Phoenix Extra 330S 60-90 Size
03-16-2007 | 05:57 PM
#131
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From: Gastonia,
NC
RE: Phoenix Extra 330S 60-90 Size
I have begun assembly of my 330S. The kit looks awesome. I have changed the pilot out, I think Stewie is a much better choice! 
My question is this. In the instructions it says to fit the carbon fiber pushrods for the ailerons then glue the brass end caps with CA. Is this sufficient or would you use something else?
John
My question is this. In the instructions it says to fit the carbon fiber pushrods for the ailerons then glue the brass end caps with CA. Is this sufficient or would you use something else?
John
03-16-2007 | 07:52 PM
#132
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From: Millington,
MI
RE: Phoenix Extra 330S 60-90 Size
My question is this. In the instructions it says to fit the carbon fiber pushrods for the ailerons then glue the brass end caps with CA. Is this sufficient or would you use something else?
03-19-2007 | 06:48 PM
#133
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From: Gastonia,
NC
RE: Phoenix Extra 330S 60-90 Size
Having an issue I'd like some advise on.
I have the elevator hooked up using two Futaba S3004 standard servos. The rods are adjusted so each elevator half is in alignment when the stick is centered. The problem arises when I deflect the elevator. The right half moves more than the left half. The control horn on each are exactly 15 mm from the base of the horn. The only thing I can think of to fix this is to move the left horn closer to the elevator to get more throw, or move the right further away to get less throw, or some mix of the two. Is this a workable solution? Has anyone else had this issue?
I have the elevator hooked up using two Futaba S3004 standard servos. The rods are adjusted so each elevator half is in alignment when the stick is centered. The problem arises when I deflect the elevator. The right half moves more than the left half. The control horn on each are exactly 15 mm from the base of the horn. The only thing I can think of to fix this is to move the left horn closer to the elevator to get more throw, or move the right further away to get less throw, or some mix of the two. Is this a workable solution? Has anyone else had this issue?
03-19-2007 | 06:55 PM
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From: Jackson,
TN
RE: Phoenix Extra 330S 60-90 Size
I usually adjust the endpoints on each elevator servo in the transmitter so that they are even at center and max throw both up and down. This is assuming that you have a computer Tx and are plugging each servo into a separate channel, not using a Y harness.
I just got my Extra 330 this past weekend and haven't started on it yet BUT,,, man-o-man, this thing is light!! Unless it has some weird flying traits, I'm gonna love it!
I just got my Extra 330 this past weekend and haven't started on it yet BUT,,, man-o-man, this thing is light!! Unless it has some weird flying traits, I'm gonna love it!
03-19-2007 | 07:13 PM
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From: Gastonia,
NC
RE: Phoenix Extra 330S 60-90 Size
I do have a "Y" harness connecting the servos together. Certainly wouldn't hurt to split them up. Just pick up a couple extensions.
However, leaving things as they are, I guess I'll adjust the control horn position until I get them to throw equally. If that proves to be a pain, then it's off to the hobby shop.
What two channels do you plug them into? I have a Sig Somethin' Extra with ailerons in 1 and 6. I suppose I could use channel 6 with elevator. Thanks for the input.
However, leaving things as they are, I guess I'll adjust the control horn position until I get them to throw equally. If that proves to be a pain, then it's off to the hobby shop.
What two channels do you plug them into? I have a Sig Somethin' Extra with ailerons in 1 and 6. I suppose I could use channel 6 with elevator. Thanks for the input.
03-19-2007 | 07:18 PM
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From: Jackson,
TN
RE: Phoenix Extra 330S 60-90 Size
I usually do the ailerons on 1 and 6 as well. I do the elevators on 2 and 7. I have also done a mix on 2 and 5 before for a 6 channel Rx. That is what makes my Futaba 9C a joy. It's "user friendly"
03-19-2007 | 07:30 PM
#137
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From: Gastonia,
NC
RE: Phoenix Extra 330S 60-90 Size
I may have to investigate that. I have a 7C, so shouldn't be an issue. My solution worked to get the elevators in sync while "up", but now the down elevator has a differential in it's travel. The horns are in the same position on each side. I went way overboard and fashioned a "jig" to ensure the horns were in the same place on each side.
I guess I'll break out the manual and study up on putting the elevator servos on separate channels. Thanks for the input.
I guess I'll break out the manual and study up on putting the elevator servos on separate channels. Thanks for the input.
03-19-2007 | 07:35 PM
#138
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From: Jackson,
TN
RE: Phoenix Extra 330S 60-90 Size
Happy to help. There is a really good FAQ on Futaba's site for the 9C that simplifies a lot of things that are in the manual. http://www.futaba-rc.com/faq/faq-7c.html is the link for the FAQ on the 7C. I haven't read it though...
