nitro wing

My Feedback: (1)

I can only compare it to a Zinger Pro 22x8,which pulled OK,but was loud.The MSC is quiet.Lost about a 1000 rpm but the torque is there from idle straight thru.No prop rip.easy to control subtle throttle inputs.

JoeAirPort

My Feedback: (41)

The MSC is more rigid so I imagine the efficiency is better (hard rock maple). It's not just wasted engine power churning undirected air. Also the MSC's paddles are much bigger than the Zinger Pro. Can't wait to try my MSC.

nitro wing

My Feedback: (1)

Never used a tach in my live,but was curious.I think I am at about 2.5 gallons thru it.
Just fixed my Edge and got to fly today.The motor is awesome!! smooth and pulls and wont quit pulling.
Never really played with the settings as it ran so well (once the hall sensor was changed)
Not sure if I am at maximum rpm yet,but it turned the MSC at 6780.The MSC loads the motor much more than many other props,but still gives all (and then some) thrust.Its also very quiet,and barely has prop rip.My Edge is probably at 18 pounds,maybe more,the Taurus never hesitates to pull it out of trouble.

JoeAirPort

My Feedback: (41)

I finally got my MSC prop...wow the paddles are giganto. It wouldn't even fit in my Tru turn spinner cone. That sucked. Your RPM is good for this prop...it really is bigger than any other props out there. I can believe that you're getting tons of thrust and that it's quiet.

nitro wing

My Feedback: (1)

Yeah ,it looks like a friggin 2x4 piece of lumber,definately kicks in power,but am only comparing it to a Zinger Pro 22x8.The Taurus revved way high on it,the Zinger (no tach reading),or at least I got way too much prop rip.I was getting prop rip on vertical uplines and during waterfalls [X(]
The MSC is giving me all around good performance.I'll probably try something else in future just for fun.
I still want to put this in the EF Extra,how are you liking yours now?

JoeAirPort

My Feedback: (41)

I totally dig the EF Extra. Awesome plane. Can't say enough good about it. That Taurus will be perfect for it.

Tired Old Man

My Feedback: (1)

Due to it's size the MSC 22-8 will not turn up the rpm numbers that may of the other props will. You already discovered that. However, the MSC will outperform most other props in just about any flight attitude and airspeed than the others. That becomes especially evident when pulling out of a hover and at low speeds using low throttle settings. You never feel that the plane might fall out of the sky at slow approach speeds.

Yep, the MSC loads up an engine more for sure, but the rpm is puts out is not wasted. MSC props are a perfect example of how rpm numbers can trick a person. Higher rpm counts are not indicative of higher performance. Just the opposite can be true where the prop turning higher rpm may be wasting power through inefficiency. The proof will always be found in actual flight performance, and many that decide not to try an MSC because they provide less rpm lose out because they don't really understand how a prop works.

The numbers you are getting with the Taurus/MSC combination are right in the ballpark but you'll probably pick up even more performance if you tune the carb. It's a rare day that and engine comes out of the box with the needles already set "just right" for your plane and location.

Flyfast1

My Feedback: (1)

I am using a Menz S 21x12 on my TF GS P51 with the Taurus 52 and am getting great results. It has nice low speed performance and the plane moves nicely at full throttle. With a Menz S 21x10, it was ripping the prop at full throttle and was much louder. Plus, I didn't have nearly the same top end speed that I get with the 21x12. So, the Menz S 21x10 wasn't enough prop on this plane. I have also tried a carbon fiber prop (Mes 21x12). It is a heavier prop, so the idle is real slow and smooth, but I don't think the top end performance is any better than with the Menz S 21x12. So, at less than half the price, I am staying with the Menz S prop. For aerobatics, the weight of the carbon fiber prop may be less desirable because it spools up a little slower, but I fly mostly warbirds where that is not an issue.

How does the blade size of the Menz S compare to the MSC? The Menz S looks pretty wide to me and it is also thick. I had to increase the size of my spinner slots to accomodate the Menz S 21x12.

