I've seen painting covered many times, but never pointed to a complete dummy to the subject. Here is the scenerio. I have my JHH Mirage about ready for paint. I have heard alot of talk about PPG, but I don't have a clue about. I have a friend who does auto body painting that will shoot the final coats for me. What paints would you recomment, and what surface prep should I start with. I am hoping to prep, prime, and sand at home with something from a spray can, and having my friend shoot the final with a automotive gun.

I am sure that there are many in the same boat, as I will be in a few months. Can someone break it down in nice details for those that are just lurking?

Thanks.

A gentleman by the name of John Redman once send me this procedure. I have not done it yet, so can't comment on it.

Good luck,
Edgar
Painting a jet (word document)

John's technique is very good and works. The PPG paints are designed as a system and work very well together. You should keep in mind that there may be some compatability issues when mixing different paint types, as in from a can and automotive types. Also you should be aware that the guys that paint cars are not as conscious of weight as we are. They can get a model really heavy in a short period of time.

John R's painting tips (see tag from Edgar) are right on target. But here's an added tip when wet-sanding: consider using distilled water rather than tap water. Why? Some tap water is not the best and contains impurities that can literally be *sanded* right into the paint!! (I know this.)
David R's comment about reluctance in letting an autobody shop paint a jet is partially true- they WILL lay on the paint if left to their own devices. However, a good painter takes pride in being able to apply just what is necessary - no more.
For some of the more trick (read: busy) color schemes I stumbled onto a custom *motorcycle* painter of all things who is a graphics genius. The two I've encountered think these jets are the coolest thing since sliced bread and electric starters on Harleys. And these guys are familiar with what it takes to handle small parts and related fiddly bits. And it's in their gene structure to use as little paint as possible - most of these guys operate on a limited overhead and paint costs a lot of money these days.
A good automotive paint store that handles the generic brands is the place to go. The generic paint (acrylic enamel which is also less toxic than the PPG "numbered" system) is much cheaper. Most of these stores will put up paint in spray cans (for touchup) too. I've been painting anything that floats, flies, or rolls since I was 15 and in my quest for a cost effective approach to painting I've discovered the PPG (and DuPont) is not the only show in town. Your mileage may vary.
My $0.02US worth.

Mike

Ok...For those of you who would like to be able to get a nice finish from a spray can, here's what you can do. Primer the entire plane with krylon gray primer. Paint the plane as desired with FLAT Krylon colors of your choice. Use 3M Scotch Plastic Tape for masking lines between colors, this stuff is awesome...Nice crisp edges and flexable enough to make curves (kinda like good electrical tape) and comes in various widths. When done painting carefully take a scotch pad and and run it down the edges of the colors to knock the high edge off. Wipe the entire plane down with denatured alcohol. Now, the clear. The clear I am about to recommend is very easy to apply but you will need a decent gun to do the job right (Walcom STM HVLP is the gun I use), if you dont have the means to apply the clear then buy it and take your plane to a paint shop and have them spray it for you.
You want to go to your local automotive paint supply store and get PPG OMNI AU HIGH SOLIDS URETHANE CLEAR part # MC161 and you will need the hardner for it which comes in slow, medium and fast cure. I prefer the fast MH167 which is the easiest to work with since it gets sticky moments after application, this give the clear a bite so it does not tend to run or sag. This clear is 100% compatible with Krylon paint and the finish looks as good as the PPG base coats. I have yet to do a FULL paint job using this technique but have mixed in some Krylon colors with my PPG's with no incompatibilities with the PPG base or clear coat. The F15 below was painted with the above technique for the black. Hope this helps...Feel free to email me with any questions.

Todd

Mike,

When I am wet sanding I am going through gallons of water what difference does the distilled water make?

I have done autobody for 4 years and we never used anything special, just tap water in a squirt bottle.

John & John,
I have won many awards in the past For custom paint jobs on automobiles. Never had a problem with tap water out of the hose for wet sanding.

You need to clean up after the sanding is done with a good solvent. such as PreKleano or Prepsol.

Then not touch the surface again with your bare hands.

It's the oil in your finger prints that contaminate the paint.

Terry,

That's what I have always done. I always clean before painting with the DX330 cleaner PPG has.

how do you cut the tape for the trim job?
tape it on the cut(on the plane)
or paste it on after its cut?

I usually cut in place with a number 11 blade. Careful not to cut into the model.
Mike

About the distilled water thing. Once upon a time, in a galaxy far, far away, (actually it was New Mexico) the water was down right horrible. The calcium deposits were so bad, if you washed your car you had to dry it immediately. Now by this I mean, wash fender, dry a fender, wash a door, dry a door. Get my drift.

