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RE: GP Cap 232
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RE: GP Cap 232
Awsome vid...
What engine are you using? Havn't bought one yet but soon.... |
RE: GP Cap 232
it's an o.s. 160.
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RE: GP Cap 232
Vince,
How about listing the complete setup and the changes you made to the airframe along with the weight you are currently at for those who may be considering using the OS160FX in it. |
RE: GP Cap 232
ORIGINAL: Barry Cazier :)One of the things that makes this plane light is the one piece wing. It's hard to carry to the field but easy to install. So, like most things, the one piece wing is great!....and Bad!!!! Thanks Barry Amen brother, well put It's great for those lunch time flights as it takes somewhere around 5 minutes to get it ready. But a royal P.I.A. for transport. I have a Ranger shortbed so the wing sticks out over the tailgate a few inches. As you are finding out as you lean the engine, you'll get less oil spots. At 50:1 you will always have some and at 32:1 you will have even more. On the DA-50 in my Cap, I'm long into 100:1 and I only wipe the plane down after every 5th or 6th flight and then I could go longer if I wanted to (and have at times). I have been using rubbing alcohol to clean planes since my glow days. It's fairly cheap, you usually only need to apply it once and it does not leave any streaks. As far the plane itself, I'm completely happy with mine. It's all trimmed and the mixes are done. About the only thing I have had to do is add 1 degree each in up thrust and right thrust to handle the bigger prop and I shaved about 1/16th of an inch off of the back of the wing saddle. Once I did these, I had to remove my mixes. I only needed 2% elevator at max rudder (all I can get) and that was to hard to mix out. Mine is pretty stock with the pants installed, but not completely: DA50 PT models 23X8 (turning 6700, 22X8 turns close to 7300 and is much better for 3D) Pete's 3.5 inch CF spinner Hitech 5945's on all surfaces Hitech 5875 (I think that's the number) this servo is .08ms on 6 volts and gives great throttle response Smart-fly Optical kill SWB and Airwild servo arms H9 Titanium control rods on the elevators and ailerons Central Hobbies CF control rod on the rudder Weight is 13.75 pounds CG is very neutral. I pull a 45 degree inverted upline and let go of the sticks. I want to see the nose drop ever so slowly (slightly nose heavy, good for IMAC) or just continue in that position (neutral, good all around CG). If the nose pulls up I know I'm tail heavy. Mine stays in the climb without doing anything with a full tank. I have gotten pretty good at doing KE spins with this plane. It winds up almost as tight as my Ultimate does :D. I did get it to tighten up once on a very rapid Waterfall with no altitude loss, but I have not been able to re-create that since [:o] As far as flying qualities, this has got to be one of the best Caps I have flown and I have flown quite a few including the Cap580. I went through a few deadsticks with this plane due to a clogged fuel screen in the DA's carb and quickly found out what a floater this thing is. You can slow this thing to a crawl and not worry about it dropping a wing on low rates, even at the weight I am at. With the Da on the nose, I can do a 25 foot takeoff run, pull straight up and power right out. I do this quite often and I usually hear comments like "that plane is not lacking in vertical", etc... With the trim changes I made, KE if easy as pie to fly, I need no stick inverted to just a touch when inverted (depends on how much fuel I have left), standard and advanced aerobatics are a breeze. You can easily do the Intermediate IMAC sequences with my plane, Lomecvaks (tumbles) are a blast. I do them climbing, inverted and upright. The climbing ones are nice but the inverted ones look the best and all look way better to the left which you would expect since this is a high stress gyroscopic maneuver that is know to remove engines from mounts/firewalls and snap wings off I'm not much of a 3D person but I do fly with whaturi and as you saw in his video, 3D is a none issue with this plane. The only real problem I found on this plane is this: The plane whaturi has is my first one which he fixed. I went into a blender/flatspin and it deadsticked using the Fuji43 (not the engines fault), I came in too hot and had an off field excursion. It never really hit that hard but the front just snapped off just like I took a saw and cut it off. The wing had a very slight dent in it at the root and the cowl was scratched. A quick look revealed little to no glue holding the F1 former in place. I sent pics to GP and the promptly sent a brand new plane. Other than that one issue this plane has held up well to my abuse. Granted not 3D abuse but many high stress things like the tumbles, waterfalls and KE spins. |
RE: GP Cap 232
:)bubbagates...
