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Old 11-17-2007 | 01:47 PM
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Default RE: DL-50 engine

That's great to hear buddy!! You making that CAP dance around like a foamy yet??? There's a post in RCU somewhere written by Pat Roy on how to tune your engine from what it is doing in the air. I'll have to find it and move it to here. Pat is an expert on the subject and the post he wrote is really outstanding.
Old 11-17-2007 | 01:57 PM
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Default RE: DL-50 engine

Found It!!!

ORIGINAL: Pat Roy

Not much to it really. Mix your oil at a ratio from 32 to 40-1 for the first couple of gallons. I prefer a good synthetic but a good natural oil will do. Say Pennzoil Air Cooled (natural), BelRay MC1 (synthetic), Bel Ray H1R (synthetic), Motul 800 (synthetic), Redline Two Stroke Racing Oil (synthetic), Stihl two stroke (natural), or the like. Do not use Lawnboy Ashless. There are a lot of great oils out there and all you have to do is pick one. I use 3W engines at work so there's been tens of thousands of hours of testing using some of those oils. Once the first couple of gallons have been run you can change over to a 50 to 70-1 mix, preferably with a synthetic. The hotter the day the more oil. 87 to 92 octane pump gas is just fine. There's no benefit to using higher octane gas.

For the ignition use a 4.8v battery with at least 800mAh of capacity. That will provide a bit more than an hour of running time for the ignition. Tom makes connecting the ignition leads easy by providing the connectors you might need. You have two leads coming from the ignition. One end of the ignition leads goes to the switch of your choice. One end on the switch leads go to the battery. A standard radio switch works just fine. The other ignition lead plugs into the lead coming off the engine. Mount the ignition and ignition battery somewhere they will not be next to the receiver, receiver battery, or receiver switch.

Here's a copy of somthing I had in another forum that covers the tuning process:

Basic Engine Tuning:

My tuning method doesn't really care which needle is set first. Either way, let the engine warm before you start twisting on the needles. You will not have an accurate needle setting if you start with a cold engine. The idle setting will be higher when it warms up if you start with a cold engine. Using the low range for a starting place the following works. You can use the high needle for a start as well if you want, just start at max rpm.

Set both needles to 1-1/2 to 2 turns open. That should be enough to get the engine started and running reasonably well. I like to bring the engine up to about 3,000 rpm or a little less and peak the rpm at that level using the low needle.

Now go to max rpm and tweak the high needle to max rpm and back off an audible skosh. I've never needed a tach so I can't provide a specific rpm drop amount. Go back to the low and peak it again at that lower rpm level. Leave the low needle peaked. Check the high one more time by going to max rpm and back it off that little skosh.

Now go fly.

Does the engine falter (sound like it's going to suddenly quit) when you go from low to high? The low needle is a little too lean. Does the engine sound like it's blubbering going from low to high? Then the low needle is a little rich. In the upper mid range does the engine sound like it's blubbering? Lean the high just a tiny amount. Can you hit max rpm in level flight? The high needle is a little lean if you can. Pull straight up vertical and see if the rpm sags any. If so the high end is a little lean. When you can go straight up at max rpm and not hear the rpm drop off you have it close enough. You may have to play with both needles for a bit to get it as close as you can. It's a trial and error process. Don't be surprised if the mid range does not become what you want it to until you have a few gallons of gas through it.

Remember that unlike a glow engine tiny movements of a gasser's needles have big effects. Often turning a needle the width of a small screwdriver blade is all you need once you're close to the right place. There's no need to bench run the engine nor is there a need to run it rich for break in. Set the needle to a point that it will be flown at all the time. All gassers made with cast components benefit greatly from heat cycling during the break in. The best heat cycling you can do with an engine is that performed in the air.
That means you fly at varied power settings to raise and lower the running temperature while keeping the temps within the normal operating range.

