Gereke

Thought I'd run this by my fellow R/C vehicle enthusiasts..

I was in my local hobby shop today (Hobbytown USA- not a big fan, but hey it's a two minute drive), doing some shopping and a couple of guys walked up to the car counter. The guy who works behind the counter asks what he can do for them and they mention they are looking into getting a R/C monster truck. It was obvious they were were newbies, and had not done any kind of internet research, given the questions they started asking.

They said they wanted to look at 4WD Nitro MT's. The first vehicle the salesman pulls off the display and plops down on the counter was a HPI Savage X 4.6 RTR. He gives them a very BRIEF run down about the vehicle.. Says "Big block .28 motor, four wheel drive". The potential customers then ask the infamous question. "How fast does it go?" To which the salesman says "Oh, about 40-45mph". He doesn't mention the caveat of "If you tune it properly". Then instantly after that he goes.. Though, HERE we have a couple of trucks.. the Revo and T-maxx- made by Traxxas, which are the 45+MPH trucks. He then goes on to say "Not only that, these have reverse, which the savage doesn't have, and if you look here on the T-maxx..."

At this point he plops it down on the counter....

The T-maxx has electric start, (the onboard EZ start stuff), and if you look here it has a built in Wheelie Bar. The Savage doesn't have a wheelie bar.....

He says "The savage will only wheelie if you really spend a whole lot of time tuning it. Where as the T-maxx will wheelie ALL the time. It will wheelie on you during the BREAK IN period. It'll wheelie ALL DAY LONG". Of course the potential buyers he was looking at were getting the wide eyed OOOOOHHHH AAAHHHHH looks on their faces. The short of it is, it seemed like he was a paid Traxxas employee the way he was talking up the T-maxx. Then one of the customers looks up and sees the Stampede VXL and asks about it. The sales guy says "Oh, thats electric.. but it's a 65MPH electric".

One problem.. He made no mention that it'll only do 65 if you gear it properly and throw in LiPo... Which to me seems like something you should mention.


Which brings me to the crux of why I posted this. I'm not at any way trying to start a big Traxxas vs HPI (or any other company for that matter) flame war. My problem with it was is that he was not giving an honest, side by side comparison of the two vehicles. It's my opinion that as a good salesman you should put the different products side by side and go over the GOOD AND BAD POINTS of both. This will give the consumer what he needs to make their decision. What irritated me about the whole thing is that he made the T-maxx out to be the greatest R/C truck known to man, and the Savage out to be some slug that couldn't wheelie or go backwards. I own a Savage X 4.6 RTR and the F4.6 motor is NO SLOUCH, and it's not hard to tune.. Wheelies (if they are that important, which I don't think they are.. I find them annoying after a certain point) are no problem with the truck. He didn't mention anything about their reputation for taking an extreme amount of abuse. He just gave it a 15 second pitch, and pretty much tossed it aside like it was crap. Oh, he also didn't mention the Monster GT, Aftershock, or LST2. They had those vehicles, but I think the only one they had out on display was the Aftershock..

At no point did the salesman mention any of the negatives about the T-maxx.. for example the weak bulkheads that are known to break under what some would say are pretty mundane circumstances. Again, I think thats something that people should know before they make a $400 purchase. Again, I'm not bashing Traxxas I've never owned one so I'm not going to say anything more than what researching the internet has told me. I do know that T-maxxes can be beefed up by buying aftermarket products.

I really wanted to turn around and say something. I wanted to tell the customers what the salesman wasn't saying. I didn't however, because it's not my store, and I don't work there so I didn't think it was exactly the right place for me to interject in the conversation.. So all I did was just kind of shake my head and walk away. I understand that people have brand loyalties. But I think that if you are a Hobby Shop employee (or in any retail sale position for that matter) you need to show your customers all the options, and again like I said.. Give them all a fair showing. Let the customer decide for themselves what they want.. Instead of trying to influence them based on your own personal opinion.

So, would any of you piped up and said something? Do you think I should have? Do you think the sales guy was being a dope?

sheograth

Its always a tough call for me too, but the salesperson has a job to do.

I'm an art dealer, so I can understand how the salesperson thinks, its an unfortunately reality of how these stores work.

