The CPA (Classic Pattern Association) and E-power
05-05-2011 | 10:57 AM
#26
RE: The CPA (Classic Pattern Association) and E-power
CPA- So Cal Classic Pattern Get-Together will focus on one-maneuver-per-pass flying, with less emphasis on the aircraft. That is what we are doing out here. "Run what ya brung". Over-scrutinizing aircraft rules will result in the strife seen emanating from the SPA, where there is more focus on the airplane. (Not an attack on the SPA- I am a member).
We should be diligent on not overly dividing a movement that is in it's infancy. Much talk lately about starting even more CPA-like organizations. This is akin to butchering a pig before it is weaned from it's mother. We need to be UNITING under a common banner. Otherwise we will witness a still birth instead of a rennaisance.
So let us conduct ourselves in a gentlemanly manner, and have each other's backs instead of throats.
We should be diligent on not overly dividing a movement that is in it's infancy. Much talk lately about starting even more CPA-like organizations. This is akin to butchering a pig before it is weaned from it's mother. We need to be UNITING under a common banner. Otherwise we will witness a still birth instead of a rennaisance.
So let us conduct ourselves in a gentlemanly manner, and have each other's backs instead of throats.
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05-05-2011 | 03:46 PM
#28
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RE: The CPA (Classic Pattern Association) and E-power
wow.....
Maybe we do need to re-word the "mid-90" to a early 90's... Please remember like someone said we are in the infant stage and growing... I have been a 1 man band getting things started all last year and this year I have had some help from a few guys with stuff this year and that is great ! yes we need to work on some of the finer things, but all good things come with time... 1991 was the last year of none turn around.
Please also remember we went from one contest or gathering in the past years to 7 this year alone and all across the US.... It will take some time but we will grow.
well it's been a long day and I have to pack for a weekend trip.
gear down...
scott
Maybe we do need to re-word the "mid-90" to a early 90's... Please remember like someone said we are in the infant stage and growing... I have been a 1 man band getting things started all last year and this year I have had some help from a few guys with stuff this year and that is great ! yes we need to work on some of the finer things, but all good things come with time... 1991 was the last year of none turn around.
Please also remember we went from one contest or gathering in the past years to 7 this year alone and all across the US.... It will take some time but we will grow.
well it's been a long day and I have to pack for a weekend trip.
gear down...
scott
05-05-2011 | 04:14 PM
#29
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From: Rosamond, CA
RE: The CPA (Classic Pattern Association) and E-power
Turnaround in pattern started in 1984 in F3A. It didn't migrate to all the AMA classes until much later. But airplanes like the Aurora, Jekyll, Beetle, etc, were designed for turnaround in F3A. Just wanted to clear that up. Personally, I believe "Classic" pattern should be one maneuver per pass.
05-05-2011 | 04:33 PM
#30
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RE: The CPA (Classic Pattern Association) and E-power
TonyF..
Great to see you here and get some input... I saw you at the worlds in Tide Water VA and was truly impressed with you and the other pattern fliers.. That is the whole idea of CPA ... one pass one manuver...
scott
Great to see you here and get some input... I saw you at the worlds in Tide Water VA and was truly impressed with you and the other pattern fliers.. That is the whole idea of CPA ... one pass one manuver...
scott
05-05-2011 | 05:12 PM
#31
RE: The CPA (Classic Pattern Association) and E-power
ORIGINAL: TonyF
Turnaround in pattern started in 1984 in F3A. It didn't migrate to all the AMA classes until much later. But airplanes like the Aurora, Jekyll, Beetle, etc, were designed for turnaround in F3A. Just wanted to clear that up. Personally, I believe ''Classic'' pattern should be one maneuver per pass.
Turnaround in pattern started in 1984 in F3A. It didn't migrate to all the AMA classes until much later. But airplanes like the Aurora, Jekyll, Beetle, etc, were designed for turnaround in F3A. Just wanted to clear that up. Personally, I believe ''Classic'' pattern should be one maneuver per pass.
I remember it like it was yesterday!
It was the winter of 83 that I found out that the 1984 season would be the beginning of the turnaround format,
which was the end of pattern for me !
You can’t rewrite history!
05-05-2011 | 05:32 PM
#32
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RE: The CPA (Classic Pattern Association) and E-power
As Tony said in 1984 FAI it went to the turnaround format and the rest of the AMA classes which the CPA is based off 1991 was the last year for none turnaround... Paul I was wondering why I never saw you on the contest trail in the NE as I was flying pattern in 85-95 then took time off and now been flying AMA,SPA for the past 8 years and now CPA here in the south...
