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Interesting.

Old 07-30-2020, 07:48 AM
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rcmiket
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Default Interesting.

Don't post much here anymore but here's a interesting Email from the AMA this AM.

Mike

https://contentsharing.net/actions/e...T3yOWTEElYrzXa
Old 07-30-2020, 08:14 AM
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I find it interesting that the teen package includes an "E-magazine" rather than the hard copy. Seems to me that the powers that be should have been doing that with ALL memberships UNLESS a hard copy was specifically requested
Old 07-30-2020, 09:05 AM
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Originally Posted by Hydro Junkie View Post
I find it interesting that the teen package includes an "E-magazine" rather than the hard copy. Seems to me that the powers that be should have been doing that with ALL memberships UNLESS a hard copy was specifically requested
I find it interesting that youth members who want to fly will now have to pay $15 per year , weren't youth memberships free up till this point ? The only free option for youth has no flying (insurance) allowance so that amounts to a mailing list at best ? I see it as a sign of the AMA's looming financial disaster if we now have to charge kids who used to fly for free ?

Anyway , that's my take , take it or leave it ....
Old 07-30-2020, 09:14 AM
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And if I'm wrong on the youth memberships having traditionally been free , I'm sure someone will post that up shortly . I just seem to remember good ol Porcia83 (or whatever his name was) using someones mention of youth memberships being free as a weapon against them by taking it out of context . The context was of course that if out of 175 K members only 125K were paying memberships , were were financially only an organization of 125 K members , with the 50 K free (youth) memberships not counting to the annual dues financial total .

So , , , IS this the AMA's first instance of charging youth to fly ?
Old 07-30-2020, 09:57 AM
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There's a reason the youth membership is no longer free and it has nothing to do with a financial implosion, it's all about insurance
Old 07-30-2020, 10:44 AM
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So , Andy, how is it youth memberships are only $15, including insurance and an E-magazine when an adult membership is so much higher? It kind of goes to show how much a membership actually costs the AMA as compared to what the adult membership are being charged

Last edited by Hydro Junkie; 07-30-2020 at 10:54 AM.
Old 07-30-2020, 01:00 PM
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Originally Posted by BarracudaHockey View Post
There's a reason the youth membership is no longer free and it has nothing to do with a financial implosion, it's all about insurance

Than why am I paying 75 bucks? Of course it's about finances and your right about a " financial implosion". The last posted EC meeting minutes painted a pretty bleak picture of our finances. IMO the proposed changes are little late. Franklin was on to something after all.

Mike

Last edited by rcmiket; 07-30-2020 at 01:02 PM.
Old 07-30-2020, 01:07 PM
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Originally Posted by Hydro Junkie View Post
I find it interesting that the teen package includes an "E-magazine" rather than the hard copy. Seems to me that the powers that be should have been doing that with ALL memberships UNLESS a hard copy was specifically requested

This is one item that I agree with Franklin on, the magazine should move to paperless period. Printing costs are on a sliding scale, the more copies that are printed the less each copy costs. With only 180,00 or so copies I would tend to think that a 50% reduction in printed copies is not going to save much money.

I think it would be a good idea for the AMA not only have an online magazine that is available to everyone but I would like to see them develop an online forum much like RCU and RCG with some forums unique to AMA. Contest announcement/results forums would be nice, club forums, product reviews, club review, FAA news, just to name a few things. The forum could be a great tool to generate ad revenue that the magazine lacks.
Old 07-30-2020, 01:15 PM
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speedracerntrixie
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Originally Posted by Hydro Junkie View Post
So , Andy, how is it youth memberships are only $15, including insurance and an E-magazine when an adult membership is so much higher? It kind of goes to show how much a membership actually costs the AMA as compared to what the adult membership are being charged

We know that the magazine is costing more than it generates. That is part of the cost difference. Figure $4 as an average cost of a magazine these days. That's $48 annually. I would also consider the risk assessment between a minor and a 40-60 year old adult. A minor is most likely not going to be flying a 40% Extra or 50lb F-16. More like an Apprentice, Kadet etc. The property loss/injury potential on average should be less with a minor.
Old 07-30-2020, 01:45 PM
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As I mentioned in another post I choose wisely where my membership/donation dollars go. AMA only gets some because of the local club requirement and the fellowship it provides, nothing more. Now some here on RCU feel that is being apathetic and selfish, and, they are correct. Being in my sunset years I have grown weary of the battles, having my good nature crapped on yet expected to be my usual happy self.

