Aurora 60 Build Thread - Electric Power
#126
RE: Aurora 60 Build Thread - Electric Power
Sorry if i'm not making myself clear ! That was not the intention. Flying outrunners demonstrates the peculiar phenomenon that the motor allways gives good performance on a plane that has a weight exactly 10 times the weight of the motor !
Example : Typical shock flyer and AXI 2204 54. Motor is 20 gramme and shockflyer is 200 gram including two 640 lipo cells. Gives good performance.
Flitons "Rogue" and AXI 2808. Motor is 76 gramme and the plane is ca 750 gramme with 3s 2100 cells. Also gives good performance
My own "Elaine" ( Search the electric pattern threads ) Cocaine with 553 gramme of Hyperion 4045 14 and 5400 gramme of model with 10 s Hyperion 5000 cells. Also has very good power. Funny, right ?
You should be able to put a much smaller motor, and benefit from the lower overall weight, on your Aurora. Something around 400 gramme would be fine !
Example : Typical shock flyer and AXI 2204 54. Motor is 20 gramme and shockflyer is 200 gram including two 640 lipo cells. Gives good performance.
Flitons "Rogue" and AXI 2808. Motor is 76 gramme and the plane is ca 750 gramme with 3s 2100 cells. Also gives good performance
My own "Elaine" ( Search the electric pattern threads ) Cocaine with 553 gramme of Hyperion 4045 14 and 5400 gramme of model with 10 s Hyperion 5000 cells. Also has very good power. Funny, right ?
You should be able to put a much smaller motor, and benefit from the lower overall weight, on your Aurora. Something around 400 gramme would be fine !
#127
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Ottawa,
ON, CANADA
Posts: 179
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
RE: Aurora 60 Build Thread - Electric Power
Eggert, I've got it now. You're probably right in that 1200ish watts might be plenty for this airplane (maybe comparable to having a traditional .60 up front?) but if I can get the advertised 1500-1600W out of this set-up, I'll take it even though I could maybe have saved a few ounces up front using a smaller motor. Better to over-do it than come up short....IMHO.
Jeff
Jeff
#128
RE: Aurora 60 Build Thread - Electric Power
I see your point, the plane will be ballistic, but you also have to consider power conservation i.e the length of flights. The smaller motor will make it easier to have long air time and the Aurora deserves to stay as long as possible in the sky .
#129
Junior Member
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: longueuil,
QC, CANADA
Posts: 26
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
RE: Aurora 60 Build Thread - Electric Power
For your information I tried the 13X13 today with a more rearward cg...
A lot less thrust but a lot more speed... I even had to reduce the throws...
Landing is also faster (less prop brake)
Snap are a lot more violent (cog)
This setup is running well believe me a 4035 would be pushed to its limits thus by putting 150g more of iron your are buying reliability.
Moreover the weight of the 4045 is exactly the same as a YS61
A lot less thrust but a lot more speed... I even had to reduce the throws...
Landing is also faster (less prop brake)
Snap are a lot more violent (cog)
This setup is running well believe me a 4035 would be pushed to its limits thus by putting 150g more of iron your are buying reliability.
Moreover the weight of the 4045 is exactly the same as a YS61
#132
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Ottawa,
ON, CANADA
Posts: 179
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
RE: Aurora 60 Build Thread - Electric Power
It's been a while since my last post. To update eveyone, the entire aircraft has been glassed with multiple coats of Polycrylic applied. I've sanded a few areas just to get a feel for the Poly and it seems to sand just fine.
Unfortunately I have to stop there for a while as I'm moving back to Canada in about 3 weeks. I'm having to direct all my energy and attention preparing for the move so no modeling time! The good news is that generally speaking, the RC scene in Ottawa, Ontario (where I'm moving to) is good...the bad news is pattern in eastern Canada is in a bit of a lull. Anyhow, I expect to be back at it late in the summer and I'll continue to post my progress as I apply the finish to what I'm hoping will be a beauty.
Jeff
Unfortunately I have to stop there for a while as I'm moving back to Canada in about 3 weeks. I'm having to direct all my energy and attention preparing for the move so no modeling time! The good news is that generally speaking, the RC scene in Ottawa, Ontario (where I'm moving to) is good...the bad news is pattern in eastern Canada is in a bit of a lull. Anyhow, I expect to be back at it late in the summer and I'll continue to post my progress as I apply the finish to what I'm hoping will be a beauty.
Jeff
#133
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Ottawa,
ON, CANADA
Posts: 179
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
RE: Aurora 60 Build Thread - Electric Power
These last 2 months for me have been spent moving to Ottawa, Canada. Now that the dust is settling, I'm continuing where I left off.
After installing all 3 retracts/wheels and assembling the airplane, I adjusted the nosewheel height to achieve an approximate zero degree wing incidence wrt the ground. After establishing this reference, I then proceeded to rough-in the nosegear retract cut-out in the belly pan.
