Why Hoss?
08-29-2008 | 03:06 PM
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From: Ghost Town
RE: Why Hoss?
Mr. Cain did post his resume and opened himself to questions. He chose to do that. He opened the door to close scrutiny. He has years of written posts from which to judge him. Be it good or bad.
With Mr Cain it is either you like him or you don't like. There are not many in the middle.
To me his thoughts about AMA were clearly stated in his DVP campaign statement published in MA December 1978 page 71.
With Mr Cain it is either you like him or you don't like. There are not many in the middle.
To me his thoughts about AMA were clearly stated in his DVP campaign statement published in MA December 1978 page 71.
08-29-2008 | 03:57 PM
#229
RE: Why Hoss?
ORIGINAL: Kemosobie
Mr. Cain did post his resume and opened himself to questions. He chose to do that. He opened the door to close scrutiny. He has years of written posts from which to judge him. Be it good or bad.
With Mr Cain it is either you like him or you don't like. There are not many in the middle.
To me his thoughts about AMA were clearly stated in his DVP campaign statement published in MA December 1978 page 71.
Mr. Cain did post his resume and opened himself to questions. He chose to do that. He opened the door to close scrutiny. He has years of written posts from which to judge him. Be it good or bad.
With Mr Cain it is either you like him or you don't like. There are not many in the middle.
To me his thoughts about AMA were clearly stated in his DVP campaign statement published in MA December 1978 page 71.
I don't know Mark from Adam's pet cat. Never lived in his district. I don't know where he stands on any issue. I do know that when you have an opportunity to install a watchdog, you want a big ol' Rottweiler. Horrace fits that description. I don't know about Mark. He has not been here yet, and frankly I don't expect to see him on the open forum as well. If you don't have the cajones to walk through this dog pen, when are you going to grow some? Not when you get to Muncie.
Bill, AMA 4720
08-29-2008 | 04:02 PM
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From: Lexington,
KY
RE: Why Hoss?
ORIGINAL: Hossfly
Mitchell, it's both. I am with sorrow that the Leader Members in their uninformed naive state-of-mind passed this ludicrous change to the Bylaws.
Mitchell, it's both. I am with sorrow that the Leader Members in their uninformed naive state-of-mind passed this ludicrous change to the Bylaws.
Do you really expect individuals on the EC to work with you with that kind of approach? Snowball's chance. It's pretty difficult to convince people to follow your lead when you characterize them in such a manner when they disagree with you.
49% of all leader members supported the change. These are individuals who have been so chosen because of their level of involvement in the sport. Previously you've essentially written off most of the AMA members in terms of their involvement with AMA, after all they can't even pick up their own trash, can they? Now you've essentially written off half of the AMA leadership......the half that chose to vote, for Pete's sake.
Who is left Horace? Who is there left for you to lead?
βIt is a terrible thing to look over your shoulder when you are
trying to lead β and find no one there.β
Franklin D. Roosevelt
08-29-2008 | 04:06 PM
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From: Bloomington,
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RE: Why Hoss?
ORIGINAL: Stickbuilder
Without getting on a personal attack (your description not mine)
Without getting on a personal attack (your description not mine)
It is not Data Privacy when the information is readily available to anyone; eg. The published Telephone Directory. So how did you construe that this information is private?
My name is private information. I can choose to give it at will, just as I can other information. You may wish to gloss everything inconvenient to you over, but the fact is that the query tool provides more private information than that which is put into it. This is not something you can or should argue about.
That, however, is a minor point. It's the willful misappropriation of an AMA database that is troubling. Horrace is using the database for a purpose other than that for which it was made available. He's doing it to satisfy personal desires, rather than any sort of AMA business. He has no problem with this. I have asked him about it, and he will not address my concerns. Do you want him having access to considerably more information? I do not. I do not believe he can or should be trusted with it.
