1Jimbo

My Feedback: (2)

Well, I saw my first NERF demo this past weekend. All I can say is, I sure hope they don't ALL fly like that. If so, this is NO way for a newbie to fly combat. They look harder to fly than a real combat plane. Can't even do a loop. Stall stall stall stall stall stall stall stall stall. One of em flew in to the spectators area because it stalled out of control. If that was any example of what the rest of the NERF guys are doing, good luck getting it to last as a class or anything else. EWWW, that was ugly !

John B

My Feedback: (1)

Stallig into the crowd? thatis super scary, think maybe anew setback for that class because of new fliers and bad handling?

1Jimbo

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I'm just hoping this was not the norm for SSC planes. Don't know for sure, this is the only example I've seen so far. Looks like they needed more power or less weight.

LaneO

1Jimbo,

Johnny and I were talking about the SSC planes on the way home Saturday. These planes and class or so new the the designs have not evolved yet. Didn't you try serval designs for your open planes before you chose what you use now? I sure did.

I did learn some things. I am so use t o flying Open B planes and being able to just jerk them around the sky that I had to much throw on the controls of my nerf. I think that why they stall so often. We are trying to fly them like the bigger ones. Thats not going to work.

I was OK with the way mine flew for the most part, but it's not what I will stay with. I going to try a rudder design next. I'll be able to have everything inside and clean up the airframe. Maybe the dihedral will also help the stalling.

We sure had a blast flying with you guys. I was happy I did get a cut in the Nerf demo. To bad it didn't count in the heats (I sure could have used the points

Lane Osbon
Sharks R/C Club

Cajun

Jimbo is right. Our first try at Nerfs left quite a bit to be desired. But look at how much fun it's going to be making them better.

They flew about as good as the pictured Raptor,,,,,,,,,on it's way down

Man, when those Bandits get you, they have no mercy

Ugh, you didn't happen to find my needle valve assembly embedded in the foam did you

Cajun

Cajun

Lane, We enjoyed you and Johnny coming over and flying with us. Be sure and let us know your clubs plans for the October meet. we will try to make the scene.

Bob and I spent the evening in the shop saturday evening and came up with a Nerf wing we flew Sunday. It was 100% better than the one we flew Sat. And, I think we can build some improvements into it.

I'm hoping to have two more wings ready to test Sat.

Cajun

LaneO

Cajun,

Thanks for letting us come fly we you guys. We had a great time. It had been awhile for me to fly a round of combat. To Long...

I have talked to Doug tonight and we are going to meet this week to iron out everything for the meet Oct.27th. As it stands we will fly RCCA Open B and Scale if enough show for that class.
I've also ask for a Nerf demo round.

Hope ya'll get to come, and maybe we can setup some times for this comming season to fly together.

LaneO

1Jimbo

My Feedback: (2)

Good pic Cajun. Look at it long and hard. That's the same planes I been kicking your butt with every single contest for two years.

1Jimbo

My Feedback: (2)

LaneO we will have our NERF planes ready in a short while but they will all be under weight. Can't bring em to a contest like that can we?

1Jimbo

My Feedback: (2)

Hey Cajun, at least my Raptors wings don't fold for no reason like that Bandit did.
You got a picture of that? :stupid:

Cajun

I think Evil Mike hid that one away real quick before I could get a pix. I suspect that one had some undetected damage prior to flying.

Cajun

johnny v

jimbo, we will be using the ssc rules that Lou has posted all over the net.... 2.5# min.......

I agree, we were off by a bunch, but in testing mine out saturday, it is flying better by a bunch... I even tied on a 30' streamer to make sure.... rpms were down because of a trim problem... makes a bunch of diffence with a .15........

I think ssc will work with a .15... but I also think you guys are on the right track with a club level .25 combat plane... If every one will stay with the guidelines and not start buying perf spec mufflers, 30% fuel, ect.... anything will work that is slower than what we fly in RCCA B open... and can really be called Slower and more survivable than RCCA b open planes..... I tried to get a couple of guys 2 yrs ago to fly hat tricks with stock .25s..... 2 to 3 wanted to try it but our local speed combat dude insisted he fly a mvvs21 with tuned pipe..... so back to square one....

1Jimbo

My Feedback: (2)

We plan on doing whatever it takes to match the speeds of your SSC planes. The one and ONLY thing we want to do different is to get GREAT vertical perfomance(not fast). I don't see that as a problem at all.

Tattoo

Now that sounds like a job for a Pizza box!!!

1Jimbo

My Feedback: (2)

Hey Tattoo, does your Pizza box ever go in to a spiral when you try to get it in to a straight hover? Sometimes mine will get in to a spiral that I just can't get it out of. (Only on a straight hover.)

RogerWilson

Yesterday we had a pair of flat bottom foam wings with 432 sq inches of area (I will shorten the cord on subsequent wings and narrow the thickness of the wing from 1.25inch to 1.00 inch) flying SSC with a pizza box (not a good combat plane) and had a blast!!! I believe that you guys are flying aircraft that are meant to be flown very fast to fly well (very aerodynamic that is thin on the ends, fully and semisemetrical wings) with smaller engines that can't pull the airframes fast enough to get enough lift. This is why you are stalling aircraft. The design needs to be made with alot of lift (such as a flat bottom) so that at these slow speeds the aircraft does what you tell it. We flew these slow defenders with stock 25's and .28s, but got our butts kicked by the shreveport crew in class B, but they fly much, much better as SSC ships. I have yet to stall one out. I'll post a picture this afternoon to give you an idea of what we built.

