Anyone seen the ad on page 97 of the Feb 2008 issue of Fly RC?

No, what did it say?

New Park Pilot program is announced (dues = $29) and link given (www.parkpilot.org) to a single page that provides no real information. Does anyone know if this new class of membership will be honored in AMA sanctioned events?

Are you talking about sactioned events for Park Pilots, or regular Open competition?

Bill, AMA 4720

Heck yeah they will and not just in events but clubs too! It's been rumored this was coming and that the Park Pilots will not only be able to fly at current AMA chartered clubs, but to have the authority dissolve all current AMA club charters officers and replace them with Park Pilots only, so they say. Not only that I think, or it's been rumored, that the $58 AMA members are going to have to flip the entire bill on the program and that the Park Pilots were actually going to get their money back as an instant $29 rebate, with interest!

Edit: For Stay Puft

Probably not. I don't think that the Full membership clubs will recognize the Park Pilots. I am reasonably certain that the Park Pilots will not be allowed to compete in open competition. Regardless of what Dion has to say, I don't believe it will happen. This is what I meant when I was talking about the AMA developing a group of, "Second Class members." I'm sorry guys, but that's how it will shake out.

Bill, AMA 4720

Excellent points there Stick. While I understand why the AMA is going through with this, and I'm excited for them, I don't think it's thought out enough, nor is it even a good idea as it's currently put into motion.

Second class members that full AMA flip the bill. Call them anything you want!

Dion,

Bray all you like. What I am afraid of is that we will be calling them, left out.

Bill, AMA 4720

I think that most clubs will allow them, since our usual requirement is AMA membership mostly for the insurance. It is very specific to aircraft under 2 lbs, and under 60 mph. Contests for this type of aircraft will happen. You know sooner or later most of them will want to fly some heavy iron, but first things first.

I doubt the AMA will allow them as part of a current "regular" club as stated in the initial proposal. So far Joyce's initial email and proposal has been spot on.

But luckily the AMA cannot control the decisions of the site owner. All that needs to happen is for the Park Pilot group to form their own flying club and then they can co-exist with a current flying site if the site owner decides this is in his/her best interest.

Problem solved.

UM...from what I can gather, this is a program that offers insurance for people who fly small electric planes at AMA sites only.

Frankly, anyone who wants to fly such a plane ANYWHERE else would not need to join. These planes can be flown almost anywhere, and since there is no need for AMA club sites, there is no need for this program.

Please inform me if I am mistaken.

The program provides insurance to anyone that is a member of the Park Pilot program whether they are flying at an AMA club site, or not. This is no different then the current AMA program. And just like the current AMA program, the Park Pilot program was designed to create organization and to bring pilots, in this case Parkflyers, together at flying sites and as a National voice of the aeromodeling hobby.

My main concern is making certain that Park Flyers remain within the parameters that are stipulated in the membership outline.
Most park flyer airframes can be hopped up to the point of exceeding design parameters which effectively removes them from the park flyer category. How can this be controlled?

If someone turns up at a site with a park flyer membership and a hopped up park flyer airplane who decides if the pilot or plane is appropriate?

A very large can of worms has been opened.

BM

Nope you understand it. So the first thing the AMA will need to do is explain to the park flyer the 1/2 million of damage they can cause with that 32 ounce piece of foam. And of course sell them the insurance they did not know they needed. Look at the new ad, we are already selling the insurance.

More AMA (marketing) money down the drain, at least this will speed up the inevitable layoffs and or dues increases to keep the full site insurance alive.

The 2lb part is easy.
How are we gonna know if that 600w Brushless Outrunner will stay below 60mph?

Tach it & use a 60mph Pitch Speed?
I dont think that will work so good in practice.

How else will clubs/PF-clubs know if a guy is over 60mph or not.

They will know when you understand the AMA does not make a single rule, they set guidelines for insurance purposes. The only time you have to worry about whether or not you went 60 mph is after you caused and accident. So it's not up to club to make the determination, it's up to the pilot to figure it out. Next time you are driving down the road, go 60 MPH and stick your head out the winow, that's 60 mph.Don't make things harder to figure out for people than it already is.

Mr. Matt why did you quote agexpert with 100% false information? For the fun of it? I have first hand information from DM that both statements xagepert made are mistaken. Before you try to cause more damage why don't you confirm your data with your local DVP so that legitimate people that WANT to join this program are not given BS information from disgruntled AMA members.

It would be nice if the AMA would get information out to the clubs regarding this program before they launch it in January '08. As a club president, I'm going to have to make a recommendation to my membership regarding how we will handle these new members. It would be nice to know exactly what the AMA is telling them, and what the AMA's expectation for charted club acceptance of this class of membership is.

Brad

Brad I believe that the AMA created the program with the intention of not changing a single thing in regards of current AMA clubs, that was one of the major points and concerns of implementing the program. I don't think you'll have anything to discuss because the Park Pilots will have to form their own club and find their own homes. If they want to co-locate with current AMA clubs at current AMA flying sites, it's up to the landowner to decide, based on the agreement of the current club with the current landowner. In most cases these clubs will want to find their own homes for obvious reasons.

If your belief is true, then the AMA is really creating a division within the ranks.

Many clubs around the country are -- and more will follow suit -- the landowners. When the Landowners/Clubs say "Nay, not here," the PFs will cry and cry more to AMA who will chastise the landowner-clubs for not furthing the "AMA Mission" which will create even more split-ups.
It is true that while AMA has to start somewhere, I think -- without knowing all I need to know to make a judgment -- that this program lacks adequate sophistication.
IMO I agree with bkdavey as I think again AMA is acting with their usual knee-jerk reaction. However in my 55+ years as an AMA member, I expect nothing else.
As a learning item I suggest everyone read DVP Bliss Teague's article in the Dec. 2007 issue of MA, pg. 180. How will this club react to any push to accept a bunch of PFers, especially if the PFers form themselves into a separate club?

Brad,
I can tell you how we plan to address it. The club's contract says that all members must have an AMA membership. So if they have an AMA membership, regardless of what they pay, they can join our club. They will pay the same amount of club dues as the "full ride" members.
Tommy

Well Hoss doesn't the fact that a club, which has exclusive rights to an AMA field, which decides to deny another club, in this case an AMA Park Pilot club, to co-locate at the site actually say something in itself about the reason why the AMA had to go ahead and form the Park Pilot program in the first place? Why wouldn't a club want to combine forces with another AMA club, if they so choose? Wouldn't that increase overall revenues for the flying site? AMA membership dues are seperate.

But if the club decided not too, great, they've just shown their true colors and the likelyhood of the Park Pilots finding a new home is not going to be half or even a quarter as difficult as it was for the the $58 members. Park Pilots don't have to worry about noise issues and much smaller flying sites. Heck they also don't have to even worry as much about shooting down their own planes as they may accidently shoot down others.

I'd figure you wouldn't go for this program, not surprised at all. In fact in the time I've been on this board I don't recall anything that the AMA has done right in your eyes.

I have to say this program is most likely not perfect, nothing ever is. Whenever you break new ground and go where no one has before, you have to be adaptable. I am considered by some a chief critic of AMA, ( i disagree with that premise). This is exactly what a lot of people have been asking for for a while and i want to give my kudos to the powers that be for breaking the mold and being willing to be brave enough to give this a try. Lets wait and see what the direction this program heads and let the folks at AMA make the necessary correction.

Doc, i am glad to see your club as the first to announce on here its willingness to open their arms to this group. Congradulations for being the first.