Engine Conversions Discuss all aspects of engine conversions in this forum

SMALL DISPLACEMENT FOUR STROKE GLOW TO GAS CONVERSION

Reply
Old 01-08-2011, 12:51 PM
  #526
kochj
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Victoria, MN
Posts: 3,927
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default RE: SMALL DISPLACEMENT FOUR STROKE GLOW TO GAS CONVERSION

Have not a clue.... Only that in a RCuniverse walbro to Zema conversion they were equal....
so I ASSuME they are the same...

I saw the M&M site but wasn't sure what the walbro "part" meant....(a actual carb, or carb kit parts ect)

Here is one place that gives cross reference: http://www.manddsmallengine.com/carburetors/zama.html

I know ther is also a very good one on RCuni... can't find it right now though.

CARBURETOR Cross Reference WALBRO to ZAMA

RYOBI/MTD
MODEL WALBRO ZAMA
STRING TRIMMER WT-456 > C1Q-P8
STRING TRIMMER WT-827 > C1U-P10A
STRING TRIMMER W/ GOV. WT-455 > C1U-P11B
STRING TRIMMER WT-827 > C1U-P14A


C1Q Butterfly
Diaphragm Carburetor


Carburetor Type Engine Size Throttle Bore Diameter Venturi Diameter Mm
C1Q 14-50CC 11MM 6.5
C1Q 14-50CC 12.7MM 8.0, 9.5
C1Q 14-50CC 14MM 8.0, 9.0, 9.5, 10.0, 11.0
C1Q 14-50CC 16MM 9.5, 10.0, 11.0, 12.5, 13.5, 14.0

Applications: String Trimmers, Chain Saws, Blowers , Hedgetrimmers & Edgers
Carburetor Type Engine Size Throttle Bore Diameter Venturi Diameter Mm
C1M 14-50CC 14MM 8.0, 10.0
C1M 14-50CC 16MM 9.5, 11.0, 12.5, 13.5


Available Features:
Choke
Accelerator
Remote Primer
Pump-Side Primer
Metering-Side Primer
Tamper Resistant Limiter Caps
Twist Start ®
Simple Start ®
Multi-Position Throttle Control

Standard Features:
Zama Patented Friction Bar & Ring
Zama Metering Diaphragm Manufactured “ONE AT A TIME”
Zama Manufactured Mixture Needles, Shafts and Nozzles.



not sure how the Available features become on the carb though....


kochj is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 01-08-2011, 02:28 PM
  #527
Pull Up Now!
Thread Starter
 
Pull Up Now!'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Northfield, MN
Posts: 669
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default RE: SMALL DISPLACEMENT FOUR STROKE GLOW TO GAS CONVERSION

Here's the only parts diagram I could find for Zama. It was from some 3rd party site. There doesn't seem to be an organized site with all the different carb's diagrams (for Zama). And looking at these detailed diagrams are the only way to answer questions such as the presense of an intake-only spring, or an accelerator pump. Anyway, here's the diagram.
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	om33753.jpg
Views:	27
Size:	74.7 KB
ID:	1544203  
Pull Up Now! is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 01-10-2011, 09:02 AM
  #528
kochj
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Victoria, MN
Posts: 3,927
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default RE: SMALL DISPLACEMENT FOUR STROKE GLOW TO GAS CONVERSION

I honestly do not know what I am looking at...or for...
could you tell me what you see???

THanks..
kochj is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 01-10-2011, 09:10 AM
  #529
optech
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: San Diego, CA
Posts: 544
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default RE: SMALL DISPLACEMENT FOUR STROKE GLOW TO GAS CONVERSION

There was a guy earlier in this thread that posted a response from Zama saying that the diaphragm return spring is available if desired but that the diaphragm material was designed to be resilient enough to spring back on its own.

If you search back I think there was even a part number stated in the response.

Mike
optech is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 01-10-2011, 01:33 PM
  #530
Pull Up Now!
Thread Starter
 
Pull Up Now!'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Northfield, MN
Posts: 669
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default RE: SMALL DISPLACEMENT FOUR STROKE GLOW TO GAS CONVERSION


Quote:
ORIGINAL: kochj

I honestly do not know what I am looking at...or for...
could you tell me what you see???