Note: If you change props to a different size or manufacturer you may (read should) have to tune the engine slightly again. Especially if you went to a larger prop from the one you originally tuned with.
Old 11-17-2007 | 02:41 PM
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Default RE: DL-50 engine

Any insights on a possible DL-85?? would be great for the Ziroli Jug I'm about to start.
Old 11-17-2007 | 04:01 PM
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Default RE: DL-50 engine

Well, for those interested in rather spectacular performance capabilities and a very precision airframe, I must recommend the Goldberg Obsession with DL 50. It's vertical capability is, shall we say, "sparkling". Although the DL adds a bit of weight beyond what the Obs is meant for, it has ample wing and stab area to support it easily. Floats on by, if you're not careful, and the big ol' 22" disc slows that baby down like a parachute.

The new DL 50 in her is just as reliable as the others, and it needs to be, as nearly all the flying is literally 1/3 throttle. I did a couple of full-throttle verticals, and the lookee-lous very quickly surmised that "it would go out of sight real fast".... Yup. Under-stated, that was....

It is a "first flip" restart already, and there is only about 40 oz of fuel through it. These can run on fumes on a 12 lb pattern-airframe, let me tell you.

There were no videographers present, so you'll just have to imagine an airplane that at full throttle will take about 25' to be able to pull off and go STRAIGHT up, accelerating.

Yeah, it's pretty impressive....
Old 11-17-2007 | 04:41 PM
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Default RE: DL-50 engine

LMAO!!!!! Are the wings still on it Bob????? LMAO!!!!!!!!
You should have a drink and calm down!!! LMAO!!!!! Anybody that would fly this plane with a DL-50 in it needs a drink!!!LMAO

REQUIRES: Engine: 1.20-1.40 cu in (20-23 cc) 4-stroke


Alpinestar, There is a twin 100 coming out soon.
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Old 11-17-2007 | 04:54 PM
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Default RE: DL-50 engine

Lou, thanks for the tunning info

I forgot to add that i opened up the cowl in the front. Now most of the cylider is getting hit with incoming air. Before, only the top of the cylinder was getting fresh air. Anyway, the engine was running alot cooler. Last week when i landed we temp gunned it at 275 just after we killed the engine. Today we were getting 164 just after shutdown. It was a few degrees cooler today also. The engine showed substantial power increases. This thing is a rocket.
Old 11-17-2007 | 05:11 PM
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Default RE: DL-50 engine

Sounds to me like you have it entirely in-hand buddy!! Keep up the good work!
Old 11-17-2007 | 06:14 PM
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Default RE: DL-50 engine

hi all

having probs with my DL 50 & KS 1060 tuned pipe (vess 23b prop) being to peaky/ punchy, ive measured the header lengh (TBM 25mm drop) from the exhaust flange to start of pipe and it comes out at 12 1/4 inches now i ve read somewhere that it should be 11 inch with this pipe but my problem is i have a nice knuckle on the end of the header which i dont really want to cut off so my question is do i have to cut it off or can i shorten the pipe lengh and by how much ??

cheers guys [sm=spinnyeyes.gif]
Old 11-17-2007 | 06:36 PM
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Default RE: DL-50 engine

If it is peaky and touchy, it is too SHORT.
Old 11-17-2007 | 06:39 PM
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Default RE: DL-50 engine

If you make it shorter it will get even more peaky I would make the header longer or use more prop.
Old 11-17-2007 | 07:47 PM
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Default RE: DL-50 engine

Check this cowl cutting job. I went back to my stock pipe. What do ya think guys? Just got it done.
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Old 11-17-2007 | 08:19 PM
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Default RE: DL-50 engine

WOW, that is better than mine will ever be
Old 11-17-2007 | 08:26 PM
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Default RE: DL-50 engine


ORIGINAL: paul5992

Check this cowl cutting job. I went back to my stock pipe. What do ya think guys? Just got it done.
Paul, that looks really VERY good. Exceptional.
Couple of things. Where you've relieved the cowl for the front of the canister - watch that very closely. My Cap has a similar cut, and I had it too close, the cowl flexed during flight and started rubbing. Not good.
Of course - you'll secure the spark plug lead to the cowl so that wire isn't flapping about, right? If not, the thing will fail at the cap in short order.