The water was unbvelievable. Well I wet sanded the final colors in prep for a clear, and after the clear dried, you could see water spots that were not there (visible) before I cleared. Had to repaint the plane.

That is why I recommended the distilled water for the sanding. Since that time I am in So. Cal. and the water isn't a problem. I still use the procedure as it is just in the routine and doesn't cost anything.

John

Terry, I like to use the DBC base coat clear coat system from PPG, and prepsol will take the paint right off in one wipe. The DBC paint is what we have here in LA county in California. The EPA hammers us. I have to drive to Nevada to get clear coat.

Of course the good part about the DBC, is five colors in one day is a good possibility.

John

I also have a Byron Mig 15 in Krylon Sandable Primer. What are the compatability issues with going over it with PPG? I don't really want to wipe it all off and start from scratch again. Guys thanks for the tips. This is exactly the type of responses I was hoping for. I have since talked to a friend who does auto painting. He recommended using the cheaper stuff like Marhyde for the primer and then using a good name brand like Dupont or an equivalent for the base and colors. Any thoughts on the cheaper stuff.

John, David, Todd, and all who have contributed to this thread. Since this is important info that comes up over and over, I have decided to add your stuff the the FAQ section (http://www.crcja.org/faq) if any of you have any objections and do NOT want your contributions added, please let me know

Turbulence
[email protected]

No objections here!

Mlevings...
I canot tell you the entire PPG line will be compatible with your krylon primer but it should. I can tell you however that the OMNI AU line will work just fine painting over the krylon. Just make sure you finish sand with 600 grit and have cleaned the plane throughly with Denatured Alcohol or similar prior to your colors. BTW, Black & Decker make a sander called a Mouse which is fantastic for sanding jets! About 30.00 at Home Depot.
Regards,
Todd

People mention that the inside of a jet should be painted with a primer. I am not sure what the purpose of this is. What can possibly happen to the fiberglass structure which effectively has an epoxy coating? I realize that it's a good idea to cover the wooden bulkheads, but isn't a regular thing of painting with thinned epoxy enough for that? Can somebody enlighten me here?
Nikita.

how do the masters keep the paint from seaping through....and I spent 6$ on a roll on "PROFESSIONIAL GRADE MASKING TAPE" not the blue stuff....but was not vinyl either....is that the trick..using a vinyl tape...cuz i have tried alot and just can't seem to keep the paint from seeping throught the lines......thanks in advance

Jetfreak,

I don't claim to be a master but I use the 3M Fine line tape, the blue stuff, and I did sleep at a Holiday Inn one night. If you lightly burnish the fine line tape down it will not bleed under it. THen back mask away from it with the regular 3M masking tape. Don't use the cheapo stuff that you can get at the ACE hardware store, it leaves a residue, and bleeds like crazy.

Jetfreak,

David has got it on the nose! The 3M plastic fine line tape is the NUTS! Have yet to have a bleed through using that stuff.

Nikita,
You should only have to primer the inside of a jet if it is ducted fan, turbines should not need it. Due to the amount of fuel/oil that ducted fans tend to blow inside the fuse it is just extra protection from breaking down the glass/resin over a period of time. I use a good epoxy primer for this.

Todd

When do you guys remove the 3m tape? I find that if I remove it after the paint has dried for 24 hours I often tear off a portion of the paint I just applied, but if I remove it while the paint is still drying then I don't have that problem. Of course if I use option 2 then it's much more effort to apply a second coat since I have to re-tape, and I run the risk of getting dust in the freshly painted surface. I usually opt for option 1 then touch up the damaged areas with a fine brush before clearing. Do you have any tips?

If you have to leave the tape on for second coats hit it with some 600 grit wet. Just run the paper down the tape lightly and it should break the spots that cause it to pull paint up. I usually try to pull the tape as I the paint is drying though. I use the DBC paints like John mentioned and you can mask the next color within 15 about minutes.

I usally paint my coats about ten minutes apart, when the paint is dry to the touch and I am done with that color I pull the tape (aprox 15 min from last coat). Never had an edge pull with this method? As John and David mentioned, PPG Base coats dry fast, I can tape on a color I just sprayed within 15 min of application.
Todd

I haven't tried taping over "just" applied color with my current system (Martin Senour), though I did try this when using spies-heckler paint and it worked fine. I will have to set up a few test pieces for this spring when it gets warm enough to paint in my garage again.

Thanks guys.

Antony