I'll spell all of this out for you. You may argue and whine and call names, but here is what is happening. Horrace has this idea in his head that he wants to only speak with AMA members. He can't tell anyone apart here, so he has decided that he'll verify memberships. What a fine idea, right? Unfortunately, it's very far from an effective method of accomplishing his goal. Let's say some less than ethical person wants to ask Horrace a question. How hard is it to grab a last name and an AMA number from the forums here? Many of you gleefully give out such information, being ignorant of how others may use it. Horrace can't actually verify that a given poster is an AMA member. All he can do is verify that a given name and AMA number belongs to an AMA member.
That's ineffective. A name is not tied to a user account here at RCU. I wouldn't want someone representing themselves as me, and you wouldn't want someone representing themselves as you. The only thing that Horrace is accomplishing is the encouragement of identity theft. Dishonest people will always be dishonest, and Horrace's little game won't prevent that.
This is what I mean when I say it's ineffective. His method can't accomplish his goals. He hasn't thought the process through. He's willing to improperly use an AMA database to create red tape, and doing the whole thing in a way that cannot accomplish his goal. That is not leadership, nor is it an intelligent use of AMA resources.
Yes, I would, could, and given the opportunity will, behave in the same manner face to face as I type on the keyboard. Being older does not mean that I've forgotten how.
08-29-2008 | 04:19 PM
#232
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RE: Why Hoss?
I will apologize that this thread has deteriorated to such a low point. I am on the road in Dayton covering an airshow for RCU and I haven't had much time on the keyboard until now. But the behavior of some in this thread is completely out of line. The personal insults, jab, and attacks STOP RIGHT NOW. If I see any more of this childish name calling we'll start looking at handing out some "time outs" to those doing it. I am sorry if that sounds like a kindergarten teacher admonishing the classs, but right now that's how I feel about the behavior of some in this thread. For those out there that this does not apply to I apologize for this post, but for those that it does apply to please consider this your last warning to stop acting like a child. IT ENDS NOW.
Thank you.
Ken
Thank you.
Ken
08-29-2008 | 04:20 PM
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From: Lexington,
KY
RE: Why Hoss?
ORIGINAL: Jim Messer
I would dare to say that Hoss, (who I do not know, and have never met), still has done more in his lifetime, to promote the model aviation hobby, than you three will ever do, in your combined lifetimes.
I would dare to say that Hoss, (who I do not know, and have never met), still has done more in his lifetime, to promote the model aviation hobby, than you three will ever do, in your combined lifetimes.
I don't question Horrace's knowledge, involvement or passion for RC modeling, and have said so. What I question and doubt is his ability to be effective in the position.
08-29-2008 | 04:21 PM
#234
RE: Why Hoss?
ORIGINAL: MikeL
Calling someone a nimrod, amongst other things, isn't a personal attack? The reason I don't often participate here is just that sort of intellectual dishonesty. Heck, that's not just intellectual dishonesty, it's plain old lying.
Some of you are rather stuck on this. It's much like a child telling his parents that other kids get to do it, so why can't he?
My name is private information. I can choose to give it at will, just as I can other information. You may wish to gloss everything inconvenient to you over, but the fact is that the query tool provides more private information than that which is put into it. This is not something you can or should argue about.
That, however, is a minor point. It's the willful misappropriation of an AMA database that is troubling. Horrace is using the database for a purpose other than that for which it was made available. He's doing it to satisfy personal desires, rather than any sort of AMA business. He has no problem with this. I have asked him about it, and he will not address my concerns. Do you want him having access to considerably more information? I do not. I do not believe he can or should be trusted with it.
I'll spell all of this out for you. You may argue and whine and call names, but here is what is happening. Horrace has this idea in his head that he wants to only speak with AMA members. He can't tell anyone apart here, so he has decided that he'll verify memberships. What a fine idea, right? Unfortunately, it's very far from an effective method of accomplishing his goal. Let's say some less than ethical person wants to ask Horrace a question. How hard is it to grab a last name and an AMA number from the forums here? Many of you gleefully give out such information, being ignorant of how others may use it. Horrace can't actually verify that a given poster is an AMA member. All he can do is verify that a given name and AMA number belongs to an AMA member.
