Phoenix Giles 202
11-04-2005 | 11:55 AM
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From: Wichita,
KS
RE: Phoenix Giles 202
Eyeguy-
Thank you for your very thought out lesson on snap problems, angle-of-attack and CG effects, and transmitter program settings on high-wing loading aerobatic airplanes. I will certainly use your suggestions on my Giles G-202, and my yet-to-be-built Matt Chapman CAP 580...
Thank you for your very thought out lesson on snap problems, angle-of-attack and CG effects, and transmitter program settings on high-wing loading aerobatic airplanes. I will certainly use your suggestions on my Giles G-202, and my yet-to-be-built Matt Chapman CAP 580...
11-04-2005 | 09:36 PM
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From: Austin,
TX
RE: Phoenix Giles 202
Thanks for the info.
I do have low and high rates. I fly it mostly on high rates. When I'm going fast, I can pull up without it snapping. But when cruising at slow speed, it'll snap when I yank the elevator. On 3D planes, when you yank the elevator, it just pops the nose up. I wish this plane would do that. But heck it's fine as is right now. I like the way it flies. I have done a bit of hovering up high, but it drops right out. I don't think this plane is capable of full 3D.
Question! How the heck do you get this plane into a spin? I've tried doing a blender but at the end, it just spins tail high. It's not a complete flat spin. I only tried it once. It was kinda windy so I was practicing my landings instead.
-Tomi
I do have low and high rates. I fly it mostly on high rates. When I'm going fast, I can pull up without it snapping. But when cruising at slow speed, it'll snap when I yank the elevator. On 3D planes, when you yank the elevator, it just pops the nose up. I wish this plane would do that. But heck it's fine as is right now. I like the way it flies. I have done a bit of hovering up high, but it drops right out. I don't think this plane is capable of full 3D.
Question! How the heck do you get this plane into a spin? I've tried doing a blender but at the end, it just spins tail high. It's not a complete flat spin. I only tried it once. It was kinda windy so I was practicing my landings instead.
-Tomi
11-04-2005 | 09:42 PM
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From: Austin,
TX
RE: Phoenix Giles 202
Oh I also forgot to mention. The elevator stock configuration uses one push rod on one side of the elevator. Perhaps one side could be lagging a bit causing the tail to act as a elevons making it snap. I'm sure it will help if you use a Y pushrod for the elevator to evenly push/pull the elevator up and down...
-Tomi
-Tomi
11-04-2005 | 10:40 PM
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From: Cranbrook,
BC, CANADA
RE: Phoenix Giles 202
We fly our airplanes by looking at how they respond to the transmitter stick movement - thus you constantly adjust the amount of stick movement that you use to what you want the airplane to do. At higher speed all control surfaces become more sensitive to stick movement because of increased airflow over them ( that is why pylon racers have small control surfaces and use small amounts of control throw ) When pulling up at speed the plane will respond briskly to even the slightest stick movement and you automatically (sub-consciously ! ) down-tone the amount of stick movement that you use. When flying fast you may think that you "yanked" the stick up but that is unlikely. Really "yanking" the stick abruptly full back at high rates, at full throttle will most like not only cause a snap, but may even test the structural integrity of the whole airframe ! ! At slow speed the airplane response to stick movement becomes much more sluggish and automatically you will use much more stick movement. That is where the "yank" comes in that causes a slow speed snap. These differences in the amount of stick movement is easy to see when watching someone's hands when they fly at different speeds. There may be a slight uneven motion of the two elevators because of the control rod issue as you mentioned, but even if the movement was excactly the same it will still snap.
11-04-2005 | 10:47 PM
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From: Austin,
TX
RE: Phoenix Giles 202
I never had this problem until I started flying glow. This is my first glow plane. I call it my trainer plane. hehe..
I fly slope gliders. These things go fast. I've never done a snap on my gliders at full speed coming in from a dive before. From simple 48" EPP foam wings, to Vtail hand launched gliders, to 2 meter Slope racing planes. Never had one snap on me before. Dynamic soaring with these planes require less input into the control surfaces becuase, like you said, the faster you go the less input you need because it will be more sensitive. I think it's the design of the Giles that is making it snappy. I could be wrong, but this is my experience.
thanks for the info..
-Tomi
I fly slope gliders. These things go fast. I've never done a snap on my gliders at full speed coming in from a dive before. From simple 48" EPP foam wings, to Vtail hand launched gliders, to 2 meter Slope racing planes. Never had one snap on me before. Dynamic soaring with these planes require less input into the control surfaces becuase, like you said, the faster you go the less input you need because it will be more sensitive. I think it's the design of the Giles that is making it snappy. I could be wrong, but this is my experience.
thanks for the info..