Great info about this plane. I've wondered myself about adding a bit of up thrust. I have problems pulling out of hovers, not power, but it pulls pretty bad to the wheels when you "snap" full throttle on it. Yet it also seems to be hard to balance in hover and falls backwards. So...I think the upthrust would help with the sudden acceleration (pulling to the wheels) but what would it do with the balance part? That confuses me a bit. Wouldn't it make it fall backwards even more? The waterfalls on this plane are amazing to me. It will just pivot on the wing and stay there. I love the KE also. Overall I really enjoy this plane. As I said, my first gasser...I love it. Thanks Barry |
RE: GP Cap 232
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This plane is one of the better first gassers next to WH. It seems that GP did their homework on the Performance series planes. I have both the Cap and Ultimate from that line and both are excellent. If you go over to rcuvideos.com and look at the Cap in the pic, that is mine, they just reverse the pic, you can tell if you look at the Cap232 logo on the side, it's backwards. I've attached the original pic for reference
you probably have a bit of up trim in it because of the down thrust which could cause the plane to fall backwards in a hover. Think of it this way, your cruising along at 1/2 throttle, you have a click or two of up trim in it to hold it there. Now you plant the throttle and the plane pulls towards the gear as if you trim did not exist. Same thing pointing straight up. In a hover your probably close to half throttle, your up trim is in there but you are not moving so the trim is forcing the plane over backwards do to airflow from the prop in combination with the trim. The other thing could be your rudder to elevator mixes. Most people leave it on all the time which is fine for normal/advanced aerobatics, but in a hover that mix can bite you. Try turing off your mix when going into a hover I cannot hover all that well, so I may be way off base here. I like 3D flight but I'm more of a pattern/IMAC style pilot I noticed my down thrust problem more in a full power climb but only after the plane started to slow down, which with the DA50 does take a while |
RE: GP Cap 232
Is the LG strong enough,looks like its bending just sitting there?
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RE: GP Cap 232
mine weighs 12 pounds 3 ounces. and i used a 14 ounce tank, so i really cut hte weight down. i also use a wood prop for better spool up, because this plane is almost to heavy for 3d with the 160. but it keeps it nice and light on the wing.
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RE: GP Cap 232
:)mixmaster...
The landing gear is plenty strong on this plane. For some reason the camera makes it look "squaty". My pictures look the same way. I think it's because of the way the gear sweeps back. It's not landing gear is not bending. It's make of fiberglass. It flexs nicely without breaking. I really like the LG. It stands up plenty high for my 21" prop. Even on a couple of bouncers I haven't had a prop strike. The landing gear is one of the rather nice features on this plane. Like bubbagates says, "Great Planes got it right with their performance series airplanes. Thanks Barry |
RE: GP Cap 232
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Mix,
As Barry said, it looks flexed but it's not. This landing flexes just enough to turn a not so good landing into something nice and smooth. If you bouce this baby into the air, you either hit pretty hard or really came in hot. The gear on the Ultimate looks the same way. It's exactly the same gear including the bolt holes except they are red. I have a spare set of the red and tried them but it just did not look right, see the pic. It's an old one, there is now a Brison 3.2 on it with a CF prop and spinner. |
RE: GP Cap 232
:)Here's my review of this plane. I'm trying to be as honest and objective as I can. I like the plane but do have some critical opinion as well. My facts are just that, facts. It's the information I personally found out. I'm reviewing this plane as I hope others would. Hopefully this will give you some honest information for you to evaluate whither or not you'd like to own this plane.