It's good to be building again!!!
Jeff L
After installing all 3 retracts/wheels and assembling the airplane, I adjusted the nosewheel height to achieve an approximate zero degree wing incidence wrt the ground. After establishing this reference, I then proceeded to rough-in the nosegear retract cut-out in the belly pan.
It's good to be building again!!!
Jeff L
#135
RE: Aurora 60 Build Thread - Electric Power
ORIGINAL: Bootalini
I then proceeded to rough-in the nosegear retract cut-out in the belly pan.
I then proceeded to rough-in the nosegear retract cut-out in the belly pan.
Welcome back.
Mark
#136
Senior Member
RE: Aurora 60 Build Thread - Electric Power
ORIGINAL: mmattockx
Does anyone else think that may be the nicest job of "roughing in" a cut out ever? There are a lot of guys in the gas forum that can't FINISH their ARF cowls that nicely. Beautiful work, Jeff.
Welcome back.
Mark
ORIGINAL: Bootalini
I then proceeded to rough-in the nosegear retract cut-out in the belly pan.
I then proceeded to rough-in the nosegear retract cut-out in the belly pan.
Welcome back.
Mark
#137
My Feedback: (18)
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Euharlee,
GA
Posts: 1,828
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
RE: Aurora 60 Build Thread - Electric Power
ORIGINAL: Nathan King
I second that!! That looks as good as my finish jobs.
ORIGINAL: mmattockx
Does anyone else think that may be the nicest job of "roughing in" a cut out ever? There are a lot of guys in the gas forum that can't FINISH their ARF cowls that nicely. Beautiful work, Jeff.
Welcome back.
Mark
ORIGINAL: Bootalini
I then proceeded to rough-in the nosegear retract cut-out in the belly pan.
I then proceeded to rough-in the nosegear retract cut-out in the belly pan.
Welcome back.
Mark
We have CNC Machined parts at work that don't look that good!!
Glad your back at it!!
Have Fun...
Chuck
#138
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Ottawa,
ON, CANADA
Posts: 179
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
RE: Aurora 60 Build Thread - Electric Power
[link]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0VOiPiwFmTE[/link]
A video from a fellow in Montreal (Chronos 333) flying an Aurora with the identical electric set-up that I'll be using. No lack of power there!!!
Jeff
A video from a fellow in Montreal (Chronos 333) flying an Aurora with the identical electric set-up that I'll be using. No lack of power there!!!
Jeff
#139
Senior Member
RE: Aurora 60 Build Thread - Electric Power
I've never heard an electric setup sound like that before. We have a few guys with electric 2x2 pattern ships that are almost as quiet as a foamy.
That's a pretty rough landing area. I wouldn't think those gear would hold up well over time. All he needs to do now is to actually fly pattern!!
It doesn't seem to need more power though. [8D]
That's a pretty rough landing area. I wouldn't think those gear would hold up well over time. All he needs to do now is to actually fly pattern!!
It doesn't seem to need more power though. [8D]
#141
Junior Member
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: longueuil,
QC, CANADA
Posts: 26
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
RE: Aurora 60 Build Thread - Electric Power
Hi guys,
Cool you like it, love its sound... that's all prop noise and wood resonance. A sheated wing won't make as much noise...[:-]
The grass is a bit long at our field, I may change field for saving my retracts...
If you look carefuly, Iam not that rough with my dear, the field IS!
If you think my Erora is overpowered, look at this:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tHmyHKZ_eUc
To me my erora has just enough power. the 14X12 eprop was cool (lots of thrust, less amps)... but I really like the speed of the 13X13. If we were flying on a paved runway I would put the 14X12e back...
The 14X14 glow prop was INSANE... like the bart hotliner in a way...
See ya
Cool you like it, love its sound... that's all prop noise and wood resonance. A sheated wing won't make as much noise...[:-]
The grass is a bit long at our field, I may change field for saving my retracts...
If you look carefuly, Iam not that rough with my dear, the field IS!
If you think my Erora is overpowered, look at this:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tHmyHKZ_eUc
To me my erora has just enough power. the 14X12 eprop was cool (lots of thrust, less amps)... but I really like the speed of the 13X13. If we were flying on a paved runway I would put the 14X12e back...
The 14X14 glow prop was INSANE... like the bart hotliner in a way...
See ya
#142
Junior Member
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: longueuil,
QC, CANADA
Posts: 26
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
RE: Aurora 60 Build Thread - Electric Power
I forgot to mention, before playing the 2nd vid, crank up your speakers so you can hear the noise during the dives.
It is trully addictive
It is trully addictive
#143
Senior Member
RE: Aurora 60 Build Thread - Electric Power
ORIGINAL: chronos333
The grass is a bit long at our field, I may change field for saving my retracts...
