Knowledge Quiz for Warbird wiz
04-03-2018, 03:59 PM
A couple more clues...
1) Aviator was born in the 19th century...
2) to an affluent family...
3) Trained as a Fighter Pilot...
4) Avid Polo player...
5) Member of the Military Polo team, whose leader would become a very famous General in WWII...
6) As mentioned above, "Trained" as a fighter pilot, but never officially flew any war time missions as one...
7) Gregarious, out-going and smooth talking, he had a way of communicating...
8) As a military attache' during the Spanish Civil War, he talked his way into the cockpit of a fighter to get first hand experience of the oppositions potential...
1) Aviator was born in the 19th century...
2) to an affluent family...
3) Trained as a Fighter Pilot...
4) Avid Polo player...
5) Member of the Military Polo team, whose leader would become a very famous General in WWII...
6) As mentioned above, "Trained" as a fighter pilot, but never officially flew any war time missions as one...
7) Gregarious, out-going and smooth talking, he had a way of communicating...
8) As a military attache' during the Spanish Civil War, he talked his way into the cockpit of a fighter to get first hand experience of the oppositions potential...
04-04-2018, 07:37 AM
A couple more clues...
1) Aviator was born in the 19th century...
2) to an affluent family...
3) Trained as a Fighter Pilot...
4) Avid Polo player...
5) Member of the Military Polo team, whose leader would become a very famous General in WWII...
6) As mentioned above, "Trained" as a fighter pilot, but never officially flew any war time missions as one...
7) Gregarious, out-going and smooth talking, he had a way of communicating...
8) As a military attache' during the Spanish Civil War, he talked his way into the cockpit of a fighter to get first hand experience of the oppositions potential...
9) A couple more important lessons were relayed by our quiz person, while he was in Spain...
10) He relayed info stating that Air Forces needed to develop better relations / communications with ground forces...
11) And...that the "Flying Fortress" idea of the Bomber being able to defend itself against enemy fighters, w/o friendly fighter escort, was incorrect...a myth, if you will...
1) Aviator was born in the 19th century...
2) to an affluent family...
3) Trained as a Fighter Pilot...
4) Avid Polo player...
5) Member of the Military Polo team, whose leader would become a very famous General in WWII...
6) As mentioned above, "Trained" as a fighter pilot, but never officially flew any war time missions as one...
7) Gregarious, out-going and smooth talking, he had a way of communicating...
8) As a military attache' during the Spanish Civil War, he talked his way into the cockpit of a fighter to get first hand experience of the oppositions potential...
9) A couple more important lessons were relayed by our quiz person, while he was in Spain...
10) He relayed info stating that Air Forces needed to develop better relations / communications with ground forces...
11) And...that the "Flying Fortress" idea of the Bomber being able to defend itself against enemy fighters, w/o friendly fighter escort, was incorrect...a myth, if you will...
04-04-2018, 12:53 PM
Senior Member
My Feedback: (3)
Proptop; I can't find much info about him, but I do know Lt. Colonel Griffis, the first American killed in Europe in WWII, was an avid polo player and a friend of General Patton. Thanks; Ernie P.
Lt. Colonel Townsend GriffissLt. Colonel Townsend E. Griffiss (April 4, 1900 - February 15, 1942)[1]
[2] was a United States Army aviator, the first American airman killed in Europe, following the United States's entry into World War II. He was born in Buffalo, New York to polo player Ellicott Evans and Katherine Hamlin, both from wealthy New York families. His mother later married San Diego banker Wilmot Griffiss and Townsend took his surname. Known to his family as "Tim", he was raised in the affluent coastal suburb of Coronado, California. Townsend Griffiss graduated from the United States Military Academy in 1922, and joined the United States Army Air Corps.[1]
He trained as a fighter pilot, and between 1925 and 1928 served in Hawaii. His family's wealth allowed him to rent a house on Waikiki Beach, and there he wrote a guidebook When you go to Hawaii you will need this guide to the Islands, which was published in 1930.[1] He shared his birth-father's passion for polo, and joined the military team based in Hawaii, led by Major George S. Patton.[1]After operational postings in California and Texas, Griffiss was assigned to Bolling Field in Washington DC in 1933.[2] This helped him gain connections to allow him to be posted to Europe in 1935 as an air attache, working in Paris and then Berlin. He was then assigned to Spain during the Spanish Civil War, as an observer.[1]
[2]
Returning to Paris, he was awarded the Lιgion d'honneur.[1]Returning to the United States in 1938, he became a student at the Air Corps Tactical School. In 1939 he worked for the Assistant Secretary of War, and then for the War Department Chief of Staff, where in 1940 he was appointed Major.[1]In 1941, with Europe already at war but before the United States had entered World War II, Griffiss was seconded to London. There he was part of the staff of General James E. Chaney, the team was coordinating US military cooperation with the UK in the North Atlantic theater, and organizing the US occupation of Iceland.[1] Ordered to the Soviet Union to discuss planning for US air cargo flights between Alaska and the Russian Far East, he spent two months in Moscow, before moving to Kuibyshev when advancing Nazi Germany forces threatened to overrun Moscow.[1]
