rowdyjoe

My Feedback: (9)

My Camel is ready for an engine test run. Iinstalled the fuel DOT and routed the plumbing last night. I also turned the weight around so it wouldn't interfere with the cowl. I drilled it off-center and I'm now I'm glad I did. I plan to put a 2 oz. Higley hub on the prop shaft to add a bit more weight up front. I also have a 4 oz. if the 2 isn't enough. She's balancing just a tad toward the tail and I think the hub will do the trick.
The cowl fits snug with nothing rubbing that Ican see or feel.

RJ

Azzir325

If I was you I'd make the first flight with the 4 ounce, and if she flies well, try the 2 ounce. If that goes well, try a prop nut, but if it's like mine, it'll get squirrely without the heavy hub. I'm very interested to hear how the flights go, but even more interested in how the landings go. I want to know if moving the lead down low helps or not.

I reset my drill press for its lowest speed (620) and got one hole drilled OK. Just need to locate and drill the second hole and get the bolts/brackets to hold it in place. Thanks for the tips!

PS: Remember to hold the tail down in the early part of your take offs. This is equally important whether you have a tail wheel or a skid. Good luck!
Rick

PPS: The Biplane Bash was a smash! I flew my D VII and my Giant Aeromaster and was rubbing elbows with Top Gun winners all day. I also won about 200 dollars worth of swag for a 20 dollar investment in raffle tickets! Sweet!!

rowdyjoe

My Feedback: (9)

Great Rick. Glad you had a good time. It's always great to get together with like-minded folks and do your thing. Did you get any good autographs?
Great return on your $20 investment. Kinda makes you want to do it again, don't it? Have you marked it on next year's calendar yet?

Igot the little FA-80GK started today but, had a few trials and errors. Fuel tank plumbing, throttle linkage, glow starter extension came loose, flying wires vibrating loose ....all that stuff you want to find wrong on the ground rather than in the air.
She's running at idle and mid throttle fine but, top end doesn't want to tune properly ....Ican't get her to peak. May be a dirty HSneedle. I'll have to pull it and clean it after Ido some studying on the tuning procedure. I'll monkey with it more tomorrow.

Glad you got the "brick"drilled. The last hole will be the best one.

RJ

Azzir325

I don't ask for autographs. The guys are just regular folks, quite happy to make your acquaintance and pass the time of day with you. Also very ready to share tips and techniques. One of them, Roy Vaillencourt (Vailly Aviation) and his partner Dave Wigley come to our club annually and give seminars on their amazing builds. Sal Calvagna (writes the Giant Scale column for Model Aviation) is a funny and fun guy to hang with. Mitch Epstein who placed high in Top Gun with his AMR Waco a few years back was also on hand with his 1/3rd scale Stearman today. He flew it with another 3rd scale Stearman. All in all, a great bunch of guys. I go to a lot of events every year and I always invest in raffles at events. The odds are good, and the prizes are very cool.

I don't know what to tell you about your engine. It might be just what you say. I had an OS 91 four stroker that seemed to run fine until I lifted my Mud Duck with it. It quit cold in mid climb and the Duck hit hard. It's on my channel on YouTube. I tore down the carb, washed all components in glow fuel, put it back together and it ran great.

Oh yeah, about the flying wires, if you want them on your plane, you must tie a wire thru the turnbuckles or they simply will fall off every time.

rowdyjoe

My Feedback: (9)

OK Rick,
Just joking about the autographs. I know what you mean when you say they're just regular guys. I've had the pleasure of meeting a few folks with large reputations in our hobby and find they are the same every where you go. Really nice folks. That's what keeps me in this hobby ....the people. The planes, etc. are a really good excuse to get together with good people and have fun. Oh, I've run in to a couple of jerks but, even they turned out to be OK after their bluff was called.
Iremoved the HS and LSneedles and sprayed her down with carb cleaner and wiped the grime off the needles (not much there really). When trying to start her up again I noticed bubbles in the fuel line so Ihave something else going on. I'll re-plumb the factory-plumbed tank (should have known better) and give it another try. The copper tube for the pressure side is too short and doesn't go to the top of the tank (can't get a full tank that way)and Ineed to replace it with a longer one. Ialso may have a hole or crack, etc. in the fuel feed line in the tank. Will find out shortly. Right now, I have an ice pack on my sore lower back. Getting old is for the birds.