I'll start with the engine and do a mini seperate review. Evolution 45GX Weight = 3lbs 6ozs. (DA50R for comparison is 3lbs 4ozs) with ignition Prop = NX 21x8 Muffler = Evolution pitts style Max RPM = 6800 Measured thrust with my trusty, highly accurate fish scale = 19.0 lbs Elevation = 4800' I have 1 3/4 gallons of break in fuel through the engine. It has loosened up some. Initially I only got about 6400 RPM. The oil it came with is pretty darn sticky. I hope that it will spin over 7000 RPM when I change (in about 4 more flights) to the Amsoil 50:1 mixture. This is my first gas engine. I found it very difficult to start. (I couldn't actually ever get it start, even after about 1000 flips) I finally asked and got help here on the internet and via friends (thank you). It had a leaking diaphram and we had to physically prime the engine. After that it fired right up and has ever since. Starting procedure is: Full choke and full throttle. 10-15 flips until she pops. Open the choke, 3-5 flips and it starts. So far I've only had one deadstick (27 flights). That happened on landing 3 feet above the ground. (no problems) The engine makes plenty of power for the 13lbs 5ozs plane it's in. Tranisition is quick and smooth. Overall I'm very impressed with the smoothness of the engine. Vibrates less than my mighty 110s. The midrange power is outstanding. It is super easy to hold power in slow high alpha knife edge and in flat spins and hovers. Transition to full power is also nice. I'm told I should be able to pull a larger prop at a higher RPM to compete with the DA50 (we'll soon find out as I'm building a plane with a DA in it right now) So maybe this engine won't compete with the DA because I don't think it will pull a larger prop. I do think it will loosen up and pull over 7000 RPM once I change to regular oil. At least I hope it does. Many that compare my numbers to their own might not realize I'm at high elevation. It makes a lot of differenct. Overall I'm very satisfied with the reliablity and smoothness and performance of this engine. Thanks Barry |
RE: GP Cap 232
:) Here's my review of this plane. I'm trying to be as honest and objective as I can. I like the plane but do have some critical opinion as well. My facts are just that, facts. It's the information I personally found out. I'm reviewing this plane as I hope others would. Hopefully this will give you some honest information for you to evaluate whither or not you'd like to own this plane.
Plane: Great Planes CAP 232 27% Engine: Evo 45GX Prop: NX 21x8 Price: $325 street price after discounts, freight included Servos: Rudder HS5945, Elevators HS5945, Ailerons HS5645, Throttle HS625 Batteries: NIMH 4.8v 1650 mAH Radio: Futaba 12ZAP Receiver: PCMG3 R5014DPS Weight: 13lbs 5ozs ready to fly less fuel CG: 5 7/8" Wing Load: 26.25 oz/sq ft Power to weight ratio: 1.43 Building: Cost: 9.5 very competitive, one of the least expensive in class Availability: 9.5 available almost anywhere Orientation/visability: 8.5 pretty easy to see but can get confusing sometimes with certain clouds Durability: 9.0 Tailwheel wimped out and came loose. Weight: 10.0 lightest in class. Hardware: 8.5 pretty good stuff. Used all of it except pushrods. Control horns are a little funky Building: 9.0 Excellent manual, easy to follow, no weight required to balance, the way the stab glues makes me nervous but no problems so far Covering: 9.5 monokote, heavy but the best there is Total = 73.5/8 = 9.2 rating Flying: Take off: 9.0 short and sweet Ground handling: 9.5 excellent steering Precision: 8.5 tends to wadle in the turns a bit Rolling Circles: 9.5 easiest plane I've flown to keep level. Very little tail wag. Precise and beautiful. I love a nice rolling circle Hover/Torque Rolls: 8.0 Hard to keep exact. Pulls to wheels with hard throttle. Fastest torque rolls I've ever seen. Can get away if not careful Waterfalls: 10.0 Best I've ever seen. Fast. No