OK, this is going to be one of the more off the wall (and long) posts... I have been trying to get into helicopters for about five years now. Finally in a position to do so, unfortunately I am stationed in South Korea right now (and yes I have to specify South as there are too many people that hear Korea and wonder what the American military is doing in North Korea!) I have so far purchased three electric helis, one PoS Esky E004 Honey Bee, One (now very wrecked) Walkera 22e (better, but still not very smooth with the motor driven tail rotor) and a Esky King II. I kind of like the King II and am getting there, but my eventual goal was to be a Nitro Heli... Well now we get to the situation: After talking to the LHS owner about my eventual plans he told me in essence to quit screwing with the micros and just get the nitro. So, going tomorrow (Sunday for Me, Saturday night for Y'all in North America) to look at a "top quality" 90 series nitro bird. Unfortunately I don't know much more than that. The LHS owner says it is just run in, very little use, never wrecked and total when built topped 5,000,000 Won (about U.S. $5,500). It is being offered to me for around $2200 complete (everything needed to turn Key fly it except experience) and included in the deal, the LHS owners son is going to teach me to fly it. Apparently said son is the South Korean National Champ for 3D RC Helicopters, and although I can not read Hangul, I have no reason to doubt the claim. Enough trophies and awards in the place to sink a small boat (not a submarine for you sailors out there, maybe a row boat). Here is what I need: Are there specific things (brand names, frame weak points etc) I should look for to kill the deal? He is promising top quality everything, but I know no names or models and this being Korea ANYTHING is essentially possible. ANY help would be appreciated as I don't exactly have a large cadre of English Speaking (American English, Queen's English, Australian English, you name it I DON'T have access to it) RC Helicopter pilots over here to talk to and ask questions of. pretty much all my information is coming from internet searches. Thanks for any ideas Y'all can post

Hey 1969,
I think that the best thing you could do would be to identify the brand/model of the bird if you can. That would not only attract many more responses with useful information but also allow you to search through the forum list and most likely find existing posts on the subject while waiting for replies. Just for starters though, Thunder Tiger Raptors and Century models seem to be some of the most popular nitro models so you couldn't go wrong with one of them. I have a TT Raptor 90 and i love it. I can't be completely sure on the cost not knowing the conversion rate for Korea but i invested about $1,600.00 in a stock Raptor 90 without radio. That included the stock kit, OS 91 SZ hyper w/pump and Futaba 401 gyro/9254 servo combo in addition to all necessary field equipment. I guess $2200.00 w/radio wouldn't be such a bad deal if it is indeed like new and maybe assuming that it included a few upgrades with the guy being a champ and all. Good luck and thank you for your service!

A 90 is a LOT of helicopter and they cost a pretty good buck to keep in the air. I normally tell people the 50's are the way to go, especially for your first nitro. Most people (me included) with 90s own and log far more time on 50s because they are no where near as expensive to crash (about half) and consume about half as much fuel. I was going through a gallon a day when I had my 90 Avant.

Just some food for thought, not trying to discourage you.

Other than that we would need more information to give you specific advice.

I was a flyer at Humphreys back in 76/77. Have you access to a cheap simulator? While your at it what type of heli is he trying to sell you. Although $5500 down to $2200 is a deal and may be top equipment. I see decent Raptors for around $1500.

Quote;

The LHS owner says it is just run in, very little use, never wrecked and total when built topped 5,000,000 Won (about U.S. $5,500). It is being offered to me for around $2200 complete (everything needed to turn Key fly it except experience) and included in the deal, the LHS owners son is going to teach me to fly it. Apparently said son is the South Korean National Champ for 3D RC Helicopters



Let me first say DO NOT BUY THIS HELO TOMORROW!!!!!

I say this because of a few things.
First, like you say you have absolutely no idea what you're looking at. Take a pad of paper and a camera and write down what he says is in it, as specific as possible. Take pictures, a general whole picture and close ups of the mechanics, head, tail, motor area, and the radio area from both sides. Then come back here and post it all. What radio on what frequency (it might not be on a freq you can use stateside). Also find out exactly what support equipment you'll get, battery, starter, fuel pump, flight box, tools.
Second, while you may be getting a really good deal (MAYBE) odds are you are looking at a helo that you might be able to learn on but odds are it is a very high performance machine that is not as user friendly as a normal 90 helo and WHEN you break something it WILL cost many $$$, many people spend more than the cost of the original helo in repacement parts during the ownership of a helo. Odds are you'll be able to buy a NEW cheaper 90 helo for the cost of a crash with this helo. Blades are in the hundreds of dollars, frames are too...
Third, While the owner says "just run in, very little use, never wrecked" I would be warry, while it may not be crashed it may easily be very used or have used parts from other helos. Where he says "total when built topped 5,000,000 Won (about U.S. $5,500)" he is talking full retail not what he paid for it which was probably half that amount or less. That does not mean that it is not worth the asking price and you could also get the price down some, after all you are in the haggling capital of the world.