Griffiss died in 1942, aged 41, when, on the last leg of his return journey from the Soviet Union, via Cairo, the Consolidated B-24 Liberator in which he was a passenger was mistakenly shot down over the English Channel by Polish fliers in the Royal Air Force (RAF), thus becoming the first American aviator killed in the European Theatre of World War II.[1]Griffiss was posthumously awarded the Army Distinguished Service Medal.[1]
[2]
[3] His body was not recovered; there are memorials to him in Forest Lawn Cemetery, Buffalo and in the Cambridge American Cemetery and Memorial, England.[4
[7]His great-nephew and namesake is Rear Admiral Townsend Griffiss Alexander of the United States Navy.[1
Lt. Colonel Townsend GriffissLt. Colonel Townsend E. Griffiss (April 4, 1900 - February 15, 1942)[1]
[2] was a United States Army aviator, the first American airman killed in Europe, following the United States's entry into World War II. He was born in Buffalo, New York to polo player Ellicott Evans and Katherine Hamlin, both from wealthy New York families. His mother later married San Diego banker Wilmot Griffiss and Townsend took his surname. Known to his family as "Tim", he was raised in the affluent coastal suburb of Coronado, California. Townsend Griffiss graduated from the United States Military Academy in 1922, and joined the United States Army Air Corps.[1]
He trained as a fighter pilot, and between 1925 and 1928 served in Hawaii. His family's wealth allowed him to rent a house on Waikiki Beach, and there he wrote a guidebook When you go to Hawaii you will need this guide to the Islands, which was published in 1930.[1] He shared his birth-father's passion for polo, and joined the military team based in Hawaii, led by Major George S. Patton.[1]After operational postings in California and Texas, Griffiss was assigned to Bolling Field in Washington DC in 1933.[2] This helped him gain connections to allow him to be posted to Europe in 1935 as an air attache, working in Paris and then Berlin. He was then assigned to Spain during the Spanish Civil War, as an observer.[1]
[2]
Returning to Paris, he was awarded the Lιgion d'honneur.[1]Returning to the United States in 1938, he became a student at the Air Corps Tactical School. In 1939 he worked for the Assistant Secretary of War, and then for the War Department Chief of Staff, where in 1940 he was appointed Major.[1]In 1941, with Europe already at war but before the United States had entered World War II, Griffiss was seconded to London. There he was part of the staff of General James E. Chaney, the team was coordinating US military cooperation with the UK in the North Atlantic theater, and organizing the US occupation of Iceland.[1] Ordered to the Soviet Union to discuss planning for US air cargo flights between Alaska and the Russian Far East, he spent two months in Moscow, before moving to Kuibyshev when advancing Nazi Germany forces threatened to overrun Moscow.[1]
Griffiss died in 1942, aged 41, when, on the last leg of his return journey from the Soviet Union, via Cairo, the Consolidated B-24 Liberator in which he was a passenger was mistakenly shot down over the English Channel by Polish fliers in the Royal Air Force (RAF), thus becoming the first American aviator killed in the European Theatre of World War II.[1]Griffiss was posthumously awarded the Army Distinguished Service Medal.[1]
[2]
[3] His body was not recovered; there are memorials to him in Forest Lawn Cemetery, Buffalo and in the Cambridge American Cemetery and Memorial, England.[4
]
Camp Griffiss, a US military base in Bushy Park, London, which served as the European Headquarters for the USAAF from July 1942 to December 1944 and was Dwight Eisenhower's SHAEF headquarters, was named after him. The USAF had originally named the Fort Worth Army Airfield "Griffiss Air Force Base" on 1 January 1948, but the name was changed on 27 February to memorialize native son and Medal of Honor winner, Major Horace Carswell, who gave his life while attempting to crash land his crippled B-24 over China.[5] Later the same year, Rome Air Depot, an Air Corps base in Rome, New York which opened the month Griffiss died, was renamed Griffiss Air Force Base. USAF aircraft operated from there until 1995; it is now Griffiss International Airport and Griffiss Business Park which supports a detachment of the Air Force Research Laboratory.[6][7]His great-nephew and namesake is Rear Admiral Townsend Griffiss Alexander of the United States Navy.[1
Last edited by Ernie P.; 04-04-2018 at 12:55 PM.
04-04-2018, 04:13 PM
You got it Ernie!
I found some previously unknown to me info here...
Townsend Griffiss, forgotten hero of World War II - BBC News
I am less than 2 miles from the active runway...it is KRME Griffiss International Airport now...11,000+ feet long...
The main runway was freshened up a couple of years ago...and can handle the biggest and heaviest there is...
Three of the four main Hangars now house Premier Aviation, a maint. facility...
We flew R/C here from 1972 until 2005...
Many good memories of flying over there...
There is a Drone operation ("corridor") between here (KRME) and Syracuse Airport now...don't know much about it though...
