Gr8,
I think you may be getting a little mixed up there.Circuit diagram clearly shows that when using the unit as CDI, emitter Q2 is connected to ground through 1k0 resistor with the collector connected directly to the positive rail.
When using it to pulse a transistor ignition, the collectorof Q2 is connected to the positive rail through 1k0 resistor with the emitter connected directly to ground.
If I remember my theory from 30 odd years ago, the former is common collector and the latter is common emitter configuration.
Basically, with the pulse from the micro, the CDI and the Transistor power stages require inverse signals.
Anyhow, you nutted it out in the end so good work there. Hope to get time myself for some results shortly.
Cheers .....Jeff

Hi John,

You are right and I change the PCB. (new documents online now)

THX !

BTW, I use teflontape to cover the coil.

Rob,
I look for new document but could not see any changes. I worked out how to use the Layol program enough to make the change and I can send it over to you. ..... Jeff

Hi Jeff,

R8 isn't connected to plus anymore but to ground into the new pcb.
I work for 40 years with layo1, I think I can make changes faster

Ah,ok, so I am looking at wrong version. I will lookout for changes. Thanks...Jeff

Changes have already been made 2 days ago Blue...take a close LOOK...

John

Yes, as I just said, different version.
Thanks...Jeff

Hi Rob..
I finally have time to post the "How To" for the toroid coil on the CDI boards.

I start by taking a 1/8" wooden dowel rod cut to 1 foot in length to use as a shuttle for passing thru the center of the toroid. I cut a V-notch in both ends to keep the wire on the dowel as I prepare the wire. I usually wind about 30 turns of #36 guage wire onto the shuttle which gives me 30 feet of wire for the secondary winding on the toroid. This can be seen in the first picture. I wrap a 1/8" slice of masking tape around the toroid on the perimeter which I trap one end of the wire to start winding so it won't slip. Leave about 1" of wire hang out from the core to solder to the board when you are finished.
Proceed to wind in a clockwise rotation, keeping the turns close together. The next picture shows some turns on the core. As you wind the secondary, try not to loop the wire or get any kinks in it which could cause broken wires or cracked insulation and a shorted pair of turns later.

On the first layer around the toroid, I can get approximately 150 turns of wire, keeping it snug and without too many gaps in the windings. Take your time and take a few breaks now and then, writing the number of turns down so you can resume with a correct count of the turns. The second last picture is 400 turns of #36 wire on the core which completes the secondary windings. Wrap a strip of tape around the perimeter again trapping the last loose end of the wire, then trim it to about 1" again.

The primary is wound next with #26 guage wire with 15 turns and taped again so it doesn't unravel from the core. Trim both ends of this winding to about 1".

Next is the feedback winding from #36 wire for 6 evenly spaced turns around the core. Make sure you wind all turns in the same clockwise direction and keep them neat. When all turns are wound, take an exacto knife blade and scrape about 1/8th inch of the insulation from each winding end for soldering later to your board.

When all finished, your coil should look similar to the last picture.
I hope this helps those of you trying to wind these little gems. Any questions, just ask...

John

Hi Rob,
Found a bit of spare time. Pics of completed Strobe light and one of a test print of TCI board.
Cheers .... Jeff

And here you can find your HowTo.

http://www.electronics.gompy.net/CompleteCDI/

THX, John !

Hi Jeff,

Nice PCB and a very nice case you have made, but there is a bug into the PCB.

Yes Rob, I saw that after I posted the photo. I made a couple of other errors as well and I am in the process of fixing them as well.

Spoke with a mate of mine today and the query came up about the range of the ignition system. We are currently working on a V8 and have the patterns completed with the first two castings done and machining started. I looked at the software for the pc and by changing the "top end" speed to 40,000 to represent 10,000 in a V8, the graph etc. handled the changes ok. When I get some more time I will experiment some more with the hardware and get back to you here on how it goes.

