The fact you have a 120 2-stroke doesn't hurt. Lately I have had the practice of "building light" pounded into me. We try to get a Simla abound 9lbs.

As far as comparisons go...good luck. When we have our SIMLA FLY-IN, (or whatever we decide to call it), it will be interesting what set-up appeals to the most pilots. I hope that some of the 50-odd Simlas that have been spoken for so far, will be built in the "Clipped-Wing" version...that some will have .60-2-strokes in them...some electric, (to get the best set-up for that medium)...and some no doubt will have some huge 2-meter powerplant in them and will be able to do an unlimited vertical climb. It will be great to see all of that.

Kevin and I have even discussed the idea, (in general terms...see the EKT thread), of making mods to the basic Simla to make a contemporary 2-meter pattern plane out of it. I know that plane should never be the "norm", but it would be interesting to see what we could dream up. Of course the red/white/black Kaz color scheme would be a must, along with the Bosch airfoil, (just cut down to 78"). Personally I'd like to retain the basic looks of the Simla, and keep as much of it as possible...it would be a great project. The general thinking would be, "what would Ed do now to make a modern 2-meter pattern plane if he were here"? We would, of course take cues from modern planes, but it would have to retain the basic current fuselage, and be built from the kit...(ie no "widebodies").[:'(]

Duane

Just a little ditty that I use to do some paint work. I have fabricated heads for 40,60,120, and one 50cc size aircraft. It will also hold wings as well.

That paint stand is like a jig that was previously posted in a magazine years ago(I forget which). However, you made it out of pvc and it appears to be an excellent upgrade! I will be sure to copy it.
The original had an additional arm to hold the wing. It was made of wood and attached to the wing at the aileron servo plate(Remember using just one aileron servo?).
Finishing a pattern model leaves one with a multitude of questions. Film is the lightest(unless you can finish an airplane the the U/C stunt guys!). However, I used to use K&B clear to attach the 3/4oz fiberglass. Then, Superpoxy primer,sanded off and the Superpoxy color. Silk and dope produced lighter finishes but have you priced silk and dope lately?
I got around that by buying Randolph clear and thinner from Aircraft Spruce and then 5mm silk from Dharma Trading. The urethanes are great if you have the safety equipment to use them. Painting a pattern airplane is my favorite method but use anything that suits you.

somiss1, this particular idea came from being a long time gear head and engine builder. I basically copied an engine stand in 2" pvc. I did have toream out the upper T in order to get a 2" pipe to slide all the way through and rotate. If you decide to make one I would recommend that you move the angled brace farther out on the legs and farther up the upright closer to the head as that will increase the stability for larger models. When I first built this one I was building 40 size aircraft, not thinking about larger and larger birds.

Bill,

Nice! Yet another idea of yours that I'll steal.

Remember, plagiarism is the sincerest form of flattery.

;-)

Cheers,
Richard

Richard, Just received my tube and sleeve, so it looks like a wing building weekend to me. Check the weight difference.

Bill,

My set of tubes arrived today, also. That's a nice weight difference. Every bit helps.

According to my measurements, the inner tube is roughly 0.90 inches in diameter, and the sleeve is about 1.02 inches in diameter. (It's flexible, so not able to get a perfect reading.) The holes may not need to opened much, if at all.

Got the first coat of primer on the stab, ready to be sanded down. Working on sheeting the fin. I decided to try something different for sheeting the leading edges and will report if it works/is worth the trouble. Really want to get the tail surfaces done so I can start on the fuse. (I did use your idea of laying out the engine mount before the firewall is glued-in. Looks like a bit of the mount will need to be ground off.)

Beautiful day here. Would have been nice to get to the field, but I re-kitted one plane (I think it can be repaired) and the OS .95AX on the remaining flyable plane is acting up. Just because I can land dead-stick doesn't mean that I enjoy it.

Cheers,
Richard

Richard, I basically wrapped a piece of 180 grit from my roll (about six to eightinches longwill do)around the cardboard sleeve supplied with the kit. You will have to start it at an angle and just keep twisting until it makes it's way through the original hole. After that, test and sand until you get the fit you want. It only takes a couple of minutes per hole ( ten holes counting the fuselage) for about twenty to thirty minutes total. It's 8:00 pmright now and I already have the right wing prepped for sheeting and a wing tip. One suggestion that made it a lot easier for me was to tape both sides of the rib feet with a piece of 3/4" masking tape. Before I did that the feet kept breaking off when working the two 5/16"steel jig rods through the ribs. After taping the the feet to theribs not one broke off. With any luck,I'llget the left wing framed up tomorrow and both covered by Monday or Tuesday. Photos to follow.

