RE: Scale Gee Bee Z question.
 

Can you tell me how you did or some time I will have an nice fire with this plane.

Jonas

RE: RE: Scale Gee Bee Z question.
 

Greetings Jacs;

Hang in there - I fiddled with these things for a month before I
finally re-drew them.

I think I ran into the same problem that you're seeing - on my plans,
the three forward WF formers are roughly a trianle; the flat bottom
is easy enough to figure out - it goes against the fillet base, but
then, neither of the curved sides appears to fit the curvature of
the fuselage. Then there's the strange one that's three straight sides;
what on earth do you do with that??!

So, on a piece of drawing paper, I traced the wing rib, and some
pertinant details from the fuselage, viewed from the side, and on top
of this I free-handed what I wanted the new fillet to look like. That
gives you the height of each former.

Then I made three tracings of F2, F3 and F4, but also with the wing's
surface on each one, and just plotted on each one a straight line from
the height of the fillet, out to the width of the base (which goes, I
think, almost to the wing's third rib out, or something like that).

To get the sharp curvature at the very front of the fillet, I made the
whole front former out of 1/4" balsa, and rounded it over, but you
at least have the plastic parts. You're way ahead of the game in
that respect.

Once the fillet shapes were determined, it was easy to make the actual
sheeting. Since I took the concave curvature out of the former tops, I
could use one long piece of balsa sheeting to go over the whole thing,
and I determined the shape it needed to be from my new drawings.
I still have them. Let me see if I can get them scanned and post them
for you tonight or tomorrow.

Dan.

RE: RE: Scale Gee Bee Z question.
 

Does anyone have a brand name or source for a scale pilot to put in my Gee Bee Z? Also what size or scale should I use?
Thanks for any help.
Mike

RE: RE: Scale Gee Bee Z question.
 

I used a Williams Brothers 1/5th scale "sportsman" pilot but a pilot with goggles would be more accurate. Lowell Bayles wore goggles when he flew the plane, in case he had to ditch the canopy, although he probably kept them pushed up on top of his head.

Adrian

RE: RE: Scale Gee Bee Z question.
 

Thanks for the info Adrian.
Mike

RE: RE: Scale Gee Bee Z question.
 

Hi Jacs; Here are the drawings I came up with to work out the fillets:

The first image is the wing rib top with the vertical lines showing where I want the wing fillet formers to be (the first one is a little bit behind the corresponding fuse former). I freehanded a somewhat smooth line for the new fillet outline.

The images after that are just tracings of fuse formers F2, 3 and 4, with the wing's actual surface drawn on, and then a line is drawn between the intersection of the fuse and fillet, and the wing and fillet. I tried to keep each angle about the same to avoid much twisting in the fillet sheet - that made the actual fillet shape easier to determine.

If you'd like more pictures, just holler - I have the actual fillet on the plane (I left off the base - didn't really see a need for it while the wing is on) and the template I used to shape it.

Dan.

RE: RE: Scale Gee Bee Z question.
 

This was very good to see, hope to start making it soon. The project is at a halt since I'm feed up with it. I need a vacation before I do anything else. I'm also making a new hobby room and the money isn't coming in the same rate it's going out.

Now it's only 6 more weeks before my winter holiday, imagine 7 days of snow and maybe sun and you just put your skies on and let it go, and you don't think of anything.

Mike

How was the Sunday?


Regards
Jonas

RE: RE: Scale Gee Bee Z question.
 

Jonas,
Our Frozen Fingers Fun Fly & Chili Cookoff on Sunday was windy, 20+ MPH. My Cub kept sinking into the powdery snow and I was never able to get it off the ground. I think I need to make bigger ski's for it. The Chili was great, but mine didn't win any prize. Overall it was a good time.
Mike

RE: RE: Scale Gee Bee Z question.
 

Well, I'm getting close to finishing my Gee Bee Z. I've got all the decals and lettering done and I've painted my pilot figure. I'm ready to attach the canopy and I'm looking for some advise. I've attached canopies in the past by using the canopy glue, but I didn't like the looks of it. Maybe I'm applying it wrong. Does anyone have some advise on how to do a good clean job?
I finished the plane in Solortex with a clear coat finish, so that is what the canopy will be attached to. Thanks for any help.
Mike

RE: RE: Scale Gee Bee Z question.
 