So the conclusion is one pass one maneuver.. pretty simple concept...
s.
So the conclusion is one pass one maneuver.. pretty simple concept...
s.
05-05-2011 | 05:53 PM
#33
RE: The CPA (Classic Pattern Association) and E-power
One, I wasn’t flying pattern in 85, read my post.
Better get the 83, 84 and 85 Book.
We both want the same thing!
Better get the 83, 84 and 85 Book.
We both want the same thing!
05-05-2011 | 06:00 PM
#34
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RE: The CPA (Classic Pattern Association) and E-power
Here are the AMA books.. again we are NOT talking FAI...
http://www.classicpatternassociation.../1982-1983.pdf
All the rule books can been found on the appropriate websites..............
http://www.classicpatternassociation.../1982-1983.pdf
All the rule books can been found on the appropriate websites..............
05-05-2011 | 09:30 PM
#35
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From: Pasadena, CA
RE: The CPA (Classic Pattern Association) and E-power
When the turnaround style of pattern was being phased in1984, as stated in a previous post, some contests allowed entry into two categories. I was flying AMA Expert at the time, and several times entered both AMA Expert and Turnaround class. One contest had a really low turnout, so after flying three practice flights on Friday, we flew 8 rounds of pattern in two days. Flying nineteen times in one weekend was a busier schedule than I kept when PRACTICING!! I'm glad I had a good callerit was hard to remember what maneuver I was supposed to be doing!
Kevin
Kevin
05-06-2011 | 08:04 AM
#36
RE: The CPA (Classic Pattern Association) and E-power
I see way too many authorities on rules and not enuogh people wanting to do what we do and that is enjoy flying Classic Pattern Planes. People are stressing way too much on dates. Lets have fun and enjoy this, instead of causing hard feelings by bickering on this forum. I have met some really cool people from being associated with this, and I have met some terds! (YOU KNOW WHO YOU ARE LOL). But the CPA can grow or fall appart it is up to its members.
DP#3
DP#3
05-06-2011 | 11:00 AM
#38
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RE: The CPA (Classic Pattern Association) and E-power
DP3 well said...... As said CPA is in the infant stage and there be some tweeking that needs to be done....
Rusty, looks like your still blocked, showes you posted but no info up......
cpa#2
Rusty, looks like your still blocked, showes you posted but no info up......
cpa#2
05-06-2011 | 01:11 PM
#39
RE: The CPA (Classic Pattern Association) and E-power
ORIGINAL: pitstop000
One, I wasn’t flying pattern in 85, read my post.
Better get the 83, 84 and 85 Book.
We both want the same thing!
One, I wasn’t flying pattern in 85, read my post.
Better get the 83, 84 and 85 Book.
We both want the same thing!
If you and Scott are after the same thing then what is the contention? I'm just an airline pilot so you've got to spell out the difference for me, I've not found it in this thread.
Is it that you don't like the models designed after 1984?
Chris...
05-08-2011 | 02:54 PM
#40
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RE: The CPA (Classic Pattern Association) and E-power
Chris.....lol....I'm in the corporate aviation world.....currently bouncing around in RJ's to get back to Knoxville
05-11-2011 | 07:20 PM
#41
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RE: The CPA (Classic Pattern Association) and E-power
ORIGINAL: pitstop000
Thank you Tony ! ''1984''
I remember it like it was yesterday!
It was the winter of 83 that I found out that the 1984 season would be the beginning of the turnaround format,
which was the end of pattern for me !
You can’t rewrite history!
ORIGINAL: TonyF
Turnaround in pattern started in 1984 in F3A. It didn't migrate to all the AMA classes until much later. But airplanes like the Aurora, Jekyll, Beetle, etc, were designed for turnaround in F3A. Just wanted to clear that up. Personally, I believe ''Classic'' pattern should be one maneuver per pass.
Turnaround in pattern started in 1984 in F3A. It didn't migrate to all the AMA classes until much later. But airplanes like the Aurora, Jekyll, Beetle, etc, were designed for turnaround in F3A. Just wanted to clear that up. Personally, I believe ''Classic'' pattern should be one maneuver per pass.
I remember it like it was yesterday!
It was the winter of 83 that I found out that the 1984 season would be the beginning of the turnaround format,
which was the end of pattern for me !
