hello everyone,
i was doing loops and crashed 2 out of 5. and i decided, wat the heck, and want to learn to hover inverted. i don't have a sim or anything, only 14yo. the blade cp was my first heli. can do everything with it upright, got a futaba 7c, lipo and bh upgrade...
ok, so i decided, hmmmmm, i dont have the $$$$ to try it out in real knowing that i would DEFINITELY crash, so... i made an X with zip ties across the skids, and hung it to the ceiling. i first initialed the gyro while upright, and then hung it upside down. i spooled it up on normal and then flipped it up to idle up 1. it was doing ok... then, as i add negative pitch, the heli starts to jump up and down, more negative, faster jumps, i didnt go any futher than that and took it to thorttle hold.
so... why is it jumping up and down as i add negative? (not sure if i'm in negative, or still in the positive range, if that's the case, then reducing positive) how might i learn to fly inverted? i will be getting a bigger bird sometimes after the winter (if no good deal shows up in my lhs 2nd handed)(probably a trex). should i learn to go inverted on that bird? i do find that rudder is reversed and can really mess me up. dont have a hh on my blade. anyone here learnt to go inverted with a blade and not a better heli?


ANY suggestion is appreciated.

what blades are you using. flat bottom or symmetrical

esky wood symmetricals, cheaper than eflights...

The best, and only thatt i know of, way to learn flying inverted is with a simulator.

If you have jumping, you have a sticky collective. Not to say, I have ever flown upside down. But trust your gut, if you see weird behavior like that, then something is wrong. Remember with negative pitch the collective slides into an entirely different range than it is used to.

i think i have a theory to my own problem, tell me how likely this is...
since i made an X with zip ties on the skids, it'll stretch like a rubber band because the cf rods on the skids are not stiff. and while i might think i'm adding in negative pitch, i'm actually on the way of reducing positive pitch, it came to a point where the positive pitch has the power to pull it down but not have the power to correct it's 'rubber band' bounced up, and as soon as it bounces up, the 'rubber band' releases and it drops back down.

it is confusing, but try tying two strings across the skids to make an X, then gently pull on the middle of the X, you'll see what i mean. i doubt i have a sticky collective. i lube all parts and running bh with 3bb blade grips.

Chopperdudes,

What part# are you using? If those work on the CP they should work with the CPP I dont want to spend another $15 for main blades..

i would be alowed to order online shortly, if you can order online, get a pair of those $8.00 sym blades from helidirect.

it is possible you are having a ruber band effect.....try just holding on to it, m,ake sure you got it good and the blades are clear and spin it up....add some negative pitch. See if the presure feels smooth or jerky. If it is smooth then I bet you are experincing a rubber band effect. Otherwise something is wrong....start diagnosis.

ya, forgot to mention, i did do that and the pressure is even. i guess then i'd have to wait for a simulator. btw, i saw g3 in china for 350 bux chinese. it doesnt include a tx, but includes a usb cable that allows you to plug the blade tx into your computer. i might get my grandparents to get it and bring it over, since they are immigrating to canada. but that will likely be in the spring. i know teh concept of inverted really good, and can do it in g3 demo that i downloaded, but i uses the keyboard. so it's just not the same.

Is it a dumb question to ask if your in idle up mode?

http://www.helidirect.com/product_in...roducts_id=779 Those?

yes, i'm in idle up and yes, those are the blades.

Where is your upright hover in Idle up? 3/4 stick? 1/2 stick? I ask because in idle up at middle stick should be zero pitch. Upright hover should be above that and inverted should be below mid stick. Ive flown my cp inverted, flips, rolls, loops, And even some invert hover. Ive found that the pitch can be manipulated buy changing the links between the blade grips and the mixer. If you have a pitch gauge, check it there. I get +10 to -10 Im in the middle of a rebuild from a loss of control fron inverted hover. Oops the pice is this spring(winter)

the pitch i'm not too worried about, i hover between midstick and 3/4. i have a 7c to do all the programming. so by what you mean... FLYING in inverted is easier than hovering? i've done loops... but that's it. i also found out that the motor will stall very badly and the headspeed will decay if i give a jab of collective. what setup do you use on yours? gyro? bl motor? or all stock? i got a bh upgrade and a lipo.

and oh ya, would you say that doing a roll is easier or a loop? wanna try my first roll in the near future.

