caad5

If you are swapping the engine out due to the fact that it doesnt have enough power then how can you say that a stock HPI Baja is better than a stock FG when for starters it comes with an inferior motor. Even you have gone to a zenoah 260 as seen in your pics above which is standard equipment on an FG.

fourwheeler

Congrats on the new ride man !!! And the wifey will get over it as soon as you buy her something really nice !!!

My Baja has the CY 29cc engine in it along with an X-Can muffler and I changed it because of a lask of torque off the line. The 29 cc wakes up the Baja and actually has too much torque for the Baja if that is possible. The Baja is really good straight out of the box though.

So far as the FG can't jump comment, here is a couple of pics of my FG in flight...

Timmahh

fg usees the Zen 260, the Baja uses the CY23. differnt engine, different bore same stroke, so different power, for most the stock 23 is fine. but some like myself, like it to be on the edge ( or past) of uncontrollable. ( IF I had went with an FG, this would be no different). the motor used is IRRELIVANT to the overall design. if you put the zen 260 into the baja, then they have the same motor, still dont make the new design of the baja any less impressive imo over the FG line. im not saying the FGs are bad, as i stated i looked, researched, and dug into the design of the FG before i knew about the Baja, it was ok, but Nothing i couldnt manufacture in my friends shop, and then buy the addtional parts needed, ie, a arms, diff, axles, ect....

calling the eintrie rc crap due to useing a less powerfull engine is nutz. or is it? by your reasoning CAAD, when HPI releases the Baja 5R (COMING SOON TO A LHS NEAR YOU) with a 29cc stock, then i guess, by your reasoning, then the BAJA WILL BE THE BEST RC AVAILABLE, becuz it has a 29cc motor stock. its bigger than the stock Zen 260 that FG uses in their RCs, so It must be Best RIGHT CAAD?

its not hard to cut a piece of aluminum and bend/weld it if you have access to the proper tools and equipment. especially when your making a simple Pan Design Chassis. My Bergonzoni is pretty much the same, but i like the ReedCase motor is has STOCK in it. plus its an Onroad with a Porche 911 Turbo, so i doubt i ll be jumping ANYTHING with it anytime soon.

there are MANY threads of FG owners putting new/upgraded bigger engines on their FGs. so if thats the case then i guess the ZEN 260 is a Crappy motor, becuz ALOT of FG owners have swapped them out. MAYBE NOT YOU CAAD, but Others have. pull both engines out of the FG line and the HPI Baja, and the HPI wins hands down for overall design imo. you must hold my OPINION in VERY HIGH REGAURD to want to question Why i have the opinions i have. Thank You! I appreciate the Shout Out CAAD.

My Neighbor has the Zen 260, i m still useing the Stock CY 23, as is his brohter for the record. the stocker is Pleanty of motor, just not enough for my nib/ his brother (installing the ESP 30.5 kit next week). i put 5 gallons thru mine before i had a sand ingestion issue, even the zen 260 wont beat out sand. if you think it can, i have a STATE just south of Florida i own i ll sell you for 10,000,000.00 USD. great lil place i like to visit thats called INYOURDREAMS. thats not to say im not gonna go bigger cuz i am, BUT only cuz i WANT MORE power, not that the Baja Needs more power. is a personal choice, something We HAVE.

JD, after 4 months of this shizzzzzz, im just tired of it. while i ll agree the initial post IN THIS THREAD was an eye poker, by a baja owner. after 4 months of BS by a few FG owning IDIOTS, (MOST PRESANT COMPANY EXCLUDED) it was bound to happen. actually im impressed it took four months for someone to start poking back. sometimes its GOOD TO STIR THE POT as you stated earlier.

Timmahh

SIM2U

Dont mean to flame anybody here but I agree there. The stock engines are total gutless crap. If I stuck a weed wacker in there, it would go faster lol. But seriously, for the amount of money you fork out for it, what you get is a slow driving clap clap sounding rear end runner. I drove my mates new Baja - or at least hpi new version; not just the other day and I was so excited about driving it and getting a chance to really putting it through it paces on a cool track. I was so bloody dissapointed I gave the controller back to him after an hour of messing with it.