Enjoy!
Enjoy!
03-19-2007 | 07:38 PM
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From: Salem ,
OR
RE: Phoenix Extra 330S 60-90 Size
If you run dual elevators on a 7c, then you can only trim one servo with the trim button. The 7C doesn't support dual elevator servos. You can mix them together, but like I said, only the master channel will trim, and the slave will always be centered. Just an fyi.
03-19-2007 | 07:41 PM
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From: Salem ,
OR
RE: Phoenix Extra 330S 60-90 Size
the cause of the two eleavator servo's not having equal throws is because the low line servos are not very accurate. You will tend to have quite a bit of difference in performance or movement between two like servo's. You're better off buying $30 digital servos and having a far superior working elevator.
PEOPLE, DO NOT FLY THIS PLANE FAST!!!!!!!! Look at the size of the ailerons and the counterbalanced elevators. This thing is a aerobatic gem, not a pattern ship. You will flutter the ailerons and strip servo's, just as the previous pics prove.
PEOPLE, DO NOT FLY THIS PLANE FAST!!!!!!!! Look at the size of the ailerons and the counterbalanced elevators. This thing is a aerobatic gem, not a pattern ship. You will flutter the ailerons and strip servo's, just as the previous pics prove.
03-19-2007 | 08:03 PM
#141
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From: Gastonia,
NC
RE: Phoenix Extra 330S 60-90 Size
Oh my.. not the best info. Can I mix digital and analog servos in the plane? I have a couple S3010 high torque servos (not digital), but might not be much better for being closer to sync'd movement.
03-19-2007 | 08:46 PM
#142
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From: Salem ,
OR
RE: Phoenix Extra 330S 60-90 Size
Yes, you can mix digitals and analog servo's no problem. I run digitals on my planes except the throttles. Ever notice how some servo's list them as coreless, and 5 pot servo's? This is in relation to the accuracy of the servo. I believe the 3004 Futaba's are 3 pot servo's, but not positive.
03-19-2007 | 09:06 PM
#143
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From: Sacramento,
CA
RE: Phoenix Extra 330S 60-90 Size
You won't be able to get this properly adjusted with a Y harness.
You can't adjust control horn position and have the throws equal at all points. What you need to do is put each servo on a separate channel, adjust the center point so that both arms are at whatever deflection you want, and then adjust the end points. As long as your mechanical connections are even, you will have the same throw on either elevator.
You can't adjust control horn position and have the throws equal at all points. What you need to do is put each servo on a separate channel, adjust the center point so that both arms are at whatever deflection you want, and then adjust the end points. As long as your mechanical connections are even, you will have the same throw on either elevator.
ORIGINAL: jbloom
I do have a "Y" harness connecting the servos together. Certainly wouldn't hurt to split them up. Just pick up a couple extensions.
However, leaving things as they are, I guess I'll adjust the control horn position until I get them to throw equally. If that proves to be a pain, then it's off to the hobby shop.
What two channels do you plug them into? I have a Sig Somethin' Extra with ailerons in 1 and 6. I suppose I could use channel 6 with elevator. Thanks for the input.
I do have a "Y" harness connecting the servos together. Certainly wouldn't hurt to split them up. Just pick up a couple extensions.
However, leaving things as they are, I guess I'll adjust the control horn position until I get them to throw equally. If that proves to be a pain, then it's off to the hobby shop.
What two channels do you plug them into? I have a Sig Somethin' Extra with ailerons in 1 and 6. I suppose I could use channel 6 with elevator. Thanks for the input.
03-20-2007 | 05:23 AM
#144
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From: Gastonia,
NC
RE: Phoenix Extra 330S 60-90 Size
What about this as a solution. Since my radio doesn't support dual elevator servos, this Futaba servo sychronizer seems the perfect answer.
http://www2.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin...?&I=LXCTS1&P=0
http://www2.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin...?&I=LXCTS1&P=0
03-20-2007 | 06:28 AM
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From: seattle,
WA
RE: Phoenix Extra 330S 60-90 Size
This question was asked in post 111 and no one seemed to pick up on my comments. There's a fundamental problem with the servo/elevator set-up on this plane: the servo axis to elevator axis distance is different between the servos (vertically). Unless you can actually control each servo's travel (its complete range- not just centering and endpoint), the elevator halves are not going to be in-sync. The output curve (actual movement of the elevator halve) will not match on both sides. The simple and proper solution is to raise (or lower) one of the servos so its axis is in line with the other.