That being said, I wish for AMA to be the success it once was but I really don’t give a crap if it sinks. Recently the leadership has managed to pi$$ off the FAA which is now in the process of destroying a successfully long and fulfilling hobby. AMA could have represented us as the deep pool from which past, present and future aviators emerged, a pool of dedicated hobbyists leading young people into the world of aviation and beyond. But, like all political animals today, they choose to corral power unto themselves at everyone else’s expense and ignore the potential fallout.

There are many here that research and post for those who care to learn about good and devious deeds within the AMA. I applaud their efforts at the task and encourage them to continue until you tire. Over the years I have watched the same online duels within other organizations that abandoned their core principles, then saw membership dwindle until all was gone. Sometimes my involved efforts made a difference, most times it was in vain.

It is sad to see the hobby we care about losing it’s ability to share what we once enjoyed. The current direction FAA is moving to control UAS activity will end it. AMA’s inept efforts to play with the big boys helped things along.
Old 07-30-2020, 04:14 PM
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For a discretionary activity, everything that makes it harder to participate decreases likelihood of participation. Now the geniuses running AMA think that it's a good idea to INCREASE the obstacles for a kid, in the form of charging for something that heretofore was free. Did none of these guys ever take a 100 level economics course?

And some say it's about insurance? BS! In 2018, per their own IRS filings, AMA spent $1.2 million on ALL insurance. That's flying, for staff, for slips trips and falls, buildings, etc. I seriously doubt that 50,000 free members cost AMA $750K to insure.



Old 07-30-2020, 04:19 PM
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i seem to remember someone around here coming up with a 15 dollar a year per member insurance cost in our yearly dues.
so, not too surprised at the 15.00 dollar youth membership decision..
Old 07-30-2020, 04:25 PM
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Originally Posted by Hydro Junkie View Post
So , Andy, how is it youth memberships are only $15, including insurance and an E-magazine when an adult membership is so much higher? It kind of goes to show how much a membership actually costs the AMA as compared to what the adult membership are being charged
About 1/4 of your dues goes to staff and 1/4 to magazines. Mind you, staff headcount has remained almost the same since 2002, yet the total number of paying members has plummeted. Same size staff taking care of fewer members? And magazines are major money sumps. On a GOOD year they lose half a million dollars. This is why both of these would be my first targets for cuts.

I'd cut staff expense by half, and every dollar from magazines. That alone would reduce dues to about $45 a year. Force remaining staff to produce content for e-magazine and take care of members.
Old 07-30-2020, 04:28 PM
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Originally Posted by mongo View Post
i seem to remember someone around here coming up with a 15 dollar a year per member insurance cost in our yearly dues.
so, not too surprised at the 15.00 dollar youth membership decision..
If we take 2018 number above, $1,211,474 divided by 180,000 members is less than $7 each. And that $1.2 million includes other types of non-flying related insurance. So the number is likely even lower.
Old 07-31-2020, 03:22 AM
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Originally Posted by BarracudaHockey View Post
There's a reason the youth membership is no longer free and it has nothing to do with a financial implosion, it's all about insurance
Andy , I find it VERY difficult to believe the insurance company is demanding that our youth members pay AMA dues , I would like to see your proof of this , otherwise I AM going to call this yet another desperate money grab from an organization that refuses to take any personal responsibility (As in staff PAY CUTS !!!!!!) for the money crunch that is presently facing it .

Gee , if he were still around , you could ask ol porcia83* how despicable the notion of charging AMA youth members is , he used that very premise to harangue Franklin back when Franklin causally mentioned that 50K of our members don't pay dues and therefore aren't part of the financial makeup of our (rapidly sinking) organization . Between the "AMA or no way" attempted power (money) grab of the whole CBO farce back during the 336 days to now charging youth members , doesn't that give you reason to question the organization's present financial direction ?