Im not trying to intentionally put it down mind you, I was a massive fan of it until I drove it. Seriously, its like if I put wheels on a weed wacker, that would drive faster with more power and torque. biggest upgrade would be to do what has already been suggested and...........................GET A NEW ENGINE AND MOD IT.

BUT...I dont agree with FG being better than the baja though.

SIM2U

In terms of the total package being crap...no its not. Its just let down in verious ways in tipical HPI fashion.

But by all rights if there was a beafier engine in there that could really take advantage of what the chassis design offers, then it would be a great package. But as it stands I feel they have let it down in those and other areas. I know people on here have them of course and feel the need to justify their buy by standing up for it, and thats logical. I just had a few small beefs with the Baja when I drove it and thought at the end of the day it was'nt what I was after.

But hey, each is to their own. Sorry guys, dont mean to tread on toes here.

bryan70546

My Feedback: (4)

funny how this guy asked a few questions ,about a vehicle he purchsed .and then it all turns to crap becuase of a few i would take it adults want to act like kids .some of you people need to grow the hell up.beaglegod did not buy a fg he purchased a baja .good for him stick to the topic people if you dont have anything possitive to move along, i dont see fg mention in his post at all.stick to the topic at hand.[&o]

caad5

The 29cc engine you refer to is a CY which is an inferior copy of a Zenoah. The 29cc and 30 cc engines you refer to do not make more power than a 26cc zenoah and that has been tested and proven here in Aus as people have bought these engines from the States and they end up making less power and the Zenoah ends up getting put back on. So no my reasoning is not due to the bigger CC's its due to the quality and power of the Zenoah engine. The people that are swapping out their engines from an FG to put in CY are the people looking at the CC's and think bigger is better. Those 29cc and 30.5 engines are making around 3.5 to 4HP but a 26cc Zenoah with stock bottom end and just porting alone makes 5.5HP and thats tested with the square type muffler box and square type air filter/ box no tuned pipe and no high flow K&n air filters.
And I never said anything about keeping out sand as the fan on a zenoah will suck in just about anything and what has that got to with what motor the Baja comes with stock out of the box anyway. Nothing. And what im questioning is how you keep going on about the Baja being so superior yet I just dont see where as 1) It comes with a inferior motor both quality and power and 2) I dont think the design is superior over an Fg because in terms of design and looks an FG front and rear end including wishbones, uprights , shock towers etc etc look way better than a Baja. At least Fg have a unique 1/5th look whereas the Baja wishbones, uprights etc just look like overgrown nitro parts.

ryan@ddm

Sir, the only person that can take the G260RC from 3 HP (with no muffler and no filter - as tested and spec'd by Zenoah) to 5.5 HP (with stock filter and canister muffler) is GOD. Does he port for you?

J_D

yo ryan, heres the dyno.

stock zenoah with porting.

ryan@ddm

I could make a dyno chart that shows my (nonexistent - I don't do it) "Type R" porting gives 10+ HP to a stock G260RC. Doesn't make it reality. Enter the right variables into the software and a dyno will give you any result you want.

Let me be frank with you. I have been working with Zenoah and CY engines for more than a decade. I've worked with, and still work with, many of the top engine builders in the space. I've sold thousands of motors, and deal directly with Zenoah. My comfort level in making this assessment comes from experience.

With the airfilter and stock muffler, the G260RC makes less than 2.5HP. Porting to 5.5HP would be a 120% performance gain. Sorry, but I stand by my statement that only God ports that well. Is 5.5 HP from a ported G260RC believable with a tuned pipe? Yes. With a stock muffler? Frankly, it's impossible. I'll give you fifty grand in cash and my firstborn if, on a dyno that shows a stock G260RC with no airfilter and no muffler making 3 HP (i.e. on a dyno that is apples to apples with the official Zenoah numbers), the engine in question with a stock filter and canister muffler makes 5.5 HP.

