five-string

LT, your design boggles my mind! That is radically different! In a good way. I am curious to see how it performs. Turn your rates down lowwww with that much aileron it will roll very quickly. If it were mine I would put the prop at the back of the wing just for ease of mounting and not worrying about a slight shift of motor/prop eating wing. That is cool.

Hunter, nice looking bird. Let us know how she flies. My 27 is doing well after many crashes. Not nearly as pretty as yours.

ntjp2005

String,
I plan on being very careful with this bird. I was thinking the same thing about the prop. That is why I posted the question. Thanks for the advise. Did you see the elevator? It rotates from the middle. This will give some wild control along with the aileron.

Hunter.... Plane looks almost to good to fly..... Hope you have happy landings

five-string

Yes, LT, I noticed the whole Horizontal stab is elevator. You should see loops as small as the plane. You prob have already said, but what motor are you using?

ntjp2005

Took the B21 off my Slow Stick. I have 2 B21s a Rim Fire and 4 brushed motors. I figure the best thing would be the B21. Thought about a brushed. It is the 400 geared motor that comes with the Slow Stick.

AJ1202

LT, how much does she weigh, the 400 geared might not be a bad idea, it will give you good thrust at slow speeds and make it more stable. with the BP21 you want to stop at around a 8" prop to avoid overheating your batt and motor, this also means faster plane and harder to get a grip on, I think from looking at your design it is going to have some EXTREME responce, even on low rate settings
Oh and if I didn't mention [sm=thumbup.gif] cool idea, hope it flys good, get pics or vid

I'm going to give String my beat up F-15 if he still want's it, String just became a soon to be owner of a P-51 Mustang
I have decided to build a T38 Talon next, I realy like the looks of it and I am going to build it and make the wing with with a airfoil instead of flat, this one might take a while to complete, I'll post picks as I get going with it, then after it's done I'll build another F-15

ntjp2005

AJ
Good point. The B21 on the Slow Stick was a lot more power than I needed or thought it would have.
I will have to weigh the So-eXtreme. Get back to you on that and see what you think.


OK the So-extreme is 18 oz AUW with the 400 brushed motor and 9.4 v battery.

AJ1202

LT, OK IMO I would go with the 400 geared, here is my reasoning, OK new plane, new design, unsure of stall rate and or slow flying abilities, the larger prop will give you plenty of thrust to get out of trouble in either case and still give very decent speed. fly it some, get a feel for it, slow it down make it stall(get high enough first of course) check it's ability to climb and how it handles speed, then if it seems easy enough to control, put the BP21 on it and just go easy
the down side to trying the BP first is smaller prop is needed meaning more speed right off, this could create some unnessasary panic moves while trying to get a feel for it causing it's untimely demise. Just my opinion Good luck with the maiden, and tell us all about it

ntjp2005

OK AJ Help me out

My plane has 3" from the ground to the bottom of the TE and 5" to the top of the LE. The hole in the middle of the wing is 9" The two carbon rods out the rear are 10" apart. If I do a pusher prop I guess I could mount the motor 3" above the TE and that would give a 10" prop. Help me with ideas

AJ1202

LT now that is going to be a tough one, OK just went back and looked at it real hard and noticed something that might be a small prob, the tail has no stabilizer, now I know many planes are built that way but they usualy have something to stabilize level flight ie fuse, this might make normal level flight rather tricky, I hope you have a real strong servo controling the elevator and aileron.
OK 2 ideas 1 if made a pusher what I think I would try would be to make some form of slim sleek air foil or fairing from the LE to the TE that rises as it goes back and mount the motor in the TE of it at whatever hieght was needed, this way you get the motor raised and it blends in smoothly. 2 pull it, and build the same design but in reverse and not as high to blend it in. where are the electrics going, mostly batt as that is the weight. personaly I would think that design would pull better than push, but it's anybody's guess which would be best

five-string

LT, Some good advise from AJ there on motor selection.

How about a stick mounted into the wing and extending out the front for a tractor-type setup? I'm thinking the mount should be parrallel to the bottom of the wing to get a good angle on the motor. Can you cut a square hole in the front of the wing and push the stick in and apply glue through the 9" hole? If you mount the motor on the top side of the stick you would have adequate clearance for a prop as big as 8", maybe more. See picture.

I personally like firewall mounts better than sticks but a firewall mount is gonna require more materials in this case.

AJ, I have been thinking about the F-15. I have no servos right now to offer you and I hate to see you cut those out. On top of that I have no other 'tronics to put into it. I'm trying to figure out where my next setup is coming from (i.e. I am on a strict rc budget these days) to complete my F-14, so I'm gonna decline the offer for your jet. As much as I'd like to play with it, it would sit on a shelf for a long time. And instead of doing that, maybe someone else would put it to better use. Thanks for the offer.