That's ineffective. A name is not tied to a user account here at RCU. I wouldn't want someone representing themselves as me, and you wouldn't want someone representing themselves as you. The only thing that Horrace is accomplishing is the encouragement of identity theft. Dishonest people will always be dishonest, and Horrace's little game won't prevent that.
This is what I mean when I say it's ineffective. His method can't accomplish his goals. He hasn't thought the process through. He's willing to improperly use an AMA database to create red tape, and doing the whole thing in a way that cannot accomplish his goal. That is not leadership, nor is it an intelligent use of AMA resources.
Did I make a mistake by insinuating that you might be a polite, thoughtful, well-spoken man in person? Let me apologize in advance if I did.
ORIGINAL: Stickbuilder
Without getting on a personal attack (your description not mine)
Without getting on a personal attack (your description not mine)
It is not Data Privacy when the information is readily available to anyone; eg. The published Telephone Directory. So how did you construe that this information is private?
My name is private information. I can choose to give it at will, just as I can other information. You may wish to gloss everything inconvenient to you over, but the fact is that the query tool provides more private information than that which is put into it. This is not something you can or should argue about.
That, however, is a minor point. It's the willful misappropriation of an AMA database that is troubling. Horrace is using the database for a purpose other than that for which it was made available. He's doing it to satisfy personal desires, rather than any sort of AMA business. He has no problem with this. I have asked him about it, and he will not address my concerns. Do you want him having access to considerably more information? I do not. I do not believe he can or should be trusted with it.
I'll spell all of this out for you. You may argue and whine and call names, but here is what is happening. Horrace has this idea in his head that he wants to only speak with AMA members. He can't tell anyone apart here, so he has decided that he'll verify memberships. What a fine idea, right? Unfortunately, it's very far from an effective method of accomplishing his goal. Let's say some less than ethical person wants to ask Horrace a question. How hard is it to grab a last name and an AMA number from the forums here? Many of you gleefully give out such information, being ignorant of how others may use it. Horrace can't actually verify that a given poster is an AMA member. All he can do is verify that a given name and AMA number belongs to an AMA member.
That's ineffective. A name is not tied to a user account here at RCU. I wouldn't want someone representing themselves as me, and you wouldn't want someone representing themselves as you. The only thing that Horrace is accomplishing is the encouragement of identity theft. Dishonest people will always be dishonest, and Horrace's little game won't prevent that.
This is what I mean when I say it's ineffective. His method can't accomplish his goals. He hasn't thought the process through. He's willing to improperly use an AMA database to create red tape, and doing the whole thing in a way that cannot accomplish his goal. That is not leadership, nor is it an intelligent use of AMA resources.
Yes, I would, could, and given the opportunity will, behave in the same manner face to face as I type on the keyboard. Being older does not mean that I've forgotten how.
Now get over it, or get on with it. You can't get my logon information from the AMA. I do my corresponding with other AMA members here on RCU. So knowing my name and AMA number won't get you anywhere. When you look at a post or a pm from me, there is no doubt from whom it came. Your argument does not hold water. As before, you can look me up in the phone book, and find my address and Zip Code. The only thing more that you can get from the AMA is my member number. Your argument is weak.
Bill, AMA 4720
Bill, AMA 4720
08-29-2008 | 04:21 PM
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From: Ghost Town
RE: Why Hoss?
ORIGINAL: Stickbuilder
Instead of making this a popularity contest, why not use the record of what each of the individuals has accomplished in regard to the AMA. It's not about who you would like to have over to dinner. It's about who will get the job done. Never mind the bodies left in the road, there is a clean up crew (grounds care) to take care of that.
