Welcome to Club SAITO !
09-14-2015, 04:36 PM
It looks like the FA 62b is what I am after, the dimensions on HH dont spec out the distance between the mounting flange where it sits on the beam to where the center of the throttle arm is, which is what I need in order to determine if I can use it or not.
As I mentioned previously, the spray bar which is at the center of the throttle arm (hence why I need it) is an inch and a quarter above the tank center line. So when I have the engine adjusted for under 1/2 tank, and running perfect, it is way too rich for when it goes inverted and the fuel flow with pressure floods the engine causing it to flame out. I either have to lower the engine, or raise the tank, neither of which is an option with the OS 70, so if I can reduce that to what I have on my LT-40 with the OS 52, which is what I am hoping the Saito 62 is equal to in dimensions, then it will work fine for the SIG SE. I have to go measure the LT-40 to get an idea of where it needs to be.
The weight difference is over 100 grams too, so I either have to pull the 2 ounces out of the tail, or see if it balances with the battery moved forward. The trick will be figuring out how much to remove from the tail. Good news is the 62 swings the same prop, 13x6, or smaller 12 x 6. The plane was fast with the 70 on it, but could not hold a knife edge, the nose would drop even at full throttle. I did a low high speed pass yesterday, and got a little too close to me, passed within 10 feet, and it was MOVING! It is a Very Fun Plane to fly!
As I mentioned previously, the spray bar which is at the center of the throttle arm (hence why I need it) is an inch and a quarter above the tank center line. So when I have the engine adjusted for under 1/2 tank, and running perfect, it is way too rich for when it goes inverted and the fuel flow with pressure floods the engine causing it to flame out. I either have to lower the engine, or raise the tank, neither of which is an option with the OS 70, so if I can reduce that to what I have on my LT-40 with the OS 52, which is what I am hoping the Saito 62 is equal to in dimensions, then it will work fine for the SIG SE. I have to go measure the LT-40 to get an idea of where it needs to be.
The weight difference is over 100 grams too, so I either have to pull the 2 ounces out of the tail, or see if it balances with the battery moved forward. The trick will be figuring out how much to remove from the tail. Good news is the 62 swings the same prop, 13x6, or smaller 12 x 6. The plane was fast with the 70 on it, but could not hold a knife edge, the nose would drop even at full throttle. I did a low high speed pass yesterday, and got a little too close to me, passed within 10 feet, and it was MOVING! It is a Very Fun Plane to fly!
09-14-2015, 06:31 PM
Thanks, appreciate it. I just did some measuring and fitment. I have to build a new firewall, so found that I can raise the tank up 18 mm which puts the centerline much closer to the spraybar, which looks like it will be close enough for the 70. As it sat before the wrong landing, there was no way possible to raise the tank up as there was a plug holder in the fuse that locked the tank in place, and the hole in the firewall is also down there. There was also no way to get the tank up high enough as former F3 blocks it. With having the nose busted apart I took the top off, and have full access now so I can fit the tank between F3 and the firewall, and then put the top back on. I have some inch thick foam to space the tank with.
The tank centerline was 8 MM below the engine centerline, and the spray bar was 31 mm above the engine centerline putting it 39 mm above the tank centerline. With raising the tank like this the spray bar is now only 21 mm above the centerline, which is about where the OS 52 is in the LT-40. So once I know what the distance is on that 56 I can decide if I want to stick the 70 back on and see if that fixed it, or go look for a 62.
The tank centerline was 8 MM below the engine centerline, and the spray bar was 31 mm above the engine centerline putting it 39 mm above the tank centerline. With raising the tank like this the spray bar is now only 21 mm above the centerline, which is about where the OS 52 is in the LT-40. So once I know what the distance is on that 56 I can decide if I want to stick the 70 back on and see if that fixed it, or go look for a 62.
Last edited by acdii; 09-14-2015 at 06:33 PM.
09-15-2015, 04:01 AM
are you doing this so that people here will start nagging ME to copy it ?
