Reindeer

My Feedback: (25)

I know that the merits of these tanks have been discussed before, but as someone who is interested in giving an R/C tank a try, I really would appreciate everyone's thoughts as to what a good path to take would be. My interest is in modern armor, which pretty well narrows my decision. The tank would be primarily for display and bashing, although I wouldn't necessarily want to rule out the possibility for combat. The way I see it, here are my options:

21st Century/Ultimate Soldier 1/9 Abrams:

Pros It's BIG! I like BIG! BIG is good! Detail seems good out of the box, cost seems reasonable, and it gives me plenty of room to tinker.

Cons Oddball size, and just a hair under 36 inches which I understand is the minimum size for sanctioned combat. I’m also concerned that the suspension is too fragile. On a related note it seems that the suspension may be wrong. I thought the Abrams used a torsion suspension. However the picture below shows a suspension similar to that on the Sherman tank.

VS Tanks:

Pros Quality and detail both seem good. Price is such that I could conceivably afford two of them, and recruit others for some combat. On the other hand airsoft option could be interesting… heheheh

Cons Small, really prefer a kit or something I can tinker with. With unscrupulous sellers either trying to pass off Hen Long tanks as the real deal, or charging outrageous shipping fees in some cases, it can make online bargain hunting risky.

Tamiya:

Pros Superior quality and realism. Size is good. Comes in kit form so I actually get to build it up. Plenty of options.

Cons The ONLY option I have here is the Leopard, and of all the Tamiya tanks it is the most expensive. By the time I get it assembled and out in the field, I expect it to be over the $1000 mark, which is a bit too steep to justify for a backyard basher.

Scratch build my own:

Pros Build any kind of tank I want.

Cons I wouldn't even know where to begin a project like this. Doubtful I could begin to come close to the detail and features of the above tanks.

Hen Long:

Not an option! I may be a noob to R/C tanks, but I know junk when I see it!

icecreamslick

My Feedback: (9)

I think that you have a good handle on the pros and cons of the current RC tank market. [sm=thumbup.gif]

If you are interested in new armor, I would suggest that you go with the Tamiya Leopard and damn the money. It is an awesome tank! I want one badly, but I have the Pershing and Sherman, so my wife said no more for at least a year! [X(] .......next tax season.

The only real question that you have to ask yourself is what are you more interested in: affordable fun or quality at a price

If the answer is affordable fun, you can have fun with either the 1:9 Abrams or the 1:24 Abrams or Leopard. The 1:9 is big and impressive, but hard to store and there will be little chance of battling unless you install a paint ball gun. I personally think that my two 1:24 VS tanks, with the IR battle system, are very cool for the money and the owner has the option of sophisticated battle. Plus, you can go farther on upgrades/details and they display well on any shelf.

If it is real quality that you can build and be proud of that you are after, the Tamiya Leopard is the pinnacle..............unless you want to jump up several thousand dollars for a metal 1:8 scale tank.

If I were single, I would aready own a 1:16 Tamiya Leopard.

Good Luck!
Jason

Brimauster

Why does everyone bash the Hen Long's? I got one a few weeks ago for $65 shipped, and it works fine. It's not a smoker and has no sound, but that does not bother me. It has plenty of power, I actually drove it up and over my daughters' legs as she was laying on the floor! The airsoft gun is a wee bit weak, but I'm putting in a CO2 airsoft paintball gun in it eventually. I hear of Tamiya's having problems here and there, so what gives? I like my HL Tiger 1 a lot, and I'll be putting in metal gears, tracks, sprockets and idlers as well. I'm sure I'll also have to beef up the chassis a bit to take the added stress, but no big deal there. If you guys got bad HL's, well then that's just bad luck. Maybe to some people they ARE junk, but not to me. To each his own I guess, but $1000 for an R/C tank is just way too much for me.

And just so you know, Plans are already being made for an all-aluminum reproduction of my Tiger 1! So in effect,my HL will serve very well as a template for a tank that will DEVOUR any plastic tank you or I can think of!

I'm not coming down on anybody in this forum, I just don't know why people hate the Hen Longs.