I don't know Mark from Adam's pet cat. Never lived in his district. I don't know where he stands on any issue. I do know that when you have an opportunity to install a watchdog, you want a big ol' Rottweiler. Horrace fits that description. I don't know about Mark. He has not been here yet, and frankly I don't expect to see him on the open forum as well. If you don't have the cajones to walk through this dog pen, when are you going to grow some? Not when you get to Muncie.
Bill, AMA 4720
ORIGINAL: Kemosobie
Mr. Cain did post his resume and opened himself to questions. He chose to do that. He opened the door to close scrutiny. He has years of written posts from which to judge him. Be it good or bad.
With Mr Cain it is either you like him or you don't like. There are not many in the middle.
To me his thoughts about AMA were clearly stated in his DVP campaign statement published in MA December 1978 page 71.
Mr. Cain did post his resume and opened himself to questions. He chose to do that. He opened the door to close scrutiny. He has years of written posts from which to judge him. Be it good or bad.
With Mr Cain it is either you like him or you don't like. There are not many in the middle.
To me his thoughts about AMA were clearly stated in his DVP campaign statement published in MA December 1978 page 71.
I don't know Mark from Adam's pet cat. Never lived in his district. I don't know where he stands on any issue. I do know that when you have an opportunity to install a watchdog, you want a big ol' Rottweiler. Horrace fits that description. I don't know about Mark. He has not been here yet, and frankly I don't expect to see him on the open forum as well. If you don't have the cajones to walk through this dog pen, when are you going to grow some? Not when you get to Muncie.
Bill, AMA 4720
08-29-2008 | 04:41 PM
#236
RE: Why Hoss?
ORIGINAL: Kemosobie
No one expects you to know the issues. Remember MA straight to the trashcan.
ORIGINAL: Stickbuilder
Instead of making this a popularity contest, why not use the record of what each of the individuals has accomplished in regard to the AMA. It's not about who you would like to have over to dinner. It's about who will get the job done. Never mind the bodies left in the road, there is a clean up crew (grounds care) to take care of that.
I don't know Mark from Adam's pet cat. Never lived in his district. I don't know where he stands on any issue. I do know that when you have an opportunity to install a watchdog, you want a big ol' Rottweiler. Horrace fits that description. I don't know about Mark. He has not been here yet, and frankly I don't expect to see him on the open forum as well. If you don't have the cajones to walk through this dog pen, when are you going to grow some? Not when you get to Muncie.
Bill, AMA 4720
ORIGINAL: Kemosobie
Mr. Cain did post his resume and opened himself to questions. He chose to do that. He opened the door to close scrutiny. He has years of written posts from which to judge him. Be it good or bad.
With Mr Cain it is either you like him or you don't like. There are not many in the middle.
To me his thoughts about AMA were clearly stated in his DVP campaign statement published in MA December 1978 page 71.
Mr. Cain did post his resume and opened himself to questions. He chose to do that. He opened the door to close scrutiny. He has years of written posts from which to judge him. Be it good or bad.
With Mr Cain it is either you like him or you don't like. There are not many in the middle.
To me his thoughts about AMA were clearly stated in his DVP campaign statement published in MA December 1978 page 71.
I don't know Mark from Adam's pet cat. Never lived in his district. I don't know where he stands on any issue. I do know that when you have an opportunity to install a watchdog, you want a big ol' Rottweiler. Horrace fits that description. I don't know about Mark. He has not been here yet, and frankly I don't expect to see him on the open forum as well. If you don't have the cajones to walk through this dog pen, when are you going to grow some? Not when you get to Muncie.
Bill, AMA 4720
Bill, AMA 4720
08-29-2008 | 04:43 PM
#237
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From: Bloomington,
MN
RE: Why Hoss?
ORIGINAL: Stickbuilder
Now get over it, or get on with it. You can't get my logon information from the AMA. I do my corresponding with other AMA members here on RCU. So knowing my name and AMA number won't get you anywhere. When you look at a post or a pm from me, there is no doubt from whom it came. Your argument does not hold water. As before, you can look me up in the phone book, and find my address and Zip Code. The only thing more that you can get from the AMA is my member number. Your argument is weak.