You can’t rewrite history!
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/m_3043807/tm.htm
There may be other threads that discussed the same thing, but this is the first one that discussed it in detail. You can also go to the Classic Pattern listings and hit the >>. It will take you all the way back, then go to page 95...look at post #5
Hope this helps
Duane
05-11-2011 | 08:42 PM
#42
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From: Rosamond, CA
RE: The CPA (Classic Pattern Association) and E-power
We're going to add Classic Pattern to our Pattern contest On October 1st and 2nd. And we're going to allow you enter both Classic and "regular" pattern. Right now I'm thinking the CPA Sportsman and Masters patterns, but we'll see who shows up and what they want. Might be light on trophies for Classic but it will be a start. We will allow just about any model for this first time. Let's see what happens and go from there.
I've been going to the field a lot with my current "Onas" pattern model and my H-9 Phoenix 7. I have to admit, the Phoenix is getting a lot more air time!
I really hope we can grow Classic into a steady event. There is so much to like about one maneuver per pass. Judging is much easier and new fliers are much less intimidated.
I've been going to the field a lot with my current "Onas" pattern model and my H-9 Phoenix 7. I have to admit, the Phoenix is getting a lot more air time!
I really hope we can grow Classic into a steady event. There is so much to like about one maneuver per pass. Judging is much easier and new fliers are much less intimidated.
05-12-2011 | 03:42 AM
#43
RE: The CPA (Classic Pattern Association) and E-power
ORIGINAL: stuntflyr
So Paul,Is it that you don't like the models designed after 1984?
Chris...
So Paul,Is it that you don't like the models designed after 1984?
Chris...
I wasn’t thinking about the actual model designs but only when turnaround was implemented, which was in 1984, Yes it was the FAI class.
As far as the models go, and this only from my own personal view. I’m thinking more Ballistic than anything else;
but if it was designed originally for a 2 stroke I’m a fan, especially if it had trike gear. Years wise that’s way past 1984, design wise that is.
But again that doesn’t imply that I have any problem with any pattern plane design, and that applies even to the current F3A designs.
In essence a pattern plane is a tool to do a job.
05-12-2011 | 03:45 AM
#44
RE: The CPA (Classic Pattern Association) and E-power
ORIGINAL: kingaltair
This Classic Pattern forum was started in 2005 at the request of 8178, and it has been a tremendous success. Back when the forum started there was a lot of discussion of just what ''Classic Pattern'' was, and the history of Classic Pattern. Take a look at post (on page 95, Classic Pattern, post #5) on this thread from 2005.
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/m_3043807/tm.htm
There may be other threads that discussed the same thing, but this is the first one that discussed it in detail. You can also go to the Classic Pattern listings and hit the >>. It will take you all the way back, then go to page 95...look at post #5
Hope this helps
Duane
ORIGINAL: pitstop000
Thank you Tony ! ''1984''
I remember it like it was yesterday!
It was the winter of 83 that I found out that the 1984 season would be the beginning of the turnaround format,
which was the end of pattern for me !
You can’t rewrite history!
ORIGINAL: TonyF
Turnaround in pattern started in 1984 in F3A. It didn't migrate to all the AMA classes until much later. But airplanes like the Aurora, Jekyll, Beetle, etc, were designed for turnaround in F3A. Just wanted to clear that up. Personally, I believe ''Classic'' pattern should be one maneuver per pass.
Turnaround in pattern started in 1984 in F3A. It didn't migrate to all the AMA classes until much later. But airplanes like the Aurora, Jekyll, Beetle, etc, were designed for turnaround in F3A. Just wanted to clear that up. Personally, I believe ''Classic'' pattern should be one maneuver per pass.
I remember it like it was yesterday!
It was the winter of 83 that I found out that the 1984 season would be the beginning of the turnaround format,
which was the end of pattern for me !
You can’t rewrite history!
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/m_3043807/tm.htm
There may be other threads that discussed the same thing, but this is the first one that discussed it in detail. You can also go to the Classic Pattern listings and hit the >>. It will take you all the way back, then go to page 95...look at post #5
Hope this helps
Duane
05-12-2011 | 04:46 AM
#45
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RE: The CPA (Classic Pattern Association) and E-power
I have never understood all the restrictions on the airplanes by the SPA, CPA, BPA, or
whatever. The emphasis should be on the maneuvers and style of flying like the old days.