Do your home work, don't be pressured to buy it and if you do get it down to a cheaper price I would consider buying a cheaper helo to learn on, still a 90 size as they are easier to learn on when set up for a beginner (which the HOt helo won't be). If you buy it have the son fly it before you do so yo usee that it flys, do this with the understanding that if he crashes it you are not responsible to buy it. Then put it away, learn on something cheaper, and in a year bring this out and try it. You'll be able to use the radio and support equipment for a cheaper helo so you are starting off cheaper still and I would suspect the hoby shop owner would be happy to sell yo a beginers 90 like a Raptor in addition to the HOT helo. If yo udo that use the radio, but leave the HoOT helo as is, don't muck up the servos in it or pull anything off it for the cheaper helo so yo know all yo uhave to do is fuel it and fly when you decide it's time to fly it.

Good luck!

BH is once again on the head.. i burn atleast a gallon a day with my 90 size bird, that makes up to be about 10 flights at about 9 minutes per flight. my 50 if i burn a gallon i've got about 18 flights at 8 minutes per flight. crash cost is EXACTLY half of my 90. hell i can buy everything you break in a crash for my 50 for the price of just my blades on the 90.


Dont get a 90 for your first heli. pickup a Trex 600N or similar.

Thanks for all the input. Evan=RCU pretty much hit on my plan. I do not intend to learn to fly on this. It is more of an it's here now the price may be right and if I put it up on a shelf it will remind me what I am spending hours a day practicing on the sim for. I'm not completely crazy. I am planning to build a 30 or 50 for practice over the summer. No 50s available over here, so am probably going to have to stick with a 30 as I am going to be here for two years figure I should stiuck with birds that the parts are readily available for over here. The inspection for this helicopter has been put off twice due to weather as the owner insists I see it fly (his son at the controls) and fly it assisted before we talk final price or if I am even going to buy it Ther Seller is supposed to be bringing two birds. One is the high dollar 90, the other I know even less about, except that it is "cheaper", This is sort of my retirement gift, and I don't retire for one to two more years, so... I have some time to learn. Retirement gift was supposed to be an near complete 27 Dodge Sedan, but I took to long making payment arrangements from over here and someon else bought it. Win some, lose some! Again thanks for all the input. Taking a camera along will bring back pics and a better description later today (Sunday)

I don't agree with the reasoning of not using a 90 to learn on. I know that a 90 is going to more expensive to operate than a .50 but if you use that reasoning you might as well buy a $29 PiccO. If a person can afford it a 60 or 90 is a great helo to learn on because it has a better presence and is more stable. You can get a .60 or .90 for not much more than a .50 though over all there are greater costs. My 2 cents, If I was learning I'd get a Raptor .60 or .90 and set it up for stability. I can afford it though and it sounds like Mr. harris can too. In fact I would even consider a gasser to learn on.

Using realflight 3.5, seems pretty good, only issues I am having is with depth perception once the bird gets more than about 50 ft away per the sim. Hard to make determinations in a 2D world. Have the sim projected onto a decent sized screen so not sitting on top of my computer screen trying to seewhat is going on. The Hump has changed just a bit since 76/77, currently poised to be the major installation on peninsula. Still one Mohawk here (display) but other than that probably all the old birds are gone. Fixed wing are all RC-12 and RC-7 and the rotary wing birds run the whole inventory the Army has.

WOW I would need to hide the bank balance from the wife probable 2 states away LOL

OK, saw the bird, was impressed with the 3D flying (long time from now for me), bought the bird. Probably did not get as good a deal as I think I did, but hey, based off the research into equipment I have been doing seemed decent. Here is a short list:

X-Cell Tempest 3D 90 chopper
Futaba PCM 1024Z Radio (72MHZ)
Futaba GY601 gyro
1X Futaba S9251 Servo
4X Futaba S9252 Servos
Futaba GV1 Governor
Engine is supposed to be X-Cell, but I can't see anything other than "YS" and "91ST"
Main Rotor blades seem to be carbon fibre and say "Curtis Youngblood" on them
MISC included equipment
Charger (digital which handles all the batteries)
Glow Plug booster
Starter with battery pack
Gallon of 15% fuel (Thought I saw him filling it with 30%, but he changed the settings on the radio to stabilize it for me so maybe that is why the change in fuel?)

Pretty sure I can use the radio with a smaller Helo for practice, and all the ancillary equipment as well. Will be getting some supervised training time on the 90 next week and will go from there. If I feel even slightly comfortable may continue training with the 90, if I don't feel comfortable, will build the JR Venture 30 I bought off eBay and train with it once it arrives and I can get the rest of the parts (servos etc)



I did try to get pics of the helo inverted or doing barrell rolls or half the other tricks I could not even come up with names for, but I am just not fast enough with the camera.

When Y'all get bored, feel free to tell me I am not bright, but what's done is done and I like the Helicopter and it's my wifes money, errrr did I say that, I mean it's my money, HONEST!

Bill

Helo does not have the current tempest head. Looks like the standard Fury head. $1130
http://www.heliproz.com/prodinfo.asp?number=169991

Motor is $320

Radio, 1024 is the resolution not the model, $600-1000.

GY-601, discontinued a 611 is $380

GV1- $170

Blades $115

Muscle pipe $120

With the misc stuff you have $3500 worth, new. Nice helo though. Don't fly it.

