In this photo you can see across the runway, its width is 200 ft and 800 ft long, pretty big.
The red line is perpendicular to the runway and the green line is parallel.

when I’m flying over the runway I see the vegetation in the gap between the airplane and the runway, but on landing I cannot tell how high the airplane is, the whole width of the runway is taking over so I just see the airplane over the big concrete slab and that’s it, I cannot tell how high it is.

Sure if I had more time while landing I would look better and tell how high it is but its happening very fast.

I do land well when I land closer and when standing perpendicular to the runway line, but if I need more distance its confusing me.

What is happening is that I pull the elevator stick when the plane is about 4-6 ft high and it just falls.

Have you experienced something like this?

Thanks
Alex

G'day Alex,
When I'm teaching a student to line up the runway, I advise them to stand parallel to the runway, & don't move, set up the approach pattern, & bring the plane around onto final, so that with your head turned to the right, or left, depending on direction of approach, the plane looks like it is heading straight at you, & in the middle of your view.
Fly a low pass, & notice that the plane is still about 4 or 5 metres in front of you, as it passes you, because you should not be able to see squarely over your shoulder, you will be looking slightly ahead of your shoulder, try it while reading this.
Be aware your shoulders should be parallel to the runway, for this technique to work.

Yeah I was thinking the same thing. I was taught to land the plane from 'over my shoulder'. It looks like you're going to land in really close, but as the plane gets closer it ends up being further out than expected. With this angle you have a really good view of the plane and can easily judge it's descent rate.

Thanks guys i'll try this over the left shoulder method tomorrow.

Let us know how it works out.

I've got a sick new plane that I just got all ready to maiden tomorrow and of course it looks like rain.

after the rain its the best time to fly, the air is still and there is no wind, well at least here.

I was taught to stand with hips and shoulders parallel to the runway as well, and now this is how I teach....why...cause you have a point of reference...part of what you're learning is to train your eyes...do as suggested above and you will get it..good luck

Hi Alex7403
The description in your initial post is excellent. After I realized I was making made many crashes due to stalling during the landing, I did some heavy studying of what was happening. I was mainly crashing when I was landing at an angle to the left/right runway due to a cross wind. Since normal depth perception is only about 17 feet, and I always landed further than 17 feet away, I suddenly realized that when I landed at an angle I did not know where the plane was in height, relative to the runway. In addition, when I land at an angle, I completely loose my sense of "rate of decent" (I don't know how fast/slow I am approaching the ground). Furthermore, with the plane coming in at an angle, I completely loose my sense of ground speed of the plane. I addition, coming in at angle completely destroys my sense of "angle of flare". I searched for a solution and this is what I do now: I only land right-to-left or left-to-right. If the crosswind is terrible I will point the nose a little into the wind. On every landing, I do my best to touch down directly in front of me as I am facing directly across the runway(at a right angle to the runway length). By landing in front of me, I have a better, and constant view, of the plane attitude, ground speed, rate of decent, and flare angle. For those that wish to point out that the plane cares nothing about ground speed, only air speed, I point out that we fly our planes without the instrumentation to know air speed, and instead substitute other input to arrive at a safe landing. Yesterday I had my SPAD Swept Wing OS46FX size Canard out and the wind was terrible. Gusts to 20MPH and direction all over the place. The landings all looked like slightly controlled crashes, yet just before main wheel touch down the plane calmed down a little and each landing was good. All landing close to "directly in front of me".

Over the sholder as mentioned, I was taught that way and I teach the same.
Nice field, has the club ever thought of Roundup then scraping the dead crap out of the cracks?? Makes for smoother take offs and landings. Worked at one of my clubs pretty well.

And i wasn't keeping my shoulders parallel to the runway.... looking directly at the airplane while its landing, i see how it makes the problem more intense.
this is the problem in having a big time gap in the hobby you forget the basics.
yes villa you described the problem very well.
yes graybeard its a great field what makes me ask "what all this field and i land poorly...?"
i was told that at WW2 pilots were practicing carrier landing there, and now we cut the green stuff about twice a season.

Thanks
Alex

If you are adding elevator at 4 to 6 feet you are going to have problems. Fly it to about a foot off the ground before you level out. Then when you start your flare, it will grease right in. And don't flare because the ground speed looks about right, flare because the plane starts sinking, or the nose starts dropping. That way when it is windier than you are used to the plane won't lift all of a sudden and result in a 6 or 8 foot crash.

I fly with my shoulders parallel to the runway and plant my feet. Then while I am flying I will turn right and left with my hips to keep orientation.

JCaster, what you are talking about is the problem, i dont see when its 1 or 4 feet off the ground, what i see is concrete above and concrete bellow the airplane and you cant tell the height.
add to this the incline of the runway for rain draining purposes and me standing on the bottom of it and doesn’t help this effect.

I’ll try the parallel standing next time its flyable conditions.