Other than those things, as cambo wrote - WOW - Mine will *never* be that good.
Old 11-17-2007 | 09:50 PM
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Default RE: DL-50 engine

Really looks great Paul!!! Great job!! I have one suggestion you may not have heard of. Get a roll of 3M 3 " Aluminum tape and put a couple of layers on the inside of the cowl between the opening at the front for the can and the opening for the stinger. Because the material there is so close to the can the heat can affect it and blister your paint. The aluminum tape acts as a shield against the heat. I use this a lot on my planes for heat shielding. I also put a couple of layers around my EI unit to shield RF. Once again, Great Job!!!
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Old 11-17-2007 | 10:11 PM
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Default RE: DL-50 engine

Great! Thanks guys. I'll do what you said about the spark plug wire aerobob. Also I'll pay close attention to the cut out on the pipe. How close was your cut to the pipe when it started to rub, and what happend that was so bad.



Where can I buy that tape Lou. And thanks for the good looks
Old 11-17-2007 | 10:27 PM
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Default RE: DL-50 engine

Any Ace Hardware. BTW If the cowl rubs the pipe it can cut through the aluminum and give the pipe opening a really hasty look around the edges of the fiberglass..
Old 11-18-2007 | 03:53 AM
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Default RE: DL-50 engine


ORIGINAL: cygnet

If you make it shorter it will get even more peaky I would make the header longer or use more prop.

ah silly me [sm=red_smile.gif] im new to gassers as you can tell :P so if i go bigger prop thatll take me up to a 24 " [X(]
is there any way i can rid this by adjusting the throttle curve ?? sorry for all the questions [] im just worried if i try different things myself ill end up getting completely lost with my setup

thanks for replys <3
Old 11-18-2007 | 04:01 AM
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Default RE: DL-50 engine

Nick

Can't really help with the pipe question as I use a cannister, but I have a throttle curve on mine, makes a massive difference. These gas engines are not linear at all and by about 50% carb travel you are almost 75% throttle, so I have really 'softened' the lower end of mine travel to give me a more liner throttle response.

As a starter I run the engine and then adjust the throttle curve so that I get a drop in rpm per click of stick travel.
Old 11-18-2007 | 04:32 AM
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Default RE: DL-50 engine

thx chris, ill give that a go
Old 11-18-2007 | 10:09 AM
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Default RE: DL-50 engine

Throttle curve will not completely remove the step in rpm from a pipe that is too short. It might help a little depending how bad it is. Its probably going to lag until it hits a certain rpm and then take off. Throttle curve may just move that step in relation to throttle stick position.

Not that I pay much attention to it but, I heard you should not drill the prop with three holes all in alignment along the grain, may weaken the prop. Any thoughts?
Old 11-18-2007 | 10:14 AM
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Default RE: DL-50 engine

Flew the final trim flight on my Aviation Models 30% Extra 260 today. Finally got the thrust lines and trims where they need to be, now I have to re-tune my DL!!! LOL Had the low end too lean and it showed. Should be perfect next time. AUW is just over 18 pounds. Here's the edited video, better for entertainment then anything else. Hope ya like music. Enjoy!!![8D][8D]

http://media.putfile.com/Final-Trim-Flight
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Old 11-18-2007 | 10:31 PM
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Default RE: DL-50 engine

If you can't run more run diameter use more pitch or a prop that puts a little more load on the engine
Old 11-18-2007 | 10:38 PM
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Default RE: DL-50 engine

Once the engine is broken in I'm going to a 23B.
Old 11-18-2007 | 10:39 PM
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Default RE: DL-50 engine

Great stuff Lou. Love that extra 260.
Old 11-19-2007 | 05:32 AM
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Default RE: DL-50 engine

Excellent


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