Oh, and I wanted to tell you about another rc shop I found in Florida. Noell's in Wildwood. Oh My Gosh [X(]. Two guys run this place. One is a 30 year rc pilot and for the last 10 years has been almost exclusively electric. The other is the owner and is the gas/glow expert. Their shop is FULL of planes with one 6' shelf of boats in the middle. Everything else is flying stuff! Very nice shop, well stocked. And the elec guy was showing me vids of his documented 150 mph (doppler radar) elec jet. Kinda like a Hawk, bungee launch. Whoa. They had Slow Stick ARF's for $21.99. The owner was offering me 3D kits at 50% off (alot like the Nasty for $12, and a bipe for $18). I did buy a trainer cord and a prop. Yippie.

I have a second Futaba 6EX coming soon (that's what broke the ol' camel's back here) for son so we'll be getting out together.

I don't know if I'll be seeing you next week or not, AJ. If I don't get my new batteries, I'm not gonna be able to fly. My old ones are fading fast. I waited too long to get a balancer and three of my four lipos are basically useless. All you guys using lipos, GET A BALANCER NOW! I'm waiting on two 1350 mA 11.1 from bidproduct.com. I'll let you know either way.

Sorry about the long post. Coffee must be kickin' in.

ntjp2005

AJ and String
When I designed this plane it was for a stick mount motor with 8 x 4 prop, thus the problem now. I too think it would be better with a pull and not push prop. The larger and slower prop is a better idea and wished I had asked sooner.

String I have been thinking about placing the prop out front, but was trying to stay away from that. Looking at it more now. I guess this is the problems you run into when designing a plane from scratch.

AJ I have fins on the end of the wing and two in the rear. I am not sure it is enough but that was my thoughts to stabilize the plane.
I will have to give some thought before I mount the motor. Will let y'all know.

The original idea for this plane came off of the SO.X by foamflyer. http://www.qnet.com/~skif/plane.html

ntjp2005

String,
I looked at the bidproduct.com Prices are really low. Let me know how your order goes. I see it is over seas and I try to avoid that. Is shipping high?

AJ1202

LT, don't despair, it will come to you with some thought, I think making a platform on top of the wing to mount the stick to and creating your thrust angle with it is the best idea, then you can keep the motor close to the LE and raise it some at same time, then you just close it in nice and neat for looks and it takes on the appearence of a cockpit behind the motor, look at the nose of the mugi and give it some thought with open mind, your so close now

coolbean

MY SU26 SHRUNK!?

Well... not exactly. My 2 year old son was so excited about "daddy's big plane" that he really wanted one of his own. I grabbed some scraps I had around and threw this together in about 15 minutes. Used hot glue to hold it together. Washers for nose weight. It actually flies pretty well, needs a little up elevator though.

ntjp2005

Cool Coolbean.... Keep him interested he will grow up to be your bud at the field. Nothing better than some father son time.

AJ and String,
Went out to the soccer fields tonight. Son is having tryouts for a classic team. So, why not catch some fly time. I ran the Stealth Sport into the ground. Me being self taught and letting it get too far out that I couldn't tell which was up or down. Anyway part of learning. The EP 8 x 4 props I got from Grayson are great. APC would have broken.... This prop had no damage. The long walk gives me time to think..... Long walk back more time to think.....The Stealth Sport does not take well to being driven into the ground nose first. Easy to repair, just put in a new stick. BUT thinking about the Mugi, I really like the wing.

Put the Slow Stick up until the battery went dead and just glided it right back in.

Back to the So-extreme.
I can't remember how much thrust you need to fly 18 oz plane. Not wanting to do much more right now than get it air born and test how it performs.

This may help on Motor and prop set up. I was thinking I could attach motor to a spare Slow Stick and use the scale I have for weighing fish to measure the thrust. That is how I could test props. That would work right???

AJ1202

LT, 18oz is fairly light so any 350 geared set up would fly it good, my E-Starter goes 22oz AUW and fly's real nice and with some authority on a 350 geared, on a 1050 ma nimh 9 min WOT and then 5 consecutive loops and then plenty of power to come around and land, I think the 400 geared you have will be more than enough to keep it airborn, however the scale idea should work well
I say set it up and give it a try, just be easy on your controls because I think it's gonna be a bit touchy untill you get a feel for it

AJ1202

Yeah I know double post,, I pulled a couple plans down today and made some mods to the designs and came up with a design of my own today, it is sort of a copy of others I have seen but only in general looks, I going to slap this thing together kinda quick and see if it fly's, it's gonna be called puddle jumper, it's a little sea plane. looks good on paper so we will see how it goes
might not get to work on it this weekend as I have a pretty hectic scedule planned, but soon, I will post pics once I get started
I have been wanting a water bird for a while

ntjp2005

Good Luck on the puddle jumper AJ. I will be unable to work on any of my projects this weekend also. We are going out of town with the kids. Kind of a Happy Birthday for me and my wife. Still thinking on the So-eXtreme.

