My Skymaster Hawk arrived last Thursday and assembly is under way. Very good kit indeed, very impressed. However, the one thing that puzzles me is the fuel system . As the tanks are mounted vertically and the access hole for the fittings is precut has anyone given any thought to the plumbing configuration so that the clunk remains immersed in fuel during negative "G" ?

Regards,

David Gladwin

Hi David,

I've been thinking about the very same situation. I think between the two tanks (plus UAT), I hopefully won't do much -ive G manouvers that will cause air to get into the lines. I know that it has been flown a bit and have not heard of any fuel problems so far but that does not mean it was tested with a lot of -ive flying etc. I am also considering making new openings at least in the front tank to help alleviate this.

On another note - How's the weather down under these days. I am flying out to Sydney this Sunday for 4-5 days before heading out to HongKong. I have made this trip as short as possible so I can make it back in time to get ready for FJ. Still need to buff out the F-14 and the Super Bandit plus try to finish the Hawk as well.

If you have some free time next week, maybe we can get together for some dinner and Foster's.

Thanks - Adil

Hi David and Adil,

Yes if you look at it at first it sure looks strange. Some of the guys in South Africa have not used the Skymaster tanks, but opted for 2 x Dubro 50 oz + UAT. It will fit very nicely between the ducts.

Ali, Eric, Anton and myself have flown many flights with original tanks and UAT. No dead stick ever! Ali has flown probably the most flights of all with all kinds of G's, so i think he will be the right one to comment.

Best regards,

Morne Nortier
www.mnmodels.co.za
Exclusive Skymaster distributor in South Africa

Thanks guys, its a relief to hear that I am not the only one to be perplexed ! I'll see what Ali comes up with , he's sure to have been hot dogging it. Adil, I have PM'ed you with my tel no. Just had a night of violent thunderstorms but should be fine next week, you will enjoy Sydney, one of the most beautiful cities in the world.

Regards,

David Gladwin.

The hawk is a favorite of mine. I had a Jim Fox Hawk and it was beutiful.

I was excited to see a larger Hawk come out, except that it's an ARF. But anyway I thought I would have one for sure.
Well after seeing it. I was disapointed in the scale out line. The canopy is too sleek. look at their add that has the full scale Hawk taken off. Compare that to the model.

Maybe I'm not getting a good look at them together, but something isn't correct.

You guys have them. What do you think?

Yes, the canopy profile isnt quite right but this is a sport model and a very good one too. I actually think it looks slighly better than the real thing ! I started to build mine yesterday and now 30 hours later its almost finished, ready for equipment installation and that does include installing concealed likages for the rudder, a tedious job, and gear doors.


Fuel system. After removing the equipment tray it seems the forward fuel tank would fit flat in the rear of the forward section. It will mean raising the trear tray about 1/2 an inch. Should work though and will try it.

Regards,

David Gladwin

Hi David
Glad you are liking the hawk. I am sure you will enjoy the way it flies. As for the fuel tank thing. I have flown the prototype model approx 75 flights to date and all has been well with the central pick up. Due to the efficiency of the design the P-120 is rarely at full power so I can get 12 minute flights with aeros all the way through.
We had a similar concern from some customers with the F-18 fuel tank. (Similar center pick up) Although they work and work well, and despite never having an fuel issue with either my hawks, or F-18 I still accept the fact that making it so the clunk is in fuel at all times must be a good thing. As always I am sure you will modify it for the best. When you do please keep us updated as I am building another Hawk right now so I would be interested to know.
David. When you are ready to fly let me know. It is very important that the elevator linkage is set correctly and even more important that the flap movement is set correctly with the right amount of elevator mix.
Devil dog,
I spotted the mis shaped nose on the hawk right away also. But as David mentioned we do not try to hide the fact that the hawk was always intended as a semi scale model which Lent more toward a sport jet performance. It was always our intention to slim the nose a little to make the model more sleek, as a totally scale hawk actually looks quite dumpy. We also cheated a little with the wing and the stab sizes but this is not so obvious.
One of the possibilities that was discussed when I was in China was that of making a new nose and canopy section at a later date that would be a lot more scale. The problem at the moment is time. There are at least another 3 new jets in pre production stages as we speak so really I am not sure when the new nose section could begin production. But if anybody is interested in a more scale model please make us aware so that we can get an idea if it is a viable project or not?