If you look carefuly, Iam not that rough with my dear, the field IS!
The grass is a bit long at our field, I may change field for saving my retracts...
If you look carefuly, Iam not that rough with my dear, the field IS!
What method do you use to mount your retracts? It's nice and sturdy.
EDIT: WOW that is a cool sound in the dives!!
#144
Junior Member
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: longueuil,
QC, CANADA
Posts: 26
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
RE: Aurora 60 Build Thread - Electric Power
The lg mounts: It'a a secret method held by the one who fly bad like me (aka who don't fly pattern [:'(])!
14X12 had a far better prop brake, I was able to land a lot slower with it... when it was glow the 11X12W was stressful to land... 1991 I was 12 yrs old at the time ... the paved runway was less than 150ftX12ft ... surrounded by grapes... had to land engine cut to come in slow enough everytime.
My new cg (1st flight with a rx battery in the tail on the vid) is too rearward:
- stall turns are next to impossible (they usually are my fav as I do them in less than 1/2 wingspan diameter without engine help ... I am no cheater)
- snaps give you 3/4 turn for free and are really nasty (check them out on the vid they are really really nasty)
- plane is twitchy and laterally unstable (as you can see from the way I correct it with the ailerons)
Yet I still lack ailerons throws, 4 pointers have to be with the stick in the corner!
Yes I don't fly pattern anymore, competition brought all the fun out of the hobby when I was young.
Now I fly the way I like, the way I feel.
14X12 had a far better prop brake, I was able to land a lot slower with it... when it was glow the 11X12W was stressful to land... 1991 I was 12 yrs old at the time ... the paved runway was less than 150ftX12ft ... surrounded by grapes... had to land engine cut to come in slow enough everytime.
My new cg (1st flight with a rx battery in the tail on the vid) is too rearward:
- stall turns are next to impossible (they usually are my fav as I do them in less than 1/2 wingspan diameter without engine help ... I am no cheater)
- snaps give you 3/4 turn for free and are really nasty (check them out on the vid they are really really nasty)
- plane is twitchy and laterally unstable (as you can see from the way I correct it with the ailerons)
Yet I still lack ailerons throws, 4 pointers have to be with the stick in the corner!
Yes I don't fly pattern anymore, competition brought all the fun out of the hobby when I was young.
Now I fly the way I like, the way I feel.
#145
Junior Member
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: longueuil,
QC, CANADA
Posts: 26
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
RE: Aurora 60 Build Thread - Electric Power
Hi guys,
2 flight today.
First flight, loss of power after 6min30
Second flight, not much power after 2min and no more after 4 min
Charged them back at home @ 0.5C = 2200mah (they were 3700mah originally)
So I guess my lipos are officialy DEAD! [&:]
They didn't last the advertised 200 cycles (in fact I am closer to 70 cycles)
They survived a fire (when the esc caught fire last year) and 1 deep discharge (cell balooned slightly but came back to normal) over 2 years.They were always carefuly balanced and discharged to 80% not more. Another mistake I did with them is to store them fully charged during the winter, consequently they developped higher IR and started to heat a bit more.
Chronos
2 flight today.
First flight, loss of power after 6min30
Second flight, not much power after 2min and no more after 4 min
Charged them back at home @ 0.5C = 2200mah (they were 3700mah originally)
So I guess my lipos are officialy DEAD! [&:]
They didn't last the advertised 200 cycles (in fact I am closer to 70 cycles)
They survived a fire (when the esc caught fire last year) and 1 deep discharge (cell balooned slightly but came back to normal) over 2 years.They were always carefuly balanced and discharged to 80% not more. Another mistake I did with them is to store them fully charged during the winter, consequently they developped higher IR and started to heat a bit more.
Chronos
#146
Senior Member
RE: Aurora 60 Build Thread - Electric Power
That set of mistakes is enough to kill the batteries after less than half of their rated lifetime.
Store at 3.8 Volts per cell.
Store at 3.8 Volts per cell.
#150
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Ottawa,
ON, CANADA
Posts: 179
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
RE: Aurora 60 Build Thread - Electric Power
For those wondering, I've not completely abandoned my project. Work and other competing interests have made it difficult. The radio installation and retract rigging is pretty much done and I'll be taking everything out soon so I can continue with applying the finish. I anticipate good progress between now and the end of the X-Mas holiday.
As an aside, any of you following the indoor pattern F3P stuff?.....it looks plenty challenging and fun. I just purchased a 'Clik' pattern foamy and will be flying this winter with the indoor crowd here in Ottawa.
Jeff
As an aside, any of you following the indoor pattern F3P stuff?.....it looks plenty challenging and fun. I just purchased a 'Clik' pattern foamy and will be flying this winter with the indoor crowd here in Ottawa.
Jeff