-Tomi
11-06-2005 | 01:15 AM
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From: Cranbrook,
BC, CANADA
RE: Phoenix Giles 202
You are right on the button Tomi ! The Giles ( and the Cap 232, and the Edge 540, and the Extra 300, and the Sukhoi 31, and the Yak 54 etc....) are all designed to be highly maneuverable, and to be that they have to be a bit "unstable" in flight. Try to snap roll a Sig LT 40 or a Goldberg Eagle - no way they won't, but they are so boringly stable in flight that they aren't much fun to fly. Planes that can snap are way more fun !
01-05-2006 | 10:50 PM
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From: Wichita,
KS
RE: Phoenix Giles 202
I have just completed the engine change on my Giles from an O.S. 46FX to a Saito .80 4S. The dry weight is now at 6 lbs. 14 oz. and it required 1 1/4 ounces added to the tail for balance. From what I can figure, the wing loading is very close to 30 oz./sq. ft.
I hope to fly her tomorrow for the first time with the new configuration, and I will be using a 13x6 APC prop; any warnings or suggestions? It flew very pretty with the FX on it, but was a dog in the performance department on takeoff and climbing.
I am hoping the new engine will help it realize its' full potential...
I hope to fly her tomorrow for the first time with the new configuration, and I will be using a 13x6 APC prop; any warnings or suggestions? It flew very pretty with the FX on it, but was a dog in the performance department on takeoff and climbing.
I am hoping the new engine will help it realize its' full potential...
03-23-2006 | 12:46 PM
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From: Škofja Loka, SLOVENIA
RE: Phoenix Giles 202
Hello !
I am flying Giles for 2 months now.
I put ASP 70 4 stroke on it and APC 13x6.
Superb flying and what a fun !!
Landings are a bit fast but a mixed alerons as a flaps.
Enjoy !
Andrej from Slovenia
I am flying Giles for 2 months now.
I put ASP 70 4 stroke on it and APC 13x6.
Superb flying and what a fun !!
Landings are a bit fast but a mixed alerons as a flaps.
Enjoy !
Andrej from Slovenia
09-07-2006 | 12:13 PM
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From: , MN
RE: Phoenix Giles 202
Hello, This is my first time posting any questions on here. Please be kind to the newbie. 
I recently acquired a phoenix giles 202. I was wondering if I dared to strap a .61 size engine to it???? Also, I was wondering if anyone knew how I could get my hands on an owners manual??? Any help would be appreciated.
I recently acquired a phoenix giles 202. I was wondering if I dared to strap a .61 size engine to it???? Also, I was wondering if anyone knew how I could get my hands on an owners manual??? Any help would be appreciated.
09-11-2006 | 12:10 AM
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From: BogotaCundinamarca, COLOMBIA
RE: Phoenix Giles 202
Hi!
I recently bought a Phoenix Giles 202 ARF. Firstly I agree with all the people that have written about the quality it's awesome! this is my 4th ARF plane and this is best that I have seen. Well, I'm writing because I've seen that this plane has lot of problems according to some comments in this forum.
I'll use an MVVS .49 with mini pipe with an 11x5 APC propeller, I live in Bogota - Colombia this mean 2600 mts. over sea level I'm not sure if this engine is not enough to power this plane because mostly people have changed the engine, any idea if this engine is ok for this plane? have anyone tried this before?
Any recommendations about something to improve or change to avoid first flight crashes?
thanks!
Ricardo
I recently bought a Phoenix Giles 202 ARF. Firstly I agree with all the people that have written about the quality it's awesome! this is my 4th ARF plane and this is best that I have seen. Well, I'm writing because I've seen that this plane has lot of problems according to some comments in this forum.
I'll use an MVVS .49 with mini pipe with an 11x5 APC propeller, I live in Bogota - Colombia this mean 2600 mts. over sea level I'm not sure if this engine is not enough to power this plane because mostly people have changed the engine, any idea if this engine is ok for this plane? have anyone tried this before?
Any recommendations about something to improve or change to avoid first flight crashes?
thanks!
Ricardo
01-13-2009 | 10:02 AM
#114
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From: Big Rapids,
MI
RE: Phoenix Giles 202
I agree that the wing bolt plate in the fuse needs more reinforcing. I have all my hinges pined & used carbon push rod (thekind inside of another tube) for the rear elevator & rudder. I see that this airplane has flutter problems, I have not seen it yet, but I have not flown it enough to try it out. I will add smome epoxy & Fiberglass tape to the fude between the wing joiner & LE of wing. My g-202 is being flown with the OS .46FX, Plenty of power, I dont know what your talking about. Just took it off with 3" of snow on the ground on top of tall grass. Ha to balance it with 1 3/4 OZ lead under the engine in the cowl & 3/4 OZ of the tip of the left wing. Flys great!!!
