badazzgti03

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Stegl,
that sounds awesome man!!! can't wait to see what you come up with. I'll be making a mold as well using industrial modeling foam. I'm going to draw up a few designs and post em up later on today....got some free time at work.

badazzgti03

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Got a quick sketch and ill post it up. Only one design was sketched up I ran outta time.

stegl

Sorry but Gatling gun/light cannon did not come out until Vietnam war... don't think ( not talking about the wild west here). Here is one picture of the heavy guns that the mossie used. They also had a cannon just about where you show your gat; comeing from the bottom. Don't have the size but it was skookum !

Found it. The 4 guns at the nose were browning .303's and under the nose on some they had a 57mm cannon that replaced earlier four Hispano 20MM cannon in the lower nose. This was just a few of the available setups. Quite a history !

Oh by the way I think the grey , if the kit manufacturer is correct could quite well be British RAF Medium Sea Grey.
AND by the way , that is a great drawing and don't mean to be criticle here now but the bulge arround the rear top is not a Mosquito trademark but in fact was on the similiar DH Hornet. Plus the Hornet had a dorsal fin in front of the verticle stab and I think a little longer engine howsings with the fuse nose being shorter. Other than that both aircraft were very much alike.

david polley

Badazz,

Really nice sketch... Very professional looking.....How long did it take you to draw that out...?

cathurga

Mosquito FBXVIII, or 'tsetse'...had a Molins 6 pounder in its nose, not very effective, so very few were built.

badazzgti03

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Hey everyone!!!!
I was being critical on the original design and made a few changes. Lengthen the nose a little bit more aerodynamical. Pointed the spinners. I know the gattleing gun is out of its time for this plane but I figures what's wrong with a little updating and personalization??. Aas for the drawing it only took a few minutes to sketch up...it's a rough draft. Pretty much what i do a living is draw. I could do a pretty picture but sketches are best to express a design and style. As for my design i would say do we have to go by the rules?? I know it won't be 100% scale but but it will still look cool kinda expendables style aircraft. Lol....what would you all come up with by going outside the guidelines?

stegl

Like the spinners and the pointy nose..... actually there was a version with a more tapered nose... similiar to your drawing. This is how I am trying to make up a new nosepiece and if it works ou,t may make more. Will be a lotta work though.

cathurga

Absolutley nothing wrong with personalising a model.....I dont have the skills/time/patience to make the super scale, down-to-the-rivet mods that some people do, and I salute them for that, I just like my planes to look like the real deal, even if it is from 100ft away :-) But, go for it, its yours! I had a H9 corsair that I hated the scheme of, just dark blue with a yellow ring around rhe front of the cowl.....whipped out the airbrush, and gave it a faux 3-tone, white, light-blue, dark blue scheme and painted it with satin clear....much better....but some of the guys turned their noses up at [:'(]....ta hell with them....I liked it!

I did some testing this weekend with the 13x10 2 bladers, and on a 3/4 charged battery, got 1100W out of it, at 55A total.....pretty pathetic actually, so I guess I will be chopping up some Master Airscrews this week... :-) 1100W on this machine is not enough power to convince me to even try it in the air.

Will report back

Dangaras

1100W, fly like a brick! Might as well tske the hammer to it before you even get to the field....

stegl

Nothing wrong with the 1100 watts (total 1100x2=2200 watts)but the important thing is what is the actual rpm as that should indicate airspeed and airspeed is what is going to make you fly.... Right ?

All too often flyers dwell too much on the wattage the motors are putting out but the other paramters that are probably more important are pitch.. airspeed and current draw and aircraft AUWweight. What I am saying is you may be getting a humungus amount of watts input/out from the motors but if you only get 25 mph at a heavy weight then you could have a problem when you need to have 35 mph to make it fly well. ( Numbers are all hypotheticle.. just trying to show the point) Also if the current draw is extremely high the flying time will be very short which again is really no good so one must look at the whole picture. An example shown earlier showed a motor efficiency of arround 54% and that also is no good. I strive for 80+ % on mine with my motors.

Dangaras

Oh, that was 2 or 1 props that gave you 1100W?

cathurga

Dangaras, yeah that was with BOTH props.....so I have decided to take your recommendation and smash it to pieces with a hammer. I am a little confused by this option though....surely it will render the plane useless?LOL

spitty

My friend David did some very nice mods on his Mossi....

He builds his own retracts, modifies the cowlings ( very nice ) and the cannons looks fantastic. The plane was flown well in a scale manner with 2 OS 48 Fourstrokers
( including one successfull Single Engine )

I think, his secret is : The plane is not so overpowered, the smaller Props don´t produce too much drag while on SE........

