Hi all. Need some pointers.
12-13-2007, 12:14 AM
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Hi all. Need some pointers.
OK , I wasnt sure where to post this so I put it here cause there is a lot of traffic here.
A little about me and whatnot.
I have been playing with GWS and similar types of park flyers for a few yers, and just got into a club and AMA. I got my first nitro a year ago and the instructor at the old feild crashed it, he said it wat a hit, but that was bs. He tried to do 3d on a maiden right off the deck. anyway I quit the hobby for a few yrs then I got back into it. So about 3 months ago I built a BUHOR spad and have flown it now for a while and have been flying a Scat Cat 500 with a 46LA( fast as a ball of fire, which is FAST!) , After the cat, I got back in the spad and increased the control surfaces abot 200%.
The LHS owner was at the field the other day and made me fly (yeah , he had to really twist my arm on this one) his H9 pulse 40 xt.
O M G batman !!! I loved it, within minutes I had her 3 ft of the deck in knife edge. The pulse will make intermediate pillots as myself look like a competitor. Now as far as my flying skill.... I can fly any plane well, including good landings( except the spad, I intentionally do weird thing to it lol ) and ground skills. My real place that I am working on is my aerobatics.
Any way I guss I need to make a point here soon. I went ahead and ordered a Pulse PNP for my Christmas gift
I will be using my Futaba 6ch computer tx and Fut rx.
this leaves me with now a bunch of servos, a .25os max and a os 46la. and 2 rx batt pacs.... so i figure its time to add a few new planes!!
So my questions are...
1 I really want a Cap 232 or Edge 540...funtana.... that style 3d plane.
So I would like to use my 25 for this, Its and loder engine but runs GREAT!!
what I had in mind was the possibility of buying a nice affordable arf in 15-25 size, and hope I can have hover power.
OR try and convert a mini funtana, but I dont know if its possible.
OR the perfered way... If someone could point me to a KIT od a cap/edge/funtana style plane....even a f3a would do... any suggestions?
I could use a 46 la in a smaller plane for extra power but i dont think tis suited for hovering.
2The other engin I need to get in the air is the 46 la, and I was thinking a pattern or fun fly areobatic type.
Again I think I would like to build a Kit. Sommething very affordable too. Money is tight with my schooling tuition.(going for a degree in machining)
3 I said before that as far as just flying I can handle any aircraft pretty much. BUT I am limited in my aerobatic manuvering.
Is there like a holy grail list or somthing that has a definition, name and instructions for all the various or most of the manuvers.
I need like a handbook of stuff to try. I dont know if this exists but if it does some one here will know for sure.
I have been told to have someone box with me to teach me.... this may work for some, but as for me It feels degrading... I am self taught and very skillfull in my flying and good at the few mainstream manuvers I do know. and I have had instant success and nearly no crashes, even learning on my own with a PZ cub, then a GWS zero, mustang formosa...... blah blah...
thanks for taking the time to help . sorry for som long of a post. MIKE b
" Gear down..... Flaps down....... DIRT NAP THAT PEICE OF #$%^&*"
Quote from "dead stick ken"
A little about me and whatnot.
I have been playing with GWS and similar types of park flyers for a few yers, and just got into a club and AMA. I got my first nitro a year ago and the instructor at the old feild crashed it, he said it wat a hit, but that was bs. He tried to do 3d on a maiden right off the deck. anyway I quit the hobby for a few yrs then I got back into it. So about 3 months ago I built a BUHOR spad and have flown it now for a while and have been flying a Scat Cat 500 with a 46LA( fast as a ball of fire, which is FAST!) , After the cat, I got back in the spad and increased the control surfaces abot 200%.
The LHS owner was at the field the other day and made me fly (yeah , he had to really twist my arm on this one) his H9 pulse 40 xt.
O M G batman !!! I loved it, within minutes I had her 3 ft of the deck in knife edge. The pulse will make intermediate pillots as myself look like a competitor. Now as far as my flying skill.... I can fly any plane well, including good landings( except the spad, I intentionally do weird thing to it lol ) and ground skills. My real place that I am working on is my aerobatics.
Any way I guss I need to make a point here soon. I went ahead and ordered a Pulse PNP for my Christmas gift
I will be using my Futaba 6ch computer tx and Fut rx.
this leaves me with now a bunch of servos, a .25os max and a os 46la. and 2 rx batt pacs.... so i figure its time to add a few new planes!!
So my questions are...