(I kinda lost some interest after I got hurt, but trying to come back to life, so to speak)
You are up sir...
I found some previously unknown to me info here...
Townsend Griffiss, forgotten hero of World War II - BBC News
I am less than 2 miles from the active runway...it is KRME Griffiss International Airport now...11,000+ feet long...
The main runway was freshened up a couple of years ago...and can handle the biggest and heaviest there is...
Three of the four main Hangars now house Premier Aviation, a maint. facility...
We flew R/C here from 1972 until 2005...
Many good memories of flying over there...
There is a Drone operation ("corridor") between here (KRME) and Syracuse Airport now...don't know much about it though...
(I kinda lost some interest after I got hurt, but trying to come back to life, so to speak)
You are up sir...
04-04-2018, 04:28 PM
I found this [art particularly interesting...about borrowing a Russian fighter to get more info on the Me / Bf-109
He convinced them to loan him a Russian fighter plane so he could go up and see what the new Messerschmitt 109s had in them," says Capt Alexander."He tangled on several occasions with the prototypes of the Me 109, which must have given him good information to post back to this country."One of the lessons Griffiss drew was that work needed to be done to develop air forces suited to working in close co-ordination with commanders on the ground.Another was that the fashionable theory that powerfully armed bombers could win a war by themselves was a mistake. Bombers, at least in the limited way they were being used in Spain, did not cause public panic, he noted. He also concluded that fighters would always be necessary to protect bombers and would "remain the decisive factor" in air supremacy.The "flying fortress" idea had died in Spain, he and military attache Stephen Fuqua wrote in 1937, to the irritation of some leading Air Corps figures in Washington.Image caption Griffiss (right) arrived in London at the tail end of the Blitz, as an aide to General James Chaney (left) The war in Europe began five months after the end of the Spanish Civil War. For the first two years the US remained officially neutral, but in September 1940 it agreed to a crucial deal - described by Winston Churchill in his memoirs as "decidedly unneutral" - to provide Britain with 50 badly needed naval destroyers, in return for the lease of military bases in a range of British territories.It was this deal that gave Winston Churchill his cue to tell parliament that "these two great organisations of the English-speaking democracies, the British Empire and the United States... will have to be somewhat mixed up together in some of their affairs, for mutual and general advantage."He went on:"For my own part, looking out upon the future, I do not view the process with any misgivings. I could not stop it if I wished. No-one could stop it. Like the Mississippi, it just keeps rolling along. Let it roll. Let it roll on - full flood, inexorable, irresistible, benignant, to broader lands and better days."It's impossible to know whether Townsend Griffiss had any misgivings about this process, but it formed the backdrop for the last 18 months of his life.He first acted as an adviser from the Air Corps to the US admiral sent to the Caribbean to select the locations for military bases on Bermuda and five West Indian colonies. The wrangling over some of these bases went on until the spring.Then in May 1941 he was sent to London as part of a special observer group (Spobs). This was a military mission by another name. Its members wore civilian clothes, but formed the nucleus of a joint military planning staff, along with a parallel British military mission in Washington. Griffiss was aide to the man in charge in London, Gen James Chaney.Among the remains recovered were some socks belonging to the flight's first officer, some bags of diplomatic mail - which should have sunk, but for some reason floated - and a leather bag belonging to Griffiss.The court of inquiry blamed the Spitfire pilots, Stanislaw Brzeski and Jan Malinowski for failing to identify the Liberator as a friendly aircraft before opening fire, and recommended a court martial - but it was later decided there was insufficient evidence to proceed.Controllers who knew that a Liberator would be arriving on a path over occupied France on the morning of 15 February were also reprimanded for not warning the Exeter fighter sector.The question why the Liberator was not immediately identified on radar screens as a friendly aircraft went unanswered - either its friend-or-foe identification transmitter was not working or it was not switched on.The flashes of light from the Liberator were assumed to be a Morse-code message flashed from an Aldis lamp. But technically the Liberator should have signalled its friendly status by firing a colour-coded flare.One of the key lessons learned from the tragedy was that fighter pilots needed better instruction in the recognition of aircraft - both military and civilian."In view of the important personages carried in civil aircraft, more attention should be paid to the identification of civil aircraft," the court of inquiry recommended.The B24 Liberator was to become one of the most familiar heavy bombers operated by US airmen in Europe, but in February 1942 there were not many around.Stanislaw Brzeski, the first of the Spitfire pilots to shoot, told the inquiry he had never seen a Liberator before. He mistook it for a German Focke-Wulf 200, another four-engined aircraft, usually grey in colour.The dead comprised five crew members and four passengers - Griffiss, a brigadier of the Royal Army Ordnance Corps, a Navy lieutenant and a Rolls Royce employee.In the Air Ministry there was great embarrassment. An approach was made to Air Chief Marshal Charles Portal to write to Gen Chaney, to "ease what may be a difficult and delicate situation to overcome".