* Of course , since porcia83's real life alter ego IS that of an AMA district one AVP , he would be pretty easy to contact , should anyone ever have the desire to actually do so .......
Old 07-31-2020, 05:37 AM
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Originally Posted by init4fun View Post
* Of course , since porcia83's real life alter ego IS that of an AMA district one AVP , he would be pretty easy to contact , should anyone ever have the desire to actually do so .......
On one hand, I kind of miss Tom. On the other hand, we do have speedy!

Astro
Old 07-31-2020, 07:02 AM
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Okay, Mr Hog, let's not get him started. We all know how fast thing go "to hell in a hand basket" when he gets on a roll
Old 07-31-2020, 09:55 AM
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Originally Posted by astrohog View Post
On one hand, I kind of miss Tom. On the other hand, we do have speedy!

Astro
Astro , It's funny , Tom and I shared a lot of the same beliefs , things like wanting the best for the hobby and for the AMA to do well , it's just that we differed in the ideas we had for making those things happen and so he couldn't let go of throwing the "AMA Hater" label around (as is still sometimes today hurled at those of us who dare to peek behind the curtain) , and he ended up literally forcing RC Ken to ban him . I'd really like to know how recognizing the financial sinking ship of an organization that some of us have belonged to for better than 50 years could ever be twisted into equaling "Hate" , VS the financial "call to arms" that such revelations should engender in anyone who actually cares for our organization's survival ?

Old 07-31-2020, 10:08 AM
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Originally Posted by init4fun View Post
Astro , It's funny , Tom and I shared a lot of the same beliefs , things like wanting the best for the hobby and for the AMA to do well , it's just that we differed in the ideas we had for making those things happen and so he couldn't let go of throwing the "AMA Hater" label around (as is still sometimes today hurled at those of us who dare to peek behind the curtain) , and he ended up literally forcing RC Ken to ban him . I'd really like to know how recognizing the financial sinking ship of an organization that some of us have belonged to for better than 50 years could ever be twisted into equaling "Hate" , VS the financial "call to arms" that such revelations should engender in anyone who actually cares for our organization's survival ?
Him and his pal bacon were more trouble than they were worth.

Mike
Old 07-31-2020, 10:28 AM
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Originally Posted by rcmiket View Post
Him and his pal bacon were more trouble than they were worth.

Mike
My friend , to be honest I always believed porcia83 and crispy bacon were both Tom
Old 07-31-2020, 10:33 AM
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Originally Posted by init4fun View Post
My friend , to be honest I always believed porcia83 and crispy bacon were both Tom
Not that I'm aware of and I looked into it.
Old 07-31-2020, 10:41 AM
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Originally Posted by BarracudaHockey View Post
Not that I'm aware of and I looked into it.
I appreciate that Andy , I want to admit to feeling somewhat sad to see Tom end up banned , under all the bluster I thought he was likely far friendlier in person than he came across as on line . It can be difficult at best to judge a person's character through their posts , especially in his case since he backed himself into a corner by way of an "Us VS Them" mentality . I truly have to believe that anyone who posts as much as we all do here must care about the AMA very much , for example I couldn't care less about stamp collecting , hence my lack of posts regarding it
Old 07-31-2020, 10:54 AM
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Okay, now we may have the answer to the Crispy/Porcia question. What we can probably safely assume is that he was so dedicated/loyal to the AMA that he couldn't get past that to see what the rest of us were seeing

Last edited by Hydro Junkie; 07-31-2020 at 10:57 AM.
Old 07-31-2020, 01:25 PM
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Originally Posted by Hydro Junkie View Post
Okay, now we may have the answer to the Crispy/Porcia question. What we can probably safely assume is that he was so dedicated/loyal to the AMA that he couldn't get past that to see what the rest of us were seeing
And that Crispy was as dedicated to Porcia that he couldn't see the forest for the trees, either.......

Kinda like a couple others here....

Astro
Old 07-31-2020, 01:38 PM
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We all know that all is well and good until a certain organization declares bankruptcy. Until that happens, we are all in the wrong. That goes doubly so for me since I both am not a member and am telling everyone else that is that the sky is about to fall on them

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