Bill, AMA 4720
Bill, AMA 4720
Now get over it, or get on with it. You can't get my logon information from the AMA. I do my corresponding with other AMA members here on RCU. So knowing my name and AMA number won't get you anywhere. When you look at a post or a pm from me, there is no doubt from whom it came. Your argument does not hold water. As before, you can look me up in the phone book, and find my address and Zip Code. The only thing more that you can get from the AMA is my member number. Your argument is weak.
Bill, AMA 4720
Bill, AMA 4720
Saying that I can't get your login information from the AMA is a red-herring. I've never stated such a thing. How you do your correspondence is up to you, again, it has nothing to do with what I've said.
You say that when a person looks at a post from you, they have no doubt where it came from. That's fine, especially if they know you. Say that a fellow with the RCU name of Avistar2 signs his name with Willard Smith, AMA 459203. Say there is a Willard Smith with that AMA number. Do you know that Avistar2 is Willard Smith? Of course not. No more than I know that Stickbuilder is Bill, AMA 4720. Are you now beginning to see what is obvious, or do you require additional examples of how Horrace's method is ineffective?
08-29-2008 | 04:55 PM
#239
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RE: Why Hoss?
ORIGINAL: Bob Mitchell
Who is left Horace? Who is there left for you to lead?
βIt is a terrible thing to look over your shoulder when you are
trying to lead β and find no one there.β
Franklin D. Roosevelt
Who is left Horace? Who is there left for you to lead?
βIt is a terrible thing to look over your shoulder when you are
trying to lead β and find no one there.β
Franklin D. Roosevelt
Bob, FDR was the closest thing to having a dictator for President this country has ever had. Probably not the best man for the job to quote in this case
08-29-2008 | 04:56 PM
#240
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From: Bloomington,
MN
RE: Why Hoss?
ORIGINAL: Stickbuilder
But you can't sign on wiith his user name without his password.
Bill, AMA 4720
But you can't sign on wiith his user name without his password.
Bill, AMA 4720
If someone wants to beat Horrace's little game, they certainly can. The hurdles he has thrown up are simply ineffective and unable to meet his stated purpose. So he's misappropriating and AMA database for personal use, and he's not even accomplishing anything useful in doing that.
08-29-2008 | 05:06 PM
#241
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From: San Antonio,
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RE: Why Hoss?
Stick
Just let it go.
He will never accept that he gave his information to an organization that publicizes it.
He has a problem with the people that read the phone book rather than the company that makes the phone book, and that dont make a lick of sense.
Good thing he didnt get an unsolicited DVD in the mail or Directory Opt Out letter.
Would that be Hoss' fault too
Just let it go.
He will never accept that he gave his information to an organization that publicizes it.
He has a problem with the people that read the phone book rather than the company that makes the phone book, and that dont make a lick of sense.
Good thing he didnt get an unsolicited DVD in the mail or Directory Opt Out letter.
Would that be Hoss' fault too
08-29-2008 | 05:17 PM
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From: The Ozarks,
MO
RE: Why Hoss?
ORIGINAL: MikeL
What's that got to do with the price of tea in China? Identity theft is the misappropriation of personal information, used to represent oneself as someone else. Do you know that Avistar2 is not Willard Smith? Willard Smith, in this hypothetical, certainly is an AMA member, but he may not be Avistar2. He might have done as you've done, and given his name and AMA number to anyone and everyone. He may just be a club member who's name and number Avistar2 has found.
If someone wants to beat Horrace's little game, they certainly can. The hurdles he has thrown up are simply ineffective and unable to meet his stated purpose. So he's misappropriating and AMA database for personal use, and he's not even accomplishing anything useful in doing that.