He convinced them to loan him a Russian fighter plane so he could go up and see what the new Messerschmitt 109s had in them," says Capt Alexander."He tangled on several occasions with the prototypes of the Me 109, which must have given him good information to post back to this country."One of the lessons Griffiss drew was that work needed to be done to develop air forces suited to working in close co-ordination with commanders on the ground.Another was that the fashionable theory that powerfully armed bombers could win a war by themselves was a mistake. Bombers, at least in the limited way they were being used in Spain, did not cause public panic, he noted. He also concluded that fighters would always be necessary to protect bombers and would "remain the decisive factor" in air supremacy.The "flying fortress" idea had died in Spain, he and military attache Stephen Fuqua wrote in 1937, to the irritation of some leading Air Corps figures in Washington.Image caption Griffiss (right) arrived in London at the tail end of the Blitz, as an aide to General James Chaney (left) The war in Europe began five months after the end of the Spanish Civil War. For the first two years the US remained officially neutral, but in September 1940 it agreed to a crucial deal - described by Winston Churchill in his memoirs as "decidedly unneutral" - to provide Britain with 50 badly needed naval destroyers, in return for the lease of military bases in a range of British territories.It was this deal that gave Winston Churchill his cue to tell parliament that "these two great organisations of the English-speaking democracies, the British Empire and the United States... will have to be somewhat mixed up together in some of their affairs, for mutual and general advantage."He went on:"For my own part, looking out upon the future, I do not view the process with any misgivings. I could not stop it if I wished. No-one could stop it. Like the Mississippi, it just keeps rolling along. Let it roll. Let it roll on - full flood, inexorable, irresistible, benignant, to broader lands and better days."It's impossible to know whether Townsend Griffiss had any misgivings about this process, but it formed the backdrop for the last 18 months of his life.He first acted as an adviser from the Air Corps to the US admiral sent to the Caribbean to select the locations for military bases on Bermuda and five West Indian colonies. The wrangling over some of these bases went on until the spring.Then in May 1941 he was sent to London as part of a special observer group (Spobs). This was a military mission by another name. Its members wore civilian clothes, but formed the nucleus of a joint military planning staff, along with a parallel British military mission in Washington. Griffiss was aide to the man in charge in London, Gen James Chaney.
The Russians were just running us around in circlesJohn Alison, Air observer in Moscow, 1941, future Major General
As well as holding regular meetings with the British operational planning staff, Spobs had to arrange for the pre-agreed American occupation of Iceland, and oversee the construction of naval and air bases in Northern Ireland and Scotland, for the use of US forces if and when they entered the war.But in November Griffiss was detached from Chaney's staff and sent to Moscow, to negotiate with the Soviet government about the opening of a Siberian supply route for American lend-lease aircraft.American aircraft were being sent to the USSR on Arctic convoys from the UK. They could also be flown to the USSR via the Middle East, but a route from Alaska to Siberia made more sense. Soviet diplomats in Washington gave assurances that Moscow was ready to help set up the delivery route, but embassy staff in Moscow were stonewalled whenever they raised the subject.Gen George Marshall sent Griffiss to sort it out. He spent about two months in the Soviet Union trying to get straight answers, first in Moscow, then, when German forces reached the outskirts of the city, in Kuibyshev, the temporary wartime capital.According to John Alison, then attached to the US embassy in the Soviet Union and later one of the fathers of US Air Force special operations, Griffiss got nowhere. "The Russians were just running us around in circles," he recalled, years later.Image caption The UK's first B-24 Liberators were used for civilian flights and coastal patrols rather than bombing Cold weather delayed Griffiss's departure. From Kuibyshev he went to Tehran, and from Tehran to Cairo, where he boarded an unarmed B-24 Liberator operated by the British Overseas Airways Company (BOAC) for a direct flight to the UK.The flight was the first of its kind. The outward journey had been made on 24 January but strong headwinds repeatedly delayed the return trip. In such conditions, the Liberator would have run out of fuel on the traditional route across the Bay of Biscay around Brittany and and along the English Channel from the west.The captain, Humphrey Page, therefore suggested a direct route across occupied Europe at night.The Air Ministry in London signalled approval for the route. But conflicting messages were received from RAF Transport Command, which was against it, and from BOAC which appeared to be in favour. After asking BOAC to confirm its position, and getting no reply, the Liberator took off on the evening of 14 February.The next morning as it reached the coast of northern France, near St Malo, the aircraft appeared on British radar screens, initially registering as hostile. Two Spitfires from a Polish Air Force squadron in Exeter were sent to investigate. As they closed in on the grey-coloured aircraft, one pilot saw a bright flash coming from a glass turret. At the same time - he told the subsequent inquiry - the aircraft turned and began to dive into cloud.Both Spitfires opened fire, the Liberator's right engine was hit and started smoking, and it disappeared from view. Shortly afterwards, emerging beneath the cloud, the pilots saw a large patch of oil and disturbed water.The flight path
- Green line shows the route taken by the Liberator, and the approximate area of the attack, south of Eddystone lighthouse
- Dark line, running south-west to north-east, indicates normal route for friendly aircraft arriving from the Mediterranean
- The aircraft was identified as hostile at 0813, this status being changed to X121 (possibly friendly) two minutes later, and at 0839 to friendly
- It was shot down at about 0850
Inquiry findings
"The cause of the accident was, in our opinion, due to the failure of Flight Sergeant Brzeski and Sergeant Malinowski to identify Liberator AM 918 as a friendly aircraft, resulting in their jointly shooting down the said aircraft."The weather and visibility at the place and time of the interception was such that no excuse on these grounds can be accepted..."The Polish pilots
- The senior Polish Spitfire pilot, Stanislaw Brzeski (pictured left) went on to shoot down a total of seven German aircraft, and to share the credit for three other "kills", before he himself was shot down over France in 1944 and became a PoW at Stalag Luft 3
- He had by this stage reached the rank of Flight Lieutenant - after the war he became a flight controller with the RAF, dying in 1972 at the age of 54
- Jan Malinowski (pictured right) returned to Poland after the war, where, in the 1950s, he helped set up the air emergency medical service - he died in Wroclaw in 1986
Image caption Gen George Marshall made clear to President Roosevelt how deeply he felt Griffiss's loss In his letter, Portal offered his deepest sympathy, adding that the Air Staff would feel Griffiss's loss acutely.
