Deception 10 Build Thread
03-07-2009, 08:36 PM
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RE: Deception 10 Build Thread
Hey Vince,
its the marching on of "progress".
Nonetheless - new site or old site, I'll have to get back onto finishing this little bullet soon!
David.
its the marching on of "progress".
Nonetheless - new site or old site, I'll have to get back onto finishing this little bullet soon!
David.
11-06-2010, 02:02 PM
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RE: Deception 10 Build Thread
Mike,
thanks for your interest in the little Deception build.
To answer your first question, I won't say no, I'll say not yet! I basically lost momentum after leaving the stab to cure while picking up my kid at school, came back, and realized it had canted to the side...
I was ticked off to say the least. Anyhow, I need some forstner bits to fix the situation. When I get them, I'll probably just go right through and finish things up.
The model was my first attempt at building a reduced scale classic pattern plane and I overbuilt it. Basically, the fuse sides which are 1/8" should have been 3/32" and the core sheeting was 1/16" where it should have been 1/32" for a model of this size. Still, these are the equivalent weights that would have been used back when the Deception was first designed and built and I expect the model to come in at 40 oz AUW. Because I feel this is a little on the heavy side, I'd like to shed some 4 oz so before covering, the airframe will go on a diet to shed those ounces.
If you are interested in building a little Deception with tall the bells and whistles (7 servos in this model), I'd recommend a slightly larger model. In fact, after having built two 40" classics (the Deception and a Tiporare), I've reached the conclusion that unless you build them very simply perhaps with electric power, you're better off building a larger version. At a minimum of 48" span, things become considerably easier. Basically a .25 to .32 size airframe and up is a good size. A Deception 30 can easily be built with a 32-35 size power plant and if you want to include retracts (no Deception should be without), there is a simple and nice option in the 4 lb electric retracts available today.
I scaled the plans to various sizes including 15, 30, 45 and 60. Of course, it's a simple matter to produce a Super Deception for a 90 or 120 size engine if desired. 6' is an ideal target span for a 90-120 version.
Let me know what plans you are interested in and I'll direct you to them.
David.
thanks for your interest in the little Deception build.
To answer your first question, I won't say no, I'll say not yet! I basically lost momentum after leaving the stab to cure while picking up my kid at school, came back, and realized it had canted to the side...
I was ticked off to say the least. Anyhow, I need some forstner bits to fix the situation. When I get them, I'll probably just go right through and finish things up.The model was my first attempt at building a reduced scale classic pattern plane and I overbuilt it. Basically, the fuse sides which are 1/8" should have been 3/32" and the core sheeting was 1/16" where it should have been 1/32" for a model of this size. Still, these are the equivalent weights that would have been used back when the Deception was first designed and built and I expect the model to come in at 40 oz AUW. Because I feel this is a little on the heavy side, I'd like to shed some 4 oz so before covering, the airframe will go on a diet to shed those ounces.
If you are interested in building a little Deception with tall the bells and whistles (7 servos in this model), I'd recommend a slightly larger model. In fact, after having built two 40" classics (the Deception and a Tiporare), I've reached the conclusion that unless you build them very simply perhaps with electric power, you're better off building a larger version. At a minimum of 48" span, things become considerably easier. Basically a .25 to .32 size airframe and up is a good size. A Deception 30 can easily be built with a 32-35 size power plant and if you want to include retracts (no Deception should be without), there is a simple and nice option in the 4 lb electric retracts available today.
I scaled the plans to various sizes including 15, 30, 45 and 60. Of course, it's a simple matter to produce a Super Deception for a 90 or 120 size engine if desired. 6' is an ideal target span for a 90-120 version.
Let me know what plans you are interested in and I'll direct you to them.
David.
11-07-2010, 02:41 PM
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RE: Deception 10 Build Thread
David,
I've got a little Enya .19X I've been looking to put on something. Its a hot little engine so I'm thinking the .15 size.
Thanks,
Mike
I've got a little Enya .19X I've been looking to put on something. Its a hot little engine so I'm thinking the .15 size.
Thanks,
Mike
11-07-2010, 04:35 PM
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RE: Deception 10 Build Thread
Mike,
Deception 15:
http://www.4shared.com/document/B2h8..._15_40x24.html
Deception 30:
http://www.4shared.com/document/NLYR..._30_48x27.html
Phil,
Deception 45:
http://www.4shared.com/document/4kXz..._45_51x29.html
Deception 60:
http://www.4shared.com/document/EOc7..._60_62x36.html
I should point out that these plans are based on Jim Kimbro's original 60 size plan (last link) and other than being scaled down and cleaned up, they haven't been altered much. I changed the specifications to match the corresponding scale but none of the wood or component text has been modified. Builders have to select wood of appropriate size for the scale of model they are building. I have made an effort to scale the plans so that things like wood thickness, spinners, wheels and such reduced to a sensible size for that scale.