ORIGINAL: Stickbuilder
But you can't sign on wiith his user name without his password.
Bill, AMA 4720
But you can't sign on wiith his user name without his password.
Bill, AMA 4720
If someone wants to beat Horrace's little game, they certainly can. The hurdles he has thrown up are simply ineffective and unable to meet his stated purpose. So he's misappropriating and AMA database for personal use, and he's not even accomplishing anything useful in doing that.
Hey ol buddy, I think you have gone a little to far with this statement. You remind me of my neighbor that is really paranoid and/or somebody that is trying to hide from something and/or someone.
08-29-2008 | 05:23 PM
#244
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From: Bloomington,
MN
RE: Why Hoss?
ORIGINAL: The Toolman
Hey ol buddy, I think you have gone a little to far with this statement. You remind me of my neighbor that is really paranoid and/or somebody that is trying to hide from something and/or someone.
Hey ol buddy, I think you have gone a little to far with this statement. You remind me of my neighbor that is really paranoid and/or somebody that is trying to hide from something and/or someone.
08-29-2008 | 05:23 PM
#245
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From: Lexington,
KY
RE: Why Hoss?
ORIGINAL: combatpigg
Bob, FDR was the closest thing to having a dictator for President this country has ever had. Probably not the best man for the job to quote in this case
ORIGINAL: Bob Mitchell
Who is left Horace? Who is there left for you to lead?
βIt is a terrible thing to look over your shoulder when you are
trying to lead β and find no one there.β
Franklin D. Roosevelt
Who is left Horace? Who is there left for you to lead?
βIt is a terrible thing to look over your shoulder when you are
trying to lead β and find no one there.β
Franklin D. Roosevelt
Bob, FDR was the closest thing to having a dictator for President this country has ever had. Probably not the best man for the job to quote in this case
I suspect if I looked hard enough I could find something that George Bush has said with which I could agree completely. Or you, for that matter.
08-29-2008 | 05:31 PM
#246
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RE: Why Hoss?
I think Hoss had hopes of limiting the conversation to those who have ERNEST AMA related concerns. By asking for your name and AMA number, that is like asking for "ernest money" in a real estate transaction. It keeps the "tire kickers" from cluttering things up.
What were you thinking, Hoss?
Too bad the focus of the job at hand and of the relevant issues has been bogged down with this "Enemy of the State", kind of stuff.
Now if I could only figure out a way to ditch those flat black helocopters while I'm logged on here........
What were you thinking, Hoss?
Too bad the focus of the job at hand and of the relevant issues has been bogged down with this "Enemy of the State", kind of stuff.
Now if I could only figure out a way to ditch those flat black helocopters while I'm logged on here........
08-29-2008 | 05:50 PM
#247
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From: Bloomington,
MN
RE: Why Hoss?
Again, please tell me how his chosen method achieves that goal. None of you have tried doing that. Tell me what is to keep Joe Blow from grabbing someone else's name and AMA number. Absolutely nothing. What is the point of Horrace's game?
08-29-2008 | 06:08 PM
#248
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RE: Why Hoss?
Mike, his intended goal for the upper forum didn't totally pan out. It did become a mess. Who can we blame for that?
Bob, FDR was a much loved man and was perfect for the times. On a completely different subject, Hoss is the guy who could introduce the AMA to the concept of running their operation as if it was a competitive business.
Bob, FDR was a much loved man and was perfect for the times. On a completely different subject, Hoss is the guy who could introduce the AMA to the concept of running their operation as if it was a competitive business.
08-29-2008 | 06:20 PM
#250
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RE: Why Hoss?
It sure is comforting to know that we have an internet crime expert here in out midst? I wonder how he feels about being on the same side of this issue as another guy who has been revealed [here] to be an intellectual property pirate?
If that guy had any sense of shame, he would not post here anymore, he would just crawl off somewhere and croak.
If that guy had any sense of shame, he would not post here anymore, he would just crawl off somewhere and croak.