"He was a personal friend of many of them, and no-one could have been a more helpful collaborator," he wrote.
Chaney later communicated the outcome of the court of inquiry to Washington, asking for there to be no publicity.
In a message to President Franklin Roosevelt written by hand on the top of Chaney's message, Gen Marshall described Griffiss as an outstanding officer. "I was bringing him home," he said.Griffiss received the Distinguished Service Medal posthumously for his work in London and in the USSR. The citation said he displayed "rare judgement and devotion to duty" and "contributed materially to the the successful operation of the Special Army Observers Group, London".Just months after Griffiss's ill-fated trip to the USSR, when Britain's hold on Egypt appeared to be weakening and the lend-lease supply route via the Middle East seemed in danger, the Soviet authorities abruptly took a brighter view of the Alaska-Siberia route he had been trying so hard to open up. Starting that summer it became the major pathway for US aircraft deliveries to the Soviet Union - with Soviet pilots collecting the planes from Alaska and flying them home.But if that story quickly acquired a happy ending, members of Griffiss's family lived with their loss for years. His mother died in 1951, while his sister Elizabeth and her husband, Rear-Admiral Ralph Alexander, who had been close to Griffiss, lived until 1982 and 1970 respectively.Captain Richard Alexander, now 89, remembers hearing the news of the accident. He and his brother Bill, both studying at the US Naval Academy in Annapolis, Maryland, were summoned to the telephone in the middle of the night to receive a call from their father."We heard dad on the phone telling us about Tim's loss. I was probably emotionally closer to Tim than my brother and it was quite a blow," he says. "I can remember those hours very clearly."After the war, he named his son, Townsend Griffiss Alexander. Now a rear-admiral commanding the US Navy's Mid Atlantic region, he too, like his namesake, is generally known as Tim.
"He was a personal friend of many of them, and no-one could have been a more helpful collaborator," he wrote.
Chaney later communicated the outcome of the court of inquiry to Washington, asking for there to be no publicity.
In a message to President Franklin Roosevelt written by hand on the top of Chaney's message, Gen Marshall described Griffiss as an outstanding officer. "I was bringing him home," he said.Griffiss received the Distinguished Service Medal posthumously for his work in London and in the USSR. The citation said he displayed "rare judgement and devotion to duty" and "contributed materially to the the successful operation of the Special Army Observers Group, London".Just months after Griffiss's ill-fated trip to the USSR, when Britain's hold on Egypt appeared to be weakening and the lend-lease supply route via the Middle East seemed in danger, the Soviet authorities abruptly took a brighter view of the Alaska-Siberia route he had been trying so hard to open up. Starting that summer it became the major pathway for US aircraft deliveries to the Soviet Union - with Soviet pilots collecting the planes from Alaska and flying them home.But if that story quickly acquired a happy ending, members of Griffiss's family lived with their loss for years. His mother died in 1951, while his sister Elizabeth and her husband, Rear-Admiral Ralph Alexander, who had been close to Griffiss, lived until 1982 and 1970 respectively.Captain Richard Alexander, now 89, remembers hearing the news of the accident. He and his brother Bill, both studying at the US Naval Academy in Annapolis, Maryland, were summoned to the telephone in the middle of the night to receive a call from their father."We heard dad on the phone telling us about Tim's loss. I was probably emotionally closer to Tim than my brother and it was quite a blow," he says. "I can remember those hours very clearly."After the war, he named his son, Townsend Griffiss Alexander. Now a rear-admiral commanding the US Navy's Mid Atlantic region, he too, like his namesake, is generally known as Tim.
04-04-2018, 07:37 PM
Senior Member
My Feedback: (3)
You got it Ernie!
I found some previously unknown to me info here...
