Yes, the preceding conversations is what shuts these threads down! CAN WE GROW UP?
Todd

Bob,

You helped me out a few times, and you always stayed around and helped get things right. Even if it wasn't part of you end of the system. You went out of your way. And I greatly appreciate it!
You give your job 150%, and I doubt anyone who knows you or has worked on these engines with you, would say anything other than the best of things about you!

Thanks again!

Richard Newman

. I don't think there are many people out there that think I have not given my all with much enthusism to help RAM customers with getting their engines running, explaining the ECU operation/features, and upgrading/servicing their ECU's. I will continue to the same now.

Bob Price

Thanks to Bob Price for the 'good news'.

The main gripe I have and have had is the lack of reliable info from RAM. I think they probably could have avoided the whole mess by just being up front with the customer whom they chose to ignore. Instead, the all-mighty internet rared its ugly head, again proving that the 'pen is mighter than the sword'.

As far as 'mr happyjet' & jocko...you guys need to get a room.


W.G. Hunter

Hey Todd

It's a two way street, I may have started the thread but NOT the insults....Jockjets obviously thinks I am a past foe, I just want some answers, not body swerves....appears he has fallen out with a few people, (easytiger, etc) , am I right ?

Mark

PS. more than happy to bury this thread, I think the point has been made.

Mr Happy, you could always mail him instead of using this forum for your personal arguing with him. And yes, it is a two way street, sometimes it takes the bigger person to stop.
Thanks

WHATEVER, just take it somewhere else please!

Consider it done !

Gone but not forgotten !

Bye

Mark

I couldn't agree with you more.

I offered my workshop, but that wasn't enough.

Basically I called his bluff, and faced with having to reveal his true identity, he chose instead to throw all his toys out of the cot, and leave.

I can do no more than I have done. I am trying to help here.

I have a question.... Why did RAM close ?

I know the first 1000s had a few problems. What
did they do to fix them ?

Was RAM getting defective parts ? Or was there
something wrong with the design ?

I know Rei and Albert, faily well and they
are just regular guys, there must be a reason
that was out of there control for this..

There is a lot to learn here.

Eddie Weeks
http://www.corpcomp.com/weeks1/

It all goes for you too Jock, lets drop it already, nobody won anything.

Back to the thread.

Good point Eddie, but werent alot of 500's trouble some too? were they really perfected before they were released? I know you never hear from the good ones, only the bad, but.....Just wondering......

"It all goes for you too Jock, lets drop it already, nobody won anything. "


I was answering mach1's post.




"I know you never hear from the good ones, only the bad,"

In two years of dealing with RAM and selling over here in the UK, out of thirty five engines, mainly 500's and 1000's, none of them had problems that could be attributed to either engine or ECU. Most of the problems were not reading and/or understanding the manual, or not following the instructions to the letter.

For instance 2% oil/fuel mixture, fortunately discovered in time. No glow plug supply because the owner/driver had cut off the earth tag of the plug supply lead in order to squeeze it into a slender fuselage.

I started testing/setting up all the engines I sold, until one customer complained that he had expected a new engine in an unopened box. I just couldn't win.

I could go on, but I won't

Personally, Id rather have an opened box than a bad engine, its kinda like insurance, I know on my JC I had to wait a little extra for it to be test run before I got, Nothing wrong with that, or my engine!

Come on everyone. Let's give RAM the chance to sort things out with the business. If all that has been said on this forum about RAM's business was said about my business, I for one would not be a happy camper.

I have stuck with RAM since 1999 ( actually, since 1997 when they did Turbomin's) and would not be looking for any other turbine. Yes, they have had difficulties in the past with the electronics side of the turbine, but I personaly have seen problems with most, if not all, others in the field during competitions and shows, even now. A lot of the time, the fault on turbine operation lies with the operator, and NOT the turbine and thats a fact.

I have 3 RAM's and have been happy with all of them. I sent one away last year after a total right off crash of my composite Bandit at an airshow and RAM had it repaired in under two weeks. I sent my other two away for a full service just prior to the Jet World Masters last year and they were back in perfect working order in 6 working days after a full bearing change and tail cone additions to both. Now considering I live in Ireland, near Shannon Airport this was faultless service.

I am now building a slightly larger model for the 2003 show season. It will be powered by 4 RAM's. If the turbines were not up to spec, then I would be selling up and not risking them in this new model that has to date, taken 550 hours to design alone. The cost of the model will be in the thousands mark with out turbines, so why would I risk it.

So as I said please could we give Albert and the guys at RAM the chance to at least breath for gods sake and grow up !!!!!!

