stuntflyr

On almost every Stunt model built in modern times the bellcrank is reversed and the up line is in the front. Instead of the bellcrank horn on the outside, it is turned around to the inside. The control horns are on top of the flaps and on the bottom of the elevator. For a no flap design it would also have the elevator horn on the bottom.
The reason that the up line is in front is that when doing outside maneuvers the down line is to the rear, aiding the model in maintaining line tension that is slightly reduced by gyroscopic precession turning the nose towards the inside of the circle (assuming counterclockwise flight, nose left in any case, with the usual engine rotation direction). The leadout and bellcrank position is a slight aid, but an aid nonetheless.
Your homebuilt design's flying problems sound like it had nothing to do with the up/down leadout position but unless someone was actually there to witness it and then look the model over with you it would be hard to say, Interesting! The most likely scenario is that the CG was so far aft it was behind the leadouts and that makes them very unstable.
Chris...

JohnBuckner

My Feedback: (1)

Yes would love to see that vidio. I don't get up to LAS to often Usually for an occassional fuel run at Hobby People and hang a bit (read that as spend money) at twice nice.

It would be nice to visit your flying spot. I don,t know if I could fly their or not as I need concrete or asphalt for my wheel chair to fly on. But then agine I keep looking at that baseline you seem to be standing on[8D]

John

509boatman55

Thanks for the info, Stunflyr.

logair

It has been 46 years since I last flew control line. Been flying RC and a starduster One experimental that I constructed from plans. I flew lots of u/c back then. ( in the olden days) as they say. Recently got the urge to see if I could still fly U/C. A fellow ukie flyer gave me a kit for a 1950 Jim Walker Firecat. I have two flights on it now, got dizzy both times! Don't remember getting that dizzy as a youngster. Will post pictures I hope. Logair

509boatman55

Beautiful airplane! Have fun![8D]

stuntflyr

Nice model, Logair. If you do acro in the Starduster much, you'll know that any of the middle ear stuff is affected by recency of experience. After you get acclimated to the rotation you'll be as comfortable as you were as a kid. When we are young we seem to be able to do things with an ease that goes away as we get older!
Chris...

mathison205

John here is a link the a few pics and c/l video with sound http://community.webshots.com/user/mathison205

logair

Stuntflyr, You know what, I have only had one occasion of vertigo while doing ackro in my Starduster and that was caused by doing rolls with only instruments. When I looked up at the horizon it was still spinning while I was upright. By the way the ukie is powered by a OS 25FP. wings covered with ultracote, fuelage and tail painted with Rustoleum. First brushed two coats nitrate dope mixure of talcum powder, sanded, Two coats auto primer, two coates white rustoleum. I like this process. Logair

stuntflyr

That's gutsy, Logair! I never had an airplane with non-tumbling gyros that was aerobatic.
I only got to feeling nauseated during acro until I was practiced up at the beginning of the practice season. Took a few days of a couple of flights a day to get acclimated.
Same with C/L Stunt, I sometimes can feel a little tug in the equilibrium during the reverse wingover until I've flown a few flights and then it's gone.
Neat finish system, the model looks very nice. The old Firecat is a popular model again in some circles as it's been determined legal for Old Time Stunt. A letter from Bob Smurthwaite proved it's origin before the end of '53.
Chris...

R/C Phile

I had not flown Control Line regularly since about 1977 until 2 months ago:

This summer to do something different from the regular swim team / soccer camp / etc and get my 8 year old son outside and away from the video games we're kickin'it old school with some Control Line backyard stunt flying excitement.

The plane is a classic late 60's "Top Flite Combat Cat" look alike.(I used to have one) My son and I re-designed and scratch-built the model to run on an “Ebay� Cox 049 just like the ones I used to have when I was his age .

Plane Specs:

- NACA 0018 Airfoil
- Carbon Fiber reinforced adjustable beam engine mount
- 32" Wingspan / over 240 square inches wing area
- Less than 10 ounces flying weight
- Thrust / weight ratio greater than 1 for unlimited vertical fun
- Custom "Exponential" control handle

The Engine is an unknown vintage "Ebay" Cox 049 Black Widow that's been re-furbished and modified as follows:

- "Decked" Gilbreath high compresion head
- Nelson Glow Plug
- Custom milled Dual Ports / Dual Boost SPI cylinder
- Custom milled lightened piston
- Polished crankshaft
- "Decked" crankcase with hex brass drive plate
- Gilbeault mouse racing program Tank gasket / Carb needle mods

Currently running a custom blended PowerMaster 30% Nitro Heli fuel with added castor oil

Using a Cox 6x3 prop to keep the revs / speed down and be more crash resistant

I am still fiddling with the CG: It's currently at about 30% of chord and I feel it needs to go futher back to make the loops smaller.

We both love flying it and with 50 ft total line that thing is just screaming in our backyard around it's little 25ft radius circle. It could probably use longer lines but we're at max for our yard and I love being able to fly at a moment's notice.

Check out our Video (Don't miss our bloopers at the end) on YouTube at [link=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4vzPJtNqvvI]1/2A Combat Wing Video[/link]

BtnFlyGuy

OK...I'm remarkably impressed! When I was 8, the best I was doing was tossing chuck gliders, but then again my dad wasn't a flyer.

R/C Phile

Thanks for the kind words. He's was even braver and doing loops when we were flying our Coroplast wing. Same here, when I was his age, it was somewhat of a record when we flew the whole tank..

We did practice a fair amount this summer: We've burned over 1.5 gallon of fuel, 8 CC at a time... I'll bet our wing has already over 100 flights under its belt.