Since Menz has discontinued the Menz Ultras they are getting hard to find, although I did find a Menz Ultra 22x14 from Aircraft International. He had them on sale and I think it was only $18, so I bought it. It may be a little too much load for the Taurus, but the ultra blade is significantly narrower than the Menz S, so perhaps it will be ok. I wouldn't mind an extra 20mph of speed!

-Ed B.

JoeAirPort

My Feedback: (41)

Funny you should ask. I posted pic's of the Menz 22x8, MSC 22x8, and Xoar 23x8 side by side. The MSC paddles are way bigger than even the Xoar 23x8.
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/m_48...tm.htm#7821798

Flyfast1

My Feedback: (1)

Wow, and I thought the Menz S was a wide blade! The MSC is huge! Thanks very much for the comparison pics.

-Ed B.

nitro wing

My Feedback: (1)

T.O.M
Took me months to figure out you ident change,wondered what hapened to you
Exceptional help all along,and truth well spoken.

Tired Old Man

My Feedback: (1)

I'm not over here much anymore. Usually at another place. I have issues with people using their moderator status to make points in a forum so I went to where free thoughts can still roam.

nitro wing

My Feedback: (1)

To me you always seem to make an honest educated effort to help people in many aspects of the Hobby.
People can judge easily,especially on ones opinions and/or knowledge,sorry to hear there was a personal/board conflict.
Hope you drop in often enough to help troubleshoot RC aircraft and engines [8D]

captinjohn

Tired..but wise old man. Keep on posting here. Maybe sometime it will be more like the "good od days" on RCU. Guys like you have been around long enough to know this engine stuff. Some of the new wipper snappers think they know everything overnite. With age comes Wisdom. Well in some cases anyway. Take Care my friend, Capt,n

JoeAirPort

My Feedback: (41)

Yeah he explained why all my engines idle high when they land...because they are up to running temperature when they land....but not when they take off....so the idle is lower on take off. Now I don't worry about it since I understand it.

closetguy

My Feedback: (13)

TOM,hope to see you around here,you help me many times.
as far as the Taurus 52 you steered me to, it has been the most smoothest, ROCK SOLID engine i have.
THANKS

nitro wing

My Feedback: (1)

I have heard some others on U tube,I have heard and seen others at my field.
The Taurus is different,perhaps a bit subdued and grown up in sound,compared to the raspy missing other gassers have.
It runs like a huge smooth glow motor,pulling from idle to redline and back,and barely making a burbly sound.No stuttering/missing and I love it.Price? about 675$
So,if you want BMW or Porsche performance and initial cost,this motor is for you.
If you can settle for off shore OK power and feel right with a second rate low cost motor,then get one of the 350 $ Motors that are designed for the average guy and a non competition plane.
Performance Aviation is risky,why safe a $ on the powerplant?

Tired Old Man

My Feedback: (1)

If you want one you'd better get it quick. Bill is retiring very soon.

nitro wing

My Feedback: (1)

Mine is just turning into a brute now,today was one of the best days for performance,its definately waking up now.It was a powerhouse from day one,but todays flights made me chuckle.Acceleration from a hover was very good,with continous and increasing speed as the Edge 540 was rocketing to a spec in the sky.The MSC 22x8 was putting a load on the motor awhile back,but now seems to spin close to redline in vertical accelleration
There was another identical Edge at the field,his was a pound lighter and had a DA 50 in it.The Taurus sounded better and had more authority [8D]
So,Bill is going to stop building Taurus engines?
Dang,this is quite concerning []

Flyfast1

My Feedback: (1)

I didn't know that. I may want to consider buying another Taurus from him. I really enjoy the one I have. Probably the most user friendly engine I've ever had.

