Hi,
What is the best method to land 90 size pattern plan ?

Thanks,

on the run way?

Yes on asfalt runway

On it's wheels[sm=thumbs_up.gif]

Sorry for the english.... what i meant is "what is the best landing approach method"

"Elevator landing" method or
"Elevator for Speed and throttle for decent" method

Transmitter mix
Both ailerons up 12 degrees (Spoilers to slow the plane down)
2 degree down elevators (maintanains a slight nose up attitude)

On the down wind leg cut throttle and engage spoilers.
If you to fast on approach, the plane will clime, at the proper speed
It will descend to the runway with a slight nose up attitude.

I fly competition and have this on 4 of my planes and use it all the time, settins May vary.

(Now this should open a bag of worms!!!)[:-]

are you doing the same on windy day ? no throttle use at all ?

Yup that's what I do too. I only use about 5 degrees of up aileron and no elevator mix though. Ideally you should be able to get the plane into a slightly nose up attitude on final and drag it to the center of the runway with the throttle. When it's windy you may or may not want to use this technique. Depends on the airplane, pilot and wind direction. If it's straight down the runway (when has that ever happend?) you can usually just come in "clean" with no spoileron (aileron) deflection.

John Pavlick
Team Black Magic, Tech-Aero Designs

Works the best especially in cross wind condition.

Adrian

Hi
What do you mean works best in cross wind condition ?

did you refer to the following :

"to get the plane into a slightly nose up attitude on final and drag it to the center of the runway with the throttle."

?

With a 5 knot head wind, I can land at a HIGH Idle. The spoilers are very effective.
The plane is very stable with the spoilers deployed. Also has helped in dead sticks on a fast approach.
You can put in as much or as little that you may desire. On final approach if I see the plane climbing, I know it’s too fast.
VERY little if any up elevator needed until the landing flare. Start off with maybe 3-5 degrees of up aileron and then increase as needed,

Cross wind does not slow the plane down on final. Therefore, with air brake deployed, you can bring it in with slight throttle and nose high attitude. In essence, you are decreasing the lift.

Adrian

Hi
I find in very difficult for me to be able to control both rudder and slight amount of throttle on my YS-110 any small change in the Y stick movment can pull the model back to the air... do you use expo on the throttle ? or do you use switch for fast idle ?

Do you fly Mode 1 or 2, does your throttle has a ratchet? Regardless, since throttle and elevator is on two different sticks, one should not affect the other.

Just keep practice.

Adrian

Increase tension on your transmitter sticks.
On some of the newer radios, their is a built in throttle curve setting that will decrease the sensitivity around idle.
On the jr 10x it's called throttle curve. I move the stick to the 3/4 full position and have about half engine throttle. This is plenty of power with a webra 160 on a 10.3 pound Focus II

The problem with using rudder on landing is the airplane will appear to be flying then just fall (stall) out of the air. Best to use ailerons/elevator to correct for major direction changes and save the rudder just to straighten the tail when only centimeters above the ground. Make sure to flair (nose above wing) once, centimeters above the ground before touching. Biggest mistake is dragging it in (nose high, no airspeed, using power). Unless you're doing a 3D harrier landing, leave that for the 3D planes. Nose down until 10cm's above the ground then hold it level until it settles on the ground.

As we said when training pilots for UAV's, trade altitude for airspeed on landing.

Rudder Control
(Sportsman and Intermediate)
http://pages.suddenlink.net/donramsey/

look under
Building/Flying/

So if i understand correctly then can we say that in general landing approach of pattern airplan is done
by controlling the air speed by using the elevator ? ( of course rudder application for small correction once the airplane is low above the runway )

Yes!Got to practice allot....

To much speed on landing a pattern plane is a common problem at the begin stages of getting use to a pattern plane. If you’re too high on final approach and you lower the nose
The chances are good that the plane will pick up so much speed that you will over shoot your landing.

Being that your flying a pattern plane you must have an idea of what an reasonable height
Would be on final approach. Reducing power and maintaining a SLIGHT nose up attitude Will help to avoid the excess speed.

By engaging the spoilers the plane will slow down and give a nose up condition at the same time.

Hear is a 16 second video of my son Andrew (14) landing my Icepoint 2 meter pattern plane. I taught him keep the nose up.
Touch down at mid runway. Runway is 500 feet long.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9jz7x0Dm7vk

Thanks !
Is there way to avoid shorten the ground affect that keep the airplane flying on 1-2 feet hight ? my airplane can fly on idle for above 100 feet on that hight.

Its called the throttle, throttle gives you lift, no lift no fly ... easy? Remember when you are landing the throttle controls RATE OF DESCEND and the elevator controls SPEED. Meaning you flare (you use the elevator to flare a plane) your plane to slow her down (causes more drag), if at that point in time she is descending too fast then give her some throttle to hold her up. That is the same principle as how you perform a HARRIER for 3D.

Like some have told you, come in with a pattern plane with a steep angle and she will speed up, come in shallow and she will be manageable. Its like when I first landed a EP pylon plane, the fuse is so sleek that it retains a lot of energy and if you dive, she picks up speed.

You know, at my first meet I watched Scott land his 2M electric plane; his prop was STOPPED downwind and turning to base. It kicked back on for a few seconds on final, and maybe back off again.

In my beginning (ha I want to say years) few months I heard it was good to land with power, so I was powering every plane straight to the ground, so was totally shocked to see a performance plane just float in. That was what I did with my trainer and was told I should not do that, so I stopped doing that.

So, are you guys idling from halfway through the downwind leg and just goosing the throttle as necessary for more lenght?

Here's what I do - right or wrong it works for me:
Deploy the "airbrakes" (both ailerons up 5 degrees) on the downwind leg. About 2 - 3 clicks of throttle and keep the nose down. Turn base leg while keeping the nose down. Turn to final - start to level out a bit, as I near the landing zone I start to raise the nose - this bleeds off any excess speed. This is where it gets tricky. Like Jason said you don't want to get into a near stalled condition by flying with the nose high and slowing down too much. What I do at this point is add a little power and drag the plane in an almost level to slightly nose high condition. More throttle will maintain altitude, less will cause descent. I don't do much with the elevator at this point, it's mostly the throttle that I'm using to control my descent. I only add more up elevator when I'm ready to land (flare). Works for me. With the ailerons up, unless you come in way too fast it's pretty unlikely that you'll bounce on a landing. Don't let things get too slow or you'll be sorry. Practice until you're comfortable with all of this and you can see how to stretch out what would be an undershot approach. That's your goal. You don't want to come in super hot - just keep enough speed to make sure you're not going to actually stall until the flare. Use the throttle to hit your mark. Like I said it works for me. Maybe it will work for you. If not, then practice until you find what works for you.

John Pavlick
Team Black Magic, Tech-Aero Designs

Thanks John