Hello Ali.
As you know, a friend of mine is currently working his hawk. I'll be over to check on it sometime this week, to bring him the custom landing light cover for the nose as well as the instrument panels i made.

All in all i have say that the jet looks really good, even though it is obvious that it is a sport jet. (Does sport have to be un-scale? Look at eurosport...). I am very much into scale and scale detail, so this made me look away from the ARF Hawk. A scale version nose would probably make me reconsider....after all, it goes together quick without all the hassle i would have with another "custom project"...
My guess is that there are probably a lot of people out there who would prefer a scale nose and canopy over the sportscale you are selling now.

Cheers
Miniflyer

When do you think you will fly the hawk David as i look forward to seeing it go. When will you fly at Maitland again also..

JR

i have also ordered the same bae hawk, having a facet 2300, there is plenty of room for everything,

can someone post some pics of thier instalation of the fuel tanks and radio gear?

thanks,

mark

What are the specs for flaps-elev mix? Mine should be here any day.

Hi there-

You guys who are already flying this model, I have got a question for you. I've got a Jetcat P70 and its thrust range is at the low to middle range for the Skymasters model kit. Would it be worth while to get this ARF and put this (P70)engine into it or wait to get a P120 for it?

thanks in advance.

Hi Don,

It all depends on what type of pilot you are. Personally i think the Jetcat P-120 is way to powerfull for the Hawk. I would guess the P80 will be perfect.

I know of some flying with a older mercury. Not the HP. You can do a nice big loop afer 6 minutes flying time. There is really a lot of wing and the construction is much lighter than previous Skymaster jets.

So i would go for it if you are just a "scale type pilot". If you like speed and unlimited vertical performace - go for 120!

Best regards

Morne Nortier
www.mnmodels.co.za
Exclusive distributor for Skymaster RC in South Africa

Hi Ali
Any idea as to when the MB339 will appear
and will that be scale or sport.
Have a Pegasus HP waiting for it

Brian

"So i would go for it if you are just a "scale type pilot"."

Damn!

My secret is found out at last! Thanks for the advice.

Don

Hi Ali,

I too will have my Bae Hawk on 2-9, or 2-10, so please list here on the forum your recommended elevator throws and flap to elevator deflection. If you use JR (JR10X) explain the mixing function for us JR10X for Dummies. LOL.

Thanks

Kevin Marks
Scottsdale, AZ

PS. I have a regular AMT mercury at 18lbs, and a pegasus at 27lbs thrust. My other engines are larger, which do you recommend.

K Marks

On my Hawk my settings for take off flap were 15mm down Maximum with no elevator mix. For landing I use maximum of 30mm flap travel and 15mm of up elevator. This is how mine was set and it was perfect. It came in on approach hands off. But! Do not assume this will be perfect for all. I am sure there will be a few millimeters of setting to do on both flap and elevator. The most important thing to remember is that you CAN NOT and I cant specify this enough. You can not deploy the flaps whilst this model is traveling at speed.
If you apply full flap on this model at any kind of speed the model will pitch down and the flap will override the elevator no matter how much mixing you have. My advice to everyone is to take some time during the first flights and following flights to get used to the flaps and how they interact with pitch. I suggest getting some height, slowing the model down into wind and as the speed decays gradually applying more and more flap. This way you can monitor any pitch change and get used to the feel of the model.
When deployed correctly the flaps can be left down and the model flown perfectly happily. My only concern is with either too much speed or too much flap without the correct up elevator mix.

Another point to remember is that you want to set your mix from flap[ to elevator so that the elevator is a progressive as the flaps. I fly a hawk recently where the customer had set the flap and stab mix so that he only got his 15mm of up elevator when full flap was deployed. Not Good. He had a model that wanted to pitch down until he hit full flap and then it would shoot back up again.
With the correct flap set up the model will sit perfectly for landing. You can see some of the videos of my hawk from long and short fields at my web site www.alshobbies.com (Video section)
As for power. Its a tough one. I like the way mine flew with the P-120 because I never had to use full throttle which males a pleasant change. But I knew I had the power there if I wanted it. My Next hawk will have a Mercury installed. I know this will have the right sort of power for nearly everything I want to do with the model. I too have a Pegasus sitting here doing nothing but I am sure this is just too powerful and too heavy.
Sorry I cant help with he 10X I was a Futaba man but have only recently switched to JR but all I know is the MX22


I am sure the P-70 would fly the model but it would not set the world alight, but if you want to fly the model in a scale fashion it would probably be perfect. i am sure with the fuel consumption of the P-70 you could get away with only one of the skymaster tanks and the overall weight would be lighter.