From what I have heard it needs to tone down the speed, Im currently running a 11x6 so I will most likely move to a 11x4 or 12x3.5 or 12x4.....
Fly Safe & Have Fun................UPWARD
From what I have heard it needs to tone down the speed, Im currently running a 11x6 so I will most likely move to a 11x4 or 12x3.5 or 12x4.....
Fly Safe & Have Fun................UPWARD
01-19-2009 | 09:30 AM
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From: , TX
RE: Phoenix Giles 202
I currently maidened the phoenix sukhoi last week and it is an excellent plane. You guys seem to be worry about flutter problems and you should if you are using a big two stroke engine that hauls @$$. I did not bother doing a Y connection to the elevator because im using a magnum .70 four stroke on mine so I compensated speed for power. Dont be afraid to use a bigger engine. Here are some reasons I chose the .70. It has more than enough power to climb unlimited vertical, sounds great, no need to deal with it after properly broken in, and its not uncontrolably fast especially on landings. Just remember, to avoid snapping ALWAYS fly with adequate power if making a turn. Heck I make my final turn to landing at half throttle and then cut down to an idle and it will slow down just fine. The giles seems like a great flyer from what ive heard and does turn heads. Giles though need a lot of runway to take off and if using a big four stroke, dont be afraid to move that CG a little bit foward say 5mm. After all you do have a 12mm margin I believe. Also, phoenix may have stopped this, but they used to hide a massive lead weight under the bottom part of the firewall in the interior. Fish it out! its useless.
Happy flying!
Ayrton
Happy flying!
Ayrton
04-01-2009 | 06:09 AM
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From: , TX
RE: Phoenix Giles 202
I just bought the giles 202 from phoenix and im excited to start the build. I had a sukhoi from them which was well built, had good hardware, and great covering. I am expecting the same out of this model. I noticed that this kit comes with 2 balsa rods for rudder and elevator as seen in a few pictures. My sukhoi was supposed to come with the same hardware but when I opened the box, I was surprised to see that they had actually already installed plastic housings leading to the tail of the fuse supplied with two long metal rods. It worked out great and prevented flutter. Does anybody with a newer model giles seen this setup? As for the plane, it looks great and has a metallic blue finish on the blue stripes. I have a cmp giles that fly's bautifully and had a blast with it. Here is the setup for my new ship
O.S. 55 AX with 13x6 APC prop
Futaba EXA6 with 5 s3003 servos
Omega 10%
Cant wait to get it in. Thanks in advance for a response.
Ayrton
O.S. 55 AX with 13x6 APC prop
Futaba EXA6 with 5 s3003 servos
Omega 10%
Cant wait to get it in. Thanks in advance for a response.
Ayrton
09-07-2010 | 03:47 PM
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From: , MI
RE: Phoenix Giles 202
Hello,
I am currently finishing up the build on a a phoenix Giles 202. I have a couple questions from you guys. The instructions for the plane are terrible and it looks like the plane in the instructions is an older version of the plane I have............so It seems like I have extra pars . First of all it seems that phoenix is trying to address the flutter issue with "New Improve" aluminum control horns and clevises. Has anyone flown with these horns? I only have the aileron nervo hooked up to one side of the elevator...........should I figure out a way to mod the plane to hook up both sides?
The gas tank they sent with the plane has a small lip on the bottom that I have never seen on any ARF that I have built. I cant fully push the stopper thru the firewall. Also the stopper is about 2/3 the size of the hole in the firewall. Did they send the wrong tank.........or am I just stupid?
The model came with no engine mounting hardware. And a new plastic engine mount..we will see how that goes.
I was planning on using a OS LA46 but Now after reading all the reviews on this plane I'm thinking about an new os55ax.
I have a great planes .40 extra 300s with a OS 46ax that I love. It flies so nice. I'm hoping to have a similar experience with this plane.
The plane is almost done and it looks sweet.........I hope it flies like it looks. ANY ADVICE??????????????
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I am currently finishing up the build on a a phoenix Giles 202. I have a couple questions from you guys. The instructions for the plane are terrible and it looks like the plane in the instructions is an older version of the plane I have............so It seems like I have extra pars . First of all it seems that phoenix is trying to address the flutter issue with "New Improve" aluminum control horns and clevises. Has anyone flown with these horns? I only have the aileron nervo hooked up to one side of the elevator...........should I figure out a way to mod the plane to hook up both sides?