09-15-2015, 04:16 AM
09-15-2015, 04:56 AM
09-15-2015, 06:25 AM
acdii- are you talking about putting a Saito 56 or 62 in a Sig SE? I'm asking because I've built those kits and also a few LT-40 kits. I've seen a SE with a Saito 72, but I don't remember the prop the guy was using. The prop diameter is always the issue with the SE. I got away with a 12.25" APC on grass but I had to raise the landing gear and keep the nose up on landing and takeoffs or it would cutting grass. The guy who showed up with a SSE and the Saito 72 had his detuned quite a bit by being sloppy rich and I don't know what the plane would do. He flew some takeoff and landing patterns all afternoon and not much else.
The hole in the firewall for the fuel tank cap can be changed by either adding a doubler to the existing firewall with the hole where you want it, or by putting in a new firewall designed to your liking. You are right- the plane is easy to work with when you have the top off of the whole model. Now, I make them with removable tops from firewall all the way back to the end of the turtleneck.
The hole in the firewall for the fuel tank cap can be changed by either adding a doubler to the existing firewall with the hole where you want it, or by putting in a new firewall designed to your liking. You are right- the plane is easy to work with when you have the top off of the whole model. Now, I make them with removable tops from firewall all the way back to the end of the turtleneck.
09-15-2015, 11:07 AM
09-15-2015, 11:55 AM
acdii- are you talking about putting a Saito 56 or 62 in a Sig SE? I'm asking because I've built those kits and also a few LT-40 kits. I've seen a SE with a Saito 72, but I don't remember the prop the guy was using. The prop diameter is always the issue with the SE. I got away with a 12.25" APC on grass but I had to raise the landing gear and keep the nose up on landing and takeoffs or it would cutting grass. The guy who showed up with a SSE and the Saito 72 had his detuned quite a bit by being sloppy rich and I don't know what the plane would do. He flew some takeoff and landing patterns all afternoon and not much else.
The hole in the firewall for the fuel tank cap can be changed by either adding a doubler to the existing firewall with the hole where you want it, or by putting in a new firewall designed to your liking. You are right- the plane is easy to work with when you have the top off of the whole model. Now, I make them with removable tops from firewall all the way back to the end of the turtleneck.
The hole in the firewall for the fuel tank cap can be changed by either adding a doubler to the existing firewall with the hole where you want it, or by putting in a new firewall designed to your liking. You are right- the plane is easy to work with when you have the top off of the whole model. Now, I make them with removable tops from firewall all the way back to the end of the turtleneck.
This could also be why my Cub Saito 100 quits at 1/4 tank at certain attitudes, the tank CL is a bit low to the spraybar even though the engine is mounted horizontally.
09-15-2015, 12:03 PM
The dimension I am looking for is not on those diagrams. I need the dimension from the bottom of the mounting flange where it bolts to the beam to the middle of the carb where the spray bar is so I can determine how high above CL it is. The OS 70 is 31 MM above the beam, the OS 52 is 18 or 21 MM(I forget which) above the beam, so if the 56 is around 20MM or so it will work perfectly.
09-15-2015, 12:29 PM
My Feedback: (3)
Jim, I ordered a new set of nuts and was waiting for them to arrive when I took that picture, that's all the nuts I had left, I have a little drawer with many extras, mostly the wrong extras. Doin what works is good. That particular incident happened because I had the timing set @ 40 degrees btdc and not at 35 as I thought. It's now a t 31 due to the 11.24 to 1 compression ratio. It's nearly electric motor smooth at 31 btdc.
Hey Richard, I'd still like to get my hands on your 1.30 to play with it for a while. Maybe some day. Enjoy, Dave aka Hobbsy
Hey Richard, I'd still like to get my hands on your 1.30 to play with it for a while. Maybe some day. Enjoy, Dave aka Hobbsy
I CAN justify the expenditure. Yes, the sweeper cost me ~$31 and I probably could have gotten the washer for ~$10 to $15, but we all know there were, are, and will be other things that will get dropped or thrown into the grass that will be invisible.
