Believe me AeroFly Pro rulez. G2 is not limited only on flat spins, try the wall, a harrier, an elevator, you have to edit the planes to unrealistics to do it.
I have a backup of AeroFly if you want to try it, I suppose you have interface to joystick port.

Zilog,
I absolutely agree that G2 has severe limits when trying 3D stuff. I have unrealistically altered planes that do everything except Harrier with complete stability and Flat Spin. I don't care that much if the plane has to be unrealistically altered as long as I can get it to do what I want. I don't think 3D was G2s target when they designed it. I am quite certian there is better out there. G2 just happens to be the leading seller right now so everyone seems to have that.

I would love to try AeroFly Pro but the only control I can use is the USB G2 controler. I have no joystick port and when I tried to install a different sound board with a joystick port, I had a major issue with the onboard sound. I work with computers professionally, so its not like I am completely without knowlage on how to perform this easy change.

That's a pit, AeroFly works only with own serial interface or joystick port based interface.
I remember now one more limitation for G2. You can't stop to roll on torque rolling even if you apply full right ailerons, maybe possible with unrealistics settings.

Yeah, just edit the rotational torque value of the engine. Still unrealistic.

[8D] Hi people

[:@]THIS TOPIC IS NOT FOR THOSE WHO SAY: "PRACTICE, PRACTICE, PRACTICE".

Our slogan is: "LEARNING 3D STEP BY STEP", with intelligence and fun.

I thank a lot those who have understood what I meant.

Dear friends,

[sm=confused.gif] where can we beginners download the best plane to learn 3d manoeuvres with
Real Flight G2?

Is there anyone who can suggest the best set up? OPTIONS, EDIT AIRCRAFT, TIME MULTIPLIER, WIND and so on.

[]IT IS TOO COOL TO FLY OUTDOORS.

Vittorio from Italy[sm=sunsmiley.gif]a beautiful country with intelligent persons (FERRARI CARS AND ENGINES)

JohnVH, you've just blown away my whole image of you!!!!

Italian Flyer,

Try some of these:
http://www.aero3d.net/Planes/planes.shtml[link]http://www.aero3d.net/Planes/planes.shtml[/link]

Or These. You have to look through Pages 1-9:
http://www.bestrc.com/hobbies-bin/rfaircraftread.pl[link]http://www.bestrc.com/hobbies-bin/rfaircraftread.pl[/link]

Pick your favorite and fly baby fly

The best way i've learned is to take a new plane, crash it, rebuild it, and the learning process begins. that way your not as scared to try new manuevers

Really? Do tell....

Outonalimb,

Truer words do not exist when learning.

What a sticky thread..,so many comments from many different minds.Most have valid points,but it sure is hard to follow sometimes.
Italian Flyer,looks like some people are going to help in the way you want,but I think dropping that repetitive slogan may help in not offendinng so many others.
Try not to fly with G2 on 25% only slow those planes to 80% maximum

Practice is not necessary, you simply need to understand what is going on and be able to react with timing:

1. you are flying on control surfaces not wing and stab
2. you must be able to"catch" the airplane at any angle to keep it off the ground
3. we all learned to fly by watching the airplane then using inputs to control it, in 3d this doesn't work, you need to put stuff in before it is needed. for most people eye/hand coordination is too slow and sloppy to fly 3d safely and under control, but there is another way to accompligh this = a basic routine and timing. If you were on an assembly line with bottles flying by you could not possibly cap every bottle perfectly every time - you would fall behind and crash, so machines do this with a set routine and timing. this is the key to 3d
4. In my oppinion the rolling circle then slowing it down to a rolling harrier, is the first step, because you will become comfortable in "catching" the airplane at any angle
5. lets look at timing, anybody can learn this in one or two nights. take your favorite radio (mode 2 for example) and sit in a dark room or with your eyes closed (do not look at the radio) set the left stick at 1/2 throttle - begin moving left stick back and forth to end points passing through the center without stopping, at a medium speed get use to this maximum stick movement - dont hessitate, stop or release, just keep moving that rudder smoothly. now for the right stick - hold 1/2 left aileron constant and move the stick up and down to end points passing through center smoothly. now adjust the timing so that when the right stick passes through center on its way down your left stick is full deflected to the left. don't look at the sticks your brain will override the routine and you will crash, just keep moving those sticks - you are doing a nice rolling harrier, forget about what the airplane might be doing just burn this routine into your brain. I am not a computer just 42 years old with slow reflexes so I start all rolling harriers by turning on my routine then make small adjustments usually by holding on to something a little longer to make corrections or add a circle. but I never, never, never stop moving those sticks. if I become disoriented and I am 2 feet off the ground I keep my sticks moving in my routine untill I reestabligh visual control then release everything and fly out. It doesn't matter if I am hovering, torque rolling, doing knife edge stuff, when I am in trouble I always switch on my routine which slows down the airplane and keeps it from hitting the ground until I can regain control. In my travels I see many people do 1/2 or 3/4 rolling circles but loose it in the final leg - this was always my problem too until I learned this routine now when I get to that last part I swich off my brain or close my eyes and let my thumbs fly through it nicely - remember trust is a must. your thumbs will save you everytime, it is your brain that gets in the way. just my 2 cents, hope this helps, good flyin ray

Ray,

That was so simply explained. I can do rolling circles or very jerky rolling harriers all day long with either the rudder or the elevator but have yet to put both together for a smooth rolling harrier. I don't loose it on the final quarter of the circle, but have seen it done many times. My stinking timing is off for these rolling maneuvers. I have to break a bad habbit that would have been as hard as quitting smoking. I have a hard time with the sticks both having to touch the stops at the same time. Great for snap rolls and blenders. Horibly ugly in the first two rolls of a rolling circle. Now I should be able to sit in the dark and retime my inputs even with say, the G2 controler and the computer off. I think I will keep my eyes open though at the field for now. Trust in such a routine will come with time.