AJ1202

LT is it your BDay this weekend, what day, mine is Sunday, anyway HAPPY BDAY to you and your wife or which ever is having one OK now I'm confused. I was mistaken I just cut out the side fuses for the puddle jumper but that's it for now, might sneak in a little time tomorrow evening BUT I dout it
I think this is going to come out OK, but the maiden will tell the real story, building is only half the fun

five-string

Ok LT, got my shipment of batteries from bidproduct.com...

They came from China. Two 3 cell lipos, each enclosed in a hard plastic shell like most things come in these days. Then bubble wrapped then both together in a padded envelope. Made the trip in perfect condition. It took 18 days to get my order.

I have one flight on each and they performed well. They were perfectly balanced right out of the package. They also have a JST connector that I cut off and installed a Dean's connector and they have a 4 pin balancing tap on them.

I'm pretty satisfied for the price. $16 each plus $9 to ship both, for a total of $41 for two batteries to my door. I can buy 3 of these for the price of one Kokam or TP.

BendR

Hey everyone! I have been lurking in your thread for some time now getting some tips and tricks and of course laughing my butt of at times. First of all let me thank you guys for all the info that you put on here. I have recently caught the bug to get back into rc flight after many years being away from it. I decided to go electric foamy mainly because of location and availability of products. Anyway, I won't bore you guys with all that. I wanted to finally get registered and drop a line to say hello. I built my first nasty this past week and FINALLY got the connectors I was waiting for so I can mount the electrics tonight (hopefully). I hope to get to fly it on monday as I have mon and tues off. Yeah I also have a very strange work schedule. I'll be checkin' in regularly to see whats going on and keep reading on the thread. I think I am on page 18 or something. Thanks again and keep 'em flyin![sm=thumbup.gif]

ntjp2005

Welcome Bend,
Good luck with the Nasty. It is a nice bird. As you will see from reading there are a lot of fff planes out there to build. AJ and String have gotten into the jets, they look nice. I am thinking about the Mugi.

AJ,
The answer is both, wifes was Friday the 14th and mine is Monday the 17th. Happy Birthday to you. Get anything for your planes? When you gonna show us some pics of the puddle jumper???

String,
I may have to check this out more. The prices are too good to be true. Servos $3.00 each
Do the quality of your batteries look good?

five-string

BendR,

Welcome! C'mon in, sit down and crack a cold whatever you're havin'. A Nasty, eh? Fill us in on details, power plant,esc,battery,prop. We like pictures. The planes don't have to be pretty. Just ask AJ about some of mine. Eww.

LT, quality seems just dandy. I will be placing another order probably this week. I am going to go halfsies with my coworker, I gotta give him a name 'cause I think he's going to get into this hobby more. I'll refer to hm as his C.B. handle- Niceguy. As soon as I talk him into buying a bunch of stuff, I'll will put in another order with bidproducts.com.

AJ,I am bringing two jets on the road this week, the Mugi and the SU-27 (yep she's still breathing). Call me Monday if you're available. If not, try to let me know befor noon Sunday.

The new batteries seem strong and charge and balance quickly so I'm gonna try to get up th GA in good time. Hope the weather is good. Whatcha got ready?

BendR

LT & String, Thanks for the welcome! I will be posting some pics soon of my newest creation. It was my first foam build and it took a while because I had to make sure everything was perfect. I'm sure that will go away after dirt diving a few of them. The problem with this one is it is too pretty. I have figured out from past planes that they don't fly good until they are all uglied up![sm=bananahead.gif] I hope I did ok picking a power setup for it. I was pretty much in the dark about all this electric stuff so I found this place and started readin'. I have an Atlas 2312/09 with PolyQuest "20" 1200 3cell pushing it. To keep the throttle where I want it I went with the Castle Creations Thunderbird-18 ESC. Castle Creations also handles the radio signals for me with a 4ch. micro-stamp rcvr. I hope it all works well. I don't expect to be hovering it or anything like that yet. That will be a ways in the future. I still get shaky bringing my trainer in to land. I think I am going to cut out of work early today and go get some flying in before going to the house. The weather is supposed to be about perfect and It's been two weeks since I last flew. I think I am going through withdrawls!! LOL! Anyway, with some luck I will take home an intact airplane. I'll let ya know how it goes.

BendR

One question for you nasty flyers. Do you need to rig in a small amount of down aileron for this thing to fly? I just don't see where the lift comes from any other way. Would hate for it to do a death dive before I got it trimmed out.