RJ

Azzir325

I couldn't have said it better. I have been an aviation buff since an early age. In my pre married life, I earned my Private and accumulated some 250 or so hours. Since then, my full scale time is pretty much zilch, but since my divorce 10 plus years ago I found RC and have pretty much adopted it as my main hobby. My fleet is way bigger then I want but it is hard to divest yourself as each plane has a story and a piece of my heart. I try to avoid getting any more, but they just keep coming. At least the model I won at the Biplane Bash is a small Dumas kit which can live in its box for a long time in a small space.

So I love the planes and I go to a lot of events each season, but it's the people I see and talk to that makes it worth while. Sure, I fly some, and watch a LOT, but the good friends I have made over the seasons are the real reason.

You don't have to tell me about sore backs. I live with chronic lower back pain, and it sucks the joy out of life, but I keep going on. My shoulders and neck aren't doing so good any more either. I'll be 60 come March. I'm grateful tho. I am in better shape then many men younger then me.
Rick

rowdyjoe

My Feedback: (9)

Just finished running he Saito attached to my Camel and got it idling well but, still need to tweak it. Peak rpm is not correct for the prop I'm running so have to keep at it 'til Iget there or find the problem (which is probably between my ears).
I posted a cry for help on the Saito Club thread and there are some real experts there who are very willing to help.

Sorry to hear about your back pain. Ican't say mine is chronic but, when Iover-do-it, I suffer. Ihate to take pills so, Iusually use ice and/or a heating pad but, if it gets too bad for me to sleep I'll take a pain pill or two. I'll be 67 next month and hoping I'll see many more BDs but, God is in control so Itry to stay ready.

When Iwas active duty Air Force, Iused my GI Bill to get my commercial and multi-engine tickets. We had an outstanding aeroclub on the base and Itook advantage of it and took the opportunity to fly a variety of different planes. Much later, after Iretired, I bought a two place homebuilt and flew it for a couple of years and sold it. Ihaven't looked at my logbook in a very long time but, I think I'm somewhere around 450 hrs. Like you, they priced me out of the market so, I make do with RC. It's not the same but, it will do. Ihave loved airplanes since I was in elementary school. My Dad was in the AAF during WWII.
I've been looking at FPV lately and thinking it's as close as one could get to driving a real plane. Imight give it a try. Prices are coming down but, I need to do much more research before I take the jump.

I guess I'm going to have to safety wire the turnbuckles for the flying wires. Threadlock is not working too well. The stuff Ibought cures so fast it's difficult to get the bolts tightened up before it locks. Ihave a couple of wires that need wiring but, I'll do them all just in case.

RJ

rowdyjoe

My Feedback: (9)

RJ's Camel saga; cont'd

I'm having engine problems and I've got it narrowed down to the carb. Can't get it tuned properly. I've ordered a gasket kit and a rebuild/upgrade kit for the carb and I'm betting that it will cure my engine tuning problems. The guys on the Saito Club site have been helpful, as usual, and one fella suggested that Ichange the intake O ring. That was a good suggestion but, I figured if it needed one O ring, all of the gaskets probably needed to be replaced. The new high speed needle, etc in the carb kit will also help.
The parts won't be in until next week so, the first flight will be postponed at least another week.

RJ

rowdyjoe

My Feedback: (9)

RJ's continuing Camel saga;
Got the parts in for the carb overhaul and installed them a couple of days ago. Haven't started the engine to test it yet. I'm still reworking the mounting system for the weight ...need longer bolts.

RJ

rowdyjoe

My Feedback: (9)

Update:
Since my last post I've installed new bearings in the engine and rebuilt the carb. I didn't like the sound I was getting when turning the prop through by hand and the front bearing was leaking oil/fuel. The carb was difficult to adjust and just could not find the sweet spot. After rebuild it was working better but, that's when I decided to replace the bearings. So, a new set of Boca stainless bearings are now installed and I'm ready to re-install the engine in the plane and fire it up.
I've read that the rebuild/upgrade kit makes the carb a bit touchy to tune but, it will be worth the effort to get the engine running right. A good tachometer will make things a bit easier.
Ihave reattached and adjusted the flying wires but, need to safety wire the turnbuckles so they won't loosen again. They tend to loosen with the vibration of the 4 stroke engine.
I hope to have it in the air for first flight in a few days. I'll post the results here.