Townsend Griffiss, forgotten hero of World War II - BBC News
I am less than 2 miles from the active runway...it is KRME Griffiss International Airport now...11,000+ feet long...
The main runway was freshened up a couple of years ago...and can handle the biggest and heaviest there is...
Three of the four main Hangars now house Premier Aviation, a maint. facility...
We flew R/C here from 1972 until 2005...
Many good memories of flying over there...
There is a Drone operation ("corridor") between here (KRME) and Syracuse Airport now...don't know much about it though...
(I kinda lost some interest after I got hurt, but trying to come back to life, so to speak)
You are up sir...
I found some previously unknown to me info here...
Townsend Griffiss, forgotten hero of World War II - BBC News
I am less than 2 miles from the active runway...it is KRME Griffiss International Airport now...11,000+ feet long...
The main runway was freshened up a couple of years ago...and can handle the biggest and heaviest there is...
Three of the four main Hangars now house Premier Aviation, a maint. facility...
We flew R/C here from 1972 until 2005...
Many good memories of flying over there...
There is a Drone operation ("corridor") between here (KRME) and Syracuse Airport now...don't know much about it though...
(I kinda lost some interest after I got hurt, but trying to come back to life, so to speak)
You are up sir...
04-05-2018, 07:50 AM
Senior Member
My Feedback: (3)
This is a warbird I have been considering as a subject for some time. Unfortunately, not a lot of information is available, so it can't go very long. But it was an interesting warbird. Thanks; Ernie P.
What warbird do I describe?
1. This aircraft was in development for nearly ten years, but never reached production.
2. It was still in development when the war ended; and was not further developed.
What warbird do I describe?
1. This aircraft was in development for nearly ten years, but never reached production.
2. It was still in development when the war ended; and was not further developed.
04-05-2018, 08:07 AM
Thas a goodie Ernie!
Off topic here is part of an email I just received. I hope this means hobby supplies will be a bit more stable in the future.
Off topic here is part of an email I just received. I hope this means hobby supplies will be a bit more stable in the future.
Important Notice Regarding the Sale of Your Personal Information and Your Right to Opt-out
Dear Valued Customer:As you may be aware, Hobby Services' parent company, Hobbico, declared bankruptcy in January 2018 and has initiated a sale process.We are excited to share with you that the RC brands and Hobby Services website that you have come to rely on over the years will continue. The Bankruptcy Court has approved the sale of Hobbico's RC business to Horizon Hobby, LLC. Horizon Hobby has been in business since 1985 and serves customers in the United States and around the World. Horizon Hobby also maintains a strong online presence and warmly welcomes Hobbico customers to its growing family. With this acquisition, Horizon Hobby looks to build upon Hobbico's great reputation for providing quality RC products to customers across the country. More information about Horizon Hobby can be found at https://www.HorizonHobby.com.As part of the sale, Horizon Hobby is purchasing Hobbico's customer databases. The Hobbico Privacy Policy provides that the company will not share any personally identifiable information with any third party without your consent. Under this Privacy Policy, you have the right to opt-out of the sale and the transfer of your personal information to Horizon Hobby, and of receiving future e-mail or mail communications from Horizon Hobby.
04-05-2018, 08:54 AM
Could be or they may have started with the people who contacted Hobbico directly and will wait for the Tower customers after they decide what to do with Tower. I would like to see Tower stay around because they carry a lot of lines Horizon doesn't. My LHS has been scrambling for another outlet for Piano wire and other K&S metal products.
04-05-2018, 04:23 PM
Senior Member
My Feedback: (3)
Evening clue. Thanks; Ernie P.
What warbird do I describe?
1. This aircraft was in development for nearly ten years, but never reached production.
2. It was still in development when the war ended; and was not further developed.
3. This aircraft was designed to be a high speed bomber, able to evade enemy fighters through sheer speed.
What warbird do I describe?
1. This aircraft was in development for nearly ten years, but never reached production.
2. It was still in development when the war ended; and was not further developed.
3. This aircraft was designed to be a high speed bomber, able to evade enemy fighters through sheer speed.
04-06-2018, 02:12 AM
Senior Member
My Feedback: (3)
Today's clue. Thanks; Ernie P.
What warbird do I describe?
1. This aircraft was in development for nearly ten years, but never reached production.
2. It was still in development when the war ended; and was not further developed.
3. This aircraft was designed to be a high speed bomber, able to evade enemy fighters through sheer speed.
4. It used an unusual engine design.
What warbird do I describe?
1. This aircraft was in development for nearly ten years, but never reached production.
2. It was still in development when the war ended; and was not further developed.
3. This aircraft was designed to be a high speed bomber, able to evade enemy fighters through sheer speed.
4. It used an unusual engine design.
04-06-2018, 11:17 AM
Senior Member
My Feedback: (3)
Okay; and an evening clue. Thanks; Ernie P.
What warbird do I describe?