DaveG55

The sales guy was being a sales guy.
You have no idea what his instructions or background may have been.
He may not like the Savage. His experience may say that newbs have better luck with the Traxxas products, how knows? Maybe he figures they will be back soon for repairs and he does not like working on the Savage. Maybe he sensed that he could make a sale if he pushed the things that newbs like (reverse, ez-start)?
His store may have been over stocked on Traxxas stuff and he was being told to push it.
His store may have had a really good margin on Traxxas and nothing on the others and he was told to push them for that reason.
Maybe there was a sales contest about who sold the most Revos or VXL's or?????
Maybe you were a bit hypersensitive because he was not pushing what you considered to be a better truck.
I don't think that you know enough to be judging the salesman.

Would I have said something? Maybe, maybe not. It would have depended on the salesman's attitude - some guys welcome customer help, some loath it. It also would depend on my mood, how much time I had free and several other things. In the past I have talked to the buyers/sales guy and also have just shook my head and walked away.

hands without shadows

I was raised on "If you don't do your own research you deserve to get screwed, but its not right to screw people over."

sheograth

So then whos going to be the deserved screwer?

Gereke

It is a salesman's job to sell things, I know and do understand this. I just think that you should show a customer everything you have to offer, and deliver all the information that you can about each product, and let the customer decide what they want for themselves w/o being pushed either way.

There could be a lot of factors behind why he made the presentation, I just thought it was far too biased and I don't agree with biased salesmanship.

Wasn't being hypersensitive about him not pushing that I think is a better truck. I thought I covered that my mentioning that I wasn't trying to start any huge discussion about what product was better. I brought up the fact that I own a Savage because I knew what some of the things he was saying about them was wrong based on that. I was mentioning giving everything in a particular class an equal showing- because t's what I would do if I was behind the counter. Because as a consumer, if I am about to make a purchase for decent chunk of change I want to know everything I can about what I'm going to buy. I want to know it's strengths, weaknesses, known issues, ease of maintenance, construction quality, parts availability etc. etc.

If I got sold something and found out about certain things about it later, that I didn't like (and could have been told about by the salesman) I'd be irked. Granted as a consumer I would be partially to blame for not doing my homework, but you can also point the finger at the guy who is supposed to be a subject matter expert- Which is what newcomers to the hobby will see the guy at the LHS as being- for not disclosing all the facts.

hands without shadows

Thats what I always asked too

j_blaze

gotta love those hobby store SALES guys, why can't they just help and tell you the truth? "yeah we stock all parts for it", then you go back later and "oops, we just sold the last one to that guy walking out, do you want me to order it for you? i'll put you on the list, let me find the book and the part number." then they'll go into "if you get that part in aluminum it will never brake again, costs a bit more but you only have to switch it out once", (forgot to mention the aluminum knuckle will probably brake the plastic arm next time you crash). all they need to ask is 4 things:

how much were you looking to spend?
where are you going to be driving?
are you driving with anybody else?
what do they drive?

tada! 4 simple questions that narrowed down the hole store down to 2 or 3 cars THEY can pick from and not feel they were "sold" something, answer all their questions and they can leave feeling it was THEIR decision and be proud of it. that or they will leave knowing how much more money they need to save up -ask mom for- before they come back. but they WILL be back at least.

i avoid htusa at all cost, except fuel and plugz, cause they are just like that. hardly ever help, just want to order you stuff, or tell you they don't have it. my favorite line is "should have bought one from here".[:@][:@][:@][:@][:@][:@][:@][:@][:@][:@][:@]

annie_himself

Gereke, you are completely right. The salesperson should have told everything he knew about each vehicle. The LST2 and MGT included. He could have been told to push Traxxas, who cares? Doing the right thing is better. As far as I know, and a little personal experience, Traxxas vehicles are less reliable, the other MT would have the buyer excited and coming to spend more money. An impulse buy can be worse in the long run because he made the wrong decision. He might end up getting out of the hobby completely.
I don't think I would've interfered but depending on what the salesperson was actually saying, I might have. I've done it before at my LHS. They are good guys but they all own old Traxxas vehicles and primarily try to get money out of you.

sheograth

Easy to say, but when your job is concerned - unless you're being told to break the law, do as youre told.