THanks..
that's why I was wondering if there is an organized Zama parts site that has diagrams (exploded views) of their various carbs. Because the picture I DID find was useless....too fuzzy to read anything on there.

Optech: Wouldn't it be nice if one could search WITHIN a thread for something? Or, can it be done easily? Maybe so, and I'm just not aware. Thanks!
Pull Up Now! is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 01-13-2011, 02:26 PM
  #531
kochj
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Victoria, MN
Posts: 3,927
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default RE: SMALL DISPLACEMENT FOUR STROKE GLOW TO GAS CONVERSION

The internals.....
Got 2-of them... @15$ per carb, it was worth a try...
The diaphram is 2-or more clear stiff plastic...
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	Qo40215.jpg
Views:	27
Size:	64.7 KB
ID:	1547071   Click image for larger version

Name:	Lg16111.jpg
Views:	36
Size:	70.8 KB
ID:	1547072   Click image for larger version

Name:	Xc80040.jpg
Views:	19
Size:	52.2 KB
ID:	1547073   Click image for larger version

Name:	Au56888.jpg
Views:	24
Size:	55.8 KB
ID:	1547074   Click image for larger version

Name:	Rd42356.jpg
Views:	18
Size:	66.9 KB
ID:	1547075  

kochj is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 01-13-2011, 09:19 PM
  #532
kochj
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Victoria, MN
Posts: 3,927
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default RE: SMALL DISPLACEMENT FOUR STROKE GLOW TO GAS CONVERSION

Do you guys know if the 2nd small brass outlet/inlet is if you wanted to install a primer pump ?? (In the 2nd picture right next to the low needle)
And I will have to crimp this off?
I don't think it is for intake tube to connect to?

I would think the carb would be like the Walbro and you have to have the tube line up on the base of the carb where there is a little hole, for intake pressure tube..

Anyone care to jump in on this one?
kochj is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 01-14-2011, 04:43 AM
  #533
Pull Up Now!
Thread Starter
 
Pull Up Now!'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Northfield, MN
Posts: 669
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default RE: SMALL DISPLACEMENT FOUR STROKE GLOW TO GAS CONVERSION

It's a little hard to follow your questions because when you ask about a little hole, you called it a tube. But when REALLY referring to a tube, you called it an inlet. But I probably suffer from a little Aspergers, so it's my problem, not yours.

Anyway, I think you're correct. Just crimp & solder the straight tube. Or cap it off with one of those little caps. This means to start the engine you'll need to be able to cover the venturi with your finger. Turn off the ignition, go to WOT, and flip the prop until your finger is wet. Then it should start. If you actually use the primer as intended, this procedure MAY not be necessary.

Yes, the little hole in the base is the impulse input. It usually just routes to the crankcase. In 4 stroke applications, it goes to the intake stack.

In picture #2, there is a little hole in the face of the base. This hole lines up with the cross shaft of the throttle plate. Look in this hole as you move the throttle to see if there is a little brass plug moving up and down. If it's there, it means you have an accelerator pump.
Pull Up Now! is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 01-14-2011, 08:40 AM
  #534
kochj
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Victoria, MN
Posts: 3,927
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default RE: SMALL DISPLACEMENT FOUR STROKE GLOW TO GAS CONVERSION

In this picture, I have at the tip of this screw driver? what? = A primer tube that I should crimp off? Correct?
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	Om33922.jpg
Views:	14
Size:	45.2 KB
ID:	1547435  
kochj is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 01-14-2011, 08:42 AM
  #535
kochj
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Victoria, MN
Posts: 3,927
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default RE: SMALL DISPLACEMENT FOUR STROKE GLOW TO GAS CONVERSION

In this picture; I have at the tip of my screw driver....??
The hole that lines up with the intake manifold??
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	Vt58574.jpg
Views:	39
Size:	83.1 KB
ID:	1547436  
kochj is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 01-14-2011, 09:20 AM
  #536
kochj
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Victoria, MN
Posts: 3,927
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default RE: SMALL DISPLACEMENT FOUR STROKE GLOW TO GAS CONVERSION

The tip of the driver must be where a hole would be drilled and the accelerator pump would be, correct?

So if mine doens't have one, is there a issue with that??
Will there be a issue with tank placement??

