hr for help with fixing... No one hangs there or talks about the place... Only there adds bring people in...

A couple of thoughts...

Many years ago, I worked in a small mom & pop computer store for a couple of years. I cannot count the number of people who came in the store, asked questions for hour, and left without buying a computer. Some of them you would see a few months later and they would almost brag about the great deal they got from some vendor in Computer Shopper. It never seemed to phase them a bit. We also had a group of people who would go buy a computer at Wal-Mart and come in and drill us with questions all of the time because no one at Wal-Mart could help them. I'm sure this behavior happens a lot at the LHS. People come in, play with a couple radios, ask a million questions, make a decision, and go home and order it from Tower. Meanwhile, the LHS spent all the time with the person but didn't make a dime.

Often times, a small business owner will get fed up with this and will only start supporting things he sells. He'll ask the infamous "where did you buy it" question and follow it up with the "go ask them" solution. Although, he is totally correct, it ends up killing him because he gets a bad reputation. People will actually say "that guy is an a**hole" because he won't support it if you bought it from somewhere else. In the end, this ends up killing his business. Ironically, the good guys have to suck it up and try to win the customers over with superior service even if the store can't get paid for it. Except, the bankruptcy roles will show that this plan isn't necessarily successful either. It's tough out there!

The other thing that is going on in this country is that the big box retailers and mega-corporations are putting small businesses out of business. The effect that this has on our economy is yet to be determined, but I don't feel that it is going to be good. This is another issue in itself.

So it is pretty simple for me. If I go in a store and pepper them with questions for information, I buy from them. If I'm going to buy mail order then I don't bother them. So I would advise everyone to do the same. If you want the local support, buy from the local guy. If you don't need it, send your money to Champaign, IL.

Again...just a couple of thoughts

This is going to be a quick story about owning a store. A new member joins the club and falls in love with giant scale, now he can't even fly yet. He asks many questions and starts shopping for big planes. Every body tells him to wait, but he wants to do it his way. He goes to Greg Garrison in Tenn. and order a 50% and then for for some reason gets mad and cancelled the order. I'm just sitting back and watching. Then he goes to anothr guy in Tenn. and orders a 50% Pitts. In the process he buys a big truck and orders a trailer for the plane. Well he come to me and buys a Futaba 12mz and a Senior Telemaster to learn on, so I think he may be serious. A week later he comes to me and wants to know what to put in the Pitts, so we spend over a hour coming thru everything I think he needs and he says order it. I get everything he ask for in the store, about $2500 worth. Now he was in the store the day before and everything was fine. I think you know were this is going. The next day i called to tell him everything is in and guess what now he's mad at every body and cancelled the order, says he quitting the hobby because everbody is telling him what to do.
I want to thank Bobby at 3-w for taking his stuff back. He didn't have to and i would have made it good to him, but i still have about $600 that I can't send back.
Will I change the way I do business, NO, there can't be that many people out there that's not on meds.
I had a bad felling about this guy from the start, but iI'm in the business to sell and it happens once in a great moon.
This story is'nt that short. Dennis

HMM, Bowling Green? I don't know, it would be a pretty long drive for me to get to work.
Sure you don't want to open up shop in Michigan?
Most of the LHSs here, not all, want a deposit when placing large orders like that.
Of course I don't mind leaving a deposit, in fact I usually pre-pay for the entire amount.
If I am ordering something I am sure I want it and will not back down.

I'll always put trust in the hobby. You only find one like this in a million years. I should always listen to myself when something does't seem right. My fault, I let money get in the way of my gut feelings. Dennis

One of the LHS's here actually gave an additional price break if you pre-paid on special orders. Helps everyone that way. Sadly that shop is now closed. [&o] They were more into trains anyway but nice people.

You said it better than I did.

I deal with a great hobby shop in Topeka called Dee and Me Hobbies and not everything is cheap but i go for the service and the actual care he gives when i walk through door and remembers my name,he always shows me whats new or what hes building as he flys and builds what he sells,I always look online but im a i want it now person and if its not in his store he has it within 3 days waiting on me,sometimes i feel sorry for him as he has to answer my dumb questions with a smile and has never even while i was building one put me off or gotten cross when i called to ask one. ive bought 4 planes from him and a couple radios and a heck of alot of parts . he offered me the use of his flying field and to even instruct me on sundays.If it wasnt for him i would have not come back to the hobby i enjoy most.

I was wondering from a business stand point and I have owned two in my life not hobbyshops but business just the same
How is it that a mailorder place can sell cheaper? Both have a buildings,both have a light bill, both pay taxes
in fact the mailorder place should have more overhead someone has to take the order, pack the order, ship the order they mail out thousands of catalogs every mouth or two they have to maintain a website.
Now I can say even though my LHS is more supportive of cars and trains they do have prices like mailorder and the tax equals the shipping in most cases.
I hear others say the same thing in fact my LHS owner has told his supplier that he wants to be equal in price to the mail order and so far it's been the case.

VOLUME