The gas tank they sent with the plane has a small lip on the bottom that I have never seen on any ARF that I have built. I cant fully push the stopper thru the firewall. Also the stopper is about 2/3 the size of the hole in the firewall. Did they send the wrong tank.........or am I just stupid?
The model came with no engine mounting hardware. And a new plastic engine mount..we will see how that goes.
I was planning on using a OS LA46 but Now after reading all the reviews on this plane I'm thinking about an new os55ax.
I have a great planes .40 extra 300s with a OS 46ax that I love. It flies so nice. I'm hoping to have a similar experience with this plane.
The plane is almost done and it looks sweet.........I hope it flies like it looks. ANY ADVICE??????????????
<br type="_moz"/>
09-16-2010 | 09:08 PM
#118
RE: Phoenix Giles 202
ORIGINAL: m1morrow
Hello,
I am currently finishing up the build on a a phoenix Giles 202. I have a couple questions from you guys. The instructions for the plane are terrible and it looks like the plane in the instructions is an older version of the plane I have............so It seems like I have extra pars . First of all it seems that phoenix is trying to address the flutter issue with ''New Improve'' aluminum control horns and clevises. Has anyone flown with these horns? I only have the aileron nervo hooked up to one side of the elevator...........should I figure out a way to mod the plane to hook up both sides?
The gas tank they sent with the plane has a small lip on the bottom that I have never seen on any ARF that I have built. I cant fully push the stopper thru the firewall. Also the stopper is about 2/3 the size of the hole in the firewall. Did they send the wrong tank.........or am I just stupid?
The model came with no engine mounting hardware. And a new plastic engine mount..we will see how that goes.
I was planning on using a OS LA46 but Now after reading all the reviews on this plane I'm thinking about an new os55ax.
I have a great planes .40 extra 300s with a OS 46ax that I love. It flies so nice. I'm hoping to have a similar experience with this plane.
The plane is almost done and it looks sweet.........I hope it flies like it looks. ANY ADVICE??????????????
<br type=''_moz''/>
Hello,
I am currently finishing up the build on a a phoenix Giles 202. I have a couple questions from you guys. The instructions for the plane are terrible and it looks like the plane in the instructions is an older version of the plane I have............so It seems like I have extra pars . First of all it seems that phoenix is trying to address the flutter issue with ''New Improve'' aluminum control horns and clevises. Has anyone flown with these horns? I only have the aileron nervo hooked up to one side of the elevator...........should I figure out a way to mod the plane to hook up both sides?
The gas tank they sent with the plane has a small lip on the bottom that I have never seen on any ARF that I have built. I cant fully push the stopper thru the firewall. Also the stopper is about 2/3 the size of the hole in the firewall. Did they send the wrong tank.........or am I just stupid?
The model came with no engine mounting hardware. And a new plastic engine mount..we will see how that goes.
I was planning on using a OS LA46 but Now after reading all the reviews on this plane I'm thinking about an new os55ax.
I have a great planes .40 extra 300s with a OS 46ax that I love. It flies so nice. I'm hoping to have a similar experience with this plane.
The plane is almost done and it looks sweet.........I hope it flies like it looks. ANY ADVICE??????????????
<br type=''_moz''/>
I hope you're moving right along with finishing up your Phoenix Models Giles 202 ARF!
The fuel tank and firewall cut-out aren't a problem, the tank and stopper are designed to sit behind the firewall rather than having the neck of the tank poking through. This is normal, and actually helps isolate the tank from fuselage vibration.
The Phoenix ARF you have isn't particularly light. You might find it a bit heavy for a .46 LA. A .65 LA or a .55 AX wouldn't be too much power, but a .46 AX would probably fly it quite well also.
Hopefully this clears up a couple of things for you. Please post any updates to your progress, pictures, or flight reports!
09-19-2010 | 09:10 PM
#119
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From: , MI
RE: Phoenix Giles 202
I just finished finished my Giles today. Maiden Voyage was successful. My brother and I put a 55AX in the model......AWESOME ENGINE......so smooth.........This plane screams. Its very Slippery.
Unfortunately during the 4th flight coming out of a loop, Flutter tore up the right aileron servo........ I was lucky enough to catch it quickly and slow it down.
I brought the plane in for a landing safely. I'm thinking that the low pressure on top of the wing was enough to stress out the servo.
I love this plane and I want to continue flying it but I don't want this to happen again. Does anyone have a suggestion?
Unfortunately during the 4th flight coming out of a loop, Flutter tore up the right aileron servo........ I was lucky enough to catch it quickly and slow it down.
I brought the plane in for a landing safely. I'm thinking that the low pressure on top of the wing was enough to stress out the servo.
I love this plane and I want to continue flying it but I don't want this to happen again. Does anyone have a suggestion?