1 I really want a Cap 232 or Edge 540...funtana.... that style 3d plane.
So I would like to use my 25 for this, Its and loder engine but runs GREAT!!
what I had in mind was the possibility of buying a nice affordable arf in 15-25 size, and hope I can have hover power.
OR try and convert a mini funtana, but I dont know if its possible.
OR the perfered way... If someone could point me to a KIT od a cap/edge/funtana style plane....even a f3a would do... any suggestions?
I could use a 46 la in a smaller plane for extra power but i dont think tis suited for hovering.
2The other engin I need to get in the air is the 46 la, and I was thinking a pattern or fun fly areobatic type.
Again I think I would like to build a Kit. Sommething very affordable too. Money is tight with my schooling tuition.(going for a degree in machining)
3 I said before that as far as just flying I can handle any aircraft pretty much. BUT I am limited in my aerobatic manuvering.
Is there like a holy grail list or somthing that has a definition, name and instructions for all the various or most of the manuvers.
I need like a handbook of stuff to try. I dont know if this exists but if it does some one here will know for sure.
I have been told to have someone box with me to teach me.... this may work for some, but as for me It feels degrading... I am self taught and very skillfull in my flying and good at the few mainstream manuvers I do know. and I have had instant success and nearly no crashes, even learning on my own with a PZ cub, then a GWS zero, mustang formosa...... blah blah...
thanks for taking the time to help . sorry for som long of a post. MIKE b
" Gear down..... Flaps down....... DIRT NAP THAT PEICE OF #$%^&*"
Quote from "dead stick ken"
12-13-2007, 07:30 AM
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RE: Hi all. Need some pointers.
12-13-2007, 07:59 AM
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RE: Hi all. Need some pointers.
I've never flown [link=http://www3.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin/wti0001p?&I=LXSVC9&P=0]this plane[/link] (Lanier Giles 202 17.5%, but it looks like it might fit what you're looking for. Its designed for a .25-40, so you're .46 LA might work fine in it. I have a 46 LA and its actually a good engine as long as you're not looking for screaming high RPMs. With an 11X4 prop, you might actually get some 3D performance with this plane. There's one review here on RCU that indicates the directions in the kit are pretty poor, and you might have some difficulty if its you're first build, but taking your time and getting some help would probably be worth it.
Just keep in mind that Kits are generally more expensive in the long run than an ARF, but you get a better built plane. Factor into your budget at least two rolls of covering (roughly $30), tools to do the covering (heat gun and iron), glues, sand paper, hardware, wheels, etc. Since you have the engine and radio, you can probably have this flying for $150 total investment. Also make sure you have room to let it sit.
Check out the Kit Builders forum for advice as well.
Brad
Just keep in mind that Kits are generally more expensive in the long run than an ARF, but you get a better built plane. Factor into your budget at least two rolls of covering (roughly $30), tools to do the covering (heat gun and iron), glues, sand paper, hardware, wheels, etc. Since you have the engine and radio, you can probably have this flying for $150 total investment. Also make sure you have room to let it sit.
Check out the Kit Builders forum for advice as well.
Brad
12-13-2007, 11:11 PM
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RE: Hi all. Need some pointers.
So are all cap edge and extra palnes "hover capable " or do they have to have special ailerons.... seems like ppl are tlling me some only do forward moving stunts and a few have ailerons large enough and inboard enough to do these hovers. Whats the deal?
As for a kit, i have plenty of building experiance, i used to do guillows kits in one sitting. and i biult 1 trainer and flew it and give it to a friend recently.
As for my OSla 46. according to my tower tach... with a 11x4 apc I get 12,180 rpm(12,300 on a good cold day) but after i back off peak lean, i get 11,900. it does unload in the air a little bit but i cant test that while its going. lol
I guess I either want to built a kit of a 25 size 3d plane or buy an arf from like raiden tech or nitromodels and pop a 46la in it.
thanks all Mb
As for a kit, i have plenty of building experiance, i used to do guillows kits in one sitting. and i biult 1 trainer and flew it and give it to a friend recently.
As for my OSla 46. according to my tower tach... with a 11x4 apc I get 12,180 rpm(12,300 on a good cold day) but after i back off peak lean, i get 11,900. it does unload in the air a little bit but i cant test that while its going. lol
I guess I either want to built a kit of a 25 size 3d plane or buy an arf from like raiden tech or nitromodels and pop a 46la in it.
thanks all Mb
12-13-2007, 11:21 PM
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RE: Hi all. Need some pointers.
