My point was that they fly a very easy, stable platform, not a low power jet. I have more respect for the Brazilians flying Tucanos. Those guys fly 100 times harder than any of the jet teams...they really have to know how to fly, manage energy...everything. It's so much easier in a jet...especially "Grannies Lil Trainer".

Wanna see some real men? Watch "Threshold, a Blue Angles Experience" (clips are on Youtube) back when the Blues flew F-4s. They flew closer then than they do now...much closer then the Reds do and what a show they put on. They flew front line hardware...not leftovers from Training Command.

Beave [sm=devious.gif]

Beave, as a Brit I agree with you, I am an Arrows fan and twice a year we are allowed to fly off their hallowed ground at RAF Scampton which we are all really greatful for but I would be the first to admit they are not in the same class as your BA guys,
Gary.

700 feet is the difference of plowing straight into a crowd, or a hot landing on a highway, or perhaps managing to plow it in where there are no people.

These guys are my heroes. May not have the best equipment but they get to enjoy the best food and wine in the world after each practice session. [8D]

The height isn't the major factor in deciding that... It's where the flame out or problem occurs at.. There are lots of different factors besides height if a person really wanted to get anal about it. There's aircraft speed, windspeed, direction of flight (location of emergency landing areas which are probably pretty few in a congested area period), etc etc etc...

Like I said, probably better at 10000 ft then...

Sometimes I think about all of the rules that we have now and wonder how we ever lived past 10...

Read somewhere that a guy called Richard Bong flew his P38 at lamp post height in a small city street while training .. the local authorities wanted to put him in jail. Obviously his career wasn´t finished as he turned out to be the greatest WWII American ace.


Hard to judge things like this. IMO as long the guy is not flying near the envelope ends of the aircraft, it is OK to do a not too low pass.

I think the lower you fly, the faster you should fly. That way if something happens you can wreck further away They should have been at full afterburner!!!!!

You forgot to mention that Bong was cited and grounded for that incident, and reprimanded by General Kenney.

The B-52 and C-17 crashes mentioned earlier point to individuals flying outside the prescribed envelope and paying for it with other's lives. I understand that those aircraft in no way fly like the aircraft involved in this fly-over, but the minimums are there for a purpose and should strictly be adhered to. Thank goodness nothing has gone wrong with those aircraft flying over the 50,000 spectators.

Bob

Ever been to an airshow? I'd hate to guess what would happen if the solo Blue Angel's rudder would jam or something else on the 400+ mph scare pass. How about the 2 Blue Angels that make the fast low pass from behind the crowd. Or how about the F16 doing the 360 degree horizontal turn (for a time straight back at the 200k+ audience), or.... etc etc etc

Reminds me about what Dave Brown (ex ama pres) said about tech in our hobby. He stated that everything had gone to far, turbines, 3d etc and that everything needed to regress some, and of course that reminds me of the new regs the faa is looking at... Maybe we should put some rubber bumpers on those jets

Of course there was that time that I shot out my eye with that new bb gun at 8 and don't even get me started on the multi casualty incident when I wasn't wearing my helmet on my bike...[:@]

I thought this was the Loud, Open Fire, 200 mph+, passes so low you burn the grass forum. Not the quiet, 3 blade prop, cannister, fly high and 1 at a time imac forum. ARRRRRGGGG ARRRRRRRG ARRRRRRG (just kidding, no one have an aneurysm)

That´s the local official midia version. The reprimend was sending him to apologize and help a woman wich he took away a clothesline with his airplane (no kidding) in her backyard.(!)

He also did some stunts like looping the main section of the golden gate with a P38.. pity there was no cellphone cams at that time!

At the Daytone 500 this past year, there was a low fly by the USAF F-15's. They were low and loud, just the way a fly by should be. It was great, the crowd loved it and I didn't hear a single complaint by any of the spectators around me.

I can understand the difference between an air show where people go to see low and dangerous maneuvers and a stadium fly over where a good part of the crowd does not even know there is to be a fly over. That being said, I believe these things should be done low and fast. We can't all live in a glass bubble forever. If I were at a stadium event where a fly over happened, I would be very disapointed if it were executed at multi-thousands of feet. I would want it low, loud, and fast.

OMG, I want evidence, can anybody cite any accidents on fly overs at sports events.
There are a lot of this spectacles especially now that is football season and not a single accident.
They are cool, people loves it so why spoil the fun, because of what might happen?

I seem to remember a competition between all the top nations jet aerobatic teams a couple of years ago and the teams and others voted............ Guess what the red arrows won.

Your comment 'Real men' makes me smile. So you think flying a jet where you are trained by the tax payer and the plane is paid for by the tax payer makes you a real man........... So how does that work. It is the year 2010 you know do wise up

Hmmm...what comp was that? Who else was there...care to share?

Real men amongst the group within...it's really not that hard to figure out. However...

Beave

I would give them all promotions.

And the FAA wants to regulate our toy jets. Really.



Steve

My dad flies better than your dad.

You seem to remember?Hmmmm. We could all seem to remember things. Doesn't make them true.

There are rules and minimums mandated by the FAA when flying over any open-air assembly. These pilots violated those rules. Safety or not, that violation is grounds for disciplinary action. You may think it's stupid, or not manly to follow regs, but they're there for a very good reason. The minimums are in place to give a reasonable buffer of safety in case something were to go wrong. The TCU at Navy flyover is the worst. If that pilot has a serious failure, bird ingestion, etc. he's not just crashing, he's putting it into the stadium, and the fans in attendance.

The Blue Angels solo in the sneak pass is STILL outside the FAA mandated deadline, and operating within the regulations set forth for the display. When the two solos are approaching from behind the crowd, you'll notice their altitude is SIGNIFICANTLY higher than any other time in the display.

Using the Blues or any other flight demonstration squadron as an example of why it's ok that these pilots violated the filed and approved minimums for their respective fly-by is ridiculous. They're in no way similar.

Sounds like you've got some time in the F/A 18's. Where were you stationed?

Like I said, don't go into one I wasn't using the Blues to justify what was done. Only to show more examples of 'what if'. What if the rudder jammed on the solo high speed pass that forced the jet towards the audience? What if one of the jets coming from behind the crowd had a birdstrike at just the right moment? What if.... Yes, all of those maneuvers by the Blues (undeniably the BEST show out there!!) have been ok'd BUT given the right circumstances could become catastrophic. The first time I saw them was when they were flying in the f4's, unbelievable!!!

Aguila!!



I don't know what it is about the CASA 101 - But I want to build one someday. I don't know of any good CASA kits - it would have to be scratched, I suppose. The AT3 is very similar, but I like the CASA better.

Randy Davis: You've been lurking for... 8 years!!!! Wow, thats got to be an RCU record! Glad you decided to make your first post here. Wish I had been there to see that awesome flyover. A Nascar Track makes a football stadium look puny, so that was probably a great one to see!

Rusty

For me, that is the best use of the tax payers money. Not paying for ungrateful snots to go to college and then they go ballistic when they are asked to pay for more of their own education! hint, hint

+1

+10

G4, Rusty,

I wonder if Plumb Boy knows what "It just got broke off in your ***" means?

Beave