If it was me I'd take the support equipment and transmitter, buy a new helo, motor and flight pack (servos and gyro) and build a trainer. Keep the Fury until you can fly it, but what you have is not so top of the line that you can't easily get parts. Heliproz has them.

You don't have a Tempest, maybe the Fury Extreme- http://www.miniatureaircraftusa.com/...de_Current.pdf

The Tempest has a lot more metal.
http://www.miniatureaircraftusa.com/...de_Current.pdf

That or he bought a original Fury and has some upgrades.

Main Frame on this one is marked "Fury" where the extreme pics show 'XL" The reference guide for the Tempest came through as another copy of the Extreme. I checked X'Cell's web site and can not find where you got these links from. Any chance you can send me a link to the Tempest? Thanks for your help.

I did know about the change to the head, just could not figure out exactly what he was trying to say. I "think" it was from a spool up fall over which damaged the blades and the head, but can't be totally sure that is what he said.

FWIW, the 3500 quote above is probably pretty close. Equates to about 5K over here. You would think that being closer to the supplier would make the prices lower than in the states, but the opposite is true for whatever reason. Prices on all RC parts, particularly electronics are about 40 to 45 % higher than stateside. If I could count on the miltary postal service to be even remotely timely, and oh yeah if folks back there would be willing to ship to APO addresses (most refuse) things would be different, but for now I just play and pay the Korean prices

Oops sorry... Go to minature and click helicopter kits...

http://www.miniatureaircraftusa.com/...3_kit_main.asp

I want to make it clear that I think you got a good deal. You are obviously not in the military bu your picture, may I ask what you're doing there?

Thanks for the link. Not sure which picture you saw, but my wife and I are both in the Army. She is a 1SG, I am a MSG. over 19 years in for each of us.

What electrical can I safely take off this chopper to use on a trainer?

How fast do you think you'll progress? If you think you'll be flying the new bird in 6 months leave it as is and don't use anything but the transmitter. If you think it'll be longer use the Gyro, maybe the servos. You'll really not need the GV1. If you touch the servos make sure you take pictures, diagrams, etc for the cable routing and leave the servo wheels in the Fury hooked up so you don't have to remember the holes and stuff.

Oh, thanks to you and your wife for serving!! [sm=thumbs_up.gif]

Is that a ding in the MP2 or just a reflection? I think where you are, plus all the stuff you have setup, the price aint bad at all. personally, i wouldnt touch or remove anything. leave it setup the way it is. use the transmitter for another trainer nitro. if you have instructions from the LHS, stick some training gear on it and go slowly with it.... but a 90 isnt for learning.... it will be more stable than the smaller electrics you mentioned, for sure.

Yes the pipe is dented. I didn't get a good explanation on that damage, but could not find any frame damage etc related to it, so may have come off another bird?

The guys who were flying out at the field when they showed methsi bird in flight were all pretty good. One of them had only been flying for eight months and was flying 3D with the best of them. If I can get there within a year I'll be appy and will plan to leave this one a lone and train with a complte nother setup

I agree with leaving it as is. Building and set-up is 60% of flying a heli IMO.. i'd get the venture 30 you have, buy electronics for it and build and set it up, you'll be amazed at how much you learn doing just that. then learn with it and save the 90 for when u get the basics down with the 30.

Well final plan after reading all of your input and talking with the banker err, I mean my wife, is to put the 90 to the side for now without taking anything off of it. I am going to either build the Venture 30 with parts removed from a older Hirobo Shuttle Plus which is currently supposed to be complete RTF (Futaba transmitter etc) or if The Shuttle Plus is worth flying (input?) I'lll fly that for a bit before I tear it down to use the electronics and engine on the Venture. All of that has to wait a bit though as one seller agreed to ship USPS to me here in Korea, but after the fact (he has my money so not a lot I can do) decided not to, so having to have it UPS'd to Maryland then shipped here, and the other would not ship to any PO boxes and my military APO address is technically a PO box, so again having to be UPS'd to MD then shipped to here. While I wait I will continue to fly and repair the King II and the Belt CP and use the simulator with a 90 series. Did pretty goods with the King II at lunch yesterday until the damaged/repaired landing gear gave out on landing and she rolled over.

Thanks again for all the help, this is going to be an experience...

As a follow up, I have now flown (hovered with adult supervision, hehehe) this bird through four tanks of fuel and I love it. I have requested the LHS find me a used 30 size so I won't spend as much if I try to practice when I don't have my trainer with me and crash (which is about half the weekends because he is off competing, last weekend was Taiwan (anybody want to tell me what was going on in Taiwan?). I still don't know his name, but he has been able to get through our joint language barrier fairly well (reminder he's Korean). I used the X-Cell web site to try to figure out what I ended up with and I came up with a Tempest with a Stratus head. Not sure why it was done, but that's what it matches up to. I am also continuing to practice daily with Real Flight and my two electric birds. Once again I want to thank the folks on this forum for all their help. Doing pretty good with hovering from all directions including nose in so hope to actually be flying (don't know about 3D) by summer.

Good job! Keep after it.