Here's a YAK that should hover with it. Couldn't ask for better control surfaces.
http://www.raidentech.com/newyak543dfu.html
They also sell a CAP and Extra that will work. If thery're out of stock try here.
http://www.egrandbuy.com/aerobatics.html
Your .46 will hover this CAP. It builds lighter then they say. I had one with a YS .63 in it and it was insane. Can't help you with kits but RCKen sure can if you want to contact him.
http://ecsvr.com/abm/shopexd.asp?id=2331
http://www.raidentech.com/newyak543dfu.html
They also sell a CAP and Extra that will work. If thery're out of stock try here.
http://www.egrandbuy.com/aerobatics.html
Your .46 will hover this CAP. It builds lighter then they say. I had one with a YS .63 in it and it was insane. Can't help you with kits but RCKen sure can if you want to contact him.
http://ecsvr.com/abm/shopexd.asp?id=2331
12-13-2007, 11:57 PM
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RE: Hi all. Need some pointers.
ORIGINAL: amdhotprocessor
I have been playing with GWS and similar types of park flyers for a few yers, and just got into a club and AMA. I got my first nitro a year ago and the instructor at the old feild crashed it, he said it wat a hit, but that was bs. He tried to do 3d on a maiden right off the deck.
.....I said before that as far as just flying I can handle any aircraft pretty much.
... I am self taught and very skillfull in my flying and good at the few mainstream manuvers I do know. and I have had instant success and nearly no crashes, even learning on my own with a PZ cub, then a GWS zero, mustang formosa...... blah blah...
I have been playing with GWS and similar types of park flyers for a few yers, and just got into a club and AMA. I got my first nitro a year ago and the instructor at the old feild crashed it, he said it wat a hit, but that was bs. He tried to do 3d on a maiden right off the deck.
.....I said before that as far as just flying I can handle any aircraft pretty much.
... I am self taught and very skillfull in my flying and good at the few mainstream manuvers I do know. and I have had instant success and nearly no crashes, even learning on my own with a PZ cub, then a GWS zero, mustang formosa...... blah blah...
Please post video. I can't wait to see the instant progression from PZ cub to ACTUAL 3D capable aerobatic models.
Seriously, if you want to move up quickly, get foam and a sim, in that order. There are many books on RC aerobatics. I recommend one by (name escapes me) Matt Shoup, or something like that.
You will go much farther, much faster in this hobby if you look to skilled flyers. I am not trying to discourage you, but I AM trying to save you thousands of dollars. Trust me, you are not currently capable of handling, "any aircraft pretty much."
Get some training...period.
12-14-2007, 08:01 AM
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RE: Hi all. Need some pointers.
If he can handle a BUHOR and the H9 Pulse XT, he shouldn't have any trouble flying a Cap, Edge, or any of the other planes identified so far in this thread.
CAPs are a little harder to get into the post stall condition required for hovering. They have a strong tendency to tip stall and snap roll with large elevator movements. But this is what makes them popular for pattern and aerobatics. They will spin easily and on demand. I have the GP Cap 232 .40, and have rebuilt the plane three times because I wasn't ready for the snap or spin while on approach. Some people will tell you the Cap 232 is great for 3D, others will tell you the exact opposite.
The Edge 540 has a straight leading edge on the wing. Combine that with the airfoil design, the actual center of lift as you move out from the plane toward the wingtip actually produces a forward swept wing. This significantly reduces the tendency to tip stall, making the plane much easier to transition into the stall condition. I have the Fliton Edge 540 Freestyle, and because of the wing design, I can't get it to enter a spin without cheating. The Edges tend to be very popular for their 3D Capabilities.
I've only flown an Extra one time, and it wasn't my plane. I found it to be a very well behaved plane, and I'm looking to add one to my hanger. The Extras are extremely popular in the IMAC circles because of their predictable tendencies and ability to smoothly and easily perform just about any maneuver you want.
I seen, but never flown, the YAKs, and have been very impressed. It may have just been pilot skill, but these planes are also popular with the IMAC crowd, and for good reason I think.
Your RPM numbers on the 46 LA with the 11x4 are similar to what I get. For aerobatic and 3D flying, treat the 46 LA like a strong 25 or 32. Get a plane designed for that size engine, and the LA should do very well. Since its a bushing engine, it tends to be lighter than the BB 46's.
Good luck.
Brad
CAPs are a little harder to get into the post stall condition required for hovering. They have a strong tendency to tip stall and snap roll with large elevator movements. But this is what makes them popular for pattern and aerobatics. They will spin easily and on demand. I have the GP Cap 232 .40, and have rebuilt the plane three times because I wasn't ready for the snap or spin while on approach. Some people will tell you the Cap 232 is great for 3D, others will tell you the exact opposite.
