R32GolfTA06

see the rating on the tamiya packing.....

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/TAMIYA-53444-Silicone-Damper-Oil-Medium-Set-1-each-of-Green-Blue-Purple-NEW-/121185347725?pt=UK_ToysGames_RadioControlled_JN&hash=item1c3735a88d#ht_71wt_1065

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Tamiya-534...b#ht_535wt_827

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/TAMIYA-534...c#ht_71wt_1065

ToraKitsu

O.K., that's Tamiya's own, which uses their own numbering system. I didn't see a viscosity number, though (the number used is not it's viscosity). Every other brand of shock oil will have a viscosity listed on the bottle. Try another brand. I'm not sure about those in the links.

Oh, yeah....what do you think about an F1 as your next project?

R32GolfTA06

Which brand/ oil would you recommend?

Am a fan of F1 so it's a definite possibility for sure, I do like trucks too!

R32GolfTA06

Is the viscosity of 40wt quite firm, I only intend to run my car on hard carpet tiled floors or shines tiles or treated concrete or wooden floors

ToraKitsu

40wt is about "middle-of-the-road" for most applications, so it would be a good place to start. I run primarily on smooth concrete, and 40wt works well. you could go up or down from there, by increments of 5 for fine tuning, but as it is 40wt sounds good for the surfaces you mention.
Brands don't matter much to me, and I've used several, and between one and another, I'm not so particular. Whatever you can find would work, I would think.

Yah, I'm doing an F1 next, so I just mention about that. It would be a cool project, and we could help each other, since I'm new to RC F1, myself. I've done some studying on chassis, and Tamiya's, though some are nice, are a bit too expensive to gather up all the components, so I'll be going with the SP-1, since that one's adjustability is the biggest factor, right now. The 3Racing F113 is the most complete kit, so that's not entirely out of the picture yet, though it doesn't conform to UF1 specs. If I don't want to race UF1, it won't make a difference, but I'll see. I won't be doing anything until next month, so there's time.

Trucks? Off-road? Been there, done that. I'm just tired of replacing broken parts all the time, which is why I do only crawling and rock racing, these days, and very seldom, at that.

R32GolfTA06

Ok I guess if I search in eBay for 40wt I'll get something, but should it not be different verosities of oil in combination with different springs, I'm just wondering how the one type of oil changes if soft springs are on front and medium rear.

I meant trucks as in lorries, but off toad buggy could be an option as it's a route I've never been down

team associated do a 40wt oil but they say it's slightly thicker than the 40wt that team losi do, if it's 40wt I'm not sure why it's not exactly the same.. The team associated one is a few dollars cheaper too

ToraKitsu

Yah, I've done Associated oils, and they do well. The viscosities should be close, so I wouldn't be too worried about that. Why they differ is the thing - a standard should be the same, from one manufacturer to another, so I don't know.....but there's not much difference between Losi and Associated oils, so don't worry about it.
Spring and oil combinations would be much more important, with grip racing. Not so much for drift. Being "in the ballpark" with drift is good enough, for at least that part of chassis set-up. The more important areas are tires and mechanical suspension set-ups.

Ohhhhh.....O.K., like Tamiya's 1/14th scale semis (lorries - I haven't heard that term for a while! )......I get it! I like those, too! Especially the MAN cab-forwards (I've seen a few "drifterized," too!). I think you'd tire of buggies, they're very simple, and would be a contender, if you intend to race. If you aren't considering racing them, the buggy would end up sitting on the shelf, I would think..... They're just "ho-hum" to me, I guess.

R32GolfTA06

Ok cool, ill get some team associated 40wt then and see whats its like..

yea Semi is an american work, its either artic, or lorry here in UK :-)

I have just noticed I can get a 0.4 module pinion with 20t and 21t .. the most recent one i bought was a 28t and 29t but i remeber you saying the smaller the better.. so i get the 20t would reduce the gearing even more to my benefit?

ToraKitsu

.04? You mean 64P?

I'm currently running a 34T pinion, which is the smallest I can run with a 112T spur. You were running a spur over 120T, right? A 20T may be too small, but another thing I thought of.....Does your ESC have adjustable programming? If so, it might have 50% or "training mode." If it does, put the ESC in that mode, then you won't have to gear down.

R32GolfTA06

No I mean 0.4, my white spur was 64p/ 0.4 module, hense getting a 0.4 module pinion to fit it. My spur is 122t and I'm currently running 28t/29t pinion and it runs great.. I'm not sure if my esc does have training mode, why does this mode mean I don't need to gear down

ToraKitsu

What training mode, or 50% does, is reduce your ESC's total output to 50%, or half of what it would, at 100%. You run a 13.5T system, so reducing it via training mode lets you keep your gearing, or even allow you to gear up a little. It also smoothes out that 50% nearly perfectly for drift.

It had completely slipped my mind until now. Check and see if your ESC has that feature. If it does, try it out. If not, back to gearing changes!

R32GolfTA06

Cool. I will check it out. But I want to run it as it is first to see how manageable it will be, I haven't actually properly had a go with it in the two tears of building this chassis! Would 50% of 13.5 be the equivalent of something like a 16t motor in terms of output ?

ToraKitsu

O.K., now we get into the "nuts and bolts" so to speak, of throttle control, which is important for drift.

Why 17.5T is "optimum," is because it allows usable throttle travel to about half. The upper half of throttle travel is never used. What it also allows is when you bolt grip tires to the chassis, you don't really need to gear up. Then, full throttle is still fairly fast, and that's where 17.5T comes in as the best all-around motor size.