1Jimbo

My Feedback: (2)

I have a two pound sport plane with a Mag.15XL on it and the vertical sucks. That is proof enough for me. Add another half pound to that and it really sucks.
We are going to do a one design, one engine, one prop contest.

Cajun

Jimbo, what prop are you going to use? I've been trying to find low pitch 10" props and they are not available, except for APC. I've tried the 10x4s, and with a light airframe, and most 25s, the speed will approach what we are flying now.

A thick wing might help, but will not slow it down enough to fall into the 40-45 MPH area. A 10x4 prop turning 15K has a speed potential of about 60MPH. My Flippin Disk, with a thick foam airfoil and 3 pounds with a GMS .25 and 10X4 MA prop will probably approach 50/55 MPH, in level flight, possibly more.

I hope you find the right combination, but history has proven in Pylon and Combat, if an engine/prop has the potential to achieve a given top speed, some dudes will be fudging enough to reach this speed. This puts a big burden on the CD to attempt to enforce what is mandated for equipment.

I have no doubts it is possible, but Probable,Hmmmm

This is what happened to Open B. The founders never envisioned the possibility of someone flying a 2.5 lb plane with a Jett .30 engine at 100 MPH. But it happened and it was legal by the rules.

Good Luck.

Cajun

1Jimbo

My Feedback: (2)

I have flown plain bearing .25's(stock) for the better part of 7 years at the beginning of my r/c days and they do not have much power. They are light and cost the same as a brearing .15. We are going to do some testing on props to see which one gives us the desired effect. There is no way in the the world a bushed stock .25 will come even close to the speeds we are flying now. Sorry, I just don't agree with you there. I will test the rpm's on my mag.25gp and let you know but I'll bet it is somewhere in the 12k range with a 9x6 mas.
I have seen the effects of a very thick wing on some fun fly planes and it is pretty dramatic. I have also seen the effects on my planes when you make the center of the wing wider (long center cord length). This alone has added a great deal of drag to my Raptors with out much weight. As for the CD thing, it would be no more trouble than the present SSC rules. It will be very easy to spot a cheater with a single engine/plane/prop/ contest. If you don't have a TT.25GP you can't play, plain and simple. If can't afford to by a $50 engine, to bad. You should have picked a cheaper hobby.
It can work and it will work.

Cajun

The 9x6 prop turning 12K has a speed potential of 72 MPH. Not
exactly slow Nerf speed. And a number of us, L.T. for example could port and retime that thing and add 1500 RPM. And it would not be evident by looking at it from the outside. Now that would add 9 MPH to it's speed potential.

Good luck. I hope you can make it work.

Cajun

1Jimbo

My Feedback: (2)

Did I say we were going to use a 9x6 for combat? NO, I didn't. All I said was I was going to check the RPM's with it so I can get an idea of the RPM range of my engine. Please don't tell me you think that a given engine/prop combo will pull all planes at the same speed. If that were the case I would fly pylon with a Sig Kadet.
You lost me on the LT thing. We ALL have tachs.

Cajun

I would assume if you were going to tach a 9x6 prop you were planning on flying it Otherwise why bother

If I were going to fly a different prop, I would tach the prop I was planning on using

Your right, all planes will not fly the same speed on a given prop, BUT the speed POTENTIAL OF A GIVEN PROP AT A GIVEN rpm IS static with one of the variables in actual speed attained being the shape and cleanliness of the airframe. And if the speed potential is XX MPH, some would be flying planes at that speed.

But, I applaud your efforts at whatever your trying to do, in whatever way your trying to do it, and I wish you luck. I am absolutely convinced something will come of it.

cajun

1Jimbo

My Feedback: (2)

Assume? Why would you do that? I'll tach it with the props I have on hand so I can get an idea about what rpm range the engine is capable of. Why is that hard for you to understand?
We will all be flying the same planes, why is that so hard for you to understand,they will all be going the same speed. Looks like trying to explain something to you is a total waist of time.
You don't applaud anything we are trying to do and you couldn't care less. All you want to do is act like a complete ***.

RogerWilson

Here's a picture of my Nerf Defender. It is perfect for SSC. The AP engines .15 is only turning around 14k with %10 nitro and Topflight 8X4. It doesn't have unlimited vertical, but at 2 lbs has enough to be fun. Flying as slow as these planes are flying the flat bottom flies AWSOME. It is rock solid even in a slow loop. I don't believe the 2.5 lb rule is a good one. The original rules were a great starting point, but we are seeing that the disadvantages (snapping out of turns and hitting spectators, sluggish vertical performance and overall crappy flight characteristics) of an extra 8 oz far outweigh the potential good (slowing down the aircraft). We are seeing that a .15 sized airplane with 400 sq in of wing will generally come out at 2lbs and fly much better than a lead sled at 2.5 lbs. I can see a 2 lb MINIMUM because that would keep the high tech guys out of buying expensive carbon fiber and whatever else they can use to get an edge, but for people's safety and overall flight performance, 2.5 lbs should be the MAXIMUM, not the minimum. This planes wing was cut from foam insulation and uses a coroplast fuselage that bounces rather than shatters like the gutterpipe sometimes does on impact. It is reasonably light (2 lbs) and flies where you put it which is exactly what we want in a safe, fun combat airplane.

RogerWilson

The servo is mounted to the bottom of the wing to keep it safe from impact. We flew two of these in several heats this weekend an had a blast. They fly slow enough to think and process your next move which is something our club members cherish since we are not on the competative scene.