SIM2U

I thought I was on topic actually son...

My opinion was a logical and a reasonable one, in terms of the engine choice when viewed within the context of the whole package. I ws not trying be negative as I stated that is you took the time to read it. As I said, I like the baja as a design package but a an RC package, there are so many small things that need to be addressed.

So what you are saying is that you want to ignor all the comments that may be either informative or functional if it be within the realm the negative...? Not all negative coments are bad. Mine was simply a factual concern with the package. I never mentioned any thing else like driving, handling, etc etc. Just the engine and some small aspects that were not really worth mentioning as there are easy to fix.

I would think that as long as there are no out right bashing or flaming or come to think of it, personal statements derived or focused on various individual coments and oppinions due to a dissagreement, than all is welcom.

I like the baja, OK. I just have an issue with the engine and other things. As I mentioned, when I drove my friends baja I was sorely dissapointed with the power it produced which effected the overal performance of the baja. Other than that its a nice looking, semi functional - without that dodgy engine; buggy that could be so much better. Hence the needed upgrades if you want performance.

J_D

so u mean like putting on a stock engine, as a control engine for the dyno to show the dyno isnt dodgey. ??

Are you serious with ur offer.. of the money, not ur first born.

ryan@ddm

Exactly.

Am I serious that no one can more than double the power output of a G260RC with mere porting? Indeed I am. I'd gladly pony up the cash if someone could do it - because that persons engines would destroy all other competition and I'd win it all back betting on their motors at the races.

J_D

haha yeah

well i'm getting my engine dynoed soon, its had a bit more than porting, hopefully it will make some nice numbers, i might have to see if at the dyno there is a stock anything lying around to check the dyno.

get caad5 to post up the dyno of his engine, i won't give away the digits here, i'll let him do that

bryan70546

My Feedback: (4)

read the orignal post SON nothing being discussed here has anything to do with what he asked.ok maybe a few but the rest is getting blown out of context like all the rest of the baja post on here.

SIM2U

Anyway.....

Thanks, guess its just a nooddle of nonsense and misunderstandings there.

Anyway. if one was to purchase the new baja, what engine mods would YOU recomend to do in order to bring the buggy up to a more pro spec machine. Engine modding that is. Im pretty well open to anything so any advice would be welcomed. I know what i would want to do, but lets hear it from anothers perspective.

I hear some of the guys talking about throwing the beast on the dyno after engine mods, so where you guys sending your mills to be modded. One of the main resons why I drove my mates Baja was I was thinking about racing one in its catagory...but with the package as it is I was just a bit let down. I also thought that the suspension would be a bit more progressive, but that could be modded.

Thanks.

SIM2U

What were some of the mods you have done to the mill before the dyno...? Cheers.

caad5

Well Ryan from DDM you are sadly mistaken and no GOD does not do my porting. The 5.5Hp Zenoah 26cc is a real engine not an imaginery one and the dyno sheet posted above is for the 5.5Hp engine and all of it is real. And I love the way you just say that no one can make that power from porting a zenoah because you cant. Yet there are quite a number of them out there and even some Zenoah 23cc's making 5.1 and it is all porting nothing else - no crank changes, no piston changes, no crank case mods nothing. Just porting the intake and exhaust ports and widening those ports.

And going off your comment where you state enter in any variable in to the software and a dyno will give any figure you want., so therefore you are basically saying that dyno sheets are all not believable. So how does one prove it then coz you will just come back and say that the dyno figure was falsified. Even if we get a stock zenoah to show the dyno is working right, because your engines havent had that power level then you will just keep coming back by saying that the figures are fake for the 5.5HP runs.

badz

My Feedback: (1)

Can you tell me who ported your engine? I can't find the number to God's Porting Service.

hndaman1

My Feedback: (6)

Talk about killing a good thread

SIM2U

Yeah...wow! I just wanted some simple answers. I find that there's a bunch of antagonistics here debating the price of stale bread of the other stale bread. Come on guys, Im only new to this thread and it would be good to get all of your knowledge on here without the personal inuendo or BS.