The Edge 540 has a straight leading edge on the wing. Combine that with the airfoil design, the actual center of lift as you move out from the plane toward the wingtip actually produces a forward swept wing. This significantly reduces the tendency to tip stall, making the plane much easier to transition into the stall condition. I have the Fliton Edge 540 Freestyle, and because of the wing design, I can't get it to enter a spin without cheating. The Edges tend to be very popular for their 3D Capabilities.
I've only flown an Extra one time, and it wasn't my plane. I found it to be a very well behaved plane, and I'm looking to add one to my hanger. The Extras are extremely popular in the IMAC circles because of their predictable tendencies and ability to smoothly and easily perform just about any maneuver you want.
I seen, but never flown, the YAKs, and have been very impressed. It may have just been pilot skill, but these planes are also popular with the IMAC crowd, and for good reason I think.
Your RPM numbers on the 46 LA with the 11x4 are similar to what I get. For aerobatic and 3D flying, treat the 46 LA like a strong 25 or 32. Get a plane designed for that size engine, and the LA should do very well. Since its a bushing engine, it tends to be lighter than the BB 46's.
Good luck.
Brad
12-15-2007, 04:45 PM
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RE: Hi all. Need some pointers.
OK, I think theres a missunderstanding....
A long while back I bought aPZ cub to learn on, after a few crashes I got it.... a few weeks later i went to a gypsy....then a formosa....minifunbtana....theres a bunch of planes i had yrs ago, even a 3d espad foam electric i DID learn some 3d with
After all the electrics i got a BIG hobby lobby cub when they had em and a 6ch futaba and an OS46LA
I was told that just because i flown electrics dont mean I know how to do nitro(so i was told) and I had an instructor (who sucked, and was warned about a day late by others) Turns out this guy i had never met WAS an idiot and crashed my cub from trying a daring takeoff and then quicly blamed the tx and got in his car an left......... I never flew a gas plane....still
so after a couple a yrs i got back into it and got another PZ cub to brush up on my flying and to use the electronics in a formoasa after a few flights on the pz.... I didnt realize that i would have gotten hooked so quick....again.....
So,,, just recen i broke out my stuff and built a spad...... I flew it now for a good few months and have so far had in the last 4 months.....
Joined the AMA and a club, built a spad and a scat cat 500, a 80 " cub was given to me, I have been playing around with some more advanced areobatics and realize that I like 2 types of flying.
So I bought a H9 PNP pulse and will be flying it after christmas... and I do want to get into learning 3d, such as hovering and whatnot.. so now that i have the PNP i have an extra engine and servos, tx, batt pac, and all so i guess that I will try getting a 25 size 3d glow plane and put in a 46 for good power....
I did not learn and progress instantly. I am l;earning everyday but i concider myself a great pilot, with a vast array of skills.
I have and can land pretty much anything and fly it well too. WHAT I DO WANT TO LEARN is the most impressive stuff like harriers and hovers tourqe rols... ect... and i have the knowlage and skill to fly proficently and wish to progress into some more technical types of flying...
as for building like i said i have built many planes some for model and some for flying. although i have never built a plane besides a spad that I have flow I HAVE built and reparied about 10 or 11 for others that do fly VERY well, including one i did a LOT of custom airbrushing in TRUFIRE that looks like a pictur realistic flame job, and I learned these skills in painting becuse I attended Mike lavales paint shop in FL during my visit to the car show where our 67 chevy 2 wont 4 first prizes and the Lexus won 2 1sts.
Sorry If i made it sound like i learned in a day, I didnt, it took me a few months to get really decent then I stepped up over time to hotter more agile planes. That what Im doing now too. going from a spad and scat cat with a 46 to a pulse and another 3d style plane.
A long while back I bought aPZ cub to learn on, after a few crashes I got it.... a few weeks later i went to a gypsy....then a formosa....minifunbtana....theres a bunch of planes i had yrs ago, even a 3d espad foam electric i DID learn some 3d with
After all the electrics i got a BIG hobby lobby cub when they had em and a 6ch futaba and an OS46LA
I was told that just because i flown electrics dont mean I know how to do nitro(so i was told) and I had an instructor (who sucked, and was warned about a day late by others) Turns out this guy i had never met WAS an idiot and crashed my cub from trying a daring takeoff and then quicly blamed the tx and got in his car an left......... I never flew a gas plane....still
so after a couple a yrs i got back into it and got another PZ cub to brush up on my flying and to use the electronics in a formoasa after a few flights on the pz.... I didnt realize that i would have gotten hooked so quick....again.....