Later this week I hope to run the 150S again.
09-15-2015, 02:23 PM
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Would I be that vindictive Old Fart?? really all you sandgropers are to suspicious any way you still have to send me your address and don't forget folks in regard to the "Red Book" Old Fart is now the "go to" guy It is starting to warm up here a respectable 31 degrees celcius and blue skies and little wind.
09-15-2015, 05:21 PM
[QUOTE=acdii;12099802]... I need the dimension from the bottom of the mounting flange ...to the middle of the carb... spray bar ...QUOTE]
Well as I said I would, I measured my FA-56. The dimension from the mounting surface of the lugs to the center of the needle valve/spray bar is....wait for it.... here it comes............drum roll...: 0.875 inches. You would think it would be metric, but my English machinists scale does not speak metric. So, convert it if you wish.
My go-to source for Saito data is: http://saito-engines.info/index.html, but even that source does not have the mount to spray bar C/L dim.
Good luck.
Sincerely, Richard
Well as I said I would, I measured my FA-56. The dimension from the mounting surface of the lugs to the center of the needle valve/spray bar is....wait for it.... here it comes............drum roll...: 0.875 inches. You would think it would be metric, but my English machinists scale does not speak metric. So, convert it if you wish.
My go-to source for Saito data is: http://saito-engines.info/index.html, but even that source does not have the mount to spray bar C/L dim.
Good luck.
Sincerely, Richard
09-15-2015, 06:51 PM
My Feedback: (3)
09-16-2015, 06:23 AM
It will pick up a lot of "cheap trash" as well. 
It will cost a lot more though.
09-16-2015, 06:25 AM
I'm going off topic here about an engine other than Saito, anyone here ever own a Moiki 180? A friend of mine just offered the dirtiest engine he had ever seen on the terms I take it with the understanding he doesn't know if it will run. The price is right, $0.00 I just need to give it a good cleaning and build a test stand to run it on. He advises me its not worth taking to a swap meet because he has new 2 cycle engines he can't get anyone to look at. If it will pull it I have a 1/4 Swift coming in around 20 lbs. all up I'm wondering if it might handle? Opinions anyone? Thank you!
Mike
Mike
09-16-2015, 07:03 AM
I like dirty engines too because I get them cheap! All and all I haven't gotten anything I couldn't get running with minimum effort or parts. Its like finding a ARF flier's airplane in the trashcan, most cases it flies again with a little TLC. I had heard Mokis don't link synthetic oil so I'm guess most of the schumtz will be good old castor oil.
09-16-2015, 11:42 AM
My Feedback: (3)
I like dirty engines too because I get them cheap! All and all I haven't gotten anything I couldn't get running with minimum effort or parts. Its like finding a ARF flier's airplane in the trashcan, most cases it flies again with a little TLC. I had heard Mokis don't link synthetic oil so I'm guess most of the schumtz will be good old castor oil.
Yeah and I have heard nothing but good about Moki's. Too bad I have a pair of ST 3000's
09-16-2015, 02:00 PM
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Old Fart watch the mailbox in about a week. I will try to get it away on Monday. Busy week ahead and I am b*^#dy frustrated and have a bad case of SOL. YS engines are not working, can't get either 63 above 8K rpm, I think after all else I have a regulator or rotor to crankshaft problem (the engines both appear to be getting excessive fuel and are unusually unresponsive to the HSN) and to top it all off that idiot Shorten has just opened his mouth on the news. A pox on all politicians and dud fuel. It is raining, the water tanks are over flowing so all is not bad. Oh yes I know your address now Old Fart so be good in the future.
09-16-2015, 04:32 PM
Who has the best prices on Saito including shipping costs? Also does anyone know if they all come with aluminum mounts, or was that just the FG models that do? There is a hobby shop in Madison that sells Saito for good prices, but nothing smaller than a 72.