elevation drop. Impressive for such a big plane Harriers: 9.0 Easy, little effort required, very little wing rock. Tends to wander a bit Inverted Flat Spin/Blender: 9.0 Very pretty, floaty, won't do a rising FS, tends to roll out with power Upright Flat Spin: 9.0 very pretty, hard to recover from, must use opposite inputs Staircases: 9.5 excellent, quick Snap/spins: 10.0 CAP like, and very fast, violent Knife Edge: 9.5 Some pulling to the wheels, easily mixed out, can do them slow or fast, high alpha/slow is a thing of beauty. Does both ways KE Spin: 9.5 Extremely fast, quick and pretty Landing: 9.0 Floats, easy to land, love the landing gear, but in a stiff breeze flys tail heavy and can be tricky, wants to bounce sometimes Field Assy: 10.0 Easiest plane I have to assemble. Fast and easy Total = 139/15 = 9.3 rating Fun Factor = 9.0 Fun to fly but gives me the "big plane" jitters a bit. Makes me nervous on recovery sometimes. But I love this plane Overall = 9.2 (building) = 9.3 (flying) = 9.0 (fun factor) /3 = 9.2 Overall rating Notes: 1. One piece wing is good and bad. Easy to assembly, keeps the plane super light, but a pain to transport 2. Landing gear is fiberglass and durable but forgiving. I wish all manufactures would use it. Much better than carbon fiber 3. Comes with a decent spinner 4. Robart hinges are easy to use and very strong. I like them 5. ARF quality is first rate. Hardware is B=. Could use better pushrods, horns are weird but I used them 6. Balanced on the CG with no added weight and only .8 oz on right wing tip for lateral balance 7. Lightest plane in it's class, yet seems durable 8. The stab installation makes me nervous. Not much area to glue to. But I did it like the manual says and so far, no problems 9. Engine came off on 3rd flight. I didn't realize how tighte things had to be with a gas engine. My fault, not ARFs. No damage. I was lucky 10. I'm going to add some up thrust. I think this will help with the pulling to the wheels in hover 11. This is my first gas plane. I love it. Great Planes has done an excellent job with this plane. It is an outstanding ARF Thanks Barry |
RE: GP Cap 232
Barry,
The review looks great. From what I've seen of you flying it, the review looks acurate. I think that engine will do better after you get more time on it, but like you stated I don't think it will have the same power as the DA. It is one of the better Caps I've seen in slow and low flight. Handles excellent. |
RE: GP Cap 232
i just got back from the field with mine and i am hammering on this thing. now what i have been doing is going up 1500 or 2000 feet and letting it deadstick, then aerobatics the whole way down. i dive it and then snap.. god! the air whistles around this thing, it sounds like a huge arrow or something! then i bring it around and slow it to a crawl for the deadstick landing. at 12 pounds, this thing is gentle as ever.
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RE: GP Cap 232
People how close it fills to G3 "Matt Chapman" CAP 580, if you had a chance to fly both(I mean sim and plane)? I'm got hooked on the CAP after I been flying CAP 580 on G3 sim. I'm learning a Rolling harrier on G3 CAP 580 is the only plane that I can do consitent five rolls in a strait line, than plane kind of pops into a hover(it used to be droping into a ground after 2 or 2 1/2 rolls two weeks ago).
Whaturi thanks for vid it is awesome. Wounder how accurate this plane(27% CAP 232) to the one in G3 sim? |
RE: GP Cap 232
i fly that one all the time. it is very similar. what i do is reduce the power to make it more liek the real plane. but as far as the airframe, yes they fly similar,. rolling harrier is great on these planes.
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RE: GP Cap 232
whaturi is absolutely correct here. The 27% is very much like the MC 580 on the sim. I never thought of dropping the power on the sim on mine. I'll give that a shot.