What purpose of a accelerator pump?
Fuel delivery? Attomization?

Thanks..
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	Fd93379.jpg
Views:	12
Size:	56.2 KB
ID:	1547445  
kochj is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 01-14-2011, 09:42 AM
  #537
kochj
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Victoria, MN
Posts: 3,927
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default RE: SMALL DISPLACEMENT FOUR STROKE GLOW TO GAS CONVERSION

I just ordered up 2-WT 456's .....from the the Isanti MN store....
I will try the Zama carbs either way....

kochj is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 01-14-2011, 09:50 AM
  #538
w8ye
Moderator
 
w8ye's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Shelby, OH
Posts: 37,526
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default RE: SMALL DISPLACEMENT FOUR STROKE GLOW TO GAS CONVERSION

The accelerator pump squirts a little extra fuel into the carb throat when you advance the throttle.
w8ye is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 01-14-2011, 07:20 PM
  #539
motorhd
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Gresham, OR
Posts: 140
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default RE: SMALL DISPLACEMENT FOUR STROKE GLOW TO GAS CONVERSION

On a Walbro, if there is a hole that exposes the butterfly shaft on the gasket face of the carb, it is has a accellerator pump. The pump is a spring loaded piston that moves on a flat spot on the shaft. It looks like the Zama might be the same from your picture.
motorhd is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 01-14-2011, 08:16 PM
  #540
Pull Up Now!
Thread Starter
 
Pull Up Now!'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Northfield, MN
Posts: 669
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default RE: SMALL DISPLACEMENT FOUR STROKE GLOW TO GAS CONVERSION


Quote:
ORIGINAL: kochj

The tip of the driver must be where a hole would be drilled and the accelerator pump would be, correct?

So if mine doens't have one, is there a issue with that??
Will there be a issue with tank placement??

What purpose of a accelerator pump?
Fuel delivery? Attomization?

Thanks..
No, that is not correct. As I said earlier, look for a hole on the mounting face of the carb, that lines up with the throttle plate's cross shaft. When I say "lines up", I mean the two holes cross each other. In your picture, I'm pretty sure I see just such a hole. Look for a little brass piston moving up & down when you rotate the throttle lever. Also, usually, you'll feel some spring tension as you rotate the shaft. Most people assume that is the external return torsion spring they're feeling. But if you remove (or unhook) the external throttle return spring, you'll still feel spring tension on the throttle. That is the accelerator pump. There's a compression spring under the little piston that keeps the plug pushing up against the throttle plate shaft.
Pull Up Now! is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 01-15-2011, 04:06 AM
  #541
Pull Up Now!
Thread Starter
 
Pull Up Now!'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Northfield, MN
Posts: 669
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default RE: SMALL DISPLACEMENT FOUR STROKE GLOW TO GAS CONVERSION


Quote:
ORIGINAL: kochj

In this picture; I have at the tip of my screw driver....??
The hole that lines up with the intake manifold??
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	Nl30179.jpg
Views:	19
Size:	136.9 KB
ID:	1547941  
Pull Up Now! is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 01-16-2011, 06:07 AM
  #542
kochj
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Victoria, MN
Posts: 3,927
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default RE: SMALL DISPLACEMENT FOUR STROKE GLOW TO GAS CONVERSION

Okay....It does have a pump.......

I cancelled my order from pats small engine shop in Issanti MN....
The reason... I was told it was on back order for 2-4 weeks...
What they didn't know, is that the carb. is discontinued, and they may never recieve the delivery of that
particular walbro carb.......
The woman I spoke with was very nice, and if I still want to get that walbro carb, I will call them up again...

I do believe the zama will work just as good as the walbro....I just have to test it out...

I have a OS 1.60 gemini twin, that already has a C&H ignition, and I have to come up with a way to mount both carbs on it...
If I could have someone machine up a mount for a single carb attachment, it would be quite easy (hint hint)

I have always found one cyl in this engine to be diff than the other....Being I will have gasoline in it, I don't want to
take the chance of a leaned out run or cyl...