Enyoy the Pics :

Andy

Dangaras

Wow! Definitely not good. So trying to fly with that litte power would result in the same as smashing the model with a hammer

Good idea to go up in props but I don't think you will get what you need untill you kick up the motor KV....

badazzgti03

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Spitty,
his mossy looks good!! I wish i had the proper facility to do a lot more work on my aircraft, more fiberglassing and such. but working out of an apartment does not allow me to accomplish those tasks.thinking about making a small vacuum former to do the nose cone but would rather make a fiberglass one.

stegl

Yup if that is 1100 combined ; definitely a no-go on the motor combo. Just to try and help could you refresh me with what you are running for brands and models of motors , brands of esc's, specific props ie brand , pitch and length and battery combination and how hooked up. Something here just does not add up.
Couple of observations I read on past posts are :
Agree with Polley that the inner wing airfoil needs fixing badly as the current size of the front flat ( in the model) creats more drag than lift. If you check a couple of posts back with my first picture of a real mossie you will see that the leading edge coolent coolers are about half the thickness of the wing and of course with the real one there will be an air outlet somewere so that air moves thru the wing and the leading edge doe not create tons of drag as in the model. Also note that the upper half still has a substantial lip to get the air moving quickly over the top of the wing. There is substantial lift lost the way the model is designed.... big time.

Another thing I would like to bring up is if the props stop turning on the glide or power off then the ESC braking should be turned off as the props
will create substantial drag and slow the model down a lot more than the flaps. Same reason why they have prop feathering on real aircraft... to cut the drag as the egines won't freewheel very well. Many years ago a full sized Cessna skymaster had to have his his rear motor shut down and the pilot forgot to feather the prop and he ended up landing a couple of miles short of a runway as the drag created could not be overcome by a full power setting of the front engine. No different with models ( they are just small airplanes... same principles) .

Thanks

Dangaras

Dude your giving bad advice about braking.

The brake on feature stops the free wheeling and causes less drag. Rotating props are a disk that creates more drag. Go to any aviation tech site to get the specifics.

badazzgti03

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CMP should have came up with a better idea for the wing vents other than just making a flat leading edge and slapping a sticker on it!!! Shame on them!!! would love to see ESM or some other company come up with a Mossy model

cathurga

Agree with Dangaras, a stopped prop offers less drag than a spinning one. I wasn't too concerned about the props stopping, it just looked a little silly....anyway, this thing does not glide to well anyway. As far as my setup is concerned, I am running:

Turnigy L5055 400Kv motors
Opto RED Brick ESC's 100A> overkill for sure, could get away with 60A per side at the moment
MAS13x8x3 Counter rotating props
6S 5000Mah pack

With this setup I did the maiden, and it flew nicely, but at mostly 3/4 to FULL throttle and the speed was not optimum in my opinion. Put out 1680W at 60A settling to 55A total, but that was a static test, I am sure it unloaded to about 50A tops. AUW was 15lbs so I was getting 112W/lb which is enough power for decent, if not scale flight. All this real life data is not far off the ecalc results, so I am confident the combo is correct. The Amps are a little off on ecalc, but I think this is because a twin drawing off a single pack will create some differential in the amp draw, but I am no expert.
The big difference comes in the pitch speed....right now ecalc says I am getting approx 62mph on the 8 pitch, take it up to 10 inch pitch and it is closer to 70mph, I think this could be an even setting. If I dont get decent readings on the ground on that setup, I wont take it into the air.....if all else fails, I will be buying a set of ramoser vario props. :-)

Dangaras, I am reluctant to go up any further on the Kv, it will mean that the amps go up too, and I would like a good mix of flight time, and to use the kit I have....

Dangaras

If you go up in KV, you can go smaller on the motors, to Aolean 42-50 or 42-60 - 600 (ish) kv for eg, and you will get better performance... Better efficiency, lighter & you will be able to stop messing around with the props..... Those vario props are expensive.

So you can, buy more props, cut down MA props or simply get two new motors.. You will need new mounts as well or to extend the existing ones. I know you want to stay with the existing motors, but sometimes you have to accept the inevitable.....

Leaderhobby.com is where I get my Aolean motors from...

stegl

If you feel you are correct about a stopped prop then that is your opinion But I base my statement on actual model experience and go with the no break. Keeps me happy .

cathurga

Dangaras, try those on ecalc and see what you come up with.....from an efficiency perspective, I dont come anywhere near the setup I currenty I have. Not being conflicting here, but if you dial in a combo that gets me better numbers, I am all ears.

Remember the constants I have. 6S battery and I need a tradeoff between speed and flight time.....easy peasy, or so it seems.

Dangaras

I dont trust ecalc. Remember Ihave a flying 16lb A-26 on 42-60-600KV, 5Cell, 4000, 25C x 2 in parallel, MA14*8*3 and Iget 6 minutes spirited flying, over 8 if Imanage the throttle.

I know you are focusing on the props but you can waste a lot of time going down blind allys when the simple solution is staring you in the face... Just remember that the alternate motor is an option when you exhaust the prop change/cut options.

I will look at ecalc tomorrow..

Dangaras

I dont feel, Iknow Iam correct. However, on a few of my models Ilike the windmilling prop when the model is in a dive or a glide.

Ask the glider guys why they have folding or static props when throttle-0 or do a search online for the pro flying sites that have info, maybe wikipedia might help too.

badazzgti03

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Hey everyone got some more progress pics for you all. motor mounted and wing vent progress with airflow channels.