-Ed

Tired Old Man

My Feedback: (1)

It's the best 50cc engine on the market IMO. I've tried more than a few others and none have matched the Taurus on stock or Pitts mufflers. Starts easy, pulls strong, never falters, not the lightest but definately not the heaviest, smoooooth running, and ultra reliable. You pay about equal to a DA but you generally never have to send one back. Unless you hit the ground with one there's nothing that needs any support. Even the carbs still have the model number on them so you can buy Walbro repair kits when needed. I can afford any engine I want so cost has not been a factor in my engine decisions. Performance and reliability are what makes the finish line for me and Taurus crosses the 50cc line ahead of them all in nearly every category.

nitro wing

My Feedback: (1)

Its sad news really,perhaps I will never need Bill's advice or service in the next few years,because of the sound engines built from day one.
So what happens,if I wanted a similar engine in the future? one that runs perfectly and strong,can take a beating,puts out regardless and reliably during high risk flying? I've seen and heard others.I dont want to run anything less or cheaper.My Taurus is newer,and will likely last for many years.I surely hope that one or others can or will compete in this level of performance for the demanding pilots of today.

Tired Old Man

My Feedback: (1)

Unfortunately as the demand for less expensive engines increases the quality and performance decreases accordingly. Many are satisfied with the reduced performance, quality, and reliability of the less expensive engines. Why? Because many are enamored with the lower price while most have not been in the gasser game long enough to understand the differences to recognize the greater value of the better products. This has an effect on the higher quality manufacturers because they lose sales to the budget manufacturers. As the experience level of the budget buyers increase they start seeking higher performance levels but, sadly, their earlier buying habits reduced the availability of high quality engines. They also become upset when they discover that to obtain better products they must pay substantially more for them so they loudly and publically complain about the prices differences between budget and high quality products, hoping to force the quality manufacturers to lower their prices. It doesn't work the way they hope. Higher quality always comes at higher expense.

The above also has an impact on those that might be contemplating buying into an engine manufacturer or starting their own company. In my case I have considered buying two separate engine manufacturers but a combination of our economic condition and the flood of prospective engine customers to lower priced and lower quality products makes the decision very difficult. It's hard to justify taking over a company requiring a substantial financial investment when you know sales levels will be too low to turn a profit. The only other option avaialble if you wanted to start or take over a company would be to move your manufacturing operation offshore and subject yourself and your product to the whims of whomever is performing the manufacturing process. Quality levels decrease because the offshore jobbers substitute materials to increase their profit margins and closely held tolerances go out the window. Both of which increase returns and decrease customer satisfaction with the product while decreasing profit margins and increasing the workload of the prime vendor due to increased customer returns.

With the above for reference, why would anyone invest the time, money, and effort required to start up or buy out a higher end manufacturing process? Unless one was comfortable with investing tens of thousands of dollars in a venture that would likely never recover the initial investment, let alone turn a profit, it probably won't happen. At least not on the hobby engine level. We've done this to ourselves and there's nobody else to blame for the situation.

Don M.

My Feedback: (5)

Before Bill retires I feel I must write this. I bought one of his 52cc engines 3 years ago. I won't go into the details but Bill and I had some very serious "words" over this engine. To make a long story short for what ever reasons I was unable until April of this year to get the engine up and running. I now have 100+ flights on my Laser 200 and I MUST say that the TS52 has been flawless. It is the smoothest, easiest starting engine I have. During that 100 or so flights I have not had 1 nut, bolt or screw come loose anywhere on the plane and there are no burbles, misses or hesitations ANYWHERE in the rpm range. It is extremely quiet ( standard muffler ) and will turn a Xoar 23-8 6500 rpm's all day long.

I must also say that I have a Chinese engine of approx. the same size and although it works well for the price it is nothing compared to the Taurus and it sits in my workshop on a shelf while the Taurus plays almost everyday.

Bill if you read this I'm sure you will remember me and I just want to say - THANK YOU

Don Menchions
Halifax, Nova Scotia, Canada

nitro wing

My Feedback: (1)

I remember some sort of mixed negative feedback from you along time ago over the 52
I think its awesome that you got it mounted and have flown it now.I bet Bill will appreciate your post