TANKDUEL

Brimauster, this is my perspective. I have a few Tamiyas and no Hen Longs. Sure, the Tamiya's do need some maintenance, depending on how you use it. But you are one of the lucky ones who got a Hen Long that works, it seems. The number of horror stories I have read about Hen Longs far outweighs those of other brands, so its not a good idea to recommend to someone just starting out in RC tanks to go for a Hen Long , I think. It's a different story for people who are experienced with RC tanks, who know what they are getting, and can do some tinkering on them. If Hen Long would produce something that's not a copy of a Tamiya, I would buy it for sure and 'upgrade' it like I have done with the Wasan T34.
The Tamiyas will last for many years if looked after, and clearly offer the best enjoyment /value for money, that Tamiya Leopard is awesome a couple of my club members have them, save your dough and get that, you won't regret it!
There's a few RC car guys here, how does it work when a newcomer asks on an RC Car forum about getting into your hobby?
Do you tell them to go and buy a $50 car, or do most suggest that they invest in a 'hobby grade' car?

kuhndog599

i never had a problem with my hen long and i put it through hell. well not really htat much but i drive in in rough conditions.

nemesis4u

My Feedback: (77)

I second TANKDUELs Comments... I have owned less quality items and you do get more unlucky with the lower grade stuff... But In order of bang for the buck I personally have 21st Century aka Ultimate SOldier Stuart, Humvee, and 3 Abrams Tanks, I have owned all Tamiya WWII tanks and have driven the Tamiya LEO 2A as well as have driven the 1:24 VS Leo Tanks twice...
for the $$$ and fun I rate it in this order... and this IS THE WORD ACCORDING TO ME!!!
#1 on the list would be ANY TAMIYA TANK ...detail and functions 2nd to NONE!! Yes they are approx 480 for a SHERMAN without radio or battery or BattleSystem or any paint, glue or 48-60 logged hrs of assembly but MAN they have digitally recorded engine sounds, turret, maingun, machine gun and track sounds!!! THey have fully functioning scale suspensions, tracks, and can be built to a museum quality model that will not only win IMPS Scale competitions but also Battle with friends or foes worldwide and yes they last...
#2 VS TANKS Infrared Battle Tanks 1:24 Abrams M1A2 and 1:24 Leo2A5 and Leo2A6 at 89.99 to 109.99 they are simply awesome tanks..have lots of details and do move quite well and handle lots of abuse.. Very cost affordable and give the owner a good intro into IR battles...Not compatible with Tamiya Infrared Battle Systems.. I tried!!
#3 21st Century Stuart, Humvee or Abrams... Just dont drive them too rough b/c they dont have a great resilient suspension like other tanks but yeah they are fun for putting around the school yard or neighborhood and cost about the same on sale as a VS tank .... I love my Abrams Tanks and I dont drive them like I stold them...I drive them cautiously and dont launch them off of curbs or hard surfaces...
#4 HenLong and copy cat tanks that dont have product support................Gamble and 1 out 0f 4 will be ok...
But hey it is only $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ I am looking forward to a new Tamiya Panther or Abrams when it comes available........ I will own all Tamiya tanks soon!! Wife loves them better than GUNS/AMMO and Beer..........

Brimauster

TD and Nemesis, I am new to this hobby, I have never owned an R/C anything until two weeks ago.

Here's MY perspective:

I could have bought a Tamiya for oh, let's say $450.00 or more, Then I would have to build it, and run the risk of screwing it up somehow, which would REALLY pi$$ me off, THEN, I would have to buy and install all the radio gear, which would up the cost even more. Now suppose that after all this, I find that R/c Tanking is not as much fun as I had originally thought... What then? I could sell it on e-bay for a loss and then I still got no hobby... OR... I could get a $50.00 MR. Cheapee r/c tank and decide then, after learning some things, if spending $1000 for an r/c tank is what I want. So in response to your question, I would tell anybody wanting to get into this hobby to do their research like I did, and decide for him or herself if they want to spend $100 or $1000. If and when I ever get a Tamiya, I'm sure I'll love it to death, but for now I'm going to love and learn my HL and if it breaks... well I'll just have to fix it then won't I?

tomzag

My Feedback: (-1)

Brimauster
I had smae perspective. then I learnt that Tamiya tank and cheap one, say HL are different aninals. Tamiya one is very educational, really make you learn how to build good rc tank. that is why I said do not waist your money on HL in other post.
Or at least take your HL and go to some local rc tank club and compare with tamiya one if some one have. and see which one make more sense to you.
HL suspension is even wrong. do not metion all soft details.
Just my 2 cents, you can check my site, there are some pictures of the details of amiya tank, tomsrctanks.com. once you own one, you will love it.

tom

Ben2006

Hello all My name is Ben.. I am 25 years old From Mass..I have a Small (Tamiya) Colletion M26' Pershing..Upgraded With a ''Tiger Mounted Gun'' Probley seen it in ''Toms Rc Website'' He was nice Enough to Post it..Anyways..Im seeking a Fully Built ''M4 Sherman Tank.(56014). With the Works (Full Option) Anyone???Also price has to be under $500.00 Thanks