Hey Mike

Pictures if possible, every weekend I see somebody go online but like always I think it's your boys. This Saturday is indoor flying with my nutta but not with the GWS engine instead a modified CDROM engine.

Regards
Jonas

RE: RE: Scale Gee Bee Z question.
 

Hey Jonas,
Sorry I haven't been online lately. My son had a part in his High School musical, and we've been going to the performances the last 2 weekends. I'll take some pictures of the Gee Bee when I get the canopy glued on. I found some threads on the subject from a search and have some ideas for attaching the canopy. Wish me luck.
Mike

RE: RE: Scale Gee Bee Z question.
 

Don't you know that I always wish you luck!

I hope that the progress for you is better then mine. I haven't done anything to my plane for a month now, still working in my new hobbyroom. Have to buy the liquid concret and pour it out, but like always it's indoor flying this Saturday so I only have three days on makeing it happend.

RE: RE: Scale Gee Bee Z question.
 

Hey Gang,
It's been a long road but I'm finished, almost. I still have to complete the radio installation and break the new engine in, but it's ready for next weekends Mall Show. I'll let you all know this spring how it flys. Thanks again for all who helped me with thier advice, and thanks to ZPAT for starting this great thread. I'd also like to thank Adrian Page for such a nice kit to build. I'm very happy with the way it turned out.
Jonas, don't give up on yours. I want to see pictures of the finished plane someday.
Mike

RE: RE: Scale Gee Bee Z question.
 

Very nice pictures Mike

Now Gee Bee Z and Pitts S1 hangs up to the ceiling because I borrowed a mini lathe from a friend so that I can manufacture a prop hub and an engine mount for my converted chainsaw.

Hope that you make it to next weekend and nobody by accident destroy it.

RE: Scale Gee Bee Z question.
 

I promised a report on my Gee Bee's first flight. I built the plane as a winter project for my club and the scheduled day for flying our projects was Saturday, the 15th. I decided to test fly the plane the week before to get any bugs worked out.
The day was overcast with a slight breeze out of the north. It had been raining for a few days and the field was wet and the grass high.
I range checked the plane with the engine running and found no problems. I refueled the tank and decide to make the first flight.
The first takeoff attempt didn't go well. The tall grass caused the wheel pants to catch and the plane to veer off to the left and flip over. That killed the engine but no damage to the plane. I restarted the engine and decided to gun the engine and make a quick takeoff. With the Saito 72 for power, the plane jumped into the air. The climb out was very smooth and level. It needed only a few clicks of elevator and aileron trim to get it flying straight and level. I made a few passes around the field and found the plane to fly very well. I was very pleased up to that point. I decided to reduce throttle and get a feel for the slow flight characteristics of the plane. I had heard that landing was the most difficult part of flying this model.
Of all the things that could go wrong on it's first flight, the worst happened. I had no throttle control. I later found out that the screw that connects the throttle control rod to the servo had vibrated loose. The servo arm was moving but only sliding on the control rod. So here I am, no throttle control on a plane that I have never landed. I had to fly it until the fuel ran out and make a dead stick landing. I kept the plane close to the field, anxiously waiting for the engine to die. When the engine stopped, it was coming in out of the north. I was over the runway with the plane traveling fairly fast. The plane was sinking fast and came down in a patch of tall grass. The grass caught the wheel pants, which caused the plane to tumble. The wing detached from the fuse and the wheel pants were damaged. The repairs included, patching tears in the wing and fuse covering, re-gluing the wing bolt blocks and wing saddle, repairing the wheel pants bolt blocks under the wing, and repairing the wheel pants. I felt that the damage was minimal for the rough landing.
I made the repairs during the week to get it ready for the Winter Project Fly Off. I left the wheel pants off for the next flight.
The field was in the same condition as the week before, tall and wet grass. We got a lawnmower out to cut a runway, which made take offs easier. Learning from my first takeoff attempt, I got the plane into the air quickly. The flight was smooth and uneventful as before. The landing was better controlled. I brought the plane in low and slow. Unfortunately, the plane bounced and flipped over. There was no damage this time. I made a second flight later in the day and almost greased the landing, it bounced at the end of the landing and flipped. I think I’m getting the feel of it. Once the field drys up and the grass gets cut short, I should have a better chance of a good landing.
Overall, I’m happy with the plane. I enjoyed building it and it fly’s great. I’m looking forward to mastering the landings.
Mike

RE: Scale Gee Bee Z question.
 