Based on what I have heared rolls are a lot harder than loops. You are a lot more likely to go shooting to the ground based on nose position in a roll. Maybe you should try something a bit easier like a stall turn?

i agree with jent. i experienced the crash jent is talking about; half way through the roll the maneuver turned into a 45deg inverted stall turn quickly. the spacious 45' i gave myself went zero faster than i could blink. now i'm working on my plain oldloops first. once i've mastered those, i'll probably try the ole "death roll" again.

Im running the stock transmitter, alum swash, bell hiller, 1320 lipo and a venom micro fireball 370. I also have some lighter paddles ive used on it. It falls like a brick if i lose the head. I have some short clips but dont know how to load them. Ive found, Even with my nitro shuttle, That collective management is important as to keep the head speed up. Heres the other pic from that day, when in an inverted hover at 5ft, I pushed up instead of pulling down to climb out. my current rebuild is from a back flip to inverted and killed the head and lost it.

thx for all the input. i can do stall turns really good, even on top of my street. i can do sideway stall turns no problem. i have not tried a 540 stall turn because i was aware of the fixed pitch tail. (not as precise as a cp tail). i've done loops and my last one was pretty good except that i released the elevator too late and ended up stalling at about 5ft. *crashed*.

olds455, wat do you mean when you said you've lost the head? should my headspeed decay so badly? or is it that my motor is going bad? when i increase collective pitch, the motor would stall, causing teh whole heli to spin tail right even with full revo mixing because of the increased drag. i'll be ordering maybe 5~10 pairs of blades from helidirect. when i do, i'll try to perfect my loop and do rolls knowing that my dad doesn't need to drive me 20min to my lhs everytime i crashed.

olds455, looks like your flying in snow. but how can you fly when your wearing a glove? just wondering...

I don't know how to load them to this site....but if you wish I have a utiltiy on my website where you can upload up to 2MB files (so they would have to be pretty short). You don't need to create an account or anything, just browse, upload, and it will give you a link back...you can then just copy that link and post it on the forums or where ever. Here it is if that helps you:

http://www.spicylemons.com/upload.php

I mean the headspeed. once the speed is lost, so is control. I ve lost it so bad the right stick does nothing. You say you increse the collective and the motor stalls, How? The motor will bog for sure. Espically if the pitch is to high. I havent ran a stock motor in so long so Im not sure. the venom fireball is only $15 so the price was a no brainer. At full + or - pitch the heli will bog but it climbs out very fast. It sill sound like your pulling to much pitch. It does take practice. Ill try to load these clips at the rcuniverse video site. The pics were on 3-24-06. its cold but Ive learned to fly with cold hands. After the flight its time to warm up. The batteries dont last long in the cold anyways.

Did my first 2 flips today and landed both! its awesome, i crashed once on the third and b/c of idle up i broke the blades (forgot that it goes to 100% when you "cut" throttle) I gotta get some blades, and ill be out flying later today!

Thats great to hear....any suggestions for us? What made you crash on the third?

I was pretty low and just at the wrong angle, overcorrected, crashed, cut power and idle up was on. Turn idle up off when you crash is one suggestion. practice on a simulator (I did for maybe 5 hours prior to this, sitting in my hobby shops lobby, lol). Warm up well is also a good one, and make sure you can see what angle the plane is at from all sides of you. It acts a little wierd in idle up (unlike the simulator) so be prepared to bail, get lots of altitude (mine was at maybe 50 feet). The biggest tip is don't get queesy about it. If you think you can't do it, then dont. I would say, go for it, once you do it, you wont be so scared to do it again and again and agian. My $.02