Ithank you for what I think is a great tip. Do you also visulize your plane as you work this into your brain or is it simply a muscle memory technique?

Errol

I do visualize the airplane today, but first things first - forget about the plane untill you have mastered this mechanical stick routine. keep those sticks moving smoothly get use to coordinated full stick movement it will be neccessary during slow 3d flight. there are many other 3d tips and techniques but you must master this first step which will make everything else possible. You have got to see the movie "The legend of bagger vance" you must trust your hands, don't think about it, be smooth, keep those sticks moving.

[8D]Hi Spadstick, Errol and Ray (are you a good eater of "pizza"?)

FINALLY WE HAVE FOUND SOME PEOPLE WHO CAN HELP US BEGINNERS
TO LEARN 3D WITH SOME METHODS.

[&:]Ray, there is a problem for me: in Italy, like in Europe, we use the radio in mode 1: right hand. ailerons and engines - left hand,
elevator and rudder.

My American is not very good: could you explain your method in a more simple way? And is it good also for radio in mode 1?
A Rolling Circle is a tonneau? Excuse me, but I have not understood your method well.

[sm=thumbup.gif]IF ERROL THINKS YOUR METHOD IS GREAT, I BELIEVE TOO.

Vittorio from Italy[sm=sunsmiley.gif]a beautiful country.

Italian Flyer,
The method described by Pizza, Ray, should work with Mode 1 or Mode 2. I started for 15 minutes last night and found it was getting easier to run this routine. For a Mode 1 radio, just use the inputs for whichever stick they are on. The key seems to be having the elevator centered when the rudder is at full deflection and then the rudder centered when the elevator is at full deflection. All the while you are holding a constant Left aileron at 1/2 and throttle at 1/2 or maybe less. Obviously you want right rudder with the left wing down and down elevator when the plane is inverted.

Maybe Ray can explain it better.

now this IS true!!!!
i've made it a habbit at our displays to get drunk then go flying without lights at about 10-11pm two years ago i was still a hanging newbie but out i went with my Cougar after about 4-5 units.
i was prophanging closer than i ever have up until that point and in perfect control, a couple of times it went wrong ( its dark ) but the thumbs just did what was needed no questions asked. it was only the next morning that i thought, how the heck did i do that??????

i'm practicing rolling circuits now, currently with the Cougar, getting better, was hanging the other day, the wind took the plane around and i was wheels in, but i was ok! i out this down to getting used to the plane at other angles. Can't wait until the Capiche is going again and i have a propper 3D machine.

And i get yelled at for not having AMA!

Really, i hope you are joking, thats just not cool.

Oh no Ifix, you used the "A" word again...you trying to open up another can o' worms?

You really did it this time Philly!

If you have seen Mr. queki somenzini?spelling fly you will know that 3d and mode 1 are no problem, however, I was at the TOC the year christopher pasant laru?spelling from France won it - I walked over to visit with him and noticed his radio was mode 2, how could this be? everyone in Europe is mode 1 and believes it is better. He explained to me that he switched to mode 2 a few years back to improve his 3d flying. If you think about it you want the elevator and rudder on separate sticks, if you mix in a little aileron and throttle it is no problem.

The name is "Quique" Somenzini.
Argentinian guy

Italian Flyer,
I have never flown a mode 1 radio and I am sure at this point I would crash hard and repetedly if I attempted to do so. I mistakenly thought that Mode 1 simply changed the sticks left to right and did not read your post closely enough to see that the rudder and elevator are on the left and ailerons and throttle are on the right.

Had I started out with a Mode 1 radio, I think it would be easier for me to implement the pattern that was described for the rolling harriers. It would be a simple clockwise diamond pattern with the left stick while the right stick would be at or below half throttle and around half way to left ailerons and not have to move at all. That doesn't explain why a TOC champion would have switched at any time in his career though.

Yes I am a good pizza eater, I posted a pic on "post some pics of those 3d models" now on page 2. I am the fat pizza eater.

i can fly gliders ok on mode 1, but only because the aileron stick doesn't move

No i'm not joking, its tradition now, last year we did it drunk, one plane had only two glow sticks, the other had us lot pointing a torch at it, but not when it was funny to take the beam off
and you can stick your AMA where the sun don't shine, i'm in the land of the free
not only does the UK not suffer from the AMA sickness but our club isn't BMFA either
FYI i was really pleased with how well i was hanging in the dark with the Cougar, drink or no drink, the year before it was even darker ( cloud cover, no moon ) and i was using a Panther ( prerunner to all these Limbos and such ) i could make out an outline above the horizon but when i landed i only knew when i touched from the wheel noise, made even worse by the hills a few miles away making the horizon even higher
our current drunk fliers are these thrust steer planes which we buzz around the tents and caravans we set up, those things are hard enough to fly sober when it's light, try drunk and dark!!
oh what fun we have

anyway, back to the miracle way to instant 3D