1. This aircraft was in development for nearly ten years, but never reached production.
2. It was still in development when the war ended; and was not further developed.
3. This aircraft was designed to be a high speed bomber, able to evade enemy fighters through sheer speed.
4. It used an unusual engine design.
5. A shortage of engines was a very large part of the reason why the aircraft never reached production.
What warbird do I describe?
1. This aircraft was in development for nearly ten years, but never reached production.
2. It was still in development when the war ended; and was not further developed.
3. This aircraft was designed to be a high speed bomber, able to evade enemy fighters through sheer speed.
4. It used an unusual engine design.
5. A shortage of engines was a very large part of the reason why the aircraft never reached production.
04-06-2018, 07:34 PM
Senior Member
My Feedback: (3)
And here's a bonus clue for participation. Thanks; Ernie P.
What warbird do I describe?
1. This aircraft was in development for nearly ten years, but never reached production.
2. It was still in development when the war ended; and was not further developed.
3. This aircraft was designed to be a high speed bomber, able to evade enemy fighters through sheer speed.
4. It used an unusual engine design.
5. A shortage of engines was a very large part of the reason why the aircraft never reached production.
6. Only a handful of prototypes, and pre-production prototypes were produced.
04-07-2018, 02:05 AM
Senior Member
My Feedback: (3)
What warbird do I describe?
1. This aircraft was in development for nearly ten years, but never reached production.
2. It was still in development when the war ended; and was not further developed.
3. This aircraft was designed to be a high speed bomber, able to evade enemy fighters through sheer speed.
4. It used an unusual engine design.
5. A shortage of engines was a very large part of the reason why the aircraft never reached production.
6. Only a handful of prototypes, and pre-production prototypes were produced.
7. Its design was probably an evolution of a noted previous design.
04-07-2018, 09:57 AM
I just had a hunch...but didn't realize they'd built so many He-177's until looking it up...yesterday...
Hmmm....O.K...to continue along the lines of perhaps unnecessarily overly-complicated designs...
How about the Ju-288?
Hmmm....O.K...to continue along the lines of perhaps unnecessarily overly-complicated designs...
How about the Ju-288?
04-07-2018, 03:30 PM
Senior Member
My Feedback: (3)
What warbird do I describe?
1. This aircraft was in development for nearly ten years, but never reached production.
2. It was still in development when the war ended; and was not further developed.
3. This aircraft was designed to be a high speed bomber, able to evade enemy fighters through sheer speed.
4. It used an unusual engine design.
5. A shortage of engines was a very large part of the reason why the aircraft never reached production.
6. Only a handful of prototypes, and pre-production prototypes were produced.
7. Its design was probably an evolution of a noted previous design.
8. The previous design was very successful, setting several speed records.
04-08-2018, 08:43 AM
Senior Member
My Feedback: (3)
A Sunday clue. Thanks; Ernie P.
What warbird do I describe?
1. This aircraft was in development for nearly ten years, but never reached production.
2. It was still in development when the war ended; and was not further developed.
3. This aircraft was designed to be a high speed bomber, able to evade enemy fighters through sheer speed.
4. It used an unusual engine design.
5. A shortage of engines was a very large part of the reason why the aircraft never reached production.
6. Only a handful of prototypes, and pre-production prototypes were produced.
7. Its design was probably an evolution of a noted previous design.
8. The previous design was very successful, setting several speed records.
9. This new aircraft set a speed record itself.
What warbird do I describe?
1. This aircraft was in development for nearly ten years, but never reached production.
2. It was still in development when the war ended; and was not further developed.
3. This aircraft was designed to be a high speed bomber, able to evade enemy fighters through sheer speed.
4. It used an unusual engine design.
5. A shortage of engines was a very large part of the reason why the aircraft never reached production.
6. Only a handful of prototypes, and pre-production prototypes were produced.
7. Its design was probably an evolution of a noted previous design.
8. The previous design was very successful, setting several speed records.
9. This new aircraft set a speed record itself.
04-08-2018, 08:03 PM
Senior Member
My Feedback: (3)
Not the backfire, elmshoot; but here's a bonus question to reward your participation. Thanks; Ernie P.
What warbird do I describe?
1. This aircraft was in development for nearly ten years, but never reached production.
2. It was still in development when the war ended; and was not further developed.
3. This aircraft was designed to be a high speed bomber, able to evade enemy fighters through sheer speed.
4. It used an unusual engine design.
5. A shortage of engines was a very large part of the reason why the aircraft never reached production.
6. Only a handful of prototypes, and pre-production prototypes were produced.
7. Its design was probably an evolution of a noted previous design.
8. The previous design was very successful, setting several speed records.
9. This new aircraft set a speed record itself.
10. The design was significant in that aerodynamic drag was kept to an absolute minimum.
What warbird do I describe?