Good question, I seem to recall innocently asking that one also before Jocky....................No I promised I wouldn't. .

But what now for RAM owners, who will provide the spares, as RAM could barely do it, I don't think the agents would be able to, they don't have the facilities either.

I still think it is down to one of the other turbine mfg's to take it on and make it work.

Jetcat, are going the same way, probably the best turbine out there but poor service, I speak from experience. The best service I have had is from Simjet, not saying it's perfect, but its the best and they try, best of all they communicate........

Any thoughts on Simjet retrofitting their FADEC / system on a RAM turbine ?

Mark

I must disagree on this one, I have had great service so far, I have not had to send mine back yet though. but on my ECU I had a problem and had a new one second day air asap.
Im happy with that.

"But what now for RAM owners, who will provide the spares, as RAM could barely do it, I don't think the agents would be able to, they don't have the facilities either."

Everybody seems to think that RAM manufactured the parts themselves. Maybe a long time ago they did, but not recently.

When I was over at their faciltity last year, I was taken around the "skunk works" and shown all the things that were in the pipeline. vitually all the metal components were machined off-site and brought in for assembly and setting up.

This also applied to the ECU's which were brought/bought in batches and programmed to suit 500/750/1000.

So, the parts are not the problem.

Equipment required to work and assemble can be bought or manufactured, my workshop is testament to this.

All that's left is the expertise and the knowlege to be able to put all these ingredients together. Not impossible, there are a lot of people out there with the ability.

Putting a FADEC system ECU onto a RAM engine admits that it is a good engine.

So why don't we stop discussing what to do, and give the idea that "a new company will be formed to manufacture the engines, and market them, and a new service facility will be placed on the east coast to supplement Tad at Goldenwest in the west" instead of trying to produce yet another hybrid bitza to compete in an already crowded marketplace.

Cut them just a little slack and see what happens.

Jocky

So if it is not part availability and not the turbines, ( being that they are all based on one design anyway ), what does that leave as the weak link in RAM's armour ?

"Happy"

"So if it is not part availability and not the turbines, ( being that they are all based on one design anyway ), what does that leave as the weak link in RAM's armour "

How about the great American Dollar, or lack of them.

If you are in business, then you'll know the importance of cash flow, and money in general.

From what I know, and it's a lot more than you give me credit for, by the time they had streamlined the production side of things, the debts had probably exceeded likely income. Unable to recoup the previous losses without being able to increase the price due to competition, they had to struggle along and hope that everybody else might fall by the wayside trying to compete with "the better product"

We know the result.

But hindsight is a wonderful thing, and that and an understanding of what was going on at RAM and being in business myself, I'm sure that we have not heard the end of the story.

And the handle is jockjets, or if you like, Ian

Lack of dollars is the end result not the cause, that is something different.

You don't start with a $2 million hole... :stupid: and is dosn't appear overnight !

The cause is losing your way, taking your eye of the ball, ( or the turbine in this case ). The dollars start to dry up once that is in effect.

Letting people lambaste them openly on the net without sorting the problems. you operate a cottage industry, you can not afford the bad press !

The customer is king, but then you may know that :stupid: Doh !

How do you make a small fortune in Micro Turbines, you start with a big one.

GeorgeR.

Hey I wasn't their accountant.

I only gave you an opinion as to what I saw as the 'problem'

Whether it was $2million or $200K, it would still be an enormous hill to climb in such a limited market. Law of diminishing returns etc

I still think that the thing should be given a rest for a while.

That'll allow everybody to get their breath back for the inevitable "I told you so" follow-ups.

As I stated in an earlier posting, which was taken entirely the wrong way, but I still think it is a good quote, "Why is it that all the people who know how to run the world are driving cabs, or cutting hair?"

And that wasn't directed at anyone specifically.

I will not be replying to any more postings on the "RAM no more" subject, as I think it has run it's course.

GeorgeR



"How do you make a small fortune in Micro Turbines, you start with a big one."

How very true.

We had a variation on that theme in a full-size club.

Definition of an aeroplane. An odd shaped hole in the sky surrounded with aluminium, into which you pour vast quantities of money.

Same could be said for turbines i suppose.

Another one was "Model flying today costs me exactly the same as it did 30 years ago. Every cent I've got."

Just about right.

Jocky

Is that a promise?

Glad to see the post by Albert has been re-posted on the forum, may help to clear things up. The writing was on the wall last year, and all the rumors appear to have been true.....

Whats that I can smell ?

Bye. I've had as much fun as I can take in one day....

Not REposted. A totally different post.

Yes, a better post with hope in it.