-François

jayseas

That video was great, i loved seening a father out with is kid doing outdoor stuff, instead of all the indoor stuff they have.
Keep up the playing.[8D]

509boatman55

Well, I flew the Crackerjack today.(See post #35) With the exception of a problem with an adjustable weight I rigged(did not know exactly where I wanted it to balance),everything went OK considering I hadn't flown a U/C since I was about 15 yrs old! I got pretty bad vertigo the first flight leading me to fly it into the grass-no damage other than slightly bent LG and cowl. Second flight I leaned it out a little, and man that thing took off-I think it will stunt if I can. It is fast- thought it was going to screw me into the ground. The red rubber spinner from Cox will not stay on. The third flight,toward the end, I was trying a wingover when I saw something fly off the airplane and was then unable to completely pull up and put it in the grass again-not too steep an angle thankfully. Turns out it was my balancing weight I was going to epoxy down after I fine tuned the CG. I popped a bottom longeron that time but it will be an easy fix.
All in all, a very satisfying day-and the best part is I think my grandson is hooked!

da Rock

Nice looking model (back in post #35 (2nd page of thead)).

Sounds like a nice day with the grandson.

A prop with less pitch will fly that little sucker a bit slower.

It was interesting (aeronautically) that when the lead weight flew off the model couldn't make the turn out of the wingover. I'm guessing the weight was toward the tail.

509boatman55

Thanks, Rock! and Yeah- the model came out real light in the rear. As I was not sure where it would balance best, I cut several different lengths of brass rod and drilled a hole through the fuse side to side beneath the stab that they press fit into-I secured it with a dab of glue, but obviously not well enough! I'm just glad I did not total the plane!
Thanks for the tip about the prop- in my excitement I had not even thought about that yet! Got any good sources for props to fit Cox? I can find 6x3 all day, but that's about it.[8D]

fokkit

Wow, another control line forum.

Hi All,
Thought Iwould jump in and show my current models, I got back into CL after about 30 years last Christmas, Still finding all sorts of new ways to mess the pattern up, but I'm getting there slowly.

TTFN
John.

Phil Heller

My Feedback: (9)

Hi,

I used to fly control line back in the 40's and 50's (yeah, I'm that old!) and have been flying RC ever since. About 4 months ago I spotted a Hornet 60 on Ebay and was fortunate (?) enough to win the bid. In 1946 (or 7) I saw Ernie Babcock win a full size Ercoupe at the Philadelphia Flying Circus with a Hornet powered little speedster called "Jughaid" at an amazing (for that time) 108 mph, (as close as I can remember). So, with the Hornet in hand and a small page of plan, I set up to build a replica of Ernie's record holder. See the attached photos. Unfortunately, the old Hornet needs some work before we can maiden the "jug", meanwhile I have caught the bug and have a few more old timers in the que - A Speedwagon with a Super Cyclone, a Hellhammer with an Atwood Champion, and a Perky with a yet to be decided engine. I am really having a ball!

build light

Phil, Welcome back! Looks like you have not lost your building skills at all. I would love to be there when you maiden it.

You mention the Perky and that reminded me of this:
http://www.blackhawkmodels.com/perky.html

Robert

mathison205

pics and video from the contest this past weekend at whitter narrows http://community.webshots.com/user/mathison205

OLDPATFLYER

Well the final pic's from post#40. Have about 7 flights and it seems kinda quick to me, but I'm not very experienced in C/L.
Seems to turn about 5 second laps and line pull is real strong even in wingovers. Controls are very sensitive.
My question is should I try to slow down the lap times, and how should that be done? Am running Fox 35
with Zinger 10-6. 60 foot .018 lines.

DAVE

stuntflyr

Hi Pat,
5.0 lap times on a Ringmaster seem about right. You could go to longer lines, about 62 feet and reduce the diameter to .015's. This would slow the rotation without killing the airspeed, which the thin wing needs.
A 10x5 prop will slow it also, keeping the same rpm and all.
Try to put a longer horn on the elevator or reduce the spacing on the lines at your handle to reduce sensitivity. I've seen 1.5 inch to 1 3/4 inch horns on them when using 3 inch bellcranks.
Fly the wings off of it, looks really nice!
Chris...

OLDPATFLYER

Thank You Sir;
Will reduce spacing on the handle and try the 10-5 next weekend. Stuck with the .018 lines for now. Just got U-Reely with .015 lines but spaceing is about what I have on other handle.
Might try to get .015 from S&S before Sat. Maybe a back up RM also. Well not back-up, You really can't have too many. Also flying a Brodack Smoothie ARF
and this is better than the one I had when I was a kid (Veco Kit). What do you think would be an ideal choice for a stunt retread who can not get enough of this stuff?

Thanks Again Guys:
DAVE

JohnBuckner

My Feedback: (1)

Dave absolutely stunning Ringmaster congratulations.

If softening up throws is not practical at the handle then perhaps using one of these control horns would be of service. I use a lot of this particular one on RC aircraft and on my only current Ukie. The offer infinate adjustability and are much longer than most commercial ones. They also are very easy to use. Maybe not traditional but a far better horn that offers good options in throws.

http://www3.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin...&I=LXD932&P=RF

Agine maybe not traditional but APC offers some wide blade 11x3 and 11'4's that would be interesting on the Fox, They do work well on my OS 40fp. Just a thought.

John

OLDPATFLYER

Thanks John;
Come to think, I purchased some of those horns for my EU1-A and did not use them. Will use one here.
And I am sorry for kinda hijacking your thread. I will be quiet now. Again. THANKS GUYS.

DAVE
Oh. Next up might be a Sterling Mustang kit # S2. Had about 4 of them when I was a kid.