1. This aircraft was in development for nearly ten years, but never reached production.
2. It was still in development when the war ended; and was not further developed.
3. This aircraft was designed to be a high speed bomber, able to evade enemy fighters through sheer speed.
4. It used an unusual engine design.
5. A shortage of engines was a very large part of the reason why the aircraft never reached production.
6. Only a handful of prototypes, and pre-production prototypes were produced.
7. Its design was probably an evolution of a noted previous design.
8. The previous design was very successful, setting several speed records.
9. This new aircraft set a speed record itself.
10. The design was significant in that aerodynamic drag was kept to an absolute minimum.
04-09-2018, 01:35 AM
Senior Member
My Feedback: (3)
Morning clue. Thanks; Ernie P.
What warbird do I describe?
1. This aircraft was in development for nearly ten years, but never reached production.
2. It was still in development when the war ended; and was not further developed.
3. This aircraft was designed to be a high speed bomber, able to evade enemy fighters through sheer speed.
4. It used an unusual engine design.
5. A shortage of engines was a very large part of the reason why the aircraft never reached production.
6. Only a handful of prototypes, and pre-production prototypes were produced.
7. Its design was probably an evolution of a noted previous design.
8. The previous design was very successful, setting several speed records.
9. This new aircraft set a speed record itself.
10. The design was significant in that aerodynamic drag was kept to an absolute minimum.
11. Its engine was set very close to the center of gravity.
What warbird do I describe?
1. This aircraft was in development for nearly ten years, but never reached production.
2. It was still in development when the war ended; and was not further developed.
3. This aircraft was designed to be a high speed bomber, able to evade enemy fighters through sheer speed.
4. It used an unusual engine design.
5. A shortage of engines was a very large part of the reason why the aircraft never reached production.
6. Only a handful of prototypes, and pre-production prototypes were produced.
7. Its design was probably an evolution of a noted previous design.
8. The previous design was very successful, setting several speed records.
9. This new aircraft set a speed record itself.
10. The design was significant in that aerodynamic drag was kept to an absolute minimum.
11. Its engine was set very close to the center of gravity.
04-09-2018, 08:17 AM
Senior Member
My Feedback: (3)
After noon clue. Thanks; Ernie P.
What warbird do I describe?
1. This aircraft was in development for nearly ten years, but never reached production.
2. It was still in development when the war ended; and was not further developed.
3. This aircraft was designed to be a high speed bomber, able to evade enemy fighters through sheer speed.
4. It used an unusual engine design.
5. A shortage of engines was a very large part of the reason why the aircraft never reached production.
6. Only a handful of prototypes, and pre-production prototypes were produced.
7. Its design was probably an evolution of a noted previous design.
8. The previous design was very successful, setting several speed records.
9. This new aircraft set a speed record itself.
10. The design was significant in that aerodynamic drag was kept to an absolute minimum.
11. Its engine was set very close to the center of gravity.
12. The first couple of prototypes used retractable landing gear.
What warbird do I describe?
1. This aircraft was in development for nearly ten years, but never reached production.
2. It was still in development when the war ended; and was not further developed.
3. This aircraft was designed to be a high speed bomber, able to evade enemy fighters through sheer speed.
4. It used an unusual engine design.
5. A shortage of engines was a very large part of the reason why the aircraft never reached production.
6. Only a handful of prototypes, and pre-production prototypes were produced.
7. Its design was probably an evolution of a noted previous design.
8. The previous design was very successful, setting several speed records.
9. This new aircraft set a speed record itself.
10. The design was significant in that aerodynamic drag was kept to an absolute minimum.
11. Its engine was set very close to the center of gravity.
12. The first couple of prototypes used retractable landing gear.
04-09-2018, 02:26 PM
Senior Member
My Feedback: (3)
No guesses? Maybe this will help. Thanks; Ernie P.
What warbird do I describe?
1. This aircraft was in development for nearly ten years, but never reached production.
2. It was still in development when the war ended; and was not further developed.
3. This aircraft was designed to be a high speed bomber, able to evade enemy fighters through sheer speed.
4. It used an unusual engine design.
5. A shortage of engines was a very large part of the reason why the aircraft never reached production.
6. Only a handful of prototypes, and pre-production prototypes were produced.
7. Its design was probably an evolution of a noted previous design.
8. The previous design was very successful, setting several speed records.
9. This new aircraft set a speed record itself.
10. The design was significant in that aerodynamic drag was kept to an absolute minimum.
11. Its engine was set very close to the center of gravity.
12. The first couple of prototypes used retractable landing gear.
13. But the third was constructed with floats.
What warbird do I describe?
1. This aircraft was in development for nearly ten years, but never reached production.
2. It was still in development when the war ended; and was not further developed.
3. This aircraft was designed to be a high speed bomber, able to evade enemy fighters through sheer speed.
4. It used an unusual engine design.
5. A shortage of engines was a very large part of the reason why the aircraft never reached production.
6. Only a handful of prototypes, and pre-production prototypes were produced.
7. Its design was probably an evolution of a noted previous design.
8. The previous design was very successful, setting several speed records.
9. This new aircraft set a speed record itself.
10. The design was significant in that aerodynamic drag was kept to an absolute minimum.
11. Its engine was set very close to the center of gravity.
12. The first couple of prototypes used retractable landing gear.
13. But the third was constructed with floats.