I actually have flown/owned both MC 580's (40 size and 1/3 scale, sold them both) and thought they were pretty good though they do have the typical Cap snappiness to them, even on low rates (it's not bad and very predictable) but this 27% just does not have that problem at all. I've tried to force the snappiness and I just cannot get it to do it. I actually watched whaturi go deadstick yesterday and KE, snap and I think a roll or three ;) all the way down to bleed off airspeed to land this thing. Sorta cool to watch... I was just looking over the 2007 IMAC sequences and this years basic is pretty easy but from that point it gets pretty busy once into sportsman and intermediate is just unreal, time to print these out and see how the Cap does http://www.mini-iac.com/DesktopDefault.aspx?tabid=1 (lower left corner) |
RE: GP Cap 232
Hi,
i don't want to spoil the conversation about Real Flight G3 and the MC 580, but this is the right thread for me. I am building the Cap 232 and i just bought a Moki 180 engine. I would really appreciate an advice from you guys: will it be overpowered with this engine or it will be just fine? Thanks a lot! Good flying... |
RE: GP Cap 232
I think you'll be just fine with that engine. Overpowered, yep just a tad. Take a look at whaturi's video. His is an OS160FX which is not quite as powerful as the Moki 180 but more than enough
http://www.hiddenhangarrc.com/video/vincentcap.wmv |
RE: GP Cap 232
Thank you for your comment! And yes i saw the video, it really IMPRESSED me....
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RE: GP Cap 232
:)bubbagates...
I looked at the IMAC sequences but I don't understand them. Is there a place you can go to see a legend of what things mean. Dotted line? Double triangles etc.? Thanks for all your informative posts. They really help. Thanks Barry PS: got no flying in last week. Weather has us rained out. Bummer. |
RE: GP Cap 232
ORIGINAL: Barry Cazier :)bubbagates... I looked at the IMAC sequences but I don't understand them. Is there a place you can go to see a legend of what things mean. Dotted line? Double triangles etc.? Thanks for all your informative posts. They really help. Thanks Barry PS: got no flying in last week. Weather has us rained out. Bummer. Here ya go. A very simple explanation of the symbols http://www.fwthunderbirds.org/IMAC/a...20maneuvers%22 Basically they are called Aresti diagrams, A dotted line is inverted flight, a blank triangle is a positive snap, a filled in triangle is a negative snap and half of a triangle is a half snap, a line with an curved arrow through it is a roll with the direction of the roll at the pilots discretion, a line with an curved arrow attached to it is a half roll, the direction of the roll is at the pilots discretion, a line with an arrow and a fraction means part of a roll so 3/4 would be 3/4 roll while rolls that say 3/4 with a 4 below are 3 points of a 4 point roll. Go to this link, join TFC and look over the 2006 IMAC videos in the Aerobatic section, it gets a lot easier when you can visualize it. http://www.teamflyingcirkus.com/newi...hp?page=Videos Also, Dean Bird and I created individual help documents regarding certain aspects of IMAC flying and competitions. There are a total of 15 documents, all can be found here with links at the bottom of each row to doanload all 15 at the same time. In those docs are links to specific things on how to read Aersti and rules and juding and etc... http://www.teamflyingcirkus.com/newi...?page=imactips Barry, here's a link to the FAI Catalogue. This contains all of the Aersti maneuver. It's really dry reading but worth it if you want to compete. http://www.fai.org/aerobatics/catalog/ |
RE: GP Cap 232
:)bubbagates...
Great info as usual. Thanks. I printed it out and I'm gonna study it. Can't have too much knowledge about what's going on in the hobby. Thanks Barry |
RE: GP Cap 232
ORIGINAL: erizzi Thank you for your comment! And yes i saw the video, it really IMPRESSED me.... One thing I did want to mention that someone else did was once you get the stab in place and the glue is partially set, cut out a bit of the covering on the bottom of the fuselage under the stab, add some glue to the bottom pf the stab where it meets the fuselage the recover. I went so far as to use pieces of balsa triangle in this area since I'm a big fan of low and high speed tumbles. If you do the triangle trick, do not wait for the glue to start setting, do it after the stab is installed and hold the stab in place with masking tape from the top of the fuselage to each stab tip both top and bottom. |
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