Thanks
Alex

Regarding the flare - Landings are my favorite part of flying RC and the flare, as I learned taking full scale lessons, is the airplane is flown to a near stall, progressively adding up elevator so you time the stall as the wheels touch and you roll out. It's a timing thing.

A friend of mine was a Navy pilot and they were taught in Navy flight school to fly it to the deck, including flying to the runway, they weren't taught to stall.

But I think general RC is much more suited to stall landings, and that's exactly what the flare is, a progression of up elevator sometimes with a final full up, keeping the airplane in the air until the last possible moment, and when it's timed right, it's beautiful. Every landing is different, which is what makes landings so much fun.

An occasional issue I have with landings may be something that relates to the OP - sometimes my eyes get so locked into the airplane coming in, like at a one or two feet in the air for an extended period of time, it's like my eyes are hypnotized and in those moments my eyes can't discern the difference of the airplane moving toward me or away. It's not a dangerous thing, I know the plane is coming toward me, but it's funny how your eyes can play tricks on you.

I fly with my shoulders parallel to the runway but I guess I don't understand what you mean about landing over your shoulder - I am tryng to visualize it. Our field is surrounded on thrre sides by 4 to 6 feet of soy beans and I have trouble on approach figuring if I am high enough to clear the beans when I am descending during the landing approach. I just can't tell when I am clear - I usually have one of the more experienced pilots coach me in until I can get it right. I also have trouble gaging trees over one end of the field as well. Yes, I have landed in the bean fields several times and I have hit the trees twice.

I always tell my students...(my field has a big hill south and west,Tress North and east) that if you keep your aircraft above the tress by sight you won't hit them. if you have to descend at the tress or the south hill like we do its just a matter of depth percepition...which is a function of both eyes...make sure to get your head cranked around so that both eyes can see the airplane well.....
Good flyin to ya

I don't think I have good depth perception[] I mean I flew right into a tree - DAMNIT!!!

You are on the right path trying it with your shoulders square to the runway. I would also suggest trying to land in the same place every time. Maybe paint a yellow line down the center of the runway and try to hit it every time. If the wind is a cross wind teach yourself to rudder it in. Both of these things will make you a better flyer in the long run.

David

An unusual problem, looks like you've got TOO MUCH runway! I agree with David above; paint some bright colored stripes on the concrete to use as a 'target'. You might even outline an entire runway, say a strip about fifty foot wide with a stripe down the middle to land on.

Flight Sims help you to learn NOT to rely upon depth perception to line up your plane for landings.

Rather you learn to establish visual cues as, others are suggesting.

Alex7403:

Here is a tip that may help:

When you see the model at the height of the horizon, then you know it is flying at the height of your eyes.
When crossing the line between the concrete and the edge of the vegetation, it is about your chest height.

Regards!

Thanks Guys, yes i tried standing parallel today and it does help, low pitch prop help as well to get out of bad landings.
vegetation height doesnt help as its much higher then me so i cannot count on it.
its the gusty winds that make it harder to land well too.

Thanks again
Alex

I was not aware I was watching the shadow of the plane and the plane as I did my approaches. I found out when it was pointed out to me. A guy was watching my eyes dart back and forth from the plane to something and back to the plane. We talked about it and I found I was watching the shadow to see how high I was. The closer the shadow, the closer to the ground.

Angles can cause your eyes to see what is not there. Are you wearing sunglasses? If not try it. My brother does not wear sun glasses much. We was bouncing the plane like a pogo stick until I handed him my shades. He was squinting so hard it effected his vision.

If the wind is giving you problems, try a little faster landing speed. I am not talking a whole lot faster just a tad bit faster then you have been doing it.


Dru.

Alex, depth perception is an individual thing. There are ways to tell how far away your plane or any other object is, and should be practiced without the plane speeding around. While someone else is flying, start looking for clues as to how far away the plane is from you, how far the plane is from the ground. After you get used to this you can judge it much quicker as you fly your plane.

Look for the plane's size in relation to how big it was on the ground. Look for shadows before you take off, the angle won't change much by the time you are ready to land so after a few low passes you can start to guestimate altitude.

I used to fly with a pilot that had one eye, how much depth perception do you think he had?

If you think about it, If you are having problems landing a plane that is within 400 feet from you (assuming you stand at the center of the runway), How do you expect to drive a car at 70MPH and come to a smooth stop at a red light behind another car?

You might think the car is irrelavent, but it's not. In fact that is also a good time to start looking at objects around you and judging how far it is from you, or if it is on an incline. If you have been driving for at least a couple of years, you probably do the calculations without thinking about it. Now it is time to relearn and adapt it to your flying.

jrc's advice is well put. I would only add that just standing next to another pilot...and visually "Landing" his plane with him ( silently) would probably help me too. That opportunity is available to me nearly every day, but..prior to reading this thread..I never thought about doing it. regards, Rich

Not sure how the over your shoulder method would help with your depth perception problem. Maybe a series of painted stripes at regular intervals would help when you can't see the weeds.