1-carb per cyl is the way to go IMHO.... Even though the new saito gas twin, has only 1-carb shared between the two cyl's...
kochj is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 01-16-2011, 06:10 AM
  #543
kochj
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Victoria, MN
Posts: 3,927
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default RE: SMALL DISPLACEMENT FOUR STROKE GLOW TO GAS CONVERSION

If I go the twin carb route, I will have to come up with a altered intake pipe...
Has anyone, or does anyone know if SS tubing can be used in a copper pipe flange maker?
Or is there a need for a specialized one??

Or perhaps I could use copper tubbing?
kochj is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 01-16-2011, 10:40 AM
  #544
optech
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: San Diego, CA
Posts: 544
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default RE: SMALL DISPLACEMENT FOUR STROKE GLOW TO GAS CONVERSION

Way back on page 11 is where Evert1969 talks about the message he got from Zama about the spring.

Mike
optech is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 01-16-2011, 10:52 AM
  #545
optech
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: San Diego, CA
Posts: 544
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default RE: SMALL DISPLACEMENT FOUR STROKE GLOW TO GAS CONVERSION


Quote:
ORIGINAL: Evert1969

I've read the posts in this forum and results are in this movie: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aXXA8ZrBD4Y

Thanks for all the advises.
Here's where he posted a video of his little Saito 80 running with Zama carb.

Mike
optech is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 01-16-2011, 09:37 PM
  #546
kochj
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Victoria, MN
Posts: 3,927
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default RE: SMALL DISPLACEMENT FOUR STROKE GLOW TO GAS CONVERSION

The needles didn't seem to be right yet.... (in the video)
...... Thank you for posting the link!...

Does anyone know where the best place to get the Rxcell ignitions with the 1/32 boot (or is it 1/4)
kochj is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 01-16-2011, 09:42 PM
  #547
w8ye
Moderator
 
w8ye's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Shelby, OH
Posts: 37,526
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default RE: SMALL DISPLACEMENT FOUR STROKE GLOW TO GAS CONVERSION

These people have a good track record and excellent service

http://www.valleyviewrc.com/RCEXL%20Ignitions.htm
w8ye is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 01-17-2011, 11:33 AM
  #548
kochj
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Victoria, MN
Posts: 3,927
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default RE: SMALL DISPLACEMENT FOUR STROKE GLOW TO GAS CONVERSION

Thanks wayne..
Looks like they supply the regular sizes....

I am looking for the 1/4-32 size set to go...
I found this site....
Agape Racing and Hobby has one already to go....
No need to buy additional parts and hastle...
1/4-32 90 Deg RCEXL Ignition System-Single Cyl.
1/4-32 Mini Spark Plug-Single Cylinder-90 Degree
55$ + shipping...
kochj is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 01-17-2011, 01:37 PM
  #549
w8ye
Moderator
 
w8ye's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Shelby, OH
Posts: 37,526
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default RE: SMALL DISPLACEMENT FOUR STROKE GLOW TO GAS CONVERSION

Jim Willis at Agape has been a good source for parts
w8ye is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 01-17-2011, 06:08 PM
  #550
Pull Up Now!
Thread Starter
 
Pull Up Now!'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Northfield, MN
Posts: 669
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default RE: SMALL DISPLACEMENT FOUR STROKE GLOW TO GAS CONVERSION


Quote:
ORIGINAL: kochj

Thanks wayne..
Looks like they supply the regular sizes....

I am looking for the 1/4-32 size set to go...
I found this site....
Agape Racing and Hobby has one already to go....
No need to buy additional parts and hastle...
1/4-32 90 Deg RCEXL Ignition System-Single Cyl.
1/4-32 Mini Spark Plug-Single Cylinder-90 Degree
55$ + shipping...
You must have called them? All I saw on their site was a bunch of cute dogs and some RC engines.

CAll them back and ask them if they do the soldering of the stainless steel 1/4-32 metal shroud themselves. And if it's the RCEXL kit. And most importantly, ask them if they're willing to put reinforcement strips soldered onto the 45% angles on the metal shrouds (2x 45 =90 degrees overall). If not, there's a danger of the solder joint breaking during flight. That has happened to me twice. When CH Ignition was in business, they used to reinforce mine for a nominal fee, by soldering a double across the solder joint. And that turned out to be worth a fortune in reliability.

If you're not sure what I'm talking about, I can supply a photo, or a drawing.
Pull Up Now! is offline  
Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools
Search this Thread
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -8. The time now is 07:27 PM.