But, as a real question standing un-answered, what mods did you do to your engine and where was it done. If I can get that kind of HP from that engine....I want to do it to the 29cc as well as some other engine mods. have any of you changed the stock carbie at all in any way or ramming - using that word lightly; the air in there with a more aggressive filter set up and system? What about the carb diametre and or other mods like changing carbs...?

thanks guys for your help.

J_D

yes, u can have modified carbs, modded jets, and a believe the butterfly thing can be modded too..

ryan@ddm

The 23cc engine on your Baja has a lot of potential. The stock carburetor is plenty capable of handling a highly modified engine and doesn't need to be changed.

If I were modding a 23cc engine on a reasonable budget, I'd go with a big-bore kit (27cc, 28.5cc, or 29cc) and a good exhaust.

ryan@ddm

A. I don't port, period. I have no skin in the game, and therefore I'm not embarrassed to be 'shown up' by a better porter because I don't port. I'm saying that 120% gain on an engine restricted by the stock can is flat out impossible. It seems like you're the one getting hot and bothered that someone is challenging your inflated numbers.

B. I'm saying that I can take an engine that shows 3 HP on one dyno, put it on another dyno, and suddenly it has 5HP. Numbers are not consistent from dyno to dyno. I'm saying that I can enter in different values for altitude, temperature, humidity, etc into the dyno software and the make the actual data gathered by the dyno look like a 2HP peak or a 10HP peak.

Here's a thread you might find worth reviewing:

http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/m_48..._1/key_/tm.htm

Timmahh

SIM2U, some info for you and a few questions. i ll assume ( hate that word ) your buds Baja was stock with the extension tube still on? sounds like it to me by your description. Pull the Extension off ( or get an XCAN on it ) and you ll see that stock 23 COME RIGHT INTO IT. i drove mine with the extension on for one gallon, then i removed it, did a small retune. differance, was with stock setup, barely get off the line and slow to go up in rpms. once i removed the extention and retuned, i was digging holes from a dead stop, and the spool up was Majorly better. have your buds try this with his baja, im sure you ll be pleasantly surprised. Originally the Baja was Spected with a 27cc motor. no real reason as anyone can tell why they went with the 23. probably got a killer price on them from CY that was too hard to pass up.

my neighbors ( 2 brothers ) both have the baja, One has the ESP Zen 260. the other will have ( soon ) the ESP 30.5 ESP motor. I m going for either the 27 raced ported kit, 28.5 race ported kit, or the ESP 30.5 with the 1mm stroker crank ( effetively makeing it a 28.5 1mm stroked ), OR a GP29 CY and have it ESPd. decisions desicions. on our track, the ESP 260 has much more speed out of the hole, and in the long run. but it, STRICTLY BECUASE OF LOSS OF TRACTION DUE TO MAJOR WHEEL SPIN due to the EXTRA TORQUE< and driver ability) only edges past the stocker baha. on the flat, it smokes the stock. gotta get better traction.

for a Serious Racer, i would go with a ported 23 or 26. start with the GP model motor ( thicker cylinder plateing for more precise porting ability), . I seriously beleive anything more would be WAY to much as you ll get so much more torque, the wheelspin would seriously inpare handling. and on a track at race time, its all about handling and control. both that are severly compromised due to the excess torque created by the bigger engines. besides, on how many tracks can you wot it and hold to the end( only the drag races can this happen on)

we re all bashers here, so the perfect race set up baja isnt our concern, but if i were to contemplate serious racing, i would stick wiht the 23cc or 26 CY or Zen, and have it ported by a reputable porter ( ESP< ODDIE< TS> and others) and then have a tuned pipe built for it. no off the shelf pipe. if your seriously raceing, HAVE THE PIPE MADE!!!!!!!.

hth Timmahh