2000-redrider

My Feedback: (1)

I'm with Brimauster, why not consider a HL 1/16? My brother and I both have a smoke and sound one. He has Tiger and I have the Snow Leopard and we've had no problems with either. You said that it was going to be primarily for display. Many of the problems I've heard with the HL's concern their smoke and bb firing. If this isn't important to you, who cares if it doesn't work. Also, many of the problems are not that difficult to fix. If you were considering a kit or scratch building you'd be doing just as much, if not more to get them to work. Don't get me wrong, I know that HLs are not for everyone. If you looking for something to be perfect right out of the box, it's definitely not for you. But, if you willing to take a chance and maybe put in some work, the HLs may just be the thing. Now if I had the money, I'd get a Tamiya, but I was short about $400+.

WhiteWolf McBride

My Feedback: (3)

Guys:

Many of the HL suppliers ARE backing up their sales because of the bad press. MatoToys is one, and Murphy Ma listens to the guys in the Marui Tank Group. The HL tanks are getting aftermarket stuff much faster than the Tamiya's did... and I say that as the owner of six Tamiya tanks, including two rare Leopard 1A4's.

Reindeer:

You want a less bias'd spin on the Hen Long 1/16 tanks, join the Yahoo Marui Tank Group and ask them, the word of tried and true owners of the product.

(if you cannot find it, e-mail me and I'll shoot you the link, as I'm not allowed to post it)

Stern can also give you a link to a good group over in Germany (posting it is verboten for some odd reason)

I've seen a few clips of them, and they don't look very bad at all. I'll probably buy one later this spring, when Murphy has more stock.

WhiteWolf

tomzag

My Feedback: (-1)

WW, I thought you said you were die-hard Tamiya fan, now we became bias'd spin? [>:]no offense, just world change too fast.

tom

Founder of CEAD

Stang951

Reindeer - If you are even considering the 1:9 Abrams I think that you should also keep the Hen Longs in mind. Do like Tom said and try to find people in your area that have some tanks.
The only thing about the modern armor HL's is that like the VS tanks they are only 1:24 which might not suit your desires. Replacement parts are the only things I have found for the 1:24 HL's and they are only tracks and gearboxes. There might be parts out there for them but I haven't really needed to search for them, so I can't help you there. If you didn't mind the WWI era tanks I'd be more than happy to help as I am in the process of modifying and upgrading my HL Tiger as we speak.
With your criteria I would more than likely buy the VS tanks. You can talk to your LHS (if you have one) and try to order them locally, which might help you out with the online buying problems you noted. You can still detail it any way you want, and it will give you some ideas on how to scratch build one later on if you still desire to do so.

Reindeer

My Feedback: (25)

Thanks for the link! I’ve signed up, will take a look through the messages later on...

LOL! It wasn't my intention to start a Hen Long debate... just more of what a course would be for a good R/C tank. My choice of words might not have been the best, but here is my reasoning against HL.

1. I’ve had a lot of experience over the years going “the cheap route”. Sometimes things work out, but more often than not the product fails a lot sooner, or turns out to be more trouble than it’s worth. It usually ends up being more of a hassle and costing more in the long run than if I had simply gone out and bought a better quality item to start. This has especially proven true when it comes to electronics and copycat items.

2. Something else to consider… if HL tanks are even half-way decent, why are some sellers on eBay going to such great lengths to disguise them as something else? Some of the ads border on fraud… kind of a risky gambit for selling a model if it really is worth getting, no?

3. Opinions are like… well, I’m sure everyone has heard that expression before. Any product is going to have its share of loyal followers and detractors. However, when there seems to be an overwhelming consensus for/against a product, usually there is something to it.

Before anybody says anything, again I am a newbie when it come s to R/C tanks, so I do realize that my opinions in this case are not worth very much.

4. 1/16 HL... I’m going to say it up front that I’m very skeptical about the quality of these tanks. The Toy East website advertises the Tiger at only $31... either they are selling the tank at cost and attempting to make their profit via inflated shipping, or the tank really is that cheap. Considering that I shipped out a couple of planes overseas this last summer, their S+H fees don't seem that far out of line. That leaves the next question... what kind of a model are you going to get for $31, and an RTR at that?

http://www.toyeast.com/v3/pdtdetail...._id=a01400699#

5. 1/24 HL... To me it just isn't worth it. First off, I can get genuine Marui tanks from Tower Hobbies for ~$100 ($110 for the Leopard). Now, if I were to buy 2 tanks as per my idea, the total would be $210. Tower is currently offering $30 off for any order over $199, plus I'm also a Super Saver VIP Ultra Deluxe Preferred Customer Club Member, which translates into free shipping for orders over $150. My family has done TONS of business with Tower over the years, so I know they are trustworthy, and they would offer recourse in the event they sent me a lemon. Bottom line is that I could buy the two tanks and have them shipped to my door for $180. That's probably not very far off from what two HL tanks would cost by the time I had them shipped.