Bill,

I'll try that. And taping the feet.

Having never done it, I do have a question or two about priming/sanding/etc.

1. Is the object to (a) keep sanding until only balsa shows, or (b) to prime and sand until any low spots show that the primer has been knocked down a bit? It would seem that (a) would lead to some holes in the sheeting. (b) would seem to produce a flat surface.

2. Does anyone use a power sander, such as the Black and Decker Mouse (which I have) for this?

The primer I have is Sem High Build Primer Surfacer (at $17.50 a can). I looked for PlastiKote (sp?) but Sem was the only recommended primer I could find. I think I probably used too much for the first coat.

Here's an image of my stab showing that my sheeting wasn't as wrinkle-free as I had thought. This represents about 40 minutes using a sanding bar and 80-grit paper. I still have the other side to do.

Richard, there are several purposes that primer fulfills. The ones that you would probably find most helpful would be high solids primers thatare used to fill small imperfections and scratches. Keeping in mind that the finer grit sandpaper you use, the less primer you will have to use. I like to finish sand to 180 grit and then prime with twocoats of primer,followed by spraying a light coat of a contrastingcolor over the primer as a guide coat. Then I finish sand the guide coated primer with 320 or 400 grit if I ampainting with solid colors, and 500 to 600 gritif I am painting with high metallic colors. Usea medium to soft block ofsome type and sand the guide coat untilthe contrasting color disappears. As you sand you will notice high and low spots (high spots will show primer quickly and low spots will remain colored). Continue to sand until you start to sand through the primer or until all of the contrasting color disappears. I would reprime any areas that I sanded through, as ringlets will form in these areas when you paint if you don't reprime. BTW use the cheapest fast dryspray can paint you can for the guide coat because you are going to sand it all off any way. It's only purpose is to show you any highs, lows, and imperfections you may have missed. I hope this clears up some details for you. I know this can be overwhelming when you first get started, but I have over forty years dealing with painting and paint products so it has become second nature to me. Just keep at it, because in this case practice truly can make perfect.Good luck!

PS- You certainly can use power sanders, but keep in mind you are sanding a relatively soft surface, so go easy and check often.

Bill,

Just to make sure I understand, and using the stab as an example:

1. Prime it again. (Probably with less than the quarter-inch coat from my first attempt.)

2. Spray on a guide coat.

3. Use a soft block instead of a hard sanding bar.

4. Sand it down again.

5. Repeat as necessary until the guide coat disappears.

6. Make sure there are no bare spots so ringlets don't form. In other words, the goal is a smooth surface, not one that is free of primer.

7. Use something finer than 80-grit.

It also sounds as though, if I find a spot that is particularly low, that I should fill with the body filler instead of trying to build it up with primer. (Deciding how low is "particularly low" is left as an exercise for the student.)

Hmmm ... I still like my idea of flying you from workshop to workshop.

Hope your wings are coming along without annoyances.

As always, many many thanks for sharing your expertise. I'd still be puzzling through the directions if left entirely on my own.

Cheers,
Richard

Richard,

1. Yes
2. Yes
3. Yes, I have included photos of the blocks and pads that I use. All should be available at your automotive paint store.
4.Yes
5.Yes
6. Yes, A smooth surface is what you are shooting for. The reason I apply two medium coats of primer is to avoid excessive build up (ie-extra weight). The idea is to sand as much primeroff as possible without breaking through the primer.
7. Yes

Check post # 208. Photos were added at 3:00 PM eastern time Sunday. 3 Shots of the right wing frame, and 2 shots of the left wing frame on the bench.

Bill,

I'm glad to see all those "yeses," meaning I'm getting a clue.

Nice job on the wings! What's your opinion of replacing the steel rod with a carbon fiber one, like you did with the stab?

By the way, here's a couple links on RCScaleBuilder.com that explain the iron-on method of applying sheeting. I'll do a test to make sure it works with the 3/32-inch sheeting. It certainly eliminates having to work really fast or apply a ton of weight to hold down the skin while the glue dries/cures.

http://www.rcscalebuilder.com/forum/...31&PN=0&TPN=26

http://www.rcscalebuilder.com/forum/...69&PN=1&TPN=33

Cheers,
Richard

Richard, I don't know about CF rods in the wings. It would definitely make the wings super rigid without adding much weight. I noticed that the steel rods are very easy to remove once the wing frame is all glued together, so sliding a couple of CF rods in after most of the sheeting is completed would not be out of the question. Perhaps Duane and/or Kevin could grace us Simla novices with a thought on such a procedure.