For those of us who actually flew pattern back then we should remember the only restriction
was engine size. That automatically limited the airplanes size and weight. When you showed up
at a pattern contest back then it was fly what you brung ! The rule books from back then are
available, I don't understand why they weren't used to restart classic pattern.
tommy s
whatever. The emphasis should be on the maneuvers and style of flying like the old days.
For those of us who actually flew pattern back then we should remember the only restriction
was engine size. That automatically limited the airplanes size and weight. When you showed up
at a pattern contest back then it was fly what you brung ! The rule books from back then are
available, I don't understand why they weren't used to restart classic pattern.
tommy s
05-12-2011 | 08:22 AM
#46
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RE: The CPA (Classic Pattern Association) and E-power
Tommy s
In CPA we are using the AMA published rule books for the years we are currently flying... Nothing has changed from back in the day..
one pass , one maneuver
scott cpa#2
In CPA we are using the AMA published rule books for the years we are currently flying... Nothing has changed from back in the day..
one pass , one maneuver
scott cpa#2
05-12-2011 | 09:33 AM
#47
RE: The CPA (Classic Pattern Association) and E-power
ORIGINAL: pitstop000
Chris, when I started this thread my initial question was about e-power and the cpa. Like most threads after the initial question is answered another question was asked which led us here.
I wasn’t thinking about the actual model designs but only when turnaround was implemented, which was in 1984, Yes it was the FAI class.
As far as the models go, and this only from my own personal view. I’m thinking more Ballistic than anything else;
but if it was designed originally for a 2 stroke I’m a fan, especially if it had trike gear. Years wise that’s way past 1984, design wise that is.
But again that doesn’t imply that I have any problem with any pattern plane design, and that applies even to the current F3A designs.
In essence a pattern plane is a tool to do a job.
ORIGINAL: stuntflyr
So Paul,Is it that you don't like the models designed after 1984?
Chris...
So Paul,Is it that you don't like the models designed after 1984?
Chris...
I wasn’t thinking about the actual model designs but only when turnaround was implemented, which was in 1984, Yes it was the FAI class.
As far as the models go, and this only from my own personal view. I’m thinking more Ballistic than anything else;
but if it was designed originally for a 2 stroke I’m a fan, especially if it had trike gear. Years wise that’s way past 1984, design wise that is.
But again that doesn’t imply that I have any problem with any pattern plane design, and that applies even to the current F3A designs.
In essence a pattern plane is a tool to do a job.
Hi Paul,
I guess it ended up sounding like there was a fundamental difference of opinion where there is not. Thanks for the note, glad to know all is well.
Chris...
05-12-2011 | 11:06 AM
#48
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RE: The CPA (Classic Pattern Association) and E-power
Scott, I don't want to put words in Tommy's mouth, but it sounds like from his opening sentence he was referring to the airframes themselves, not the maneuver schedules. Are you allowed designing your own airframes in CPA as long as you are using the proper engine size restrictions? I could be fuzzy on this, but I seem to remember that being the case when BPA first started up. I remember a gentleman on here was building a patternship based along the looks of the navy crusader. He had an entire build thread as I recall documenting the design and construction. Don't know if he ever finished.
Eric
Eric
05-12-2011 | 11:07 AM
#49
RE: The CPA (Classic Pattern Association) and E-power
Prediction:
If Classic Pattern is a "run what ya brung" event, as time passes the classic (I.E. Ballistic) airplanes will tend to dominate. Why?
Because that is what they are designed to do. Fast and powerful is well suited for one-maneuver-per -pass style of flying.
Like I said, only a prediction. No crystal balls were harmed or used
If Classic Pattern is a "run what ya brung" event, as time passes the classic (I.E. Ballistic) airplanes will tend to dominate. Why?
Because that is what they are designed to do. Fast and powerful is well suited for one-maneuver-per -pass style of flying.
Like I said, only a prediction. No crystal balls were harmed or used
05-12-2011 | 12:19 PM
#50
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From: Knoxville,
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RE: The CPA (Classic Pattern Association) and E-power
See www.classicpatternassociation.com for the mission statement-
The planes are from the pre-turn around days...
There are threads on the basic plane info elsewhere.
Remember guys this is in the infant stage and we have increased contest this year and are working on all the other details.
S.
The planes are from the pre-turn around days...
There are threads on the basic plane info elsewhere.
Remember guys this is in the infant stage and we have increased contest this year and are working on all the other details.
S.