03-20-2007 | 08:02 AM
#146
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From: Gastonia,
NC
RE: Phoenix Extra 330S 60-90 Size
Are you speaking of the axis down the center of the servo post? I'm certainly no engineer, but it seems the point you'd want to be certain of are the points on the servo wheel where the push rod connects. These points should be at the same height in relation to each other. While not measuring them, they are very close on this model. I have also measured down from the elevator control horn and each nylon connector is now the same distance again, after my earlier experiments.
I also changed the servos to S3010's. They're still standard servos, just high torque. This improved the synchronization, but it's still off. Moving to S3151 digitals could improve still more. But it seems at this point that the absolute answer is the MSA-10 servo synchronizer. It will allow for center, and full travel adjustments for the individual servo, since this capability is missing in the 7CAP radio. The cost is roughly the same for two S3151's as for the MSA-10. I'll just need to pick up a couple 12" extensions, but that's true in either case. Does anyone have experience with this synchronizer?
I also changed the servos to S3010's. They're still standard servos, just high torque. This improved the synchronization, but it's still off. Moving to S3151 digitals could improve still more. But it seems at this point that the absolute answer is the MSA-10 servo synchronizer. It will allow for center, and full travel adjustments for the individual servo, since this capability is missing in the 7CAP radio. The cost is roughly the same for two S3151's as for the MSA-10. I'll just need to pick up a couple 12" extensions, but that's true in either case. Does anyone have experience with this synchronizer?
03-20-2007 | 10:15 AM
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From: Salem ,
OR
RE: Phoenix Extra 330S 60-90 Size
Unfortunately the easiest answer isn't the cheapest. You can buy programmable digital servo's, buy a programmer and "time" them together, or alot of the new radios let you adjust servo speed, like the JR 9303 etc... so you can individually adjust the speed of each servo to help fix a concern like yours. I have also seen guys make a joiner wire, that joins the elevator halves together, then run a single hi torque servo to run a single pushrod that drives the joiner wire.
ORIGINAL: jbloom
Are you speaking of the axis down the center of the servo post? I'm certainly no engineer, but it seems the point you'd want to be certain of are the points on the servo wheel where the push rod connects. These points should be at the same height in relation to each other. While not measuring them, they are very close on this model. I have also measured down from the elevator control horn and each nylon connector is now the same distance again, after my earlier experiments.
I also changed the servos to S3010's. They're still standard servos, just high torque. This improved the synchronization, but it's still off. Moving to S3151 digitals could improve still more. But it seems at this point that the absolute answer is the MSA-10 servo synchronizer. It will allow for center, and full travel adjustments for the individual servo, since this capability is missing in the 7CAP radio. The cost is roughly the same for two S3151's as for the MSA-10. I'll just need to pick up a couple 12" extensions, but that's true in either case. Does anyone have experience with this synchronizer?
Are you speaking of the axis down the center of the servo post? I'm certainly no engineer, but it seems the point you'd want to be certain of are the points on the servo wheel where the push rod connects. These points should be at the same height in relation to each other. While not measuring them, they are very close on this model. I have also measured down from the elevator control horn and each nylon connector is now the same distance again, after my earlier experiments.
I also changed the servos to S3010's. They're still standard servos, just high torque. This improved the synchronization, but it's still off. Moving to S3151 digitals could improve still more. But it seems at this point that the absolute answer is the MSA-10 servo synchronizer. It will allow for center, and full travel adjustments for the individual servo, since this capability is missing in the 7CAP radio. The cost is roughly the same for two S3151's as for the MSA-10. I'll just need to pick up a couple 12" extensions, but that's true in either case. Does anyone have experience with this synchronizer?
03-20-2007 | 10:16 AM
#148
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From: Salem ,
OR
RE: Phoenix Extra 330S 60-90 Size
You take a big gamble with reversing Y harnesses. If you do a search, they have been the source of many many headaches. JR matchboxes work fantastic, and are adjustable and fairly inexpensive.
03-20-2007 | 06:00 PM
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From: Jackson,
TN
RE: Phoenix Extra 330S 60-90 Size
I have not used the Futaba MSA-10 or the JR Matchbox (both are fully capable "synch boxes") I have, however seen them used and have never seen anyone have a problem with them. Those reversing Y harnesses are a whole 'nother bag of burning dog doo.... I don't like 'em or trust 'em, and I only know one person who likes them and his elevator servos still don't match at full throw. I, personally, would advise against the Y harness option.
I agree with mtwister. Programmer, transmitter or synchro box. The last would be your cheapest out. I think the 3010's will be fine and you're on the right track.
I agree with mtwister. Programmer, transmitter or synchro box. The last would be your cheapest out. I think the 3010's will be fine and you're on the right track.