13.5T allows only the first one-third of throttle travel for drift, and as you might imagine, one-third will be harder to modulate than one-half.

As an example, I rarely, if ever, go above quarter-throttle with a 17.5T motor when drifting. Now imagine a 13.5T motor......it doesn't allow you much in the way of fine control. Now, if you can program the ESC to 50%, that will allow you to use up to half of throttle travel, and is actually finer in control, than a 17.5T. This would aid novices, and yet, many novices balk at this here, because of that American "if fast is good, faster is better" mindset. While this thinking works for off-road, and on-road grip racing, it is actually bad for drifting, because drift uses so little throttle to accomplish, to begin with.

So don't think of it as an alternate motor size. Look at it more from the amount of throttle travel. In this case, more throttle travel equals finer throttle control.

The other alternative, is to reduce overall FDR, by gearing down, which is what you have done, with the 122T spur. The TA06 won't allow you to gear down to 17.5T specs, because of it's limitations in the motor bay, so if your ESC is capable of being programmed to 50%, you can forego gearing down.

If you find that you don't have enough throttle control, or it doesn't seem fine enough, your only alternative past programming the ESC or swapping motors, is gearing down. The TA06 has limitations here, though, so a 20T pinion may be too small. go as small on the pinion as you can go, because it appears like you have about the largest spur that will fit on the TA06.

What I'm trying to get you to do, is increase your fine control.

R32GolfTA06

Why would 20t be too small? Especially after saying that the smaller the better? I'll look at my esc programming over weekend and see what I can do

R32GolfTA06

I might consider getting this.....http://www.modelsport.co.uk/novak-cl...roducts/369085

ToraKitsu

Because of the TA06's limitations. A pinion that small may be too small, diameter-wise. You may not be able to mesh it properly. That is what I mean.
Some older ESC's don't have a 50% setting, so if yours doesn't have any, it's not an aberration. Many new ESC's are coming out with a "training mode," or 50% setting.

As far as a new system, you could probably do better just getting a 17.5T motor, but that particular combo is good. It's a stock-spec, so it will be durable, and Novaks have some parameters to adjust, though, as a rule, stock-spec systems don't allow many.

R32GolfTA06

What 17.5 combo would you suggest?... I think a smaller pinion could fit ok, because the 122 spur pushes the motor over to the right to the furthest away position so I have a good bit of scope to reposition the motor back towards the spur with a smaller pinion. I have a question under general about grease and lubs but no one has commented yet, maybe you could have a look :-)

ToraKitsu

On combos, I'm a fan of LRP. They have very strong systems, and some are adjustable, and LRP motors are smooooottthh. I have been getting the LRP Spin Super (which is a stock-spec, and effectively non-adjustable ESC), and the LRP X12 and X20 motors. You may not be able to find them in combo, so they may cost a bit. I know LRP motors are $100 a pop, just by themselves, so if you can swing a Speed Passion motor in 17.5T, I know those will do well in the TA06, because their motor tabs stick straight out from the endbell, rather than have tabs that go up and over the end of the can, like all others, and best of all, their price is definitely right! Those will allow more adjustment in the TA06 motor bay, because without them, I couldn't get what little adjustment I do now. The TA06 has much less adjustment than other chassis, and this is what reduces the ability to gear up or down.

As far as lubes, I go with Tamiya AW grease where greases are required. It doesn't "fling" off, like other greases, and tends to work longer, and wear is significantly reduced, with every application I've used it on. You only need a tiny bit to work, so although it comes in a tiny container, that container lasts quite a while. For all other applications, I use a Teflon-infused oil called "Dry Ice," made by Sullivan. It has Teflon particles in it, and the oil itself dries, and leaves just the Teflon behind. Only a little is required, and works well, because it doesn't attract dust and grime. I have a 4 oz. bottle that's now half-full, and I've had it for six or so years. A drop is all that's needed, in most applications.

R32GolfTA06

http://www.modelsport.co.uk/schumach...products/21297

thanks for the info.. I just bought this before you replied, hopefully it will be decent stuff.. Seems to get good reviews

ToraKitsu

Schumacher makes good stuff, too. Besides, I doubt you could find Dry Ice where you are, since Sullivan is a relatively small American company.

Try Tamiya AW grease, though. That stuff I swear by. I don't use any other grease but AW (btw, "AW" stands for "anti-wear").

R32GolfTA06

cheers man, I'll check it out, is it relatively cheap?

ToraKitsu

Yah, it shouldn't cost but a bit less than a couple of quid. Here's what the container looks like, and what's inside. It's about the size of a 5P coin.

Your TA06 came with some, as mine did. The guy you got it from probably kept it, and I'm sure he probably lubed the gearbox gears with it. It does a great job of quieting gears. It's great for ball diffs, too.

R32GolfTA06

Thanks man, your up late/early today?..

whats the longer thin tube of Molybdenum grease used for?..

yea the only thing that came with my kit was a dribble of suspension oil

R32GolfTA06

http://www.modelsport.co.uk/hpi-moly...products/40215

is this the same thing?

ToraKitsu

That aluminum tube? Toss that in the trash. I don't keep that stuff around. It's not nearly as good as AW grease. The manual says to use it on certain joints and the gearbox gears, but AW works MUCH better!

So, I suspect the guy you bought the TA06 from kept the AW for himself.

Yah, I'm an insomniac. Whatever the time reads on this post, it's just a bit after midnight here.