It is worth also pointing out that the Deception is an unusual classic for its time in that it is much more square than other contemporary models. As such, it has a wider shorter wing. Many 60 size classics had spans in the 65" to 70" range while the Deception has a 63" span while retaining the same or having a higher wing area than its contemporaries. The 45 sized version is in my opinion better suited to a good 40 size engine at 52" span. A 56" span version might be more appropriate for a hot piped 45 (e.g. a YS 45 FS) or a muffled 50. Depending on what you have in mind for a power plant, you may want to tweak the scale to suit your needs.
Finally, if you want to build a full size 60 model, you might want to scale up the 45 sized plans as they are cleaner and lighter. The original scan is a little heavy in terms of resolution but it is not needed for a printable build plan.
Happy building!
David.
Deception 15:
http://www.4shared.com/document/B2h8..._15_40x24.html
Deception 30:
http://www.4shared.com/document/NLYR..._30_48x27.html
Phil,
Deception 45:
http://www.4shared.com/document/4kXz..._45_51x29.html
Deception 60:
http://www.4shared.com/document/EOc7..._60_62x36.html
I should point out that these plans are based on Jim Kimbro's original 60 size plan (last link) and other than being scaled down and cleaned up, they haven't been altered much. I changed the specifications to match the corresponding scale but none of the wood or component text has been modified. Builders have to select wood of appropriate size for the scale of model they are building. I have made an effort to scale the plans so that things like wood thickness, spinners, wheels and such reduced to a sensible size for that scale.
It is worth also pointing out that the Deception is an unusual classic for its time in that it is much more square than other contemporary models. As such, it has a wider shorter wing. Many 60 size classics had spans in the 65" to 70" range while the Deception has a 63" span while retaining the same or having a higher wing area than its contemporaries. The 45 sized version is in my opinion better suited to a good 40 size engine at 52" span. A 56" span version might be more appropriate for a hot piped 45 (e.g. a YS 45 FS) or a muffled 50. Depending on what you have in mind for a power plant, you may want to tweak the scale to suit your needs.
Finally, if you want to build a full size 60 model, you might want to scale up the 45 sized plans as they are cleaner and lighter. The original scan is a little heavy in terms of resolution but it is not needed for a printable build plan.
Happy building!
David.
11-10-2010, 02:04 AM
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RE: Deception 10 Build Thread
As mentioned in another Deception (60) build thread, I've been poking around with the Deception plans a little to obtain a working CAD copy. These would allow Deceptions of any scale and size to be laser cut and framed up entirely of wood (if desired) unlike the original and my little D10 which use foam core wings and stabs. With that said, I do really like the results of wings built on cores.
As a means to inspire me to finish this build, I'm contemplating a larger D30 (32 SX power) or a D45 (YS 45 power) already. This is my hobby pitfall... get em finished!
Any suggestions for improving on this rough plan are most welcome.
David.
As a means to inspire me to finish this build, I'm contemplating a larger D30 (32 SX power) or a D45 (YS 45 power) already. This is my hobby pitfall... get em finished!
Any suggestions for improving on this rough plan are most welcome.
David.
05-18-2011, 08:00 AM
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RE: Deception 10 Build Thread
Man,
every time I revisit some older thread (mine or otherwise) it seems that RCU manages to lose images in the posts. And since they can no longer be edited, I can't restore them.
Oh well, I guess that's why the classic forum has picked up on RCG. There are now 4 web sites I visit to read on threads I'm interested in. I liked it better when it was one or two.
Phil, changing gears (and no one should get upset if I post this here...
), I found a picture of what we want to do to the Webra crankcases. As you can see, Webra taps them in the factory for bolt-on headers/mufflers.
David.
every time I revisit some older thread (mine or otherwise) it seems that RCU manages to lose images in the posts. And since they can no longer be edited, I can't restore them.
Oh well, I guess that's why the classic forum has picked up on RCG. There are now 4 web sites I visit to read on threads I'm interested in. I liked it better when it was one or two.
Phil, changing gears (and no one should get upset if I post this here...
), I found a picture of what we want to do to the Webra crankcases. As you can see, Webra taps them in the factory for bolt-on headers/mufflers.David.
05-18-2011, 12:30 PM
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RE: Deception 10 Build Thread
We talking RCG?
If so, yes, that would be the fourth web site I've added to the list.
I guess diversity is the spice of life. RCU really ought to clean up this mess. Not good for its reputation (or membership). But I'm not complaining - it has been very good to us.
David.
If so, yes, that would be the fourth web site I've added to the list.
I guess diversity is the spice of life. RCU really ought to clean up this mess. Not good for its reputation (or membership). But I'm not complaining - it has been very good to us.
David.
05-18-2011, 09:04 PM
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RE: Deception 10 Build Thread
once i get the header from macs Should be easy for the tool guy's here at work to do that. Only problem i have right now is i can't get the sleeve out of the case so that is presenting some problems. Any ideas on how to get it out? Phil