Cheers ...Jeff

The problem you will get is the power of the HV-part.
This small designe isn't fast enough to load the capacitor and can't produce multispark in one rotation.
Big power HV-parts must be handel differend, they must be shutdown if the spark is produced.
This means, in one rotation the HV-part must be shutdown for 8 times !
You need a very fast and powerful HV-part will you can do this.

OK...how about just using the timing board with standard ignition Tci.?

The timingboard isn't the problem, you can put it anywhere you want.
But how you gone make the sensors to fire up 8 times a differend sparkcoil ?
And how does the electronics knows wich cilider must be fire up ?
You need a kind of shiftregister between the timerboard and the sparkcoils.

Distributor

Not possible, the distributor IS the advange timing.
If you turn the distributor, you change the timing and sometimes inside the distributor there is a mechanic / pneumatic timingdevice.

Distributor body will not be turning. No advance plate inside either. Rotor arm is arced at the end to allow for changes in advance.

Hi Johh,
Thank for your toroid winding explanations.
My question is this:
If you put 30 winds onto suttle (1Ft. long) you will have 60 feet (~18.3 meters for continentals boys) of wire and not 30 feet.

How many of this will be finaly onto toroid ?

BTW this toroid is not more in allelectronics site. Is sold out

Dino

60.000 Volt, multispark, 8 cilinder PLASMA CDI [>:]

Dinoslmn,
If you tried to get 60 feet of wire on that size shuttle, by the time you used 40 feet of it, you'd no longer be able to get anything thru the center of the toroid. It only takes 30 feet of wire total...sorry.

As for the availability of those toroids..after I told you about them with the part numbers the next day they were sold out. Other sources for that size might be from an old AT sized computer motherboard. They usually have 2 of them on the boards. Most of them are perfectly sized for our projects. I've been looking for the same ones for awhile but no luck unless you want to buy 500 at a time.

John

Hi Rob..
I am still getting those multiple sparks below 1000 rpms. I tried the small cap on the hall leads, adding the 1n4007 diode to the timer board where it feeds voltage to the CDI section of the board, and am still getting the multiple sparks which start as soon as I get the first spark. It's not all the time but like every 3 passes over the hall with the magnet. As I said before, above 1000 rpm it will run the engine fine but getting it started at a low rpm is presenting a problem. Is there anything else to try? I set the pulse width for the BT151 at 250 msec. It seems like I am getting a false trigger from somewhere at this point. I tried the seperate timer board without hooking up the cdi and still get it. I am puzzled now. Is there anything else to try?

John

Hi John,

You have to set the pulse width time short for CDI and long for TCI, your use a CDI = short.
Below 1000 rpm there is no advange, pulse in = pulse out - If you have multi sparks, you have a multi pulse in.
Maybe you can try a cable with earthsheeld......BUT, you may NOT connect the sheeld on both sides to earth, only one sde !!

It's also possible the HV disturbe the the right sparkpuls.
Try with a peace of metal to separate HV and timerboard.

Do you use double side PCB-board ?

Rob..
I just tried minimum pulse width for CDI..still does it, I am using a single sided board. I tried a shielded cable with the hall..same thing. disconnected the timer from the CDI (seperate board setup) and still there. What was the old timer board using the 1 uh choke for? filtering spikes and signals? I might try that in the power line. Other than that, I have no idea where it's coming from. The older timer boards didn't have the problem so maybe the choke was working to stop it.
Have you built and tested one of the combo boards yet? I have 6 of them now and all are the same results. Just looking for the solution, they all work great other than this bug. Haven't heard from Charlie yet about his testing. He must be busy with his "Honey Do list" since he moved...

John

I'm not only try the combo board, I'm using the board on my mopped without any problems.
But I've a double sided PCB-board and the board is into a metal box.
Tomorrow I'll setup a PCB to the scope to see if it's a software bug or hardware.
I don't have see it before on the scope when we test the board.

I was thinking, your not use the 5 Volt and not the capacitors.
The problem can also be the Voltage you are using, if this is to low the timerboard can do strange things.
The 1uH shoke filter spikes from the HV and sparkcoil.