RJ

roknHS

Just read all this thread......nearly 50 pages. I've got a camel NIB I want to get going..........Has anyone used the DLE 20 on this? I know about the Zenoah 20 Minnflyer used in his review. I spose the DLE is less weight than the Zenoah by quite a bit.
I'd like to use a gas motor and the DLE would probably be my choice. Anyone else that has gone with the DLE, let me know how you came out with the CG.........how much extra lead?

rowdyjoe

My Feedback: (9)

I like your choice of engine brand. Ihave a 55cc on my IMACbird and it's a great engine. However, Ithink the 20cc would be too large in size for the airframe. I love gas engines but, there are some airframes that are just too small for them. You might take a look at the RCGF 15cc engine as it's smaller in size. Compare dimensions and see what you think. Length is also a concern so be sure to check clearance between the firewall and cowl.
I don't know of anyone who has mounted a gas engine on this airframe.

Good luck,
RJ

rowdyjoe

My Feedback: (9)

I started the FA-80GK on the Camel today and it took a few spins to get her going. It was running rough but, before Icould get the needles set Inoticed fuel leaking from the plane. Iremoved the tank and found that it had split at the seam just below the stopper and was quickly leaking fuel into the interior. Ipulled that tank and tried to soak up as much fuel as I could. I replaced the tank with a smaller one that fit well but was a bit smaller. Once installed I noticed that the replacement tank was leaking at the stopper. I'm beginning to think this bird is under gremlin attack.
I ordered a new tank from Horizon today and am waiting for it to arrive. I'll post an update when I get it installed.

RJ

roknHS

Glow fuel in a balsa and ply fuselage can be a real mess to clean up.........and if it soaks up enough fuel it will cause the covering to come loose in the affected areas. An effective means of clean up is a spot lifting product call K2R. It is a well known remedy for fuel soaked balsa and ply. You can find it at most hardware stores in the cleaning product aisle.

About gas power on this plane.......the original thread starter was MinnFlyer...........he used the Zenoah G-20 on his review Camel. The weight of the motor was just right to get this short nose airframe to balance.........power was more than required.
The RCGF 15 would be too lite.........lots of lead would be required to achieve the proper CG. I think the DLE 20 would be a little liter than the G-20 so, some lead would be required. I was looking for someone that had first hand experience.
Many have powered this airframe with small gas motors in an effort to use a power plant that was heavier to get away from all the useless lead.

Azzir325

Power this plane as you wish, the weight requirement doesn't change whether you use the brick of lead provided or way more power then you need. I used the lead and a 60 glow and there is no shortage of power. No, it won't 3D, but scale maneuvers and far beyond are well withing the capabilities of the recommended glow engine. Different stokes.... It's all for fun, so enjoy!
Rick

Mustang Fever

My Feedback: (2)

WWI airframes don't like to go fast. Around 30 mph top speed at wide open throttle is plenty. I subscribe to stuffing in as much engine or motor/battery packs into that cowl as one needs to get the CG, then use a big diameter, fine pitch prop to get the required speed and as much static thrust as possible. Loads of fun, but watch the torque on takeoff.

Azzir325

Go for it, and have fun. To me, lead, doing its job, is not useless extra weight. I've heard it said, "if enough power is good, then more power is better, and too much power should at least be considered." As long as your airframe doesn't vibrate apart, you are doing fine!

rowdyjoe

My Feedback: (9)

roknHS
     Thanks for the tip on the K2R.  I'll look for it in the hardware store.

About the gas engines ....I was thinking a rear mounted carb might be too long but, adjustments can be made by opening up the firewall plate to make room for the carb.  However, I would reinforce the firewall if I were doing it.
I had an older side carb RCGF 20cc that I intended to mount on my Camel but it was too wide.  The cowl would have needed too many holes to make it fit so, I traded it for the Saito 4 stroke that's on it now.  I wish I had bought a 15cc gas for it but, it would have been a gamble as to whether or not it would fit.  The Saito fits entirely within the cowl so it looks much more scale. 
The RCGF 15cc makes about 2 hp and measures .91 cu. inch.  You can get a really good buy on them at Hobby King's USA warehouse.