DaveG55

My guess is most of you have never been salesmen or had sales training.
I don't mean that to sound critical. It's just that if you've never done it it's difficult to understand the driving forces and preasures that go into selling something.
First off, jblaze's 4 questions are not a bad idea if a customer walks in and says I want an rc. But these guys said they wanted a nitro 4wd truck. No need to narrow it further, you know what they want, a 4wd nitro truck.
Leaving all personal opinions about any of the choices availabe at the store - Revo, T-Maxx, Savage, MGT, LST2, Aftershock are the ones mentioned - out of the discussion (and I own 4 of those so I DO have opinions about them) I'd like to point out a few things.
The salesman did his job. He presented the customer with three choices. Believe me, if he had presented all 6 the customer would likely have been overwhelmed and I guarentee that they would have said something like "which one do you like/would you buy/is best" and he would have pointed out two or three and explained why. Which two or three would depend on LOTS of different things (margins, stock, contests, personal opinion, experence, etc) and my point was, we don't know what forces were driving his reccomendations. One other point. If the sales guy had presented all six trucks and disscussed all the pros and cons of each, how long would it have taken to fully disclose all the highs and lows of each? We do not know what kind of time constraints were in place for the salesman. For all we know he may have done just that the day before and been chewed out by his manager for neglecting other customers.
My point here is that the salesman did not necessarally do a bad job. To the contrary, he may have been doing a good sales job.
We tend to look at incidents we see from the hobiest point of view but the LHS's have to look at it from a buisness standpoint and the bigger the store - like a chain store - the more it's a buisness.

nothinbetr2do

never had it, never did it, and don't want it. the best sales person is, yourself. get to know what your getting to first, is a great thing[8D]

sloppyG

yeah, heaven forbid the poor guy end up with a revo or t-maxx

those are so terrible.



to the OP, why do you even care what RC's other people buy. it's really none of your business.


I bought a brushless setup on the advice of the guy at a lhs around here, I sure hope it was the one you like

sheograth

Well, thats a bit hard line. We all take and give advice, if everything about this hobby were "ones own business" we wouldnt need or have forums like this one. Of course its our own choice, but I for one welcome input from other hobbyists about what I spend my money on - and we all rely on each others collective experience.

calvino

wow, that is prety sad[], yeah, a savy can wheelie prety easily, so he got that wrong, as for a tmaxx, I hear they aren't so hot[], yeah, and as for the VXL, FOR CRYIN OUT LOUD SAY WHAT IT NEEDS!!!!!!!!!!! gosh, the guys at my LHS maybe prety cool (well, except for one who is a total TRAIN FREAK), but other than that, they aren't "oh, this truck can do __________ and this is a piece of junk...." yeah, kindof sad, I totally understand he is there to sell the product, but to lie and tell such a twisted story, I don't know, it is prob going to bite him in the end[&:]

sheograth

If that sort of stuff bites people in the end, we wouldnt have a society or economy left. What do you think a marketing department is? Calculated stretching of the truth.

calvino

eveyone won't trust the salesman since this dude lied about this stuff.... prety sad, you prob know all this since you said you sell art, yeah, what a world we live in[>:]

Clear2Close

take it from me...being in sales you push the products you make the most money on...thats the name of the game

TheTruckingGuru

The Marines have a saying "Lead, follow, or get out of the way". I get in the way[>:] I make it my business[8D] After all it is a hobby I enjoy and I want others including newbies to enjoy this hobby as well. I do not be rude and interrupt; but when the conversation goes into pause and the customer is reflecting, I will offer my opinions and advice to him without being asked. After all we are all just friendly customers helping each other out and I would expect any of you to do the same for me. The salesmen at the RC stores are not the same sharks who sell used cars. They enjoy the RC hobby as much as we do and just want the customer to buy something from the store and be happy.

magnat

Actually... Some retail Chain hobbystores just hire who ever is the cheapest, not necessarily the best..

I mean I have listened to a Certain Hobby store chain push Ansmann Chargers that have a 3amp output and then selling the poor innocent fool 4200mah batteries but neglect to mention that the Ansmans's Safety timer of 90minutes will kick in and leave the 4200mah's only half charged...

Some stores push one brand more then others.. it is up to the Noob to jump on a forum and say

" Hey I am new.. I went to my Locals Hobby shop and they have ....... the guy at the counter told me I needed ........."

and then we can assist in aiming them in the right direction and not down some money pit...