It would be possible to use CF rod in the wings. The advantage of doing so would be that you would not have to fully sheet the wings. It would be strong/rigid enough to just sheet the LE and TE with 3" wide and then cap the ribs. You could save a good amount of weight, but you would have to cover with film or something different than FG cloth to span the rib bays.

Just a thought.

Kevin Clark

That would make the Simla really look like Taurus's big brother. I like it.I think I would like to try some of these suggestions on a second Simla. Perhaps a 96 incher with all contest balsa, CF rods in the wing and tail feathers, clothe covering on both, slimmer tail feathers with no sheet covering, and no fiber glass covering. Maybe even a 60 size engine. OMG a seven pound Simla.LOL

Great. I'm still working on tail feathers, and Bill is already getting ready to start a second Simla.

And now another lesson learned:

Using an enamel paint as the guide coat doesn't work well (at least in my case), since the enamel doesn't sand well. It balls up and clogs the sandpaper. I'll be looking for something else to use as the contrast coat.

Cheers,
Richard

The problem with getting experience is getting the experience.

On a more positive note, I sheeted one side of the fin using the iron-on method, and it seems to work. On the other side, I'll use a thinner layer of glue (Titebond Original) and let it dry even more before ironing it. I had to keep the heat over an area longer since the glue was applied too heavily and still too wet. The cotton setting seems to do the trick.

Cheers,
Richard

[quote]ORIGINAL: patternflyer76


Kevin,

Interesting idea; I'm all for saving some weight, and already had decided to use Ultracoat instead of paint. Shall give this some thought. I want to make sure I'm not deviating too much from the Simla.

Cheers,
Richard

Richard, I'm sorry I didn't warn you about enamels. They can take quite awhile to set up. You might try to wet sand what you have guide coated with enamel. Possibly a few hours out in the sun might help as well. Lacquer if you can find it is one of the better quide coating mediums. I should have mentioned that a guide coat is applied extremely light . It should look like a coatoffreckles on your primer. Though I do not plan on using primer on the Simla, I will be guide coatimg the clear coat before I sand it for paint. When I do that, I will shoot some photos.
.

Bill,

"Fast drying" apparently means something different when applied to enamels.

Fortunately, I didn't apply it heavily. Possibly heavier than necessary, but not a full, even coat. I waited another couple hours and then kept changing sandpaper and sanded until I was getting back to wood. Now I've primed it again and will get some lacquer. Probably red or yellow, or another color that shows against the gray-blue primer a bit better.

I suspect, though, that the stab will be heavier than anyone would like. On the other hand, with that large engine up front, it might not balance too poorly. And I've become fairly proficient at moving components around instead of adding unnecessary balancing weight.

As far as lessons learned go, this one is annoying, but not critical. I can live with that.

Cheers,
Richard

Richard, when I say fast drying I mean that you should be able totouch it in ten to twelve minutes and sand it in thirty minutes. It may seem like you are adding weight every time you spray your stab but remember your are sanding most of it off.

Agree with everything Kevin says about the rigidity since on a sheeting wing, most of the strength comes from the sheeting,a nd if you decided to have a Taurus look by not sheeting to save weight, that would be a good way to do it. That being said, our goal was to duplicate the exterior look of the Simla, while trying to make it as light as possible without compromising that look. A Simla wing that wasn't fully sheeted would be contrary to that goal.

I will start the wing later tonight...looks like billberry got ahead of me again while I was at an SPA contest in Chattanooga, Tn. I lost my primary plane the day before the contest, just before leaving, (you know...one more flight, then we'll leave). Using my back up King Altair that I had only flown a handful of times didn't lend itself for having a good showing...too much good competition.

Duane

Duane,

Sorry to hear about your mishap.
And thanks for reminding me the point of this whole exercise. I was trying to decide just how to proceed with the wings. I checked with my LHS and they have .3150 CF tubes for $7.49 each, so I think I will go ahead and use them to help strengthen the wings and sheet the whole wing on this go round keeping with the theme of this exercise. Later just for experimental purposes I will try the "Taurus" look for added weight reduction.

Just want to remind everyone that the wings may be a bit more rigid, but will still "bust up" like any other plane in the event of a major crash..I think what will happen is the CF rods will be intact, and the balsa around it will become "deformed" around it. If it is worth the added expense, it certainly can be done, but it may be "overkill" because the sheeting strength should be MORE THAN ADEQUATE.

Remember you've got to save up the CF dollars to travel to the "Simla Rodeo Round-Up".

Duane