Mike,

Glad you had some success with the Z. Don't get discouraged. The gear is very long on a scale Z and it causes most of the landing problems. The best advice I can give you is to keep the grass short and only fly it on windy days. If you decide to try the plane on pavement, put a small tailwheel on it or you'll get into some serious ground looping.

Only flying in the wind will make a huge difference to your landings. Everything happens slower and the air will be flowing over the tail nice and fast even though your ground speed is much reduced. As you no doubt discovered, dead stick landings are quite fast. With no prop disc to slow it down it tends to come in pretty hot. I think you did very well on your first flight considering that you had no chance to experiment with stall tests and slow flight.

BTW, there is a lowering kit available that cuts 1" out the planes height and it does improve the landings at a small cost to scale accuracy.

Adrian

RE: Scale Gee Bee Z question.
 

I feel for you.

Sad to here what happend to your plane but keep on trying. My wingfillet are getting there so maybe next year it will be in the air.

RE: Scale Gee Bee Z question.
 

I am sad for myself. I suddenly came to the end of this fascinating thread. I have always loved the thirties aircraft. I am not quite sure Gee Bee Z qualifiies as thirties but it is the right sort. I also loved the Percival Mew Gull but did not expect to build one. I found a Granger Williams Gee Bee Z plan for a 1/6 scale version on eBay. This model is high on my build list but with my limited flying skils I think I shall need a pilot. The drawings came with a very comprehensive decal sheet to the correct scale, that was the decision maker. The info' panel on the plan lists the Address for availability of decals and Fibreglass parts as:-

GRANGER WILLIAMS, GEE BEE Z
181 PAWNEE ST., SAN MARCOS, CA. 92069.

The plan is dated 6/79. I make that 25 years ago but you never know.
I hoped this info might be as interesting to someone who has followed this thread as I have.

John L.

RE: Scale Gee Bee Z question.
 

Problem

Glued the wheelpants together and think that I should sand the top notch away so that the landinggear can be inserted thru them.

Any thought on this problem?

RE: Scale Gee Bee Z question.
 

Jacs,
Good to see that your continuing on this project.
To answer your question the top fairings on the pants do need to be notched to clear the wire. Each of my pants is 2 pieces. 1 is the gear fairing and the other is the wheel fairing. The gear fairing is attached in the front only. The rest of it is open so I can slide it on and off the gear wire. It is all attached with 4-40 bolts.
Mine looks the same as it did when I posted the last picture. After seeing gbzflyers results with solartex I got frustrated with the coverite and my fuselage could use a bit more sanding to take out the imperfections.

In the meantime I have developed 3D profile fever and have spent my time with profiles.

RE: Scale Gee Bee Z question.
 

This has been a great thread. You guys do good work!

Gary

RE: Scale Gee Bee Z question.
 

Jonas,
The top of the "legs" of the wheel pants, where they contact the wing, need to be notched to allow the wire landing gear to fit. The "U" shaped inner seam of the legs need to be left unglued to allow the wire landing gear to pass through when attaching the wheel pants.
Let me know if you need me to take any pictures of mine to show you what I mean.

Mike

RE: Scale Gee Bee Z question.
 

Hi Mike

I think that I have it all covered now. But like always I'll you know if I have some more problems.

I have open them up in the top and bottom on the top wheelpants and of course also the lower wheelpants. So now it's time to start making the small pieces that will hold them together.

And then add epoxy and glasfiber on the inside of the pants so I have a strong seam. A bit of sprayplastic (spackel) and some sanding and it will be a nice surface finish.

RE: Scale Gee Bee Z question.
 

Problem.

Found that top wheelpants shall be open on the side and glue a 1/16 ply joiner but what is #2 x 3/8 BTN. HEAD SCREW? and the strut mount shall have a HOLE FOR #2 BTN. HEAD SCREW. I'm having problem with this because I'm used to the metric system. Okay I know what 3/8 is in dimension but a BTN HEAD SCREW and those strange #2.

RE: Scale Gee Bee Z question.
 

Jonas,
The #2 BTN HEAD SCREW refers to the screws that comes with the kit to attach the front part of the legs to the back part. It means #2 Button Head Screw. It has a rounded head 4.8mm in diameter, a thread (#2) of 1.6mm, and a length of 9.6mm (I cut mine down to 6.4mm). I've attached a picture.

Mike