6. FWIW, I’m starting to cool on the idea of the 1/9 Abrams for the above reasons. The main attractions were its size and that there is an attempt at aftermarket upgrades. However, after doing a little more research, I’m beginning to think that perhaps a Bandai tank might be the happy medium… but that’s for another thread.

Stang951

I think your idea about the VS tanks from Tower would be your best bet to get started......and from the sounds of it you already have a handle on things.
Don't worry about the HL debate. It seems to happen all the time. I like my tank, but that is not to say that I wouldn't love a Tamiya, but for the proce I just can't justify it.

3SGTE

My wife said I can't spend more than $80.00 for a toy tank .. So I'm getting a brandnew Henlong Tiger S&S!!!

Rumnhammer

Thats' funny, no way my wife would have let me spend more either, but then I really don't even think I could convince MYSELF to spend tamiya money on a toy tank, much less you guys that have several. For me the rc tank thing is a wimsy, sort of a hey thats really cool, I think I'll pick one up for grins and maybe mod it to look better. I have far too many other things to buy (including food and gasoline) for my 2 year old daughter and pregnant wife, then to dropping close to a grand (including radio and combat module)on some tamiya.
HL all the way for me baby.
ps they are pretty easy to fix.
Chris Rummel

3SGTE

Well you know, some would spend $500.00 on a brandnew Tamiya Tiger full option while I used that money on a set of brandnew Galfer Wave rotors and steel braided lines for my GSXR 600 .. and another $900.00 for a new Alpinestars leather suit (this was a month before I got married which was like 4 months ago . Every lifestyle is different and everyone is an individual .

Reindeer

My Feedback: (25)

I think it's too bad that there isn't more in the mid-range. If somebody put out a reasonable quality 1/16 tank in the $200-$300 bracket, I would pick one up in a heartbeat.

Very true... considering that it's entirely possible to drop $10 grand on an R/C tank!

Shagnifico

The sad thing is that Tamiya is mid-range.

Prices seem to multiply exponentially as you go up in scale.

Good 1/24 scale tank $80

Good 1/16 scale tank $800

Good 1/8 scale tank $8000

Sorry to be such a downer.

Shagnifico

But hey, look at it this way. You crash a $8000 plane you you've probably totaled it. You crash an $8000 tank and you might have scratched the paint.

Themadtanker

Look "with HL well you get what you pay for", how many times have I read this statement, over and over again, I have one, what a load of crap, low quality plastic, with stationary idlers, electronics are just junk, gearboxes are junk, it's just a cheap mass produced bunch of junk.

You could put loads of cash into upgrading one, but why, when you could simply go buy a quality Tamiya tank cheaper than you can rebuild a junk long.

PS…. The China manufacturers know all too well that their line of tanks are crap, just look at the sprockets and idlers....what colour are they new..... Silver, as if they are made of metal, but in reality only cheap plastic and all the fake functions listed on the box that stated that the tank did and almost do now in this second production line!

If the manufacturers cared about this RC Tank, then why are the gears in the gearboxes still plastic? In addition, why are the circuit boards still not covered properly to protect them from dirt?

Answer; they just don’t care; people are buying the junk so why improve the quality.

TANKDUEL

Three cheers for THEMADTANKER, I have never seen any pics of whitewoofs tanks either.

Shagnifico

Look at that wacky suspension. I wouldn't get anything that's not a scale representation of a real tank, that is important to me.

RWTDGhost

Look, I own a heng long tiger and its worked fine for me so far. Im not rich so spending $600 on a RC isnt realistic for me right now. I dont really care that is has plastic bits and pieces, as they can (and have) been upgraded on my tank for under $150. (including tracks) Would I recommend one of the HL tigers for someone getting into this hobby? Of course! What kind of idiot spends $600 on something they've never tried before?! Anyways, Im just tired of all these "tank snobs" (for lack of a better word) shooting down the only thing in my budget at the moment. It works and I can upgrade it as I get more money. Rant mode off