RJ

rowdyjoe

My Feedback: (9)

Well, decided to take my own advice and install an RCGF 15cc gas engine in my Camel. If Minflyer can make the G20 fit I'm sure Ican make the 15cc fit ...even with the rear mounted carb. I'm excited about this change. I really prefer gas engines to glow but, they just don't work well in some applications. Once I get the engine here I'll be able to measure it for fit in my H9 Fokker DVII. However, it's flying fine with the FA-80 in it and I'll probably leave well enough alone.
I'll try to remember to post some updates and installation pictures but, Iusually get all wrapped up in the build and forget to take pics.

rowdyjoe

My Feedback: (9)

Here's my progress on the gas engine installation. The engine arrived yesterday and came with the correct length standoffs, bolts, prop washer, and prop nut. It also came with a huge muffler. As you can see by the photos, the muffler would not fit inverted (too long) so, until Ifind a drop down flex pipe that will fit this engine I've mounted it as in the picture. I intend to fix an exhaust deflector to the top of the exhaust pipe to run it completely out of the cowl. It looks bad but, it fits well and will work until Ican find what Ineed. Isearched the web last night to find a 90 deg. drop manifold that would fit a 30mm bolt pattern but, no luck. I'll keep searching but, Imay have to fabricate something.
Fortunately, Horizon has parts left for this bird and Iwas able to buy a new cowl and fake engine so that when I do correct the exhaust mount I'll have a cowling to install that's not all chopped up.
I chose to use the same method Minnflyer used to mount the EI but, mine will mount under the platform as it will interfere with the cowl if I mount it on top.
I'm not happy with the appearance but, it's better than not flying it at all. Ineed to plumb the fuel tank for gas and get the electronics hooked up. Then we'll see how much, if any, weight Ineed to add up front.

Mustang Fever

My Feedback: (2)

Joe:

Did you try these guys: http://www.jtecrc.com/incowlmufflersgas.htm

rowdyjoe

My Feedback: (9)

Bob,
Isearched their web site but, couldn't find the dimensions for the bolt pattern. Looking at the mufflers that are available, I'm beginning to believe the only thing that will work would be a 90 deg. flex. It might be loud but, Ithink I can quiet it down with a snuffler or one of TBM's silencers. I'll keep searching.

Everything is installed and she's ready for an engine run. I hope to get to that tomorrow after I run the errands my wife wants me to do (never ending it seems. ) I'm hoping the LHSis open has an exhaust diverter that will fit by 7/8" pipe.

Thanks for the link.

Merry Christmas and happy new year.

RJ

Mustang Fever

My Feedback: (2)

Joe:

I think you should contact them directly. Judging from that form they have for you to fill out, they probably make them up to order.

rowdyjoe

My Feedback: (9)

Bob,
I'll probably end up fabricating one myself or having one custom made. I'll contact them later this week and find out if they can help. Ihate to put an expensive exhaust on a $150 engine.


Got the little 15cc started today and she runs like a top. Total run time was probably 30 min. off and on. This little baby litterally sips fuel with an eye-dropper. I'll run it in a bit more before she flies. It's idling a bit fast but, that will improve with break-in. The transition and top end are very good.
My LHSdidn't have an exhaust deflector in the size Ineed but, there's other shops in town and I can always order one if Ican't find it locally. I hope to have her ready to fly on 1 Jan. for our club's annual "Black-eyed Pea" event. So I've got about a week to get her ship-shape. Ineed to install another switch for the ignition too. Shouldn't take but, a couple of hours providing Ican find the parts Ineed.

Garry

rowdyjoe

My Feedback: (9)

Bob,
I contacted Jtech and a fella named Al is helping with the exhaust issue. Isent pictures and dimensions. He's looking at the issue and will get back to me soon, I'm sure. Hope he can find something for me.

In the meantime, I found a piece of thin wall metal tubing in my garage that will work as an exhaust extension. Icut it to length and mounted it over the exhaust pipe to ensure the exhaust exits the cowl. So, she's ready to fly once I get the 2nd switch installed for the CDI.

RJ