So,,, just recen i broke out my stuff and built a spad...... I flew it now for a good few months and have so far had in the last 4 months.....
Joined the AMA and a club, built a spad and a scat cat 500, a 80 " cub was given to me, I have been playing around with some more advanced areobatics and realize that I like 2 types of flying.
So I bought a H9 PNP pulse and will be flying it after christmas... and I do want to get into learning 3d, such as hovering and whatnot.. so now that i have the PNP i have an extra engine and servos, tx, batt pac, and all so i guess that I will try getting a 25 size 3d glow plane and put in a 46 for good power....
I did not learn and progress instantly. I am l;earning everyday but i concider myself a great pilot, with a vast array of skills.
I have and can land pretty much anything and fly it well too. WHAT I DO WANT TO LEARN is the most impressive stuff like harriers and hovers tourqe rols... ect... and i have the knowlage and skill to fly proficently and wish to progress into some more technical types of flying...
as for building like i said i have built many planes some for model and some for flying. although i have never built a plane besides a spad that I have flow I HAVE built and reparied about 10 or 11 for others that do fly VERY well, including one i did a LOT of custom airbrushing in TRUFIRE that looks like a pictur realistic flame job, and I learned these skills in painting becuse I attended Mike lavales paint shop in FL during my visit to the car show where our 67 chevy 2 wont 4 first prizes and the Lexus won 2 1sts.
Sorry If i made it sound like i learned in a day, I didnt, it took me a few months to get really decent then I stepped up over time to hotter more agile planes. That what Im doing now too. going from a spad and scat cat with a 46 to a pulse and another 3d style plane.
12-15-2007, 04:49 PM
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RE: Hi all. Need some pointers.
ORIGINAL: agexpert
Please post video. I can't wait to see the instant progression from PZ cub to ACTUAL 3D capable aerobatic models.
Seriously, if you want to move up quickly, get foam and a sim, in that order. There are many books on RC aerobatics. I recommend one by (name escapes me) Matt Shoup, or something like that.
You will go much farther, much faster in this hobby if you look to skilled flyers. I am not trying to discourage you, but I AM trying to save you thousands of dollars. Trust me, you are not currently capable of handling, "any aircraft pretty much."
Get some training...period.
ORIGINAL: amdhotprocessor
I have been playing with GWS and similar types of park flyers for a few yers, and just got into a club and AMA. I got my first nitro a year ago and the instructor at the old feild crashed it, he said it wat a hit, but that was bs. He tried to do 3d on a maiden right off the deck.
.....I said before that as far as just flying I can handle any aircraft pretty much.
... I am self taught and very skillfull in my flying and good at the few mainstream manuvers I do know. and I have had instant success and nearly no crashes, even learning on my own with a PZ cub, then a GWS zero, mustang formosa...... blah blah...
I have been playing with GWS and similar types of park flyers for a few yers, and just got into a club and AMA. I got my first nitro a year ago and the instructor at the old feild crashed it, he said it wat a hit, but that was bs. He tried to do 3d on a maiden right off the deck.
.....I said before that as far as just flying I can handle any aircraft pretty much.
... I am self taught and very skillfull in my flying and good at the few mainstream manuvers I do know. and I have had instant success and nearly no crashes, even learning on my own with a PZ cub, then a GWS zero, mustang formosa...... blah blah...
Please post video. I can't wait to see the instant progression from PZ cub to ACTUAL 3D capable aerobatic models.
Seriously, if you want to move up quickly, get foam and a sim, in that order. There are many books on RC aerobatics. I recommend one by (name escapes me) Matt Shoup, or something like that.
You will go much farther, much faster in this hobby if you look to skilled flyers. I am not trying to discourage you, but I AM trying to save you thousands of dollars. Trust me, you are not currently capable of handling, "any aircraft pretty much."
Get some training...period.
Mabey you didnt read thouroughly, I have a few yrs or learnin under my belt, AND DIDNT learn instantly and progress to 3d, unless about 2.5-3 yrs is overnight success..... dont talk to me like Im and idiot or child, be respectfull!!!
12-15-2007, 07:01 PM
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RE: Hi all. Need some pointers.
i flew the crap out of my trianer,had my pulse for a while after the 7th or 8th flight the pulse was boring. i now have a funtana 100 and love it!!!!!!! every time i fly i just stuned it will do anything you can throw at and it will do it with a smoothness like no other. i plan on getting into bigger planes but i will allways have a funtana
