jfetter

I know these planes are not new, I've heard them referred to as the best kept secret in the UK for under $300 but they've been LONG overdue in the USA. I finally got mine today (after waiting since August 15!) so I thought I'd do an official build thread for those interested. First of all I have to say this is the first ARF I've build that was designed especially for electric. The weight is very, very light and the parts are all perfectly covered and the detailis above and beyond in my experience. Wing pins are fitted, the cowl is cut for air cooling holes, the canopy is cut and mounted, the magnetic latch holders are pressed in place, very nice!

I plan on weighing it all this evening, for now here are some pics illustrating the packaging and detail evident even through the plastic. this one is a winner, I can tell and from what I've heard, flies exceptionally well. I plan on using a slight variation for the power, instead of the hacker A50 16S they are recommending, I have opted to go with the hacker A50 14L, it seems better suited to the powerful 6S EVO 5000 packs I intend to run. This motor is 10mm longer than the 16S so I am hoping there is room to push the cowl out that little extra, we'll see as the build continues...

Enjoy!

JFetter (Jack)

jfetter

Some more pictures, I was pressed for time when I got home but I will get more online later today...

Jack

Jeff Boyd 2

Great stuff. Will follow this with interest.

I have one still in the box (for the last 4 - 5 Months [] ) but haven't had the time to work on it. Should get clear in the next 2 - 3 weeks. Powering mine with a Hyperion Outrunner and 5S.

A friend has been flying his for the last 3 weeks coverted to Glow with a OS55AX . . flies fantastic. With a YS63 it would be awesome. Great F3A practice plane, flies very true and locked in.

PS. While this is designed and set-up for EP, a glow conversion is easy. Shorten the engine box (a peice out of the middle works well), butt it all back up, sheet it with 1/16" balsa and glass it . . all done.

Cheers, Jeff

jfetter

Wow, I've been chomping at the bit to get one and your sitting on one ;-)

Careful with the motor choice, the one thing I learned tonight looking over all the parts is there is room for the designated motor, that's it. The Hacker A50 14L is 10mm longer than the specified A50 16S (Long versus Short can) and in fact it isn't going to work. I am going to change to the recommended motor rather than try and retro-fit, the idea being they give you the firewall already drilled and fitted with blind nuts, might as well use them. the issue with the 14L is the length, I wouldn't be able to get the cowl to overlap the fuselage properly to be screwed on. I could glue on blocks but I just don't want to mount the cowl with 1mm overhang, not enough IMO...

Jack

jfetter

OK, here are the weights of all the components;

Fuse (with Canopy Hatch) = 19.7 oz
Right Wing = 6.5 oz
Left Wing = 6.5 oz
Stab = 2.9 oz
Rudder = 1.0 oz
Cowl = 2.2 oz
Wing Tube = 1.3 oz
Gear/Wheels/Spin/Prop = 8.6 oz

Airplane Total Weight = 48.7 oz
-------------------------------------------

Electronics;

Hacker A50 16S with Mount = 14.9 oz
Jeti Spin 75 = 2.6 oz
4 x Spektrum 821 Servos = 5.6 oz
Servo Extentions = 1.8 oz
Spektrum 6200 2.4 GHz RX = 0.5 oz
Dimension Eng. VHVBec = 0.5 oz
FlightPower EVO 6S 5000 = 28.5 oz

Electronics Total Weight = 54.4 oz
--------------------------------------------

All Up Weight = 103.1 oz (6.4 lbs)
-------------------------------------------------------

Jack

Jeff Boyd 2

You could still use the motor . . I would. Just run a band-saw through the middle of the motor box and shorten it the desired length using balsa traingle stock in the four corners.

The Hyperion motor is dimentionally exactly the same as the Hacker. Bolts straight on. As a matter of a fact, the specs for the motor are very close just 100kV more which is perfect for the 5S pack. Would almost bet that this series of Hacker and Hyperion outrunners are made in the same factory. They sure look close.

Jeff Boyd 2

Let us know how you fit the 821's to the wings . . I tried them and they sit proud. Need about a 1/4" spacer to mount them (bottom of the servo hits the wing skin).

jfetter

I might have tried that motor if it weren't for me running 6S, the kV is too high for 6S. I thought about using the Axi 4130/16 (the other motor they list as a drop-in) but I've had bad luck burning them up the past year. If I can't find a hacker A50 16S by tomorrow afternoon I might do what you suggest and simply modify the motor box.

Would you cut it in the middle, take out some and join it back together or knock out the firewall, shorten the box and try and re-key it in?

Thanks for the suggestions...

Jack

jfetter

Here are the MotoCalc numbers. I'm not sure about what others use (if anything) but I have found MotoCalc to be very handy, it is very solid at predicting the amp draw (though always a little light) and gives a great idea of the performance by calculating watts/pound and ft/min climb...

Jack

Jeff Boyd 2

Personally, I would cut it in the middle giving you equal area on both sides to run doublers or stringers. Also keeps the integrity of the firewall intact, and easier to line up the "two halves" of the motor box to keep all the thrust angles the same. If you use triangle balsa stock in the corners, it almost does this by itself.

We have used motorcalc a lot . . very helpful with getting everything close. Nothing is the same as actually flying it and playing with props / batteries, etc . .

jfetter

I like that idea and I see what you mean with the corner stock, you in essence use the corner stock to re-join it all back together which also assures it is lined up, hmmm. Looking at the design, I am tempted to remove the top and bottom which would allow me to remove the firewall and simply cut new keys to hold it as it is held in place now, this might prove more work though considering your approach.