Brian
Sorry no news on the MB339 release date yet. The model had flown and all is good and if we wanted too we could go into production in a matter of weeks. But!!! As of last month the plug was being totally re engineered to make it more scale in out line and detail. This model is being produced for Al's Hobbies and when I commissioned the project the goal was to have as close to scale MB339 as we can get, and the one I flew in China although perfect in flight performance was far from what I wanted in scale outline.

Mini Flyer.
I would be very interested to see pictures of your landing light and instrument panel. I always wanted a landing light I think it might look good on my new hawk. Thankyou for your opinions on the nose section.

Ali, i will take pictures of the instrument panel tonight when i get home.

As for the landing light, pictures will be until i get a chance to visit the plane again. But the basic principle is fairly easy: A 1W luxeon emitter (available through conrad electronics for instance) with a larger custom heating conductor is placed in a MagLite flashlight mirror. Diameter is about 2cm (rough guess). I heated a butyrate sheet in the oven and pulled it over a plug to fit the Hawk nose. Cut off the nose cap, install it and off you go. We were afraid of using the 3W or 5W emitters, as they produce enormous temperatures and would probably melt away the mirror if our heat conductor doesnt work the way i plan. Might try them if the 1W holds up fine and the temps we are getting remain in the ok-range. I'll keep you posted on this, and will get the pics to you asap.

Nice looking hawk, by the way. That airbrush look sparkles out a lot . However, it is not quite scale...the real thing had sharp lines as i recall....
[link]http://www.jetphotos.net/images/j/JetPhotosHawk2.jpg.11814.jpg[/link]

Regards
Miniflyer

Here are the pictures i promised. Sorry for the low resolution, modern mobile phones do come with camera, but they are not worth their weight in fertilizer.....cant see any of the fine panel line detail or screw heads
I'll be off to deliver the stuff tomorrow, and will see if i can get my hands on the "family digital cam" for that .

Hi everyone that just received their BAE Hawk. Mark from Wilkes-Barre Pa. and I are building one each. I just received mine today, 02/18/05. Did anyone do anything to the fuel tanks to keep the rubber stoppers from being cut by the hole in the tanks? I plan on machineing up a top hat type bushing to glue in place of the stopper, then insert the stopper into the top hat bushing so when it expands it won't get cut . Also has anyone tried to counter balance the stabilizers. Looks like they are a little heavy on the trailing edge. Any information would be a big help. I plan on using a Jet Cat P-80 in mine. Again looking for any information......

Larry Wright
Wilkes-Barre Pa.

One more thing. Did anyone make the speed brake work on their BAE Hawk?

Larry Wright
Wilkes-BArre Pa.

I did mass balance the stabs. It nearly cost me the model. In a blonde moment I added the lead and was so keen to see how it worked I just went out and flew. Of course I didnt factor C/G into things and the lead added made the model too tail heavy. Anyway the out come was one exciting flight and the decsion that no difference at all in flying feel was made by mass balancing. I wont do it on the one I am building now.
As for airbrake.
Just finished but have not flown with it yet.

Been thinking about mass balancing the stabs. It should make absolutely no differencve to feel or handling but it may reduce or eliminate any tendency for the stab. to flutter.

Incidentally the strong nose down pitch of the model is EXACTLY what was discovered on the real Hawk during test flying, and it nearly caused the loss of the aircraft as pitch control was lost until the flaps were retracted. On the fullsize it was cured by modifying the flaps.

Mine is now finished to the point of equipment installation, should fly next week!

Regards,

David Gladwin

Didn't they hacksaw a hole in the flap section on the prototype?
Glad to hear you're nearly all done.

Dave

No, according to World Air Power Journal (vol 22) it was fixed by deleting the slot on the outboard section of the double slotted flap.

Regards, David Gladwin.