Knowledge is power.. so doing research will help you avoid getting rorted..


I mean some counter help just read the info off the box and have no clue as to what the hell it means.. I mean the only power they have over you is... they want your money .....

Gereke

Why don't you try actually reading my posts before replying like this. It shows you don't even understand the point of what I posted.

I actually don't care what people buy, it's your money- get what you want. My point was that I found the salesman's method of presentation to be a little bit off. I have nothing against Traxxas vehicles. I have nothing against Losi, AE, HPI (owner of yes)- or any of the big name companies, because they all have good products which all have their good and bad sides. So lets make that perfectly clear to anybody else who'd like to make an ignorant blanket assumption about my motives behind a question generated soley for the purpose of polling my fellow hobbyists.

In the end, the customer is going to buy what they want- It's their right obviously and I would never stop anyone from buying what they felt was the right product.

I need to add further, that the biggest points he was making about the Traxxas's was how fast they went and how easy they wheelie. He didn't use any selling points like ease of maintenance, legendary customer service, and a mountain of after market hop up parts. The fact that he said the VXL was 65+ with the insinuation that it was OUT OF THE BOX like that, rather than putting in the caveat of gearing and expensive LIPO's.

So really, even though he was favoring one type of vehicle he didn't even give THEM a good presentation other than "Dude, they are fast and they wheelie all day long".

To Dave...

I may have never worked as a salesman, and I don't know exactly what the stores policy on sales are. I was making an observation as a store customer who's been in the R/C hobby (Planes, Boats and Cars) for 16 years. I've dealt with numerous different hobby shops, and this was the first time I had seen a sales pitch like that. The shop that I went to years ago had guys that would show you all the different options, and what they had to offer both good and bad. Which is the difference between a sales guy and a GOOD sales guy who actually knows his stuff.

So, really I should have asked what makes the difference between a good salesman and your garden variety "Just doing my job".

iamnot

not starting a flame war???? i don't believe that. it seems that the biggest reason you're upset is because he didn't push the savage. he did introduce it first after all, then maybe he saw or sensed something about his customer that you did/could not that said they were not interested in that truck and he moved on

it's your opinion that he was not being honest based on your experience with one truck and internet bs. he works with them everyday, how do you know that his experience and thus his opinion were not just what he said?

i own a t-maxx - the original upgraded to a bigger engine - and i've never broken a bulkhead, a-arm, shock, diff or much else really. my savage on the other hand did not make it through break in before i had to replace the rear diff and it's first wreck bent the tvp's and 2 shocks. if it were up to me to recommend a truck to a newb and it were between the savage and t-maxx, based on my experience, i very well might recommend the maxx too.

why? you wanted to influence them based on your personal opinion. which could be argued is a lot less valid than his based on you having one truck and internet "experience" and his working with many different ones daily

should you have jumped in? if you wanted to share your experience with the savage then, sure, why not? but to have started saying anything, good or bad, about any other truck would have been wrong because you don't know. all you have about any other truck is what you've read on the net, which many times is worse than useless.

zjwhitrock

you guys are all looking at this the wrong way!!!!

who in the RC industry has THE best parts suport?
who has the best customer suport?
what rc company has the best instruction manuls for begeners?


TRAXXAS

BuzzBomber

My Feedback: (4)

Personally, I doubt it's anyone being intentionally misleading or dishonest, based on my experiences dealing with a chain hobby shop. They are improving now to the point that most of the staff can at least identify a particular car and troubleshoot obvious stuff now, but most of the staff at my local place are high school or college kids who are not into the hobby when they walk out the door of the shop. When the store opened up, even the owner couldn't tell the difference between a pinata and a pinion gear. As I said, things are improving now and the owner of our local shop is striving to learn the business, but a lot of times, the sales staff only gets a crash course in r/c gear and has to rely on a "cheat sheet" they keep with important features, along with what's printed on the shiny boxes. And we all know that nobody spends more money on shiny boxes with impressive bold print than Traxxas, not that I'm knocking them.

sloppyG

ding ding ding, we have a winner

the op's feelings just got hurt because the salesperson seemed to be leading the customer toward a truck that wasn't the same as his

he got insecure about his choice in RC truck and felt the need to come in here and talk about how the sales person was being unfair and dishonest by basically reading the box on the traxxas stuff