As to the sevo issue, wow, good call! I wouldn't have even though to look at that. You'll see there is about 3/16" gap from the servo flange to the wood, about the same size as the rubber grommet though I think I'll add a popsickle stick of wood to ensure there is room to compress the rubber grommet a bit. Luckily the top side of the wing has a layer of ply between the bottom of the servo and covering so a tight fit still won't cause a bulge to be seen. the deeper end of the servo bay is fine, you can see the flange even sits on the wood...

Jack

jfetter

Jeff,

I have to thank you for the suggestion to cut down the box length and the additional suggesstion on how best to do it. Truth is it was quite easy and took little more than 15 minutes with the Dremel and cutoff wheel. I used CA to join it back together so I can move on with the build, triangle stock will be glued in with BVM V-Poxy at the end of the day to dry overnight without slowing me down.

In the end I'll be much happier using the motor I sized for it, 6S is just a tad too hot for the short can hacker outrunners and from previous experience, enough to burn the windings if not overly careful. I think the only way to improve this already excellent plane design might be to cut the firewall for the long can motors and supply 10mm spacers for the short cans, this would make the design more flexible.

Truth is this is by far the nicest plane I've put together, designed from the ground-up as electric and the details so well thought out and implemented that I have to give it a 10 out of 10. Previously I think my choice would have been Hanger 9 for fit, finish and detail in the design (like removable hatches for servo access, pre-cut cooling holes, cowl-to-fuse fit, canopy-to-fuse fit, covering, etc. I have to say now that the SebArt Angel is perfect, literally perfect as everything you might think of has been done and the extra's like pre-installed magnets, the wing mounting system, precut covering holes where necessary, installed servo tray, installed reciever tray with slots for wire tie-downs, fully cooled battery tray (all 4 sides exposed), wing pins that extend to the second rib for added strength, even an air-flow dam behind the canopy to direct the air out of 2 nicely shaped oval holes, perfect!

Jack

jooNorway

The cowl is pretty short for the 50-16S Hacker too I think I used a shorter motor in mine, and got 6-7mm more overlap.

One of the magnets for the canopy did loosen, and was glued back with thin CA.

When you attach the cowl put some thick paper between cowl and nose upper part before drilling mounting holes. This is to ensure the fit don`t become too tight for the battery hatch/canopy. If the hatch seems to not enter check if you "split" the hatch againste the cowl!

I had to adjust the pull-pull for rudder outdoor when it is cold. Otherwise the cables become dangerous tight when I bring the plane from indoor to winter outdoor

My Angel is 5-6oz less than your estimate, if I remember correct. But I don`t use the wheel-pants... And run 5S5000.

tommy s

My Feedback: (55)

Do you think the airframe is sturdy enough and will hold up with
a glow engine? I would like to have one but don't really want to
use electric power.

tommy s

jfetter

In my opinion no, even though a previous post indicates someone converted to glow and loves it. The firewall, the lightening for good airflow to the battery compartment all reduce the strength and unlike electric with smooth idle up, the glow certainly will produce more vibration. After cutting the motor mount box to shorten it, I can tell you it is light weight 1/16" ply and really is built for light weight and only the minimum strength needed...

Jack

tommy s

My Feedback: (55)

Thanks Jack, that's kind of what I figured.

tommy s

Jeff Boyd 2

Jack is right . . you can't bolt a glow motor to this airframe without strategic strengthening. An experienced builder can easily set this up for glow without much trouble at all . . .

An EP airframe is not that much different to a GP airframe, but they can go a little lighter on areas that would be normally weakened by glow vibration. When you know what areas these are, you can strengthen them . . . as they would have if they built it for glow. It all adds minimal weight done correctly. The rest of the airframe is subjected to the same forces with either power system, so generally the airframe is very adequate.

JB

swlarcham

My Feedback: (1)

Tommy s
Once you go Electric You won't want to go back I know I don't
Eddie

tommy s

My Feedback: (55)

Hey Eddie,

I guess I just like the smell of nitro !!
Nothing quite like it !!

tommy s

swlarcham

My Feedback: (1)

Yeah I know . I was just pulling your chain.

But I have to admit the comfort of not worring about the idle being too low on that downline or final approach has made E really fun. Of course I fried an ESC this summer TOO, so it hasn't all been fun-n-games.

Eddie

jfetter

Don't forget instant power without sputter, CG the same at landing as takeoff, no worrying about humidity or temperature (tuning) and best of all, no mess, straight into the car after flying ;-)

Jack

jfetter

OK, I was able to make some progress today, I managed to get the wings done (CA hinges and servos mounted). Looks like no spacer is necessary after all, with the rubber grommets in place, the servo sits down against the existing rails. Granted, it is tight and the bottom of the servo is pressing on the plywood top skin but you can safely fasten it without bulging out the other side...

Jack

jfetter

I was also able to get the stab glued, the elevator and rudder hinges glued, horns mounted, elevator and rudder servos mounted, pull-pull cables run and the elevator hardware installed. The hardware is a little odd for me, ball jointed clevises with a long screw, washer and nut to hold them to the horn, I haven't seen anything quite like it before. My worry is always with small nuts coming off, you can of course CA them but many times the CA gets into the linkage someplace and makes it all stiff. I am still considering replacing the wing and elevator rods with good old fashioned 4-40, metal clevises and a carbon tube over the threaded rod...

Jack

jfetter

Here is a shot of the air exit holes in the bottom of the fuse, this will allow a massive amount of air to flow through the cowl, across the motor, battery and finally out the bottom. From what I can see, this should be the coolest setup I have (temperature-wise) as the entire design from the ground-up is meant to get adequate airflow...

Jack

Jeff Boyd 2

These should stay tight but I would use a drop of "thread locker: . . the anti-vibration stuff, NOT the permanent stuff. I use Loctite 222 (Light purple